If all 635 unofficial problem banks were to be shown the door, how close to the S & L crisis would the bottom "Monument Valley" chart be?

Juvenal Delinquent wrote:

how close to the S & L crisis would the bottom "Monument Valley" chart be?

Really close if all of them were closed this year. Of course there will be additional banks added, so next year would be busy as well.

If you're a "Bank", you have to be on the Official Friends & Family list to remain open. Fi to thems what didn't make the right political contributions.

CR...... that 'Bank and Thrift Failures Per Year' graph is quite striking with the gradient blue "sky features". It gives us the 'TBTF doominess' feel commiserate with the late 80s, with touches of 'never-to-be-equaled-again' splashes.

I'm remembering at some in the past someone here (or CR) put together a comparison of the S&L debacle with today's mess in $$$. Faulty memory?

west of the fields wrote:

It does look like the red line could go sputnik on any given Friday.

And the researchers have determined that the world has already crossed the boundary in three cases: biodiversity loss, the nitrogen cycle and climate change.

adornosghost wrote:

And the researchers have determined that the world has already crossed the boundary in three cases: biodiversity loss, the nitrogen cycle and climate change.

Fragile road to be sure. To hell with it, grow more corn.

josap wrote:

Az is making budget cuts and it seems that kids are getting the brunt of the cuts.

Kindergärtners shouldn't be in school all day. Year-round schools in the sun-belt states is also a waste of resources. I can imagine many accountants and the school 'number-crunchers' as using an early 1960s expenses model for curriculum and operational costs.

Obama Tells Congress: Act Soon on Financial Reform
- NY Times

The president said he remains a ''vigorous defender'' of free markets

I almost spit out my coffee

What he really meant is he remains a ''vigorous defender'' of the

there

I almost spit out my coffee

That was my reaction to Biden's comment that the government will ride herd on the insurance companies. Uh huh, just like the government cracked the whip on Wall Street.

black dog wrote:

They told him to expect CRE to cause another wave down for banks.

CRE CREEP. No amount of accounting trickery can hide these failed loans. I've seen ghost towns
of commercial buildings in this land of overbuild. Banal architecture lines the roads of our uncentered
villages.

It will be ironic if Americans really start doing this:

http://pottymouthcon.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/the_falling_man.jpg

to the banksters....maybe OBL saw the future in his drug induced visions and offered his help, just a little bit early?

just caught this in the Times:
NYC homeless jumps 34%
Number of People Living on New York Streets Soars - NY Times

Anonymous Bosch wrote:

I'm remembering at some in the past someone here (or CR) put together a comparison of the S&L debacle with today's mess in $$$. Faulty memory?

One Wells Fargo = 60x $2 billion S&Ls.

josap wrote:

This summer, Arizona will become the only state in the nation that doesn't provide health-care coverage under a federal program to insure children of the working poor.

CA has threatened to do the same if they don't get federal bail out funds. When states run out of money, they have to start chopping the social safety nets. Good thing we bailed out the insolvent banks, priorities and all.

Rob Dawg wrote:

One Wells Fargo = 60x $2 billion S&Ls. ----------------------------->

Mr Slippery wrote:

they have to start chopping the social safety nets.

More people lose jobs or wages/benifits are cut, just when they need a safety net the most. This is not going to be pretty. In addition, the middle class has no idea how to navigate the system to obtain any safety nets left in place. new learning curve - how do I get food and shelter with no (or very little) income.

Mr Slippery wrote:

When states run out of money, they have to start chopping the social safety nets. Good thing we bailed out the insolvent banks, priorities and all. Snark

New Jersey is bailing out Xanadu - this is only one tiny piece of it -

Turnpike toll payers are shelling out as $285 million for road improvements at Xanadu. Bergen County property taxpayers see their taxes rise while, because of a political sweetheart deal, Xanadu pays no county property taxes at all. Now, we don’t know when, if ever, Xanadu will open for business.

Xanadu is a private, hellaciously ugly glob of retail, indoor amusement park, sports, etc. It is a decade past opening, and will likely never open. Yet, taxpayers are still paying millions for it. Why can't this junk be the first to be cut? There could be plenty of jobs generated by taking it down.

When states run out of money

virginia just raided the state pension fund for $620 million to prevent further cuts.

You've got to wonder sometimes if instead of supporting politicians we wouldn't be better off donating to an RPG fund.

Columbia, SC (WLTX) -- Lawmakers received invitations to attend the Heritage Golf Tournament the same day they started voting on the House version of the budget--a budget which included a $10 million dollar loan to the tournament if it does not receive a sponsor.

Lawmakers Received Golf Tournament Invitations as Budget Talks Began wltx.com | Columbia, SC News, Weather and Sports |

The Department of Education took the biggest hit with over $100 million in cuts.
Budget Cut: Board Slashes State Spending by 5% wltx.com | Columbia, SC News, Weather and Sports |

---Golf Tournament or Education?
The Choice has been made.

Rob Dawg wrote:

Of what gets spent on assistance, almost none makes it through to the needy.

---The golfers disagree.

I almost want to turn in my MPGA tour card, but i'd be tilting at windmills.

Year 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 00 01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09
M&A 168 274 356 451 523 435 441 450 475 334 254 249 211 259 270 271 296 287 146 127
Failures 381 268 179 50 15 8 6 1 3 8 7 4 11 3 4 0 0 3 25 140

"For only the second time in the last 20 years the bank closure rate has outpaced the M&A transaction volume. In 1990 there were 381 failures compared to 168 M&A transactions or 69% of the combined activities were closures. In 2009 there were 140 failures compared to 127 M&A transactions or 52% of the activity."

More doom here. PDF.

Sorry,Can't get table to behave...

Gnome, you guys really need a statewide billboard campaign...

STOP SCHTUPPING YOUR SISTERS.
THE KIDS ARE GROWING UP TO BE LEGISLATORS

No problem. Atleast I'm gonna get free healthcare for the brain aneurism I'm gonna blow from all my anger over the biggest financial swindle this world has ever seen.

Welfare vs. Charity
Forced vs. Voluntary

Which is more in line with the ideal of freedom?

How does the FDIC manage to spend 1B+ every weekend?
Why is it that the stock market keeps going up and up with all the mess?

josap wrote:

That is insane.

---You ain't from 'round here, is ya?

In: Eating seed corn

Out: Thinking about the future

Why is it that the stock market keeps going up and up with all the mess?

We're constantly being told that this is the biggest economic downturn since the Great Depression and stocks lost 90% of their value-top to bottom way back when, so...

If they only had computers to manipulate things with back then, stocks wouldn't have gone down~

"We have sort of become a nation of whiners. You just hear this constant whining, complaining about a loss of competitiveness, America in decline," said the former Texas senator. "You've heard of mental depression; this is a mental recession."

---Phil Gramm.

for everybody
Back from rehab

yep.

EvilHenryPaulson wrote:

It could be worse, next year

---It WILL be worse next year.

Pellice wrote:

Why can't this junk be the first to be cut?

You already know the answer to this question.

Underprivileged children tend not to provide much in the way of campaign contributions.

OT: Hourly Wages in the USA.

Commented earlier this week, freelance graphic artist at $60/hr is now glad he has a fulltime job at $14/hr.

Today, contractor (w/o license) who worked for $40/hr agreed to work for $20/hr. He hasn't worked for 6 weeks. He will even weed whack for $15/hr.

Previously, 1 1/4 yrs ago, low labor price in CA was $15/hr around here. Now, laborers are pushing to hold the line at $10/hr.

Future: Minimum wage will be a needed floor. Next January?

"Why is it that the stock market keeps going up and up with all the mess? "

Probably those will continue rising up faster and faster...no more real economy to burden the markets, just pure state of speculation plus the reloading of chips available from FED for big players. That is the first sign of hyperinflation.

Secondary wave might be coming later this year (after FED bailout of states) when the fast money M0&1 suddenly jumps big time. Thanks to (public sector) salaries paid by new shiny money, that is like putting moonshine to the punch bowl. Some economists might even assume the recovery has finally arrived...

Rob Dawg wrote:

Of what gets spent on assistance, almost none makes it through to the needy.

Once in a past life, lo 20 years ago, I contracted to a large, municipal social services department. It was considered by its peers to be a model of efficiency.

The numbers I saw, two decades ago, were that approximately 11 cents of every dollar actually reached the end-client.

To rehab or to rehab not...

josap wrote:

Az is making budget cuts and it seems that kids are getting the brunt of the cuts.

This is a time honored technique by government. They cut the things people want the most so that they can get the screaming going nice and load before they come back and ask to raise taxes.

They won't cut funds going to crony projects or excessive salaries, they will cut anything to do with kids.

This summer, Arizona will become the only state in the nation that doesn't provide health-care coverage under a federal program to insure children of the working poor.

That's worse than Greece.

Art Eclectic wrote:

They cut the things people want the most so that they can get the screaming going nice and load before they come back and ask to raise taxes.

You're talking about AZ - tax hikes aren't on the table. Only service cuts. Obama screwed the state by appointing Napolitano to DHS, leaving the far-right-wing Brewer in charge.

Art Eclectic wrote:

Black Star Ranch wrote:

Kindergärtners shouldn't be in school all day.

Public school is a substitute for day care in a many places...

Not to mention that the full day kindergarten usually serves communities where the children have the most need. So by cutting it, you are effectively eliminating any chance of those kids ever catching up to grade level and becoming productive members of society.

picosec wrote:

Why is it that the stock market keeps going up and up with all the mess?

A guess. Those 75% who feel their job is fairly safe are still contributing to their IRA's and 401's.

Not really. Money is still flowing into retirement plans, but it's flowing out of domestic equity funds.

The stock market has been going up for just one reason. Money is ultra cheap and plentiful for leveraged prop desks, institutional traders and hedge funds. We're reached the crescendo of a long cycle in which leverage has propped up the stock market.

Leveraged traders have to be very short term in mindset, and the "attention span" of the market has gotten shorter and shorter. Now, it's basically down to a day or two at a time. We are very close to a long-term top in the market. Emerging market stocks will fall faster than U.S.

HomeGnome wrote:

The Island Packet reports town council has authorized the local chamber of commerce to spend $300,000 from a disaster recovery fund, saying the poor economy justifies using the money now.
The chamber will spend the money on electronic billboards in Atlanta and on Web sites offering luxury products.

You should find out which of the town council has friends or family that lease electronic billboards.

He's not as quick as Ong Bok, is he?

Like this?
Jackie Clegg Dodd relationship map - Muckety

South Carolina, where the motto is: "We burn our bridges before we get to them."

josap wrote:

They ended all day kindergarden earllier this week. Now they are ending kids insurance through the state.

As in schools will no longer offer a K grade?

On a lighter note...

Historians will recall this time as The Donner Era.

HomeGnome in reply to.- 8:30 am

josap wrote:

That is insane.

---You ain't from 'round here, is ya?

whutz yaur doit dooin in boss keens ditch

Art Eclectic wrote:

Public school is a substitute for day care in a many places...

Due to expensive day care in the private sector?

As schools cut all day baby sitting parents will have to do thier own parenting. What a novel idea.

Juvenal Delinquent wrote:

...if LAPD doesn't overpay it's retired officers to hang out in northern Idaho, somebody else will

Somebody else does. The number of double dippers is shocking.

Thx mp. Conflict of interest, much?

lawyerliz wrote:

Conflict of interest, much?

Merely a coincidence.

A Phil and Wendy type coincidence.

So I should buy a screw gun instead of a hand gun?

Lobbyist Ben Dover wrote:

So I should buy a screw gun instead of a hand gun?

Conjure says, "Do it unto others before they do it unto you."

mp wrote:

Conjure says, "Do it unto others before they do it unto you."

In military terms, "First Strike Advantage"?

Conjure would rather be the victor than the victim.

how much of the money for the needy gets to the people who need it?

in two states , texas and wisconsin the 'bureacracy that absorbed much of the funds...was, you guessed it private contractors
and
the TANF (what used to be called aid to families with dependant children ADFC was used to pay for other ongoing state programs like CPS and that freed up money for tax breaks for property owners and small business

said twice, in at least one state, texas, the welfare money largely went to businesses and lower taxes on real estate

heres the story in part from "dollars and sense"

To understand how states really spent the money, we have to know what's happening on the ground. For example, nine of the ten states in the GAO study were using federal TANF dollars to pay for state programs formerly financed with state funds—and then using the freed-up state funds for other purposes. The state of Texas used at least $320 million in federal TANF money to replace state spending, most notably for child protective services and foster care. While advocates for poor families consider such programs vitally important, they think the state should commit its own resources, not federal welfare funds.

Texas officials claim that they're now spending more money across the board on social services, but Eva De Luna Castro, a budget analyst with the Austin-based Center for Public Policy Priorities (CPPP), disagrees. "The state general revenue is about the same," she says, "and in some cases it actually went down." Spending per client, she adds, has "gone down dramatically." At the same time, she says, the state funds freed up by federal TANF spending helped to pay for $2.3 billion in tax cuts to homeowners and businesses over five years.

There is other dubious spending that the official data don't reveal. In Wisconsin, for example, welfare contractors (counties and private agencies) can keep profits from unspent funds. Contractors have also misused welfare money. One agency, Maximus, agreed to return $1 million as compensation for spending abuses (although the state didn't require the company to pay back $6 million that went to corporate expenses in 1997-99). Another agency, Employment Solutions (a division of Goodwill Industries), was forced to reimburse the state for nearly $500,000 in misspent funds. Employment Solutions also paid out $1.7 million in bonuses to its executives and staff. In the glare of negative publicity, it is now quitting the welfare business, and Wisconsin will spend $3.8 million in—what else?—TANF funds to transfer Employment Solutions cases to other private contractors."

How States Are Spending Their Welfare Money—Or Not | Dollars & Sense

edit fixed sum spelling erras

I can't help but wonder how much of our bubblicious economy could have been avoided without the Bush era tax cuts. Admittedly, it's only part of the puzzle, but still.

Mr Slippery wrote:

Better to be the hammer than the nail?

You betcha.

Mr Slippery wrote:

Better to be the hammer than the nail?

You nailed it.

No one ever contemplates the board's feelings. Why is that? It's the board that gets nailed.

PastTense wrote:

The middle class will also find out that they often won't qualify for food stamps, etc because of too many assets--that 5 year old car they are driving...

You sure about that? Thought food stamps was just about income or savings; my uncle collected for his family back in the day once, and he owned a home and had cars. Of course the rules may have changed...

Merely a coincidence.

Twas merely a coincidence that Hank Paulson let a few of Goldman Sachs competitors go down before extending the federal teat.

If these bank failures turn comparable to the eighties, that means in 20 years we've learned... nothing?

Soon the 19 cent taco will be back. Just don't ask the burrito lady with the cooler where the meat came from.

PastTense wrote:

The middle class will also find out that they often won't qualify for food stamps, etc because of too many assets--that 5 year old car they are driving...

Repeat: That's a feature not a bug.

You have to separate people from assets as part of the dissolution of the middle class.

mp wrote:

It's got pink slime in it.

No that's the stake taco and it cost more.

Rob Dawg wrote:

Go long Tupperware. More doing for yourself or doing without. There is a great unwinding of societal interconnectedness as people begin to suspect there is less and less they can rely upon outside their own circles.

Maybe. Depends on what you mean by connections. My wife belongs to a 600K+ online knitters community that is all the time exchanging spare/unwanted yarn, books, or tools nationwide for trade, sale, or postage ("get it out of my sight"). Wonderful leveling of wanted/unwanted resources. The only drawback on the cheap end is the USPS' vig (postage), which puts a lower limit on good trades. Website software is insane; you can put your entire yarn "stash" online, all your books, and others who need what you've got (brand, type, color) can go hunting for it across the membership with a single command. Sucker's growing by leaps and bounds.

PIIGS Debt Coming Due

I don't know how they hang on.

If they go down it will be seen as a plus for the eCONomy. More of these hanger-ons we can get rid of the more we bump up the restaraunt index CR posts monthly. IMO now that we are 27 months deep into the recession all these index/surveys are being gamed by survivor's bias.

ASSTSB

Another survey susceptible to survivor's bias.

oh most certainly sir, but he didnt let them pick up like jpmc or wf or boa personally i think he really was looking out for them