Nearing Retirement and Unemployed or Underemployed
Submitted by
CalculatedRisk on Sat, 03/13/2010 - 11:06am (198 comments)
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They have assets and thus have a target painted on their back.
Take heart America. There's still a lot of wealth stripping potential in the eCONomy.
The debt eCONomy is awesome. Boomer retirees will be competing with new entrants in the work force and illegal immigrants forever.
We have to get debt...I mean credit flowing.
pigged
At the top of this thread someone llnked thhe report on Lehman. Rather that read it all, which is unlikely, I suggest reading the table of contents for appendix 1. It will tell you a lot.
http://lehmanreport.jenner.com/VOLUME%206%20-%20APPENDIX%201.pdf
play this in the background
YouTube - BRUCE COCKBURN - If I Had A Rocket Launcher
Describes my B-I-L to a T. Formerly worked IT at a bank, long-time unemployed, every job interview he competes with 20-40 applicants. Marriage crumbling. Luckily for them, they didn't HELOC their home underwater during the boom, or they'd have the won the new Middle Class Trifecta of doom.
Maybe the Fed will quantitatively ease the pain of debt impoverished boomers by overpaying for the equities in their mutual funds.
DCRogers wrote:
That is unfortunate, DC. Do you think the unemployment is the cause of the marriage problem or just a factor?
Maybe the Fed will quantitatively ease the pain of debt impoverished boomers by overpaying for the equities in their mutual funds.
If donuts grew on trees....
Mr Slippery wrote:
It brings out pre-existing fault lines.
I ejected from house and wife before the Crash, though.
I'm counting on having my employment power for maybe 10-15 more years. Saving like mad expecting that I may never see that level of income again. My 50's and 60's income will be icing on my retirement, not make or break years.
pavel.chichikov wrote:
Then you would have a hard time finding a cop. Around these parts you can find one in just about every
parking lot. Night or day.
The Lorax wrote:
I feel much the same way. I'm 40 and figure I've got 10 more years to save. I came close to pushing the reset button 2 yrs ago and trading income for the security of a govt job. I'll see if that was a mistake or not.
Mr Slippery wrote:
A big factor. People underestimate how difficult it is to be without work to organize your life; toss in fragmenting finances and the normal strains of marriage and kid, it's hard not imagine it could be better, elsewhere, somewhere else, anywhere else.
nova
!
bruce cockburn, stealing fire,
absolutely one of the best CDs i got in the collection
broward wrote:
That's got to be stressful, but you seem to have come through it intact.
I start a new job Monday, I was unemployed exactly 17 months.
Part of that was by choice, I turned down four job offers.
New position is a nominal improvement on my last, with good potential to be a new career peak.
I had five interviews going, and Friday's offer triggered an immediate second offer, and good possibility of a third. All three are good deals but after a day of reflection, I have to go with the career peak even though it has much more risk.
I wish I'd only got the one offer, though.
One is a small consulting company with huge backing doing a project I laid groundwork for and the guys there are great. The other is a startup doing interesting stuff that's almost cash-flow positive with a couple of "name" people.
I'm going to go buy a car now.
broward wrote:
broward - congratulations. Are you staying in Boise or moving?
broward
congratulations
just one piece of advice when test driving
dont floor it! and if the vehicle accelerates out of control
loose speed right away by strafing guard rails and parked cars early and often
My wife just told me about a coworker who just refinanced after buying a year and a half ago. He was sure it was the "bottom." He told her that now he could have gotten twice the size house if he had waited for the same price...
Broward,
Very cool. It will be strange going to work again I bet.
Interesting Graph at the Frankfurter Allgemeine
The Forgotten Sovereign Defaults
http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/4479/37590743.png
Edit: corrected link
broward wrote:
Come on. Don't leave us hanging. Are we talking used Corolla or Lexus SC430?
"
NEW YORK (Reuters) - Jon Daurio, chief executive officer of mortgage investor Kondaur Capital Corp., recently offered a $4,000 check to Barry Culver for the deed to his Bryan, Ohio house.
With the exchange, and a pay-off to a second-lien holder, Culver was freed of $120,000 in crushing mortgage debt on the house, said Daurio, who had bought the right to cut the deal when he purchased the mortgage months earlier. The house, after repairs, is now on the market for $47,500.
"
.
.
"
U.S. modification efforts to date have been "tragic" in delaying housing and economic recovery, Daurio said.
"All you are doing is delaying depreciation of the houses," Daurio said. "You are not preventing it by keeping people in a house that they can't afford."
More than 11 million properties with mortgages are "underwater," according to First American CoreLogic. Efforts to expand use of principal forgiveness haven't caught on.
"
"Cash for keys" aids home borrowers, investors - Yahoo! Finance
~30 cents on the dollar, and that includes the investor's profits!
Not sure this is a sizable phenomenon yet, do not recall CR writing about it.
Rob Dawg wrote:
Most don't - something like 3/4s have close to zero net worth. Some have some and a few have a lot - the latter will be targets for the rest [young & old alike].
Rob Dawg wrote:
lol my thought too. come back here; what car?
RE,
The link to the website has the better graph. Interesting further down when they mention how building the Armada ruined Spain financially. Our Armada is CRE and housing.
dryfly wrote:
I see it as the great equalizing. The social welfare safety net such as it is will be the floor for the new underclass. The object is to engineer the bifurcation without all the annoying kicking and screaming.
Yeah, but---
"Time waits for no one
And it won't wait for me"
4thstreet wrote:
I'm thinking his ride will be a sweet 2006 Volvo V-70R. Black on black with 60k miles.
nova wrote:
Nova, yes they shrunk it down incredibly. The site must be in trouble. I'll have to switch sites, I think.
I see broward in a black 2010 Challenger
the workers between the ages of 45 and 64.
ZIRP is doing them no favors as the closer to retirement they get the more risk averse (fixed income) they (should) become. Unfortunately, Ben is leading them by the hand into the casino. Good luck.
The fun part, which I am already seeing, is management having to tell people it is time to go. People who would normally be ready to go but can't. So what do you do? You tell someone in their 60's that they can;t do the job, usually because of health reasons, knowing they will end up homeless or close to it? Even if they gave the company years of their life? Sure you do.
broward wrote:
Really fantastic news.
hey a new poll
what car will broward buy?
i see him in a ford fusion hybrid...0-60 in 8 1/2 seconds
or a camry
nova wrote:
I corrected the graph now.
http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/4479/37590743.png
black dog wrote:
I laugh when I hear the new suggestions for market exposure. Used to be 90 minus age. Then 100. Now the b@st@rds "suggest" 120 minus. Running out of new Ponzi entrants perhaps?
retracted.
some of the old school boomer doomers
who aint savy enuf to steal money the squid way..
no quant access
no computers next door to the exchange for front-running
didnt work for.... or go to school with.... timmay or ben, so no inside information
may have to steal the money the old fashioned way
like bonney and clyde
heres a peg of the back then
http://www.cenlamedia.com/alb/images/newsarticles/bonnie_and_clyde.jpg
Poll up: A Car for Broward | Hoocoodanode?
rob dawg
word...yep you bet they are worse than monsters
a couple mornings ago on a morning wall street journal report
i heard an interview
some numb skull say it wasnt even 100 or 120 minus age equals stock exposure...why?
this puke had the audacity to say you have to figure social security as part of the savings - bond side so
he concluded really even those in their 60s ought to be neck deep in stocks...sob
The F-250 is nice but broward read the color schemes available for your Challenger!
The 2010 Challenger will be making its debut shortly, and a couple of changes from Dodge have generated a lot of interest in the new model. To start, the 2010 Challenger will be available in two new “High Impact” colors; Detonator Yellow and Plum Crazy.
thanks rob dawg!
nova wrote:
Det Cord Financial Bomb Yellow and Plum Company Investment Crazy.
US High-Speed Rail: China To Bid On Projects
Stimulus created or saved 1 million jobs [in China]
mock turtle wrote:
Liked my choices? I want to hear what Mr. Horne has to say. All in good fun.
If China takes dollars for trains, it would be tough to beat any price they want.
oo-rah
I'd go for throttle up red, Challenger.
But if that's too expensive, a Pinto Hatchback (to better attract Prii) from the 70's will do
Rob Dawg wrote:
Hello? Are those the only choices available?
REBear wrote:
From the link: "China is willing to share its mature and advanced technology with other countries to promote development of the world's high-speed railways," Wang said.
Generous. Lying sunufabitchbastard.
For anyone interested in the most blatant
website on the internet I suggest: California High Speed Rail Blog
The author, Robert Cruishank, doesn't tolerate negative brainwaves so don't bother trying to pop his bubble but it does show the dark side of the web.
Yeah. I got downsized when I was 55 and spent the next 2 1/2 years without a paycheck. I never again worked a steady, full time job. I did temp work until I turned 68, then had to sell the house. Sucks, but we got out at the top of the market and are renters now.
Vader is in that group. 59 cronic unemployed.
SIL and wife has moved in, when he lost job. Figure household of 5 adults. One(wife) has full time job 1 23 is pizza delivery person. One 40s catches works off and on as a car detailer, One 30s is looking for govt disability, one 20s is looking for work at pizza place and one ex programmer 59 sells computer junk on eBay.
The American Dream.
If one can stand cash only and living very modestly, one can avoid honest work in undesirable work place.
We have house over our heads and food on table for he foreseeable future. BOA sent ugly letter that I was behind 2 months on mortgage. I sent ugly letter with copies of canceled checks. BOA does seem to foreclose on homes with no mortgages Bank of America Sued for Foreclosing on Wrong Homes - ABC News.
dryfly wrote:
Leave a damn comment. Do I have to do everything?
Let me guess, you wanted a Lincoln Towncar? No, you are thinking Mazda Speed3.
It's not all bad news for the boomers. Bernanke's exponential debt growth plan has also led to exponential growth in the number of people on food stamps. No joke. That part of our eCONomy is experiencing growth like never before. Serious exponential growth.
The number of Americans on food stamps as of 12/2009 was 39 million (about 13% of the population).
Oh yeah. We have to get debt....I mean credit flowing or we'll have a depression.
Wile E. Lomans are getting beep beep'd financially...
wait a minute
oh no
should we have made a hummer an option
not !
just bein a smart-ass
Rob Dawg wrote:
The Pelosi - from Congressional Motors of course - duh!!!
the pelosi
it has 8 coats of paint (smirk)
anyone see the awfull peg of her on drudge several days ago...
he always puts up such complimentary pictures of dem libruls
mock turtle wrote:
And stretch formed body.
I got the limited edition Pelosi with Landau roof, and trustproofing underneath
Seems suited to any thread here.........
** Where are the fucking indictments?**
why cant the dems have pretty reps like boehner and backman
oh thats right we got O
Every recession seems to nail the current age group close to retirement as unemployable. History repeats.
It's a one-size-fails-all gig, and if you indict one of the Unabankers, the others come along extra at no added charge...
I don't know, maybe Pelosi is on to something. I'm curious to see just how bad the health care bill really is. I say we pass it so we can find out. Besides, it's likely to lead to more problems which might lead to some desperately needed financial innovation.
We HAVE to do SOMETHING.
.....Perfect. This is just perfect. Put together a number of large totally unneeded projects across the US, while providing China with the contracts to build the stuff while our work force rots. I can't think of a more fitting way to "pay the vig".
** Where are the fucking indictments?**
Well, if it's any CONsolation, last years $140 billion of Wall St. bonuses were an indictment of the entire system.
Angry Saver wrote:
Hey AS - I'm a librul and I'm guessing its REAL bad - basically shoveling money into insurers to keep them from [1] shutting down or [2] jacking premiums through the roof. It is to health care what bailouts to AIG was to affordable housing.
RE wrote:
The FA is channeling those who are arguing to just let Greece default. (The radicals in this debate are those who want to throw Greece out of the Euro zone -- but they can default without having to delink.)
Bet they're pissed off that a "conservative" government hasn't blocked the apparently-coming Greek debt guarantees. If the FPD were smart, they'd use this opportunity to sink the CDU and grab the populist lead on the right.
broward wrote:
Voila!
YouTube - Tennessee Ernie Ford - 16 Tons (Go-Go Version)
Angry Saver wrote:
the contract is broken
dry fly
i have to disagree
the hcr has several good parts to it
not the lease of which is ending recision, and getting almost everybody in
so we end the use of emergency rooms
as the health care modality
for the dispossessed
and the evil kneval doers
US High-Speed Rail: China To Bid On Projects
Irony in that. They have an established history in US RR construction.
The pigman's ponzi is under FIRE:
Bloomberg.com:
TV and Radio
nova wrote:
The new MBA-management types often appear to enjoy it -- quoth Dilbert, "firing employees is like printing money". You can teach this 'skill' in school -- much hard to teach how to create actual value by engineering cool things and hiring people to do it. That's why managers who 'create value' using the former technique are a dime-a-dozen, the latter rare.
Mildly close to topic: Beat the Press Archive | The American Prospect
This means that Peter Peterson, David Walker and the rest of the deficit hawk crew want workers to have very low private savings, so that they will have nothing to live on in retirement when we cut their Social Security and Medicare. They may not say this, and it's possible that they don't even understand it themselves, but that is the logical conclusion of their position.
That may make Peter Peterson look bad, but accounting identities are even more powerful than rich Wall Street investment bankers with a billion dollars to buy newspapers, reporters, and economists.
mock turtle wrote:
I wish I could be more optimistic about that working. What I expect is a shift to clinics with similar cost structures and no net savings. Until you can eliminate the $400 band-aids and the $20 aspirin, I don't see how you save money.
Here's some more color on our latest growth industry - food stamps.
Over the last three years, the number of Americans on food stamps has grown at an ~ 14% annualized rate. But the news gets better. Over the past year, the growth rate was ~ 23%! At a 23% growth rate, almost everybody will be covered by the program in about ten years.
At least the boomers won't go hungry.
'Phoodlatelists'
sm_landlord,
I agree shifting just puts the cost on a different expense sheet. Breaking even with all the high tech and freebies mandated by government has to come from some where. Add more free users and it blows up.
another OT: Somehow I missed this. Last year's CC debt dropped by $93B (to a total of $876B), but $83B of that was writeoffs. Nice.
Write-offs are driving decline in credit-card debt - MarketWatch
It's a good thing Bernanke won't allow another Great Depression for the wealthiest 1/10 of 1% of Americans. Bernanke has quantitatively eased the pain they so richly deserved for decades of mal-investment and senseless credit creation.
It's important to remember, someone's crushing debt burden is some hedge fund manager's private plane.
It's important to remember, someone's expected pension payouts is some hedge fund manager's private
.
My god that's a horribly depressing story. I don't even know what to say.
I found out on Friday that a middle-aged grant reviewer on my project (she's working on a three month contract, lives in MI ordinarily) has a PhD in statistics. Talk about overqualified for the job, but she's fortunate to have this one.
I feel lucky that I'm still young (30-35 demographic), and far more fortunate to have work right now, even if it's not in my chosen field. As easy as it is to blame the majority of the country's problems on the baby boomers, the fact remains that most of that generation is not doing well. Only a select few who have been looting and cheating and stealing while the rest wish for nothing more than the right to toil away at meaningless jobs in order to keep a roof over their heads.
I'm not an emotional person by nature, but it absolutely breaks my heart to see what is happening to this country. It's easy to sit at your keyboard and bitch about things from the comfort of our own homes/apartments, but stories like this really get to the real human toll of this situation. Merit has nothing to do with who's struggling. Education isn't a golden ticket to a great future. Our economy really seems to be nothing more than a casino where a few strike it rich and rest leave with empty pockets.
dryfly wrote:
Wife's Medigap premium just went up about 30%... in one shot.... Medicare premium deducted from SS will go up too, not sure how much yet...
Angry Saver wrote:
our money is debt and without debt there is no money, therefore he has to save the biggest debt creators
lobbyist ben dover
sm_landlord
you gotta point...and i dont know if the legislation pans out as planned...
CBO syas its relatively neutral short run and reduces the bleeding red ink long run
but nobody knows for sure until its tried
there are fraud reduction, best practices, and efficacy procedures that may make a big difference
or may get effed during implementation
doing nothing means that medcare goes bust
the free drug medcare part D plan that bush got passed just before his second term
put a huge hole in medicare more than twice as bad as what was
the mendacity...gov wasnt allowed to bargain for its drugs
then again you all know the connection between eli lilly and the bush clan
Rob Dawg wrote:
World oil production peaked in 2008 at 81.73 million barrels/day (mbd) shown in the chart below. This oil definition includes crude oil, lease condensate, oil sands and natural gas plant liquids. If natural gas plant liquids are excluded, then the production peak remains in 2008 but at 73.79 mbd. However, if oil sands are also excluded then crude oil and lease condensate production peaked in 2005 at 72.75 mbd.
Can someone remind me of the macro numbers here? Boomers, what, 78 million; total labor force about 140m; boomer scheduled retirement from nowish til 2020 at the tail. Job creation anemic, composition of new jobs likely skewed against near-retirees, possibly excepting gov but revenues cannot support that hiring; SS a gamble, MEW inversed, credit cards about as friendly as a boxcutter to the aorta...
Hard to see the way through here, especially with QE/debt pushing the outer limits of sustainability and the money multiplier sub 1.
Answers on the back of an envelope, anyone?
C
Counterpointer wrote:
What's the point?
tg
angry saver
there have been no indictments because
several in the obama administration
and in the federal reserve
are complicit in fraud
and if ya pull on the string the entire fabrik of lies gets unwoven and pulled apart
plus, dems and repubs in congress are also neck deep in the voodoo economics (as first bush president wisely called it)
terrible shame spitzer had no zipper control...he might have been our ferdinand peccora
from wikipedia
"Ferdinand J. Pecora (January 6, 1882 – December 7, 1971) was an American lawyer and judge who became famous in the 1930s as Chief Counsel to the United States Senate Committee on Banking and Currency during its investigation of Wall Street banking and stock brokerage practices.
Ferdinand Pecora was born in Nicosia, Sicily, the son of Louis Pecora and Rosa Messina who emigrated to the United States and New York City with his parents. He earned a law degree from New York Law School and eventually worked as an assistant district attorney in New York City, during which time he helped shut down more than 100 bucket shops.
Originally a Progressive Republican, Ferdinand Pecora was appointed Chief Counsel to the U.S. Senate's Committee on Banking and Currency in the last months of the Herbert Hoover presidency by its outgoing Republican chairman, Peter Norbeck, and then continued under Democratic chairman Duncan Fletcher, following the 1932 election that swept Franklin D. Roosevelt into the U.S. presidency and gave the Democratic Party control of the Senate.
The Senate committee hearings that Pecora led probed the causes of the Wall Street Crash of 1929 that launched a major reform of the American financial system. Pecora, aided by John T. Flynn, an Irish-American journalist, and Max Lowenthal, a Jewish lawyer, personally undertook many of the interrogations during the hearings, including such high-profile Wall Street personalities as Richard Whitney, president of the New York Stock Exchange, George Whitney (a partner in J.P. Morgan & Co.) and investment bankers Thomas W. Lamont, Otto H. Kahn, Albert H. Wiggin of Chase National Bank, and Charles E. Mitchell of National City Bank (now Citibank)."
50% of the children in this country will be fed by food stamps at some point in their lives.
our money is debt and without debt there is no money
tg,
Yeah, but our wealth is not necessarily debt. A man with an un-mortgaged house has wealth that's not someone elses's debt.
It's largely because of the Fed and their senseless debt creation policies that so many been impoverished with unpayable debts. Those unpayable debts and the faux wealth that goes with them should be purged from the system.
Counterpointer wrote:
Most will not get out alive, and if you were born after 1960, you will probably die a violent death.
Just kidding! The Free Market will save us.
congrats broward.
Another data point supporting my contention that a competent techie is never out of work unless they want to be.
Mock turtle,
Medicare D was wrong just like the way Medicare is set up to start with. SS has been abused and robbed to on end. How can any one have faith in a bill that no one knows what is in it. This mess has drug on so long and has been beaten to death by politicians, lobbyist and special interest groups there is no logical reason to continue. I would rather see some real BK's bring the truth out and then fix it.
The stories some folks have posted on here are very sobering. But aren't the numbers on CR's graph lower than for the population as a whole? Some other age group is getting worse treatment. And while the 55-64 group are clearly pre-retirement, I don't see the 45-54 age group as such and I doubt that they have such a bad time finding replacement employment. In the case of the 55-64 group, WHEN were they going to prepare for retirement if they aren't already?
mock turtle wrote:
Perverse, especially given the way the drug manufacturers game the patent system. But I do have a problem with forced substitutions, since I know that the undisclosed side-effects of many drugs can cause major problems that everyone wants to deny.
I did not, but almost nothing surprises me me any more when it comes to the things work. It's not like the banks were the only corrupt organizations in American business.
sm_landlord wrote:
This thing has gone beyond laws and regulation. Lehman is the proof of it.
It's time for some old-fashioned justice.
...they were only following orders
mp wrote:
Sharia is old fashioned!
mock turtle wrote:
In the current culture, I think these will have a hard time. Good they're in there, though. The word 'entrenched' comes frequently to mind.
mp wrote:
And that is probably the most appropriate response and yet the most depressing one as well.
dryfly wrote:
You can never go wrong with European styling; a Yugo or a Trabant would turn heads...
mp wrote:
I think we all agree but who is going to take down the Bankers? Politicians? they are just as dirty and the Bankers will flip them if they try it. Heads on a stick I think would go a long way to help the country move forward. Not going to happen.
If I were picking a car for broward . . .
http://www.besportier.com/archives/2008-audi-tt-s.jpg
mp wrote:
Now I understand the run on the banks and the big market crash much better than I did before.
A lot of people must have known what was going on at Lehman and elsewhere. When it became clear that the jig was up, they panicked and fled. It doesn't take that many big funds freaking out to make a crash.
Dan Quayle: Scion of the Lilly empire.
Lobbyist Ben Dover wrote:
Oh, at some time in the future it will happen. At about the same time as you have 40% unemployment.
About that time.
sm_landlord wrote:
Yup. The system has become totally corrupt. You won't solve it with regulations because the lot of them are bred sociopaths.
Duty calls.
sm_landlord wrote:
Another B-I-L story. He went to the hospital with pains in his chest. Short stay and mucho tests later, verdict comes back -- heartburn. Fast-forward a month -- bill for $10,000 arrives. Luckily, he's been scraping to pay his COBRA, right? Shame is, they refused to cover more than $50 for a "heartburn" diagnosis.
No wonder he feels the system is piling on while his life sinks.
mp wrote:
Wanna get even more depressed?
Peggy Noonan: Road to the Nut House - WSJ.com
In which she makes the case that only insane people run for president.
sm_landlord - this is absolutely right. The Mutually Assumed Deception was pervasive, almost universal across US, Yerp, and affiliates, and that, more than the shock of LEH actually being allowed to fall, was the strategic calculation that came unstuck, not just a tactical one regarding plausible (but massive, nonetheless) counterparty risk in the various instruments.
C
ShadowInventory wrote:
They're churning the pool... must be too many sickies in it. If your wife is in good health, the point is to get her to switch plans. She'd better if she can -- expect more of the same as those that can bail out.
I am happily retired now for almost 10 years. I worked, starting in High School, in one way or another, for the US Government. Sometimes second hand and then when at TRW (1969) watching head count go from 16000 to 8000 in one year, I decided to get a lot closer to the money funnel. Jumped over to NASA for a lot less money but got my 30 years in and the COLAed pension. Best decision I ever made. There were the other good decisions like finishing my BS & MS engineering degrees. Another good decision was choosing a dad who would pay for my education - thanks dad.
I am surprised at the number of my friends who are retired and still are mortgaged. Now they are getting rid of the horses and trying to sell the house and downsize.
I don't know about other professions but the half life of an engineering education and experience has been getting shorter and shorter for my entire working life. As they said at TRW you can let one senior research engineer go and hire two or three PHD freshouts.
mock turtle wrote:
The system may demands complicity. I do not know what the answer is. I feel that the social contract has been broken with the average citizen and I do not see an easy repair. I imagine to keep it together the state has to escalate it's power and control
Here's a question: was the social contract reinforced by the public school system and has it been weakening as more and more kids are removed from that system and raised in a parallel private one? For some reason, the idea just popped into my head reading your comment, tg.
tg wrote:
It has, tg. It's at the heart of all current difficulties. Not often mentioned.
I better connect some dots there. I'm not suggesting that there's anything particularly wrong with the private schools or noble about the public ones. But does the fact that kids are not growing up in the same systems erode the social contract?
Well it is St. Patrick's day parade day in my city. I made it out to hear a brief bit of live bagpipe music. Of course there were large numbers of very drunk white people. In the 15 minutes I was at the parade who came walking the parade route but none other than Chuck Schumer (D - Wall Street). And what did the drunk crowd of middle class people do when he chanted "USA" and "let's hear it for the irish!" into his megaphone? cheered him like a hero.
If there ever was a 'social contract' which I doubt but if there was no one read the fine print. There was is and will always be a lot of 'does not apply'.
(1) after they had to completely reorganize their life plans when RIFs and cuts and losing a job simply to enhance stock value became a way of life starting in the 1980s - when they were in their mid-30s
(2) after they had to start over and try to save money on their own when the pensions they had been told to expect when they entered the workforce and had paid into for a few years went south and vanished with the wind in the late 80s and 90s when they were in their late 30s and early 40s
(3) after they lost money on the stock market in the 80s and 90s in those 401ks - when they were in their early 40s
(4) after they finished paying for the education of the progeny ( the ones who now move back home and wait for the 'perfect job' ) - when they are in their late 40s and early 50s
(5) after they finish helping their 80+ year old parents who (a) had their pensions vanish after retirement or (b) had saved up money as they should but now need home health care at $80,000 -150,000 a year and of course what they had saved would have probably been okay 'but for inflation' so now their parents are broke or at least can't afford what they need at todays' prices.....
Bottom line is that is flat impossible to save up enough between ages 21 and 50 or even 65 to support yourself to age 80, 85 or 90. Even if you follow the advice of the talking heads, you will still NOT have enough money. If you retire at 65 and expect to live on 2/3rds what you were earning and live to 85 or 90, there is this HUGE problem. It is called 'inflation.' If you retired 25 years ago on the assumption that you would need $100 a year to live, in 2010 to have the same buying power, you need $210. That is over twice as much money - and one doesn't double one's income without having a source of a lot more money. It can NOT be done.
dilbert dogbert wrote:
And by the time the next recession layoff wave hits they will have just about become useful - time to recycle them too.
flaminia wrote:
I went to catholic school the first three years of my schooling. When I walked into public school I thought I was in heaven. The grade school elementary teachers really cared about their students. I think all schools shared the same ideas on what was the basis for good citizenship back in the day
dryfly wrote:
So true. I used to run dev shops with with 30-50 engineers. Once in a long while, you would get a new kid who was productive out of the box. But it was the exception that proved the rule. I found that it took about seven years of experience after their formal education ended for engineers to become serious contributors. And of course, some never did.
"I think all schools shared the same ideas on what was the basis for good citizenship back in the day." That's how it seems to me as well but I'm a product of the public system and have no point of comparison.
I'm dazed and confused to announce that the former so is joining the
.
Enter the Patriot Act.
dryfly wrote:
The entirety of the Enlightenment was an argument for eliminating the fine print - hence our own early governance. We've spent the interim writing it all back in.
dryfly wrote:
May be most did not have to, I am not saying there was not a great deal of social inequality.Quite possibly I am just voicing my own inadequacies but my sense is that we will lose the good faith of the marginal citizen.
If you use the concept, If everybody is agreeing , then no one is thinking. Public school provide one message. I personally think that is a very big part of the problem. Public Education has become public programing with box thinking. I went to public school and my kids went to private till HS. I support vouchers for competition and the rewards of different messages.
...the minutemen this time around are the HFT traders
DCRogers wrote:
And because its COBRA - no employer with muscle to lean on the insurer to 'rethink' that one.
The 'insurance based health care system' is collapsing faster than any of us realize - yours is just one more case in point.
And to those who say - well they were unnecessary tests, he should pay - I say "How did they know that?" Only one of two ways to know... [1] run the test or [2] wait and see if he dies or not.
It might turn out that if you're going to have a country you need to have a box.
burnside wrote:
And the language is in tongues.
flaminia wrote:
Don't know about that, but it helps to share a common understanding or base of knowledge. So I'm tentatively 'for'.
Is there a way to search old comments.
Someone had a great recommendation for an apartment hotel in Rome I wanted to find again.
Cheers,
Does anybody know top of their head 'how many people exhaust their max 99 weeks of UE benefits' end of March(Tier 4?)?
Could be a few million more that will have no income end of March(more foreclosures?).
burnside wrote:
Lack of a common language is killing the educational system in Los Angeles. Large sums of money are spent on language training, and later remedial education, because a lot of kids take years to learn to speak and write English. It's a tough language to learn if you don't start as a baby, and some immigrant communities have no exposure at all until they get to first grade.
Broward, many hearty congratulations! You have guts, to have turned down four offers during the interim. Wish I had your fortitude. Anyway, it sounds as if you are going with the company that suits your nature. Saves a lot of energy. Given the groundwork you have laid down, no doubt they will appreciate your contributions. Best wishes and good vibes!
SNAFU wrote:
It has to be a large number, because I remember layoffs starting in 2007 in some of the businesses that I watch.
sm_landlord wrote:
I read elsewhere it about ~2 million folks! @~450$/week, that is ~3.6 Billion $/month.
&(&($ insurance company. Just got a second CoB for my wife.... since January! Every time my wife files a claim over $100 they don't pay it, they send out a CoB letter and stall the provider their money. This is fraud ( NYS has sued them over this practice before, I guess it's far too profitable to stop ) and it's everything I've come to expect from the best healtcare money can buy. Even if we get it resolved we can expect angry phone calls and letters from the providers over the next week or so as the claim denials work through the system.
In case anyone is wondering it's The Empire Plan aka United Healthcare.
DCRogers wrote:
Sorry, I just got back from my beach walk.
The FDP is in deep trouble right now with Westerwelle's "issues". I don't think that they want to make too many waves though clearly this particular issue might help them. The Hartz IV debate has caused all kinds of animosity and at this point the FDP is under siege. If they openly were to try to undermine Merkel now I'm not certain how long the coalition would last.
edit: FDP rutscht auf acht Prozent ab
M
im not one of the better when it comes to searching comments
but
if you include in your search terms
hoocoodanode rome apartment
and if you can the handle of the person who posted the comment,
and one more key word that might set this comment apart from most others
you stand a good chance
good luck
ps i think google or dog pile or bing...any search engine...try more than one
sm_landlord wrote:
And seven more years for the most gifted to gain the experience needed to subtly but thoroughly obstruct all development progress when a decision is made that they disagree with, no matter how trivial.
A small percentage of this talent inevitably is spotted by upper management and promoted to where they can cause the most damage.
Search like this in google:
site:hoocoodanode.org apartment Rome
btw is this the thread? Report: Manhattan Office Vacancy Rate Increases, Rents Decline | Hoocoodanode?
points here: Martina Al Colosseo Apartment Rome - self catering apartment deals and reviews - venere.com
The Lorax wrote:
Name not needed: because of cross-poaching of the best management talent, 'best practices' spread rapidly across all the insurers.
Call it an abrogation of the social contract or, as mp would have it, sociopathy. But there it is.
If only I had the Russians' wry sense of humor about this.
DCRogers wrote:
vogon job description
DCRogers wrote:
I had one that figured it out much more quickly than that. He must have been a genius.
You probably know what "The Guy in the Room" syndrome is, too.
tg wrote:
+1
DCRogers wrote:
These are usually also the folks that present the least threat to upper management and are best at local empire building.
Opposite syndrome - make sure the ONLY GUY capable of saving a program you hate is absent. I'm living that nightmare now on one that means a lot to me. The faction that wants it to go away [so they can focus on 'automotive' even more vs. what I do] are making sure that the one person who can make my pay day isn't on the team.
Call it an abrogation of the social contract or, as mp would have it, sociopathy. But there it is.
If only I had the Russians' wry sense of humor about this.
SUCH AS WE
By the bitterness of Earth
Swore the Lord who made the rain,
I’d repay their evil’s worth
Of arrogance and crooked gain
And by the salt which they have sowed
In war and terror I would rot
The generations which have owed
The goods of life they have ill-got
And by the terror they have spread,
The murder of the youngest child,
I would contaminate their bread
As they the love they have defiled
I would repay for every trick,
For every bare-faced conquest and
The spittle sycophants have licked
To buy the office of command
And by the drought I would inflict
They would know their drought of honor,
And by the beating of the stick
Of pestilence they would know horror
So said God who made the light
That spreads above the morning sea,
And but for Christ His heart’s delight
He would so punish such as we
Pavel
March 13, 2010
DCRogers wrote:
Really I don't know why I'm so upset, I really should be getting used to being screwed by insurance companies. Like telling me the good side to a random doctor visit being billed as out of network ( it was in the hospital, not like we had a choice who the weekend, on call, doctor was ) and being told it goes towards my deductible for the year ( too bad the bill came 18 months after service ).
Really I can't think of a death gruesome enough to be worthy of health insurance companies.
burnside wrote:
drink more vodka
Reflexively,I think of myself as a Citizen with rights although this is not true.When someone designated by the president can name me an enemy combatant and deprive me of life,liberty and property with no appeal,when at the whim of a functionary I become a non-person,I am a subject.And since these policies have been declared just jim dandy by the highest court in the land,mp is right.The system is utterly corrupt and broken beyond repair,it does stagger forward with occasional nods to what once was,but it is a hollow rotting shell of what it once was,which while imperfect was worthy of respect.
Would that I could, tg. Allergies to grains and spuds and all the interesting things which come from them.
Fortunately, there's wine.
The Lorax wrote:
Shouldn't we all? It's their mission and they do it so very well.
dryfly wrote:
So does the proposal that everyone be required to carry insurance close the door on the one rational exit?
dryfly wrote:
You have my sympathy - I hope you either win or find a better place to move on to.
Right now, I'm trying to save three different products that were neglected to the point of being non-viable. And to tell you the truth, I'm not even sure why I'm bothering. I guess the fear of getting bankrupted by inflation and retiring on a diet of cat food keeps me going.
maxim gorky
The Lorax wrote:
If you go into a jungle, and a tiger jumps out and eats off your arm, you're not very happy about it, but you don't get mad at the tiger -- it's what tigers do. It's how they compete to survive in the jungle.
(Now, why the regulators and legislators haven't tamed this jungle more, that gets me mad.)
burnside wrote:
You know burnside - I don't know. I've thought a lot about this being self-employed for years and having to buy my own insurance. It got so bad my wife took a 'real job' just so we'd be covered... now they are talking about dropping it for 'vouchers' & HSA's.
I don't think anyone realizes just how broken it all is - everyone sees their own personal Idaho. They'll know soon enough.
sm_landlord wrote:
I'm trying to talk that person into starting his own biz & leave the others - he's mulling it over - if he does I'll sell his services lights out. He has no idea how big it could be - considers my advice just salesmanly BS - but if he goes on his own its money in the bank.
sm_landlord wrote:
Cat food is expensive - just letting you know.
dryfly wrote:
Depends how many stray cats in your neighborhood, and how rapidly they replenish themselves.
"Hallelujah I'm a bum. Hallelujah, bum again."
"Brother can you spare a dime."
Sound familiar?
OT: apple sells 50 thousand (max)i-pads in 2 hours.
A comedian taking care of one: The show was better as you got lead in and lead out monologue. one line: "and for all you nerds out there, we never even turned it on"
DCRogers wrote:
LOL - plus reducing the strays makes sure the
's remain plentiful. Double good. It's good being top of the food chain.
Barron's tries some numbers:
Taxpayers Will Pay for Massive Shortfalls in State Pension Funds - Barrons.com
(akk, seems you need a subscription)
Here's another take:
Pam Martens: The Two Trillion Dollar Black Hole
C
Counterpointer wrote:
Read the comments on the Barron's piece. Someone wrote something about doing the analysis years ago and getting $2T at that time. So the 2T number is probably low by now.
Wanna get more depressed? Check out this government obligations calculator:
My Government Spending: - - My Household
If it is any solace, must of the boomers going through this were going to be screwed if they continued under the goldilocks economy. Being over 50 and having no savings has never been a good combination.
I'm more interested in the youths. I graduated into IT in 00-01. I lost work in the 03 recession. I lost my job in this recession. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only cynical son of a bitch as a result of this.
badger wrote:
You need to look at the bigger picture - IT is a tool NOT a 'career'. I've been telling my fellow mfgr peers that since the mid80s [EDIT: wrt to mfg]. You still got time.
I skipped to the bottom after reading a few comments about health care costs. I usually stay away from this topic (too close to religion) but health care costs wont be fixed until the following situations are eliminated.
Reference: State Supreme Court to hear insurance case
The precedent-setting case involves the common situation of a victim whose insurer settles medical bills for less than the cost of treatment. For example, a hospital might bill the victim $50,000 but accept $20,000 from the insurer under a discount agreement, which includes the insurer's promise of volume business and prompt payment.
.
She underwent spinal fusion surgeries and other treatment at two hospitals, which logged their costs at $190,000 but agreed to accept $60,000 from Howell's insurer.
Thank you, AnnS.
I'm back in school now. Going to get a physics degree. Might go PhD before I'm done. I'm not in Chicago or Minneapolis, so I'm basically in the sticks as far as IT is concerned. I'm afraid I'd be wasting my time continuing to try and get going in it, considering I like where I live and all.
Counterpointer wrote:
Inflation [money creation] too - but we'll pay for that also.
badger wrote:
I understand - my youngest goes to Point.
dryfly wrote:
IT plus some specific domain expertise can be a pretty good career.
But I feel sorry for a lot of kids who did double majors thinking they had this covered. I've only seen one case where a guy got out of school with IT plus enough domain expertise to be qualified in the domain. And that was a very specialized field where the domain knowledge was still mostly held in universities, not having migrated to industry yet.
There is some quite important I that needs some serious T to manage it. If you can master this T, you will always be employed.
If you can keep your nose clean enough to gain access to the really cool I and are willing to locate to the DC area, then you can make some serious coin.
sm_landlord wrote:
I had a Chinese lady [very solid quality engineer from Beijing U] refer to it as 'content'... IT is just 'process'... combine it with 'content' and it's 'golden'. YMMV.
Sorry, anything outside the DC Metro area is the sticks ass far as IT is concerned. Anything IT that doesn't HAVE to stay inside the US WON'T.
Without getting into a full dissertation, I think the days of the high flying consultant or in-house consultant are numbered. I don't want to sound gimmicky, but SaaS is a real deal. We are approaching the point where darn near every business should give serious consideration to leasing space from a data center rather than building their own. I foresee Xen and automating tools with it making that inescapable in the next decade.
dryfly wrote:
Near the top -- we all know
is the top of the food chain.
Anything IT that doesn't HAVE to stay inside the US WON'T.
You've got that right.
I hadn't checked CBPP for a while, here's the latest in the Recovery, which according to Big News is somehow simultaneously observable by DC pols and economists at national level, but seems a little reticent about showing itself at state level:
An Update on State Budget Cuts — Center on Budget and Policy Priorities
Warning, d-word:
...
And isn't that last clause a kicker. Because policy aside, plenty of other things reduce the amount of money people have to spend, in toto and by discretionary consumption class; medical and other insurance costs, gas prices, credit rates and decisions by the tapped-out to reduce exposure, liquidate debt if and while they can, and so on.
C
badger wrote:
Domain knowledge will be useful here. I provide support/admin for researchers and their software stacks are quirky to say the least. We are converting to Xen in house to make hardware management and deployment easier, but for now we are seriously limited only by interconnects and data storage ( 10's of TB, quickly approaching 100's ) which is were the in-house solution will still shine (for a few more years).
Mock Turtle and JP
RE: search and rome apartment.
Thank you! I had to step away but I appreciate the response. I'll look into that thread JP, it might be.
sm_landlord wrote:
Yeah a big part of that is having to please arrogant overpaid scriblers like herself. I remember Jerry Brown running for president in a debate. When the question of Social Security came up he said that there wasn't anything wrong with social security that some minor adjustments wouldn't fix. Everyone laughed and laughed! Pundits like Noonan had a field day. What a moroon!
Wow! That was thirty years ago.
JP - that was the thread - thank you!
"Work on the Central Pacific was arduous and often dangerous. In the winter, many Chinese tunneled themselves into snow banks at night to create warm sleeping areas for themselves, even though such tunnels frequently collapsed, suffocating those inside. In the spring of 1866, 5000 Chinese railroad workers rebelled against the terrible conditions and went on strike to demand higher wages and a shorter workday. The company isolated them, surrounded them with strikebreakers, and starved them into submission."
burnside wrote: