Knew it!

So basically the blip up is reconfirmed as a C4C temporary uptick

cash for crack houses?

Zimbabwe? Hardly. Preserving the value of trillions in fraudulently issued Wall St. credit does not lead to hyper-inflation. Rather, it leads to a CONtinued decimation of the American middle class.

Price declines are just getting started here in the NorthEast. Up until this point we haven't been pulling our weight in this downturn but now we should be a nice drag on national numbers.

Leading indicators rise more slowly in February - Yahoo! Finance

Deflation is here and Bernanke's bailouts of credit fraud will only make matters worse for the majority. Not that he cares about what's best for the majority.

Houses are almost becoming nearly affordable, almost.

Expect more welfare for homeowners and their lenders.

Regarding solar, I recently had the experience to attend a solar testing demonstration. This is basically what would be done in lab testing and production environment.

Kind of interesting but not much to it and very little I didn't know already from reading way to much about the subject.

12th Percentile wrote:

Price declines are just getting started here in the NorthEast. Up until this point we haven't been pulling our weight in this downturn but now we should be a nice drag on national numbers.

Not so sure about that:
Cyberhomes.com - Home Details for 59 Eastern Ave, Worcester, MA 01605
The average house in Worcester, MA is down ~40% since March '07......

josap wrote:

Butler said that about 65 percent of February resale transactions can be attributed directly to foreclosures

What percent is move up buyers? I bet some of the remaining 35% is pre-forclosure, short sale, and distressed buyers. I can't imagine wanting to list a house or having to list to move out of state for a new job.

CR, your charts/graphs remain a favorite part of the offerings here. Today's house prices graph is like an old friend, and mirrors the "main stages of a bubble/speculation phases," linked below. I guess we are headed into the 'fear' stage....,

main stages of a bubble : graph

¿uʍop ǝpısdn ɹo dn ǝpıs ʇɥƃıɹ ƃuıpuɐʇs ı ɯɐ 'punoɹ sı pןɹoʍ ǝɥʇ ǝɔuıs

That is a schweeeet too!

Juvenal Delinquent wrote:

Nippon didn't have the World's Reserve Currency status to lose...

Japan is a net exporter, the US is a net importer. If Asia has inflation, American prices also go up.

So, just eyeballing the graph, it looks like we have about another 15-20% drop coming to get us to "sane" pre-bubble levels. Is that about right?

Yep.....pretty easy to figure out........take that chart, draw a horizontal line (that's "left to right" for some of you) at the Jan 91 point across to present day. THAT'S where it'll stop plunging. But then, who ever listens to their gardener. :grin:

Kinda OT: Noob question
If you put in a formal offer for a house at 30% less than listed, and it's rejected, are you able to make another formal offer?

What are the rules regarding offers?

Very OT but... Anyone have a good chart or other source of info that shows yearly addition of funds to 401ks that goes back to the 80s?

I just can't understand why the SoCal market is stable and rising, with homes being worth so very much and folks sweating out the prospect of lowered pay or no job at all...

That's not the profile of somebody that wants to make a long-term investment

tncubsfan wrote:

So, just eyeballing the graph, it looks like we have about another 15-20% drop coming to get us to "sane" pre-bubble levels. Is that about right?

If you drew a linear trendline from the 70's through till now it might be at a reasonable level.

But even if it flattened at this level that'd be enough to completely screw a great deal of home-owners and investment banks.

come on JD, u know why....
your closer to the red carpet...

Black Star Ranch wrote:

Yep.....pretty easy to figure out........take that chart, draw a horizontal line (that's "left to right" for some of you) at the Jan 91 point across to present day. THAT'S where it'll stop plunging. But then, who ever listens to their gardener. :grin:

Your BLS CPI inflation adjusted Jan '91 line would curve upwards to 120 today. That's a far more realistic retracement to mean. Now depending upon the severity of the double dip we could overshoot to the low 100s but not back to the line you draw.

josap wrote:

Looking for someone to blame is my guess.

That is probably why he said that comment, but a good reporter would have gone into forbearance and the various modifications possible at some point.

If everyone can get a cram down, everyone will want one. I am not convinced that having to file bankruptcy will be a deterrent anymore.

PK is just full of shit.

one could just as easily compare big deficits, high debt and huge expansion to Zimbabwe or Weimar Germany or dozens of countries in the developed world.

I think the more interesting question is not why we can't be like Japan but why given those dynamics Japan didn't have inflation.

Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
I just can't understand why the SoCal market is stable and rising

Me neither. I've been following "Jim the Realtor's" videos on youtube lately and the theme seems to be "100% cash buyers". I am baffled by where all this cash is coming from. He made one reference to the cash buyers possibly being people who cashed out during the housing peak but I'm finding that hard to believe at this point.

I'm not seeing TEOTWAWKI deals like last year. I'm still kicking myself for not buying that Hollis house for 179k. That was the deal of a lifetime. Oh well, woulda, coulda, shoulda.

Hollis, Maine?

CaptainMorgan wrote:

I am not convinced that having to file bankruptcy will be a deterrent anymore.

BK is the only way to go in a full recourse state, or if you have a HELOC. People are figuring that out enmass now. One good thing to come from all of this is the increased awareness of finance in general.

Angry Saver wrote:

¿uʍop ǝpısdn ɹo dn ǝpıs ʇɥƃıɹ ƃuıpuɐʇs ı ɯɐ 'punoɹ sı pןɹoʍ ǝɥʇ ǝɔuıs

Looks right to me...

sk2322 wrote:

I am baffled by where all this cash is coming from.

Investor pools. They started up about a year ago.

Take your time, learn and educate yourself and hit the local library for a few books.

Duly noted. I have been waiting a good 5+ years. Debt free life is awesome. But the spouse is losing patience....

scone wrote:

I'm not seeing TEOTWAWKI deals like last year. I'm still kicking myself for not buying that Hollis house for 179k. That was the deal of a lifetime. Oh well, woulda, coulda, shoulda.

According to cyberhomes:
Cyberhomes.com - Home Details for 179 Pond St, Dunstable, MA 01827
Prices are still dropping; maybe Hollis is different-

going back to the thread comparing consumption versus income growth.

For 40 years we have been spending more than what we have been earning. For the first part we were making up for earning more than we were spending and then basically debt. It appears to me that pattern can only go on for so long even if one takes into consideration appreciating asset prices. After all the appreciated asset prices are a reflection of future income . Plus the longer you go spending more than you are earning the greater the interest cost that has to be paid. All things being equal the longer the period of spending more than earning the longer the period that one will have to spend less than earnings to reflect if nothing else the interest burden. Since don't appear to have reached that level yet it would appear that the worst is actually in front of us .

ResistanceIsFeudal wrote:

"home as investment/retirement/speculative vehicle" meme for a good long time.

Paying off a home prior to retirement is still a good plan, if it is the one you live in.

sk2322 wrote:

Me neither. I've been following "Jim the Realtor's" videos on youtube lately and the theme seems to be "100% cash buyers". I am baffled by where all this cash is coming from. He made one reference to the cash buyers possibly being people who cashed out during the housing peak but I'm finding that hard to believe at this point.

Speculators cashing out of the stock/commodities market? HELOC artists who took six figures out of a no-down loan they walked away from, now really buying a house with the cash? Just old money looking for a return and not seeing it in financials? Other possibilities?

Patience, grasshopper. I check MLS every day and NH prices are coming down.

Money Out Of Thin Air: Now Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke Wants To Eliminate Reserve Requirements Completely?

Cinco-X wrote:

Prices are still dropping; maybe Hollis is different-

I don't know why, but there's a lot of price resistance in Hollis. Also a lot of sellers who obviously are not really serious. The houses come on the market too high, they sit, then go off, then go back on again at the same price. That's why I think a good bit of the "shadow inventory" is moot-- these people don't have to sell, they're generally paid off, so the houses clog the inventory but don't really mean anything.

And New Hampshire is an older demographic, a lot of people have paid off their houses, they don't need a big family home, and they'd like to move somewhere warmer, but they want the buyer to fund their retirement. They aren't moving on price-- they have an "I deserve it, I worked hard to pay for it, therefore gimme" type of attitude.

Since don't appear to have reached that level yet it would appear that the worst is actually in front of us .

crazyv,

I think the worst is definitely still in front of us. Excessive debt has CONsequences. So does wealth distribution. So does poor government. Junk eCONomic thoeries have poisoned the well.

There will be no bailouts for the majority. Just the opposite. The majority will foot the bill for the minority's bailouts - a travesty that will make matters worse.

Investor pools. They started up about a year ago.

I just flashed to the Beardstown Business and Professional Women's Investment Club. Wiki says they are still going strong. I don't doubt it for a moment.

CaptainMorgan wrote:

but wouldn't want to invest in individual houses.

Lenders are selling groups of houses (10+) at 20 cents on the dollar to cash investors.
These never hit MLS.

I rented a nice big place to put off the spouse one more year, but costs near us are very close to rent so not much motivation to not buy or to buy as it's mostly a wash.

I have at times thought we should have went ahead and bought, but think we will be as well or better off by waiting another year.

I didn't necessarily mean to take you time in months or years by the way, but it is not a decision to get to emotional and rush. It's easy to look at horrible overpriced houses, see something nice and get carried away with the bidding. Spouses don't always help in that case.

josap wrote:

Lenders are selling groups of houses (10+) at 20 cents on the dollar to cash investors.
These never hit MLS.

Very common in the Vegas area. Probably the other big three states as well, and a few urban areas around the country...

Exactly. I would not want to invest in one house in terms of providing financing, but providing financing for ten spreads the risk among several people in terms of capital and risk to losing the capital.

The LTV on those has got to be significantly better than buying an individual house at a foreclosure auction, at least by the numbers I see locally. I think the bulk sales are not as common near me.

Very OT but... Anyone have a good chart or other source of info that shows yearly addition of funds to 401ks that goes back to the 80s?

The best source of this information is EBRI, as they do an ongoing participant-directed retirement plan collection project. Latest data is through 2008, showing average balances of $114,337 in 2007 and $86,513 in 2008; median balances of $57,933 in 2007 and $43,700 in 2008.

Go to EBRI.org and search for "401k" This data is from the 401(k) Plan Asset Allocation, Account Balances and Loan Activity report. It will be updated by EBRI soon.

It's easy to look at horrible overpriced houses, see something nice and get carried away with the bidding. Spouses don't always help in that case.

Yup. Rent is still much cheaper in most major cities in Canada.

My main concern in buying is the limited mobility it creates. Paying too much only affects me if I can't sell at a similar price within 3-5 years for a major job change (which happens often in the IT field).

If I have to settle... it will be a damn nice house that I won't mind keeping for 20 years if we have to.

scone - I found that different towns in this state can be like entirely different countries - some you like, others you would suffer to live in.

Seacoast area has been very resistant to price reductions up until very recently. I think you're going to find that in Hollis too. Barring a fantastic uptick in the economy. Which is highly unlikely.

I think this is all seasonality, with some extra boost from the new buyer tax credit.

I believe that core-logic is a repeat-sales index such as Case-Shiller. This means that they do not control for such things as whether a house is vacant or has been damaged (such as distressed sales). Therefore, the rise in vacant homes has meant that the difference between summer' andwinter' homes has increased. i.e. Good quality homes get listed in the sprign and summer, and in the other months it is the lower quality homes. This is a quality that is unobservable and so the repeat sales index cannot control for it.

btw i think core-logic is like Case-Shiller in that it uses county recorder data, not MLS data to calculate prices.

Mel wrote:

I resent the collard greens references

Calm down, Mel. The references are derived from the Run-D.M.C. lyrics for "Christmas in Hollis":

It's Christmas time in Hollis Queens
Mom's cooking chicken and collard greens
Rice and stuffing, macaroni and cheese
And Santa put gifts under Christmas trees

QE ending. Check
House Credit ending. Check
Shadow inventory eyeing spring. Check

Does anyone think prices will be able to rise this year absent another huge round of government welfare?

I think I would call the extreme right side of your graph "Mini-me" CR........

scone wrote:

I would not buy here. There's a hillbilly F-150 element

You say that like it's a bad thing

Outsider wrote:

Seacoast area has been very resistant to price reductions up until very recently. I think you're going to find that in Hollis too.

Yes, indeed. Hollis is stunningly beautiful, and you pay for that. OTOH, they've adopted a slow-growth policy, rationing building permits, and they are buying up land for conservancy. So there's less danger of boom and bust than there is in, say, Brookline, next door.

Cinco-X wrote:

WTF are you talking about?

Like watermelon, it [used to have?] very racist overtones. Run DMC is kinda modern for the folks that would have heard those overtones, which I put in the category of "good thing" cuz the bad meanings are getting defused.

flaminia wrote:

SoCal has an exceptional concentration of stupid people.

American Idle needs people to produce it so "Stupid is as stupid does, Sir!"

yagij wrote:

To (rural?) southern folks, collard greens (and chicken) were part of their diet regardless of race (which is what I inferred was implied). Black-eye peas, fatback, and all of the other "fixin's".

Yup; however, I've never seen or heard of collards flavored with chicken (sans the reference above). Salt, Pepper, Butter, and fatback (like bacon) are the traditional flavorings of Southern cooking....

Cinco-X wrote:

I grew up eating collard greens. WTF are you talking about?

Help out the foreigner here: WTF are collard greens?

Rob Dawg wrote:

As opposed to where?

Tokyo, Berlin, Paris, and Beijing. D'uh.

JP wrote:

I assume when you cross those two problems, you get a pinus?

Paging Elvis, Paging Elvis, you're presence is required in thread #9335.

WTF are collard greens?

Nasty tasting leafy vegetable, cue spinach.

JP wrote:

Like watermelon, it [used to have?] very racist overtones.

I've heard of that, but I grew up eating that as well as working in watermelon fields; brutal in the FL sun, and you can't enter the fields in the morning until after the sun has burned away the dew.

Cinco-X wrote:

scone wrote:

I would not buy here. There's a hillbilly F-150 element

You say that like it's a bad thing

It takes all kinds to make a world. Nothing wrong with it. I'm just more into the little old lady garden clubs and weekly lecture slides of "My Trip Through Norway's Fjords." Also bitch 'n stitch. And amateur dog shows. And country auctions. And harvest festivals...

noob goldberg wrote:

Help out the foreigner here: WTF are collard greens?

Popular leafy green for human consumption. Bit on the chewy side, but at least they don't go slimy. Classic southern po' food, but pretty popular among the organic granola crowd on the west coast, too.

noob goldberg wrote:

Also, EIA just came out with a -11b draw-down

I may have posted this before, but cash players in the commodity markets in the past played a number of "games" reporting their inventories. First of all, I don't think the CFTC or anybody else ever checks if full storage facilities are really full. That goes for oil storage tanks, or caverns in the midwest that store NG or for grain elevators or refrigerated storage lockers where pork bellies(bacon) are stored. Exchanges trade deliverable receipts and it's probably fraud to misrepresent your inventory, but Billy Sol Estes did it and went to jail, IIRC. But these numbers can be misleading if inventories are moved from a certified reporting facility to one that is not; the inventory figure declines, but the inventory doesn't. Don't believe everything you read.

scone wrote:

It takes all kinds to make a world. Nothing wrong with it. I'm just more into the little old lady garden clubs and weekly lecture slides of "My Trip Through Norway's Fjords." Also bitch 'n stitch. And amateur dog shows. And country auctions. And harvest festivals...

Except that the prices are hysterical and there's no work, you should have moved to Santa Cruz. Despite the hippie rep, we've got all that as well.

I love greens of all kinds. I mix in Mustard, Turnip and Swiss Chard with my Collards. Yum.

noob goldberg wrote:

Help out the foreigner here: WTF are collard greens?

Similar to other greens, like spinach, mustard greens, etc. Southerners typically boil them to death; IIRC, you typically boil them, drain the water off and boil again to take out the bitterness. That's especially important as the plants get older and the weather gets hotter. Poke Salad is the greens of poke; it's poisonous, so these greens need to be be boiled and drain 3 times to be safe to eat....

Collards make a good soup, like kale or sorrel. You can also stew them like spinach. Put a little bacon in a heavy pot with some olive oil, saute some onions and garlic, then throw in the collards, with a couple of tablespoons of red wine vinegar. Cover and turn the heat down for 5 minutes. It's very good, especially with lamb or game. Okra is great in gumbos or currys, or you can roll it in cornmeal and saute-- again with a little bacon. That's really good, not slimy at all.

noob, you clean the green leafs from the stems and wash well. You take two or three smoked ham hocks and put them in a pot of chicken stock with a couple bay leaves, some red pepper flakes and a tbsp of sugar. Bring to a boil and simmer for about a half hour. Add the greens and simmer until tender. Usually another 45 minutes or so.

Comrade Kristina wrote:

I love greens of all kinds. I mix in Mustard, Turnip and Swiss Chard with my Collards. Yum.

Alright, CK, next time I can come up with an excuse to be in the south can I expect a good southern Collard dinner?

I'll reciprocate, of course, and prepare back-bacon drizzled in maple syrup with a side of poutine anytime you make it to the great white north.

Outsider wrote:

I've never had collard greens, but okra is absolutely the most disgusting food on this planet. Like eating big fat slugs. Yick.
Grits ain't so great either. Or that liver fried stuff. What's that called again?
Other than that, I love the south.
edit: scrapple. YICK. Maybe it's not southern but more Penn. Whatever.

Okra need to be fried; I never heard of it being studied, but typically plants with that slimy inside are quite high in soluble fiber.
Grits are fantastic; I hope you didn't make the mistake of adding sugar to them as some Yankees do. That WOULD be awful. As for myself, I never figured out how y'all could stomach Cream of Wheat.
They used to do scrapple when my Mom was a kid in AL. There we agree.....

Here was their church, and here's the sheeple
Open the door and see all the people.
Here's the realtor going upstairs,
And here he is preying on the savers.

I'm from up north originally noob. I learned to make greens for my husband who is African American. Greens are a staple in the Black community all around the country as they took the Southern cooking North with them when they became free. I always loved Chard and Spinach so greens wasn't a big jump for me anyway. I like mine with Red Wine Vinegar on them.

flaminia wrote:

Rob, I despair of coming up with any other explanation for the breathless enthusiasm people exhibit when looking at an $800K 3/2 that needs a crapload of deferred maintenance dealt with.

I have one nearby. Paid high $8s, spent a year and maybe $300k rehab/expansion. Sitting on market 6 months plus asking $1.6m. Wait... update: $1.9m They bumped the price! 1332 Fairway Dr, Camarillo, CA 93010 - Zillow

I never felt at home until I moved to Ohio. I've lived all over the country, but the midwest calls to me, even now. I am thinking Minnesota when I get out of the Navy; my wife hates the cold, tough luck for her.

Okra is best pickled and added to Spicy Bloody Marys. Although it is awesome in Gumbo as well.

otishertz wrote:

Followed by the "Me Generation"

More and more in the workplace employees are referred to as the "team." And when some fatuous management type says "There's no 'i' in team," I think, yeah, but there's "me," isn't there? And "meat."

FOllowed by the internet scrapbook generation that is too dumbed down to even whine about it.

Nuke wrote:

my wife hates the cold, tough luck for her.

Remember: a happy wife equals a happy life.

noob goldberg wrote:

I'll reciprocate, of course, and prepare back-bacon drizzled in maple syrup with a side of poutine anytime you make it to the great white north.

Why not bring her some real smoked salmon from BC when you arrive?

Nuke wrote:

I am thinking Minnesota when I get out of the Navy; my wife hates the cold, tough luck for her.

It just makes you better appreciate the warm. It is 55 degrees F in Ottawa this week, and everyone is happy, cheerful, and smiling. The snow melted, the birds came out, the girls dug out their skirts and the guys are all in t-shirts.

Bob Dobbs wrote:

otishertz wrote:
Followed by the "Me Generation"
More and more in the workplace employees are referred to as the "team." And when some fatuous management type says "There's no 'i' in team," I think, yeah, but there's "me," isn't there? And "meat."

There's also "ATM."

Cinco-X wrote:

Why not bring her some real smoked salmon from BC when you arrive?

I'd have to get out to BC for that. I'm nuzzled up to the Quebec border, so it's maple syrup and poutine for me

Juvenal Delinquent wrote:

Logan's Scooter?

Yep

"Maybe not a wall - perhaps a small step."

Fond memories of 36 foot ramps required by code to conquer a 36 inch elevation.

crazyv wrote:

0r cut them up and saute them until they are crisp

I wonder if you can put them on the grill? Say, put some olive oil on them, and stick them on skewers with other veggies and meat? I'll bet that would be good. Then dip them in baba ghanous (sp?) or hummus.

JP wrote:
Followed by "The Too-Busy-Whining-On-The-Internet-To-Do-Anything-About-It Generation".

Who would have ever thought that the i.e.d.'s* going off would have such an effect on local governments?

*Improvised Economic Decrees

noob goldberg wrote:

We just went through a few months that ranged from -4 to 14 F.

I thought I read somewhere this was the warmest winter on record for Canada? Damn!

Comrade Kristina wrote:

Amazing the memories that come rushing back.

Speaking of nostalgia, my wife came home from the library with this book, and my knees almost buckled:

Amazon.com: Cars and Trucks and Things That Go (Giant Little Golden Book) (0807728432850): Richard Scarry: Books

My dad used to read that book to me when I was a kid, and now I'm reading it to my son. And I still enjoy finding the little goldbug on every page. Now I think the "find the goldbug" game is even more fun than when I was young, of course.

otishertz wrote:

we need to come up with a name for the internet scrapbook generation to shame them into changing.

Just can't show the initiative yourself, can you?

otishertz wrote:

Facebook and Myspace accounts are going to become internet tombstones and badges of shame. They will be seen as evidence of whistling while Rome burned.

Please don't jinx it all! I need to earn my Boss rank in Mafia Wars first!

Cinco-X wrote:

I thought I read somewhere this was the warmest winter on record for Canada? Damn!

Across the entire country, yes. My SIL is in northern Alberta, and they should have the mercury firmly planted between -4 and -40F from December through March, but even they had a few weeks of weather in the 40's and 50's.

For us, we had some pretty cold snaps in December and January, but it's gotten milder over the past few weeks.

yagij wrote:

And where does that leave us, Mr. RIF?

LOL. Good point. How do we actually stop the stupidity instead of just whining like otis?

Mr Slippery wrote:

Money Out Of Thin Air: Now Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke Wants To Eliminate Reserve Requirements Completely?

There are no reserve requirements. The Fed creates reserves as necessary to meet commercial bank lending. Commercial banks wag the Fed tail. The money multiplier theory works exactly the opposite in reality.

That's what Mish claims; "reserves follow lending"...........

Not quite time for the fiddle yet. It's still Caligula out there.

NateTG wrote:

It's still Caligula out there.

We aren't really to Sulla yet on the Analogy Timeline. It only gets worse from here.

NateTG wrote:

Not quite time for the fiddle yet. It's still Caligula out there.

Yeah, it could be argued that we've declared war on the sea. In several different ways.

if you don't like collard greens, you haven't had good ones. I have some fresh collard greens in my fridge right now.
Of course good ones require fatback or a secret ingredient like "smoked pork" which is what i prefer. On their own I imagine they aren't much fun to eat.

Not to be disagreeable, but bacon/bacon fat can make anything taste good.....doesn't mean i like the underlying food.

This thing with no more reserve requirements as policy is completely insane.

I know it has been going on for a long time but he idea of everyone knowing this really makes me wonder because this is explicitly hyperinflationary. People will not properly asses but billionaires will and they will move money.

JP wrote:

How do we actually stop the stupidity instead of just whining like otis?

I would put it similar to this poem:

Each of the three (warlords of Japan's Sengoku era) faces a caged bird, that would not want to entertain them with it’s sweet voice.
The first, Oda Nobunaga, would say: if the bird will not sing, I will kill it.
The second, Toyotomi Hideyoshi, would say: if the bird will not sing, I will try to make it sing
The third, Tokugawa Ieyasu, would say: if the bird will not sing, i will wait.

I'm still in the Waiting camp.

otishertz wrote:

This thing with no more reserve requirements as policy is completely insane.

Why bother with reserves when you can print them at will? As such, they're just a waste of bits on the computer.....

lotsa on the intertubes today.

Thanks for posting this index...

RE: "The index has declined for five consecutive months."

That hasn't stopped many from claiming that "the bottom" has been reached or will soon be reached in residential real estate.

There are many metrics one can use to value residential real estate. By many of these metrics, one can say that real estate is "fairly priced" or even "a buy."

However, on an "all things considered" basis I don't believe that is the case. Here is my recent blog post on the subject for those interested:

An Interesting Article On Housing Prices | EconomicGreenfield

RockyR wrote:

lotsa Dooooooooooooooom!!! on the intertubes today.

Economic growth seen slowing this summer - Stocks & economy- msnbc.com

Cinco-X wrote:

That's what Mish claims; "reserves follow lending"...........

That's also what Steve Keen claims, and several other economists. Reserves clearly don't create lending. Look at excess reserves right now. Over a trillion, velocity slowing, total credit going down.

The kind of system that is developing will only hold together if compulsory. The kind of all day economic surveillance that corporations do will allow surveillance and compliance to merge in software.

There is no check on financial power without cash. The only way they hold this together is by outlawing cash.

lawyerliz wrote:

Drama in the ll household-more--grandma lawyyerliz fell in the parking lot.

Ug. You guys seem to have excess gravity down there.

lawyerliz wrote:

Drama in the ll household-more--grandma lawyyerliz fell in the parking lot. Anxiety making mr hip hurt in spite of pain pills.

Oh dear. Sorry to hear that, Liz.

yagij wrote:
ResistanceIsFeudal wrote:
Followed by "The Too-Busy-Whining-On-The-Internet-To-Do-Anything-About-It Generation".
And where does that leave us, Mr. RIF?
Sorry, I had to take care of some important matters. My pony is lonely in Farmville.

ResistanceIsFeudal wrote:

My pony is lonely in Farmville.

Do you need any planks or nails for your horse stable?

Kitco web site seems to be over loaded. No response.

JP wrote:

I have a theoretical explanation for everything.

I forget - are you an economist by trade?

Mr Slippery wrote:

Kitco web site seems to be over loaded.

up barely. Everything else down barely. (< 0.4%)

Honestly, I'm a little confused, what exactly does 'reserve' mean. If it's simply (money deposited)-(money lent) then it seems like reserves should be largely unaffected by lending rates in a fractional reserve system, and that reserves should go up when people become risk averse.

"Yuan float coming."
I'm still wondering if there is any way to cause that without PROC cooperation?

More linkage: Fannie Mae Slashes Mortgage Investment Forecast | N2PQ Mortgage News and Information Network

“Unfortunately, despite the high hopes associated with the extended and expanded homebuyer tax credit, housing activity appears to have faced a setback that went beyond the impact of adverse weather conditions,” the economists wrote.

Ahh, well, you know...

umm.

yep

yagij wrote:

Everything else down barely. (< 0.4%)

NAtural Gas is down 5.5%. Oil down 1%.

noob goldberg wrote:

NAtural Gas is down 5.5%. Oil down 1%.

Nat. Gas: The Commodity That Won't Follow The Rules!

Ignore the Market's Low Volume at Your Peril - Getting Technical - M. Kahn - Barrons.com

MANY IN THE FINANCIAL MEDIA have latched on to the argument that the low-volume nature of the recent stock rally doesn't necessarily undermine it. After watching the stock market grind higher over the past two months, I must agree that basing investment decisions on volume has left many looking silly in the face of a strong bull advance.

Still, one of the most dangerous phrases in investing is "this time it's different." While there are periods when basic concepts of trading and market psychology seem to be out of line with reality, eventually they do make their way back. Think back to the end of the Internet bubble when price/earnings ratios were discarded in favor of "new economy" metrics. It only worked for a short few months.

For this reason, I must caution investors that volume does indeed still matter. And when volume does start to increase, it might be a sign of a turn in the market and not the signal that it is time to buy.

lawyerliz wrote:
Drama in the ll household-more--grandma lawyyerliz fell in the parking lot. Anxiety making mr hip hurt in spite of pain pills.
Damn, sorry to hear the news, LL... unfortunately these things tend to come in threes, so here's hoping number three is minor and relatively pain-free!

Off to lunch... it's time at the salt mines...

yagij wrote:

NAtural Gas is down 5.5%. Oil down 1%.
Nat. Gas: The Commodity That Won't Follow The Rules!

Nat. Gas: The Only Commodity That Follows The Rules?

Most U.S. Stocks Fall on Speculation Fed to Lift Discount Rate - Bloomberg.com

Raising rates? What happened to the "extended period"?

Outsider wrote:

okra is absolutely the most disgusting food on this planet. Like eating big fat slugs. Yick.

Okra is great. It's like the gateway slime. Once you start enjoying okra, you might end up trying Japanese natto one day.

Downsize your home. : 21 Ways to Reduce Your Retirement Expenses - US News & World Report

china-drawing-high-tech-research-from-us: Personal Finance News from Yahoo! Finance

Looks like found something we can export to China!

OT: My linguistic centers were churning overnight on mp's thoughts.

Coining a new word: knab, an anti-bank.

Maury the Credit Responsibility Panda wrote:

Coining a new word: knab, an anti-bank.

I say "ʞuɐq" to honor the rules of pןɹoʍ oɹɹɐzıq.

Berine feel out of bed again?

The cbo report on healthcare is out and it looks to me most of the reduction is coming out of medicare and other stupid assumptions....we are spending 940 billion to lose 800 billion by the looks of it over 10 years...

http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/113xx/doc11355/hr4872.pdf
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2010-19
COMMUNITY LIVING ASSISTANCE SERVICES AND SUPPORTS 0.0 0.0 -5.4 -8.8 -10.0 -11.3 -11.1 -9.1 -7.6 -7.0 -24.1 -70.2

those seniors or savers sure are getting reamed...

this bill is b/s...calling senators and house people right now...

RE: cash buyers from Jim the realtor -

So, who are these cash buyers? The Tice chickens are coming home to roost, only took a few minutes of legwork to find the paperwork.

"The Company has decided to focus its initial efforts on a plan of operation that would focus on marketing high-quality, distressed residential properties in exclusive US markets (with an initial focus on California) to international buyers (primarily from China and other parts of Asia) through exclusive selling agreements or consignment arrangements."

Read more: JK Acquisition Corp. - FORM 8-K/A - February 9, 2010

Otishertz will never, ever grow old.