So people in Spain have been screaming that they are not anything like Greece. Wonder if they're going to come to the EU trough now and ask for some help.
Seriously, this sounds like jawboning to me. However, I await to see actual money being transferred. As for debt guarantees, who the hell is doing the guaranteeing?
Seriously, this sounds like jawboning to me. However, I await to see actual money being transferred. As for debt guarantees, who the hell is doing the guaranteeing?
I have a feeling that today's story is as much about short covering as it is about Greece.
Greece's government has vowed wage and pension reform in an effort to gain credibility in its plan to drive down its debt load. However, nationwide strikes were planned for Wednesday, possibly undercutting any confidence in the country's plan.
It's workers versus investors, in the stadium, Wednesday. "They got the guns, baby, but we got the numbers..."
it's all an illusion. I'm really starting to think that capitalism's greatest strength is tricking large numbers of people into believing it has any power at all, and now it's slowly being revealed as 3 wizened old men in wheelchairs sitting behind a 7-11 telephone booth.
The USA has had the same money that trades at par in all emerging 50 states since 1793...
The Euro is about 10 years old and includes the good, the bad and the ugly as participants. It could easily be abrogated by a few members finances falling apart.
Don't think that will happen here in the same context.
He said a bailout would be very problematic, since that would urge other heavily-indebted countries to seek the same treatment—most governments piled on debt in the wake of the financial crisis.
Some experts believe the European Central Bank may come up with a form of support which would not require a bailout, such as guarantees for debt.
"OK, bailout is a dirty word. Bonus is out. Stimulus sucks. How about we try "guarantee" again? Everyone has confidence in a guarantee. I guarantee it will fly. If you have the guarantee, you don't need to use the bazooka." Extend. Pretend.
When you owe the bank 100,000 EBUs, it is your problem.
When you owe the bank 100,000,000 EBUs, it is the bank's problem.
When you owe the bank 100,000,000,000 EBUs, it is the country's problem?
The USA has had the same money that trades at par in all emerging 50 states since 1793..
Not quite. There were Greenbacks, Confederate bills, Silver dollars, gold standard, FRN's, "1965 dollars" (real vs. inflated), etc. Don't believe the hype.
What about $14,000,000,000,000 Plus?....Ya were F'ed.
I thought that was what they're backstopping, not what they owed; no? Besides, it's what the Treasury owes that's important, right? We could just disband the Fed and let their creditors get in line, couldn't we? After all, it's not a govt. agency
Soon, however, Japan's government is going to owe a Q in yen. Now that's a mighty big number.
Thankfully, we waited until computers had enough of a bit width to handle that kind of math. Although it may make those speeches easier when you have an overflow error: We had a quadrillion USD deficit, but thanks to Intel's poor floating point calculations, you all owe us a quadrillion USD!
Recruiters are absolutely desperate these days, and having a had time filling positions that require relocation.
It's bizarre and annoying. I told the AT&T recruiter (internal, direct, not 3rd party mud-thrower) to fuck off, I don't need the weirdness & bullshit in my life anymore. He was stunned. I told him to take his constant Indian price-pinging and jam it up his ass.
You could take USA currency in any form (sorry, the Confederacy doesn't count, they nabbed 2nd place) from 1793 and still spend it.
There's no other country in the world that has longevity like that with their money...
Chinese Military Waving the Dump U.S. Bonds Threat.
Senior Chinese military officers have proposed that their country boost defense spending, adjust People's Liberation Army deployments, and possibly sell some U.S. bonds to punish Washington for its latest round of arms sales to Taiwan, reports Reuters.
Interviews with Major Generals Zhu Chenghu and Luo Yuan and Senior Colonel Ke Chunqiao appeared in Outlook Weekly, a Chinese-language magazine, published on Monday.
"Our retaliation should not be restricted to merely military matters, and we should adopt a strategic package of counter-punches covering politics, military affairs, diplomacy and economics to treat both the symptoms and root cause of this disease," said Luo Yuan, a researcher at the Academy of Military Sciences.
"Just like two people rowing a boat, if the United States first throws the strokes into chaos, then so must we."
Luo said Beijing could "attack by oblique means and stealthy feints" to make its point in Washington.
"For example, we could sanction them using economic means, such as dumping some U.S. government bonds," Luo said
I have a feeling that today's story is as much about short covering as it is about Greece.
Anyone out there getting forced to buy in?
I sometimes check on share availability by putting in short-sell orders a couple of bucks above the market price and seeing if they go through. Yesterday was the first day in forever that there weren't shares available in some of the stocks I check. KSS, for example--I had had a short position there until I closed it last Friday, but as of yesterday they could no longer be shorted.
shill wrote: Agreed, that " One world Government " just got kicked up a notch further. If I recall my schemes from conspiracy theory history, the US is supposed to become the financial 'head' of global capitalism, with NYC becoming not unlike London in the days of the British empire, much as it's already got DC for our modern Palatine Hill.
Chinese Military Waving the Dump U.S. Bonds Threat.
From their perspective it must seem like the cheapest war ever won.
And that doesn't take into account to reduced value of those dollars after they're dumped Seriously though, I wouldn't worry about it; they're caught in a dollar trap, and it they want to sink our currency, let 'em. We've been asking for a revaluation of the Yuan anyway-
A Confederate $100 is worth closer to $40-50 strictly as a collectible, it cannot be exchanged for current money, but a $100 Federal banknote from 1861 can.
A Confederate $100 is worth closer to $40-50 strictly as a collectible, it cannot be exchanged for current money, but a $100 Federal banknote from 1861 can.
broward wrote: Dishonest paper breeds dishonest people.
Paper breeds opportunity for dishonesty, which breeds dishonest paper as more and more get away with scams. And the scams just get larger over time.
The credit and stock markets are voting on government policies and they are now the only votes that count.
Pretty much. Why won't the Govenator just call Congress's bluff and get the Brink's truck moving to Dawgifornia?
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Once we bail out Greece, we might as well move the party over to the Left Coast.
You could take USA currency in any form (sorry, the Confederacy doesn't count, they nabbed 2nd place) from 1793 and still spend it.
You mean bonus money?
The Adjusted Service Certificate Law is a United States federal law passed in 1924 that granted veterans of World War I "bonus" certificates the following year that would be redeemable after a maturation period of 20 years for $1 dollar in cash for each day served in the United States and $1.25 dollars for each day served abroad. The final maturity of the certificates was in 1945,
You can "still spend it", if you're alive in 20 years and it buys a month's rent.
EU doesn't want to loose face by inviting the IMF in.
Therefore they will propose an IMF type of proposal with an EU name on the top
As Chung Tsu wrote long ago
Three in the morning four in the afternoon
And that doesn't take into account to reduced value of those dollars after they're dumped Wink Seriously though, I wouldn't worry about it; they're cought in a dollar trap, and it they want to sink our currency, let 'em. We've been asking for a revaluation of the Yuan anyway-
Exactly - they'd be in effect asking for their own second cultural revolution at the same time. Because w/out exports to Wally Mart there isn't anywhere else that output could be redirected to quickly short of intense top down central planning. They could do - have done it before - but no one [certainly not us] knows the risks of that better than they do - they been there done that.
It would truly be a last resort AFTER our consumer market had already REALLY crapped the bed. Consumer spending is down but NOTHING like that would cause.
exits got really crowded there.......volume ticks really slowed down towards the bottom of the stick.....waiting for the standard NYSE "outage" issues again.
when I was a kid, we had an old cigar box full of Confederate money that we used to play with. The bills were considered a useless curiousity. Of course, we lost it all.
Roubini's people have proposed a two-euro solution, with the bad eurozone countries getting a weak euro, while the nice eurozone countries get a strong euro. But the bad euro countries would have to pay off their debts in strong euros. Not that I understand any of this.
The gold window was open until 1971 for only foreign governments to exchange their dollars for our gold at $35 per oz, that's it. We officially went off the silver standard on June 24, 1968. That was the last day one could receive silver for their silver certificate banknotes.
Since then, the dollar has been held aloft largely by nothing.
exits got really crowded there.......volume ticks really slowed down towards the bottom of the stick.....waiting for the standard NYSE "outage" issues again.
Market moved against me...I call FAT FINGER! Give me my money back.
Roubini's people have proposed a two-euro solution, with the bad eurozone countries getting a weak euro, while the nice eurozone countries get a strong euro. But the bad euro countries would have to pay off their debts in strong euros. Not that I understand any of this.
Why not just call the "bad euro" a lira? The it would be obvious which was which-
I can see it now. A new carry trade where the workers live in Germany or Scandinavia and vacation in the "bad Euro" southern regions.
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Waitaminute...
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CaptainMorgan wrote:
At some point the life boat is full and you have to row away.
You'd think so, but I haven't really seen an evidence of it yet. Remember the Market can remain "solvent" longer than you can remain sane. (It's hard out here for a Bear...)
"Roubini's people have proposed a two-euro solution, with the bad eurozone countries getting a weak euro, while the nice eurozone countries get a strong euro."
OK, Roubini has finally lost it. Might as well just call the whole Euro thing off...
yagij wrote:
Once we bail out Greece, we might as well move the party over to the Left Coast.
If we go that path we might not ever stop the bailing.
At some point the life boat is full and you have to row away.
That moment was LTCM. Everything since then has been shipping water, bailing furiously, tossing the weak and calming the passengers.
Cinco-X wrote: Nothing? What about our vibrant economy and culture of innovation?
Scams, raking trasactions, and profit scalping... almost anything else has been hollowed out and leveraged to kingdom come, that can be
on an unrelated note... lunchtime.
Why not just call the "bad euro" a lira? The it would be obvious which was which-
LOL. Name the "bad euro" in correspondence with the region. So Greece gets drachmas. And when Italy blows up, name it lira. Spain will get pesetas. This way, each currency can reflect the economic conditions of the country.
Well, just like this situation, its effects are only temporary; you have to keep applying it indefinitely.
FWIW, it contained lead as it's active ingredient; the lead "dulled" the shiny gray to make it appear as though your color was coming back.....or so I've heard-
If you don't do so soon enough, you get sucked into the sinking ships vortex-
Tease. I could die before that happens. Why sweat the small, only-happens-once-every-80-years stuff?
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Complacency: Cheaper than , more effective than , more longer lasting than
I joked last week about breaking the EU up into an Upper and Lower two part solution. Its a mad, mad, mad...world.
Never happen. If it breaks at all it shatters - explodes - into pieces. Like Greece wants to be in an Alternative EU made up of countries like itself - ya right. Who bails it out then? Italy?
In a dramatic move to reduce its $100 million deficit, Dartmouth College announced a plan to increase tuition, reinstate student loan programs and lay off 76 non-faculty staff members, according to Business Week.
I don't think it can happen either, I was really joking about the undercurrent of nationalism that is still at work in Europe, but then to read this... I think we plunged into the rabbit hole. Where' s Alice?
Market moved against me...I call FAT FINGER! Give me my money back.
And now the market's gone quiet. Eerily quiet, with just a couple of pipsqueaks in the corner yelling bids at each other while the big money silently waits.
Picture shows a 20 something co-ed holding a sign stating "I can't afford school any longer".
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Honey at ~60k/year, you were never able to afford schooling there. If you needed a sign to voice your opinion, you didn't belong there. /hard_knocks
Most of the world's citizens aren't so enthralled with the capitalist treadmill; world bankers trying to make it so won't make it happen. Currency imbalances reflect that in the EU and Asia's peg. What constitutes a fulfilling life in Greece is too different than Germany. The former has a history and they have no need to run around all day.
Not quite. There were Greenbacks, Confederate bills, Silver dollars, gold standard, FRN's, "1965 dollars" (real vs. inflated), etc. Don't believe the hype.
And the trading at par is a bunch of hogwash, too. There was a whole industry of "bank note reporting" to spread the word about which issues were solidly backed and which ones weren't.
Picture shows a 20 something co-ed holding a sign stating "I can't afford school any longer".
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Honey at ~60k/year, you were never able to afford schooling there. If you needed a sign to voice your opinion, you didn't belong there. /hard_knocks
Right $60,000 for a piece of paper that states " Hey look at me everybody I am smart "
Currency imbalances reflect that in the EU and Asia's peg. What constitutes a fulfilling life in Greece is too different than Germany. The former has a history and they have no need to run around all day.
We discussed that in depth last night - most of us agree. The beaches & olive trees & gardens will still be there long after the euro is a memory.
It's hard to say what would have happened if the Germans hadn't come to the rescue of the hapless Italian army in Greece in 1941. It took the krauts 6 precious weeks to beat the Greeks, and as the werhmacht was only a few dozen miles from Moscow when winter broke out later in the year, it might have made all the difference in the world?
ZeroHedge: "Total, utter, complete confusion. The latest from Reuters, quoting a German Government official, is that the Greece bailout rumors are UNFOUNDED" (link)
So do they help them in perpetuity? What terms and for how long?
Because they obviously can't help themselves. Going to piss off a lot of germans and french.
ZeroHedge: "Total, utter, complete confusion. The latest from Reuters, quoting a German Government official, is that the Greece bailout rumors are UNFOUNDED"
That trial balloon didn't last long.
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Edit: Want to join in the fun that is popping trial balloons: Play Bloons Tower Defense 4, a free online game on Kongregate
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It has monkeys. It has balloons that need to be popped. It has monkeys throwing darts at balloons that need to be popped. What more do you need!
Can someone quickly let me know why the USD is tanking when it is the Euro printing that will save the PIIGS?
Is it because the USD was over bought during the uncertainty phase?
I'd like to posit a new term: Flow of fear.
There is a lot of money sloshing around and a lot of fear. IMO it ends in a UST issuance failure.
Rob Dawg wrote:
There is a lot of money sloshing around and a lot of fear. IMO it ends in a UST issuance failure.
Why do I get the impression that today is going to be a very interesting close, one way or the other?
A guess but I'd say the smart money is on the sidelines. This isn't investing and probably isn't even trading.
Thanks for the link. I'm not sure that those terms have much relevance in today's market since it presupposes that all stocks must increase or decline at a slow steady rate.
Waiting for the retraction of the retraction on Bloomberg.
Knowing the news or planting the news could be profitable for a hedge fund. Reuters is never motivated by a hedge fund manager in the news they publish...right?
Guess the green shoot aspect is that there may be few more experienced pilots for the regional airlines to hire at low wages, provide poor working conditions (schedules that allow inadequate time for rest) & poorly maintained planes.
No high speed train to take me to Vegas yet, so this will have to do!
Indeed. The smart money in my house is with my wife, tucked into various bank accounts and in the safe. I'm the sole proprietor of the foolish money in our household, and she only lets me have a tiny bit.
I'm the sole proprietor of the foolish money in our household, and she only lets me have a tiny bit.
I gleefully hold that status in my household, but than again the wife and I were never free spenders anyway. Sure we like the comforts of life like anyone else, but we are savers always were. Our friends on the other hand forget it, they would always poke fun that we owned no credit cards and so on and so fourth.
Now if we want too we can buy all their ( bought on credit ) crap for 5 cents on the dollar....but again we are all set, I do not need a 60" flat screen tv to make me happy.
Hell I don't even watch Tv.....who needs Tv when you have CR
Rob Dawg wrote:
OMG. If we don't spend more deficits will increase. Lame duck moment. Right here, right now. Jimmy Carter redux.
Who are you listening to, Dawg? The governator?
Reuters Headline Changed to: Report of EU Help for Greece Is Now Described as 'Unfounded'
When I used to drive smooth bore (no baffles) tanker trucks I was constantly aware of the fact that a small manoeuvre could send the water sloshing around and knock me out of control, and as soon as it started rocking it would take an awful lot more effort to wrestle the rig back.
This announcement and retraction feels an awful lot like that.
On our new 52 inch tv we can play slideshows of photos, or galaxies.
Ok ok I do have a big Tv, but that is for the I-Carly fanatics.
But take Note.......... 2 tv's In the whole house, I go over to some friends of ours house, and there is a Tv in a every frigging room.....yet he is sour because he is broke and cannot find work....SELL SOME OF YOUR JUNK!
Basically a one sentence repeat that a spokesman for the German government later said reports that the euro zone has made a decision to aid Greece were "unfounded."
It's amazing how cheap tv's are now, I asked my mom what we paid for our 24 inch color tv-stereo set in a console in the early 1960's, and it was $400.
CR has had over 51 million people visit, that's impressive...
That can't be true, that probably just number of visits, not individuals, and I'm responsible for a huge number of those.
(log on, no- I'm going to work, log off,...well, it won't hurt to just look,...shit, I'm late, log off, hell, I'm so late any way, might as well just take another quick peek,...crap, it's the wife, log off, etc.)
When I used to drive smooth bore (no baffles) tanker trucks I was constantly aware of the fact that a small manoeuvre could send the water sloshing around and knock me out of control, and as soon as it started rocking it would take an awful lot more effort to wrestle the rig back.
This announcement and retraction feels an awful lot like that.
Positive feedback loop. Any system that features them is inherently unstable. Whether the system is currently in or out of control is irrelevant.
You can't engineer your way around a system containing positive feedback loops. You need a complete redesign. Or ... you can nudge it out of equilibrium and see how much stress it can take before shutting down.
"Top Republicans emerged from the meeting expressing cautious optimism that an agreement could be reached on a "small package" to help lower the country's 9.7 percent unemployment rate."
McConnell [R] stressed traditional GOP priorities such as nuclear power, off-shore oil drilling, and clean coal technology. He also urged passage of stalled trade agreements with Colombia, Panama and South Korea.
Such measures, he argued, would be "jobs generators."
"Charles Schumer, D-New York, and Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, aids any private sector employer who hires a worker who's been unemployed for at least 60 days. That employer is absolved of paying the 6.2 percent share of the employee's Social Security payroll tax for the rest of 2010."
employers who keep these workers on the payroll continuously for a year would be eligible for a $1,000 tax credit on their 2011 tax returns.
It's not like he respected you before this latest spat. We all stay with the abuser thinking we can make him better or get him to show his good side, but we all know it's a lie.
Nah, that "jobs proposal" isn't nearly complicated enough or fraught with nearly enough BS paperwork for snail-mail filing with federal offices.
We need to think big, here, with a whole new federal "jobs" czar with a jobs staff and a jobs budget and a suite of offices in DC and lots of lucrative contracts to award to connected K Street buddies.
McConnell [R] stressed traditional GOP priorities such as nuclear power, off-shore oil drilling, and clean coal technology.
Nuclear power and clean coal are worthy climate change ideas, as long as the coal mines don't destroy surrounding environment. Why do we need off-shore drilling?
Positive feedback loop. Any system that features them is inherently unstable. Whether the system is currently in or out of control is irrelevant.
Excellent description, thank you. Related to the inherent instability of smooth bore tankers were these trucks, especially when the tower operator stuck an extra 5 tons on the top just so my trip wasn't 'wasted':
...not sure if we need any more proof that this market is fully manipulated. SOMEONE is spilling out totally b.s. news...other morons are reporting this unsubstantiated news...market explodes.
make note: this news came out at EXACTLY 11.31 am......THE low of the market. SOMEONE is making some serious $ on this manipulated crap. it's no longer a market of buyers and sellers...just a market of who can screw others the most wins....a microcosm of the country as a whole.
Perception of a bailout seems to be more important right now than if there's really a bailout or more importantly IF it will turn things around wherever the bailouts are used to stop deflation.
THE low of the market. SOMEONE is making some serious $ on this manipulated crap.
I think it would be infinitely funnier if the 'source' for the story had said it because he had just bought a bunch of stocks prior to the announcement. How wonderfully lopsided it would be if todays multi-billion dollar market move was precipitated on one guys $500 bet.
threetorches wrote: We need to think big, here, with a whole new federal "jobs" czar with a jobs staff and a jobs budget and a suite of offices in DC and lots of lucrative contracts to award to connected K Street buddies.
Indeed. Is there, in truth, no problem that limitless money and bloated bureaucracies with no accountability can't fix?
Nuclear power and clean coal are worthy climate change ideas, as long as the coal mines don't destroy surrounding environment. Why do we need off-shore drilling?
Because without offshore drilling the natural seepage would contaminate the natural environment. Better extracted and controlled than washing up on shore. At least that has been the SoCal experience.
Whew. I was starting to get worried.
Big farkin surprise there. Next please.
Beware of Greeks accepting gifts...
Credit event triggered?
Well, ok then; but are they going to give Greece any freakin' MONEY?
Heck, I agree "in principle" to "aid" Greece as well: Good luck, there, Greece!
So there you go. Now let the bond crisis begin.
Did they happen to mention what their plans are for Spain, Portugal, Ireland and the Eastern Block ?
Ahh now I understand why
DOW 10,102 +194 +1.96%
Fire up the machines and get the ink flowing, it's going to be a busy month.
I suggest EU members write vague letters of support during this trying time.
It's a good thing no one said anything in public to the contrary lest they run afoul of the SEC right? Right? [crickets followed by laughter.]
So people in Spain have been screaming that they are not anything like Greece. Wonder if they're going to come to the EU trough now and ask for some help.
Fro Dryfly:
Comment by Cinco-X from thread 'BLS: Few Job Openings in December'
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
What I always heard was "When you shake hands with a Greek, count your fingers".
It is always good news when those who cannot repay their debts take money by force from those who can. I guess.
What I do not understand is why anyone on earth would ever repay a loan at this point.
"the most likely possibility was to offer Greece "bilateral help", said the source. "
whatever that means.
Ummmm, is it overbought yet ?
Who is going to bailout Germany? 1 out of 7 workers in Germany are related to the car industry and we know how that is going.
Don't be fooled---Germany is not going to get Greece out of trouble--it is all a ploy and sham.
REBear wrote:
+226 on the Dow is what it means. To the MOON!
In principle, I agree to help Greece, too.
Seriously, this sounds like jawboning to me. However, I await to see actual money being transferred. As for debt guarantees, who the hell is doing the guaranteeing?
When will the Indians live us alone?!
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Now they are taking our bogus jobs providing bogus jobs to bogus people!
threetorches wrote:
I think they meant "principal"
Don't worry, Greece, we got your back, bro!
[rest of world quietly slips out]
The help is going to be worse than the disease.
The Reuters story is Charlie Gasparino level journalism.
Yancey Ward wrote:
I have a feeling that today's story is as much about short covering as it is about Greece.
Nemo wrote:
I posed that question yesterday, and I got a response about how it would kill Greece and starve its citizens. I'm starting to not buy it.
It's workers versus investors, in the stadium, Wednesday. "They got the guns, baby, but we got the numbers..."
---The Doors
Charles Kiting wrote:
I find it odd that the Euro is taking off on this news. Won't the central bank be printing up this "aid?"
noob goldberg wrote:
Shuddup, n00b!
!
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I've got about 8% of losses to recover before I can cash out. I don't care about the reason. Just show me the
Charles Kiting wrote:
I assume this vague promise will be sufficient to cancel all of the public sector strikes set for tomorrow.
Ya think?
Charles Kiting wrote:
If you think about it, it IS the disease
yagij wrote:
it's all an illusion. I'm really starting to think that capitalism's greatest strength is tricking large numbers of people into believing it has any power at all, and now it's slowly being revealed as 3 wizened old men in wheelchairs sitting behind a 7-11 telephone booth.
noob goldberg wrote:
How will we be able to tell?
Help?
Oh yeah, just like they helped Iceland and Latvia.
noob goldberg wrote:
Postponing a 100,000 pitchfork rally today for a 200,000 pitchfork rally in the middle of summer.
yagij wrote:
I'd say the best of luck, but another 8% will really hurt. I can handle another day like today, maybe, but then it starts to get a little ugly
Anyone else smell smoke?
Doesn't everyone knows better than to dump liquidity on a Greece-fire?
[groan - sorry!]
Rob Dawg wrote:
I propose a Hottie Index.
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More hotties on TV & beach:
More hotties on the street:
For Rob Dawg:
Comment by Cinco-X from thread 'BLS: Few Job Openings in December'
The USA has had the same money that trades at par in all emerging 50 states since 1793...
The Euro is about 10 years old and includes the good, the bad and the ugly as participants. It could easily be abrogated by a few members finances falling apart.
Don't think that will happen here in the same context.
threetorches wrote:
Hope the liquid isn't flammable........
Charles Kiting wrote:
Why do you hate
so much?
Rob Dawg wrote:
LOL!
"OK, bailout is a dirty word. Bonus is out. Stimulus sucks. How about we try "guarantee" again? Everyone has confidence in a guarantee. I guarantee it will fly. If you have the guarantee, you don't need to use the bazooka." Extend. Pretend.
Charles Kiting wrote:
With mounds of rotting garbage? I'm going to start planning my vacation as we speak!
The volume print on the SPY at the close yesterday (7m+ buy and 40 minutes later 5m+)
says it all to me...I alluded to it shortly after it happened.
Ciao
MS
Would the U.S. loan money to the Honduras to get them out of a jam, or Cuba?
Why should the EU care about Iceland or Latvia?
noob goldberg wrote:
Why would you want to stay in Ottawa?
But if you throw enough gasoline on a fire, eventually all the oxygen gets used up and the fire goes out, doesn't it?
German Bonds Plunge
German bonds are plunging on reports that a rescue package will be put together for Greece.
According to Bloomberg, Germany's Finance Minister will address lawmakers on Greece, tomorrow. Obviously, the lawmakers reaction will be key.
Stay tuned.
Rob Dawg wrote:
Well, you'll just look at...I mean, you'll call the...you know, you'll see on TV the...
Well shit.
It's just such a small amount. No
Greece, WHO'S YO DADDY ?
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
When you owe the bank 100,000 EBUs, it is your problem.
When you owe the bank 100,000,000 EBUs, it is the bank's problem.
When you owe the bank 100,000,000,000 EBUs, it is the country's problem?
shill wrote:
Unintended consequences, much?
FOFI rules apply to Greece if they indeed are gonna get bailed out. It's the best position to be in.
Not quite. There were Greenbacks, Confederate bills, Silver dollars, gold standard, FRN's, "1965 dollars" (real vs. inflated), etc. Don't believe the hype.
Inflation is tacit default.
Yancey Ward wrote:
Let us know....
Recruiters are absolutely desperate these days, and having a had time filling positions that require relocation.
They typically get paid a percentage of the salary when the position gets filled. Less positions to fill and lower salary's in some cases.
bearly wrote:
Greece, wer ist Ihrer Vater?
yagij wrote:
And when you owe the bank $2,500,000,000,000 ?
Ummmmm ... so "no," they are not going to give Greece any money.
[sound of balloon deflating, while it zooms crazily once around the room and then flops limply to the ground]
http://myiiphone.com/images/trish_regan_cnbc_outfit.jpg
Cinco-X wrote:
It is your citizens' problem. See Zimbabwe.
barfly wrote:
I found that one too, but it it really her? She doesn't look quite that attractive in the other photos.
When the banks owe a Q ($1,000,000,000,000), it's the worker/taxpayer's problem.
Charles Kiting wrote:
When Greeks strike they look organized & active - when they work not so much.
What about $14,000,000,000,000 Plus?....Ya were F'ed.
You could take USA currency in any form (sorry, the Confederacy doesn't count, they nabbed 2nd place) from 1793 and still spend it.
There's no other country in the world that has longevity like that with their money...
dryfly wrote:
+1 LoL!
1 currency now -yogi wrote:
I think you need help on the math - that's a T not a Q.
Soon, however, Japan's government is going to owe a Q in yen. Now that's a mighty big number.
shill wrote:
I thought that was what they're backstopping, not what they owed; no? Besides, it's what the Treasury owes that's important, right? We could just disband the Fed and let their creditors get in line, couldn't we? After all, it's not a govt. agency
dryfly wrote:
Ahh, the California municipal test. Thanks. At least we don't allow barbed wire on our white sand beaches.
shill wrote:
Who cares?
Federal Reserve can buy them!!
Sounds so dirty when one calls it money.....is it really money anymore?
Now this is money....
Well, it won't be long before "number reform" is a big political item.
threetorches wrote:
Words of support - that's just what is needed. Then Greece can repay those German banks with those words. All fixed - right?
Good news from the EU. Its important the the bail-out of the irresponsible be not solely an American undertaking.
Threetorches,
Yes, that was the key phrase, wasn't it?
Agreed, that " One world Government " just got kicked up a notch further.
Weather Helm wrote:
Thankfully, we waited until computers had enough of a bit width to handle that kind of math. Although it may make those speeches easier when you have an overflow error: We had a quadrillion USD deficit, but thanks to Intel's poor floating point calculations, you all owe us a quadrillion USD!
CaptainMorgan wrote:
It's bizarre and annoying. I told the AT&T recruiter (internal, direct, not 3rd party mud-thrower) to fuck off, I don't need the weirdness & bullshit in my life anymore. He was stunned. I told him to take his constant Indian price-pinging and jam it up his ass.
Yup, forgot 3 zeros. And it's now 2Q in notional derivatives.
They fucked up big time and let the Greek proles get internet access. There will be a general strike tomorrow. Care to bet?
When will the EU bail us out?
shill wrote:
Gross said buy German Bunds.
A guarantee, a promise to pay if Greece defaults, without intending to actually pay, isn't that an empty promise?
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
What about the pound?
REBear wrote:
Gross was selling German Bunds. What did you expect? Heck, he doesn't even need to pay for ad time in CNBC to make the damn pitch.
Chinese Military Waving the Dump U.S. Bonds Threat.
Senior Chinese military officers have proposed that their country boost defense spending, adjust People's Liberation Army deployments, and possibly sell some U.S. bonds to punish Washington for its latest round of arms sales to Taiwan, reports Reuters.
Interviews with Major Generals Zhu Chenghu and Luo Yuan and Senior Colonel Ke Chunqiao appeared in Outlook Weekly, a Chinese-language magazine, published on Monday.
"Our retaliation should not be restricted to merely military matters, and we should adopt a strategic package of counter-punches covering politics, military affairs, diplomacy and economics to treat both the symptoms and root cause of this disease," said Luo Yuan, a researcher at the Academy of Military Sciences.
"Just like two people rowing a boat, if the United States first throws the strokes into chaos, then so must we."
Luo said Beijing could "attack by oblique means and stealthy feints" to make its point in Washington.
"For example, we could sanction them using economic means, such as dumping some U.S. government bonds," Luo said
China PLA officers urge economic punch against U.S.
| Reuters
yagij wrote:
That's why we practice with Mersenne Primes...
Greece would make for a good patsy to blame your malinvestments on in America if you were the fatherland...
Weather Helm wrote:
Everything is a promise to pay, except hard commodities in your hot little hand.
So whats all this about Q's? We talking 'quatloos' again?
anti-spike!
Eric wrote:
anti-anti-anti-spike!
noob goldberg wrote:
Anyone out there getting forced to buy in?
I sometimes check on share availability by putting in short-sell orders a couple of bucks above the market price and seeing if they go through. Yesterday was the first day in forever that there weren't shares available in some of the stocks I check. KSS, for example--I had had a short position there until I closed it last Friday, but as of yesterday they could no longer be shorted.
dryfly wrote:
Qs and Greece? I'm not going there.
Confederate $100 bills are worth 100 USD, often more depending on the mint and condition.
Even Zimbabwe dollars sell on eBay.
iceman wrote:
Bailout Pandemic
Yalt wrote:
shill wrote:
From their perspective it must seem like the cheapest war ever won.
Eric wrote:
Somebody dumped BAC:
BK OF AMERICA CP Share Price Chart | BAC - Yahoo! Finance
Cinco-X wrote:
Somebody dumped AOT (Any Old Thing).
Federal officials review Toyota Corolla complaints - washingtonpost.com
And this shortly after Toyota pulls adverts because they thought there was too much negative publicity. Toyota's really getting pummeled.
The credit and stock markets are voting on government policies and they are now the only votes that count.
shill wrote:
If I recall my schemes from conspiracy theory history, the US is supposed to become the financial 'head' of global capitalism, with NYC becoming not unlike London in the days of the British empire, much as it's already got DC for our modern Palatine Hill.
Agreed, that " One world Government " just got kicked up a notch further.
Cinco-X wrote:
Pull up an intraday chart on any stock at random and you'll see exactly the same.
Unless it's a bond ETF; then you'll need to stand on your head.
OK, so much for that bailout. When is the next one?
I mean come on, it looks like they're going to bail out Greece, so 20 minutes later, the fear trade kicks in again?
dryfly wrote:
And that doesn't take into account to reduced value of those dollars after they're dumped
Seriously though, I wouldn't worry about it; they're caught in a dollar trap, and it they want to sink our currency, let 'em. We've been asking for a revaluation of the Yuan anyway-
Grim_Poppet wrote:
So many lies everywhere.
This will be dumb-ass Gen-X's wakeup call that lying about everything is NOT okay, after all.
Dishonest paper breeds dishonest people.
A Confederate $100 is worth closer to $40-50 strictly as a collectible, it cannot be exchanged for current money, but a $100 Federal banknote from 1861 can.
Eric wrote:
How bad? I don't have real time reports...
sm_landlord wrote:
I figure it took 20 minutes for traders to notice the words "in principle" and draw the correct conclusion.
Great vid over at jesse's
Jesse's Café Américain
Cinco-X wrote:
70 INDU points in 1 minute.
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
Can't those presumably be traded for gold?
broward wrote:
Dishonest paper breeds dishonest people.
Paper breeds opportunity for dishonesty, which breeds dishonest paper as more and more get away with scams. And the scams just get larger over time.
Eric wrote:
At what time? 12:45 EST?
Rob Dawg wrote:
Pretty much. Why won't the Govenator just call Congress's bluff and get the Brink's truck moving to Dawgifornia?
.
Once we bail out Greece, we might as well move the party over to the Left Coast.
When we went off the gold standard in 1933, all obligations on banknotes were voided.
Cinco-X wrote:
Seven S&P points in a tick.
And it wasn't just S&P 500 stocks; it was everything. Reminded me of autumn '08.
I always thought the Grecian Formula was a load of crap
From CRs update: We are talking about support in the broad sense of the word. I cannot specify it now.
Hmmmmm.
JD:
You mean bonus money?
You can "still spend it", if you're alive in 20 years and it buys a month's rent.
Cinco-X wrote:
A little before that. 12:41:10.
EU doesn't want to loose face by inviting the IMF in.
Therefore they will propose an IMF type of proposal with an EU name on the top
As Chung Tsu wrote long ago
Three in the morning four in the afternoon
Cinco-X wrote:
Exactly - they'd be in effect asking for their own second cultural revolution at the same time. Because w/out exports to Wally Mart there isn't anywhere else that output could be redirected to quickly short of intense top down central planning. They could do - have done it before - but no one [certainly not us] knows the risks of that better than they do - they been there done that.
It would truly be a last resort AFTER our consumer market had already REALLY crapped the bed. Consumer spending is down but NOTHING like that would cause.
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
I thought that was '71, and I thought that if you had a Silver or Gold Certificate, they were still valid; no?
exits got really crowded there.......volume ticks really slowed down towards the bottom of the stick.....waiting for the standard NYSE "outage" issues again.
Ciao
MS
Cinco-X wrote:
12:42 EST.
Eric wrote:
I see it now-
Bunds in the oven.
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
Ahem. Silver Certificates? 1964.
Cinco-X wrote:
Gold convertibility for US citizens ended in 1933. For foreign sovereigns, it ended in 1971.
Rob Dawg wrote:
Thanks; all questions now answered-
Maury the Credit Responsibility Panda wrote:
Hey, Sweet Cheeks, what about sending some of those Euros my way?
when I was a kid, we had an old cigar box full of Confederate money that we used to play with. The bills were considered a useless curiousity. Of course, we lost it all.
Roubini's people have proposed a two-euro solution, with the bad eurozone countries getting a weak euro, while the nice eurozone countries get a strong euro. But the bad euro countries would have to pay off their debts in strong euros. Not that I understand any of this.
The gold window was open until 1971 for only foreign governments to exchange their dollars for our gold at $35 per oz, that's it. We officially went off the silver standard on June 24, 1968. That was the last day one could receive silver for their silver certificate banknotes.
Since then, the dollar has been held aloft largely by nothing.
MS wrote:
Market moved against me...I call FAT FINGER! Give me my money back.
noob goldberg wrote:
Can't turn down any of the EU nations now.
California breathes a sigh of relief, too.
John Stark wrote:
Why not just call the "bad euro" a lira? The it would be obvious which was which-
yagij wrote:
If we go that path we might not ever stop the bailing.
At some point the life boat is full and you have to row away.
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
Nothing? What about our vibrant economy and culture of innovation?
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
By our ability to export and tax - so 'yes' - pretty much nothing.
Tool of the Fed wrote:
Well, just like this situation, its effects are only temporary; you have to keep applying it indefinitely.
Cinco-X wrote:
I can see it now. A new carry trade where the workers live in Germany or Scandinavia and vacation in the "bad Euro" southern regions.
.
Waitaminute...
.
CaptainMorgan wrote:
You'd think so, but I haven't really seen an evidence of it yet. Remember the Market can remain "solvent" longer than you can remain sane. (It's hard out here for a Bear...)
Wait some old guy told me one time my house was money in the bank.......man was he dumb.
dollar = packaged air
"Roubini's people have proposed a two-euro solution, with the bad eurozone countries getting a weak euro, while the nice eurozone countries get a strong euro."
OK, Roubini has finally lost it. Might as well just call the whole Euro thing off...
CaptainMorgan wrote:
That moment was LTCM. Everything since then has been shipping water, bailing furiously, tossing the weak and calming the passengers.
Maury the Credit Responsibility Panda wrote:
In principle.
Cinco-X wrote:
Nothing? What about our vibrant economy and culture of innovation?
Scams, raking trasactions, and profit scalping... almost anything else has been hollowed out and leveraged to kingdom come, that can be
on an unrelated note... lunchtime.
Cinco-X wrote:
LOL. Name the "bad euro" in correspondence with the region. So Greece gets drachmas. And when Italy blows up, name it lira. Spain will get pesetas. This way, each currency can reflect the economic conditions of the country.
Some days, my brilliance astounds even me.
Maury the Credit Responsibility Panda wrote:
FWIW, it contained lead as it's active ingredient; the lead "dulled" the shiny gray to make it appear as though your color was coming back.....or so I've heard-
China PLA officers urge economic punch against U.S.
| Reuters
I joked last week about breaking the EU up into an Upper and Lower two part solution. Its a mad, mad, mad...world.
RockyR wrote:
Send them pictures from PeopleofWalMart.com and tell 'em to try their best.
yagij wrote:
If you don't do so soon enough, you get sucked into the sinking ships vortex-
"Hey man."
"Yeah?"
"You Small Euro?"
"No man. I'm Tall Euro. I don't get Small."
Roubini really doesn't know much about money.
Seeing as all Euro banknotes are the same, and only the coins are nationalistic in looks, how would you go about making a good Euro/bad Euro?
EU doesn't want to loose face by inviting the IMF in.
i think that the IMF uses some variant of the paper-bag test, but in reverse.
Cinco-X wrote:
Tease. I could die before that happens. Why sweat the small, only-happens-once-every-80-years stuff?
, more effective than 
, more longer lasting than 
.
Complacency: Cheaper than
I had no idea it was for sale....
Hollywood Sign
Vonbek777 wrote:
Never happen. If it breaks at all it shatters - explodes - into pieces. Like Greece wants to be in an Alternative EU made up of countries like itself - ya right. Who bails it out then? Italy?
dryfly wrote:
Turkey. Who else covered 'em for the previous few hundred years?
Meanwhile, over in the financial I.V. League...
Dartmouth Slashes Staff, Lobbyists Thwart Student Loan Relief
yagij wrote:
Covered - as in dirt - is the appropriate descriptor.
Wholesale inventories fall more than expected - Stocks & economy- msnbc.com
I don't think it can happen either, I was really joking about the undercurrent of nationalism that is still at work in Europe, but then to read this... I think we plunged into the rabbit hole. Where' s Alice?
One Euro makes you larger
One Euro makes you small
And the ones that Mother gives you
Don't do anything at all.
Mr Slippery wrote:
And now the market's gone quiet. Eerily quiet, with just a couple of pipsqueaks in the corner yelling bids at each other while the big money silently waits.
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
Picture shows a 20 something co-ed holding a sign stating "I can't afford school any longer".
.
Honey at ~60k/year, you were never able to afford schooling there. If you needed a sign to voice your opinion, you didn't belong there. /hard_knocks
See and you thought my reference to Hector's sword was obscure. You get it.
Most of the world's citizens aren't so enthralled with the capitalist treadmill; world bankers trying to make it so won't make it happen. Currency imbalances reflect that in the EU and Asia's peg. What constitutes a fulfilling life in Greece is too different than Germany. The former has a history and they have no need to run around all day.
1 currency now -yogi wrote:
And the trading at par is a bunch of hogwash, too. There was a whole industry of "bank note reporting" to spread the word about which issues were solidly backed and which ones weren't.
dryfly wrote:
You say "bail"; I say "cover". Did they have "big, fat" Greek weddings when the Turks ruled there?
Right $60,000 for a piece of paper that states " Hey look at me everybody I am smart "
....sure you are.
purple wrote:
We discussed that in depth last night - most of us agree. The beaches & olive trees & gardens will still be there long after the euro is a memory.
It's hard to say what would have happened if the Germans hadn't come to the rescue of the hapless Italian army in Greece in 1941. It took the krauts 6 precious weeks to beat the Greeks, and as the werhmacht was only a few dozen miles from Moscow when winter broke out later in the year, it might have made all the difference in the world?
Sorry, you're incorrect.
John Stark wrote:
He's been dining with Chavez.
ZeroHedge: "Total, utter, complete confusion. The latest from Reuters, quoting a German Government official, is that the Greece bailout rumors are UNFOUNDED" (link)
Can someone quickly let me know why the USD is tanking when it is the Euro printing that will save the PIIGS?
Is it because the USD was over bought during the uncertainty phase?
Tell Alice
So do they help them in perpetuity? What terms and for how long?
Because they obviously can't help themselves. Going to piss off a lot of germans and french.
Someone wants to make a little more money on the uncertainty? Where is Soros today?
Greece needs a new currency besides You're-Oweds.
Wonder if you can make money on this kind of volatility?
C
sk2322 wrote:
ZH's website beginning to buckle under the load..........................
When people use words like overbought or oversold, what metric are they comparing to?
sk2322 wrote:
That trial balloon didn't last long.
.
Edit: Want to join in the fun that is popping trial balloons: Play Bloons Tower Defense 4, a free online game on Kongregate
.
It has monkeys. It has balloons that need to be popped. It has monkeys throwing darts at balloons that need to be popped. What more do you need!
Oxtail wrote:
Usually, either their book, or their handful of orders they need to match.
Relative to what they bought it with. The other item of the transaction.
Eric wrote:
I didn't see a citation there, and I can't find the opposing story on Reuters. Anyone have a link to support that German cold-feet assertion?
Interesting Times wrote:
I'd like to posit a new term: Flow of fear.
There is a lot of money sloshing around and a lot of fear. IMO it ends in a UST issuance failure.
Report of EU Help for Greece Is Now Described as 'Unfounded' - CNBC
Externalized Costs wrote:
Thankyou, EC.
Oxtail wrote:
It depends, but usually some technical indicator.
overbought/oversold glossary
Rob Dawg wrote:
Why do I get the impression that today is going to be a very interesting close, one way or the other?
It truly is a war....Sinclare is correct in his assumption.
The Greatest Money War of All Time | Money and Markets: Free Investment Email Newsletter
Then why did Trichet run out of a meeting in Sydney to rush back to Europe?
noob goldberg wrote:
A guess but I'd say the smart money is on the sidelines. This isn't investing and probably isn't even trading.
CaptainMorgan wrote:
Thanks for the link. I'm not sure that those terms have much relevance in today's market since it presupposes that all stocks must increase or decline at a slow steady rate.
"I cannot specify it now"
I don't stand under you.....
Could be whipsaw land. Any idea what crashed the Yerp markets just before 4pm GMT? Impressive bounce back for
, but crazy swings.
C
Rob Dawg wrote:
That would be the equivalent of an Extinction-Level Event for capital markets.
Waiting for the retraction of the retraction on Bloomberg.
Knowing the news or planting the news could be profitable for a hedge fund. Reuters is never motivated by a hedge fund manager in the news they publish...right?
Reuters Bends To Steve Cohen And Kills A Story
Trichet bails out of Sydney
Rob Dawg wrote:
No high speed train to take me to Vegas yet, so this will have to do!
OT, it's more relevant to the prior thread: UPS may lay off at least 300 pilots - The Boston Globe
Guess the green shoot aspect is that there may be few more experienced pilots for the regional airlines to hire at low wages, provide poor working conditions (schedules that allow inadequate time for rest) & poorly maintained planes.
Oxtail wrote:
Indeed. The smart money in my house is with my wife, tucked into various bank accounts and in the safe. I'm the sole proprietor of the foolish money in our household, and she only lets me have a tiny bit.
Wouldn't those 300 jobs qualify as brown shoots?
Ha!
Maury the Credit Responsibility Panda wrote:
Conjure called that correctly last summer. This is all the short term survivors scrambling for a niche.
Rob Dawg wrote:
Amen!
OMG. If we don't spend more deficits will increase. Lame duck moment. Right here, right now. Jimmy Carter redux.
I gleefully hold that status in my household, but than again the wife and I were never free spenders anyway. Sure we like the comforts of life like anyone else, but we are savers always were. Our friends on the other hand forget it, they would always poke fun that we owned no credit cards and so on and so fourth.
Now if we want too we can buy all their ( bought on credit ) crap for 5 cents on the dollar....but again we are all set, I do not need a 60" flat screen tv to make me happy.
Hell I don't even watch Tv.....who needs Tv when you have CR
CR has had over 51 million people visit, that's impressive...
Take a bow, please.
Rob Dawg wrote:
Except Jimmy Carter wasn't in collusion with those who held the US populace hostage.
Reuters Headline Changed to: Report of EU Help for Greece Is Now Described as 'Unfounded'
Rob Dawg wrote:
Who are you listening to, Dawg? The governator?
This comment has higher ratings than Lost ? wow.
On our new 52 inch tv we can play slideshows of photos, or galaxies.
shill wrote:
Have you ever read CR on a 60" flat screen?
Interesting Times wrote:
Why watch Gilligan's Island with guns, when you can have a front row seat at the downfall of Western civilization?
noob goldberg wrote:
Young Barry.
Dual euro idea has been floating for months. I think one is called the "euromark"
and the really smart money is on Mars, well away from nuclear strike range.
Dow volume collapses. 300k trades per minute.
Silence on the floor while we listen out for a fuse burning, please...
C
CalculatedRisk wrote:
When I used to drive smooth bore (no baffles) tanker trucks I was constantly aware of the fact that a small manoeuvre could send the water sloshing around and knock me out of control, and as soon as it started rocking it would take an awful lot more effort to wrestle the rig back.
This announcement and retraction feels an awful lot like that.
Ok ok I do have a big Tv, but that is for the I-Carly fanatics.
But take Note.......... 2 tv's In the whole house, I go over to some friends of ours house, and there is a Tv in a every frigging room.....yet he is sour because he is broke and cannot find work....SELL SOME OF YOUR JUNK!
CalculatedRisk wrote:
well they discredited you! that'll learn ya!
Counterpointer wrote:
Exactly. There's been, what, 10 million trades in the past half hour on the Dow? A ghost town.
double inverse recession wrote:
Actually, nothing more than 42". I wouldn't want to go to 60", because the graphs would be just too scary for my delicate constitution.
dryfly wrote:
not to start a ruckus, but I bet the Palestinians thought the same conditions would hold, and Israel would be a memory.....
From: FOREX-Euro climbs vs dollar, lifted by Greece rescue talk 00:24 Hours ago
Basically a one sentence repeat that a spokesman for the German government later said reports that the euro zone has made a decision to aid Greece were "unfounded."
CalculatedRisk wrote:
Can't even trust those socialist bastards for a decent rumor...
Uh oh. He called them "The Islamic Republic of Iran." That doesn't end well.
And just think about how awful this would look on a 60" tv
justaskin wrote:
I don't do smileys.....i didn't do that one....I think I need a drink now
noob goldberg wrote:
On the tick, you can still see the noise from the robots tweaking each other.
Market manipulation?
I guess the Germans saw what the bailout talk was doing to their bond rates and decided to say 'screw this plan'...
sm_landlord wrote:
Like a thousand trades here and there, just weird. No huge blocks, nothing much over a hundred thousand or so.
I've seen this dance before. Testing the markets for support of various ideas without actually having to commit to anything.
bbartlog wrote:
Good thing they gave the bailout plan the long and careful deliberation it merits.
Management by trial balloon. Where have we seen this dance before?
It's amazing how cheap tv's are now, I asked my mom what we paid for our 24 inch color tv-stereo set in a console in the early 1960's, and it was $400.
I paid $1300 for a 52 inch Sony
The Lorax wrote:
I feel so...used.
20 hour flight from Sydney to Berlin. Can't make a decision until the central banker arrives to put a stamp on whatever decision being made.
That's very Yogi of you.
http://static.businessinsider.com/image/4b228af700000000001ede90/miss-greece.jpg
Greece needs a tan.
noob goldberg wrote:
You are so used.
There. I fixed that for ya.
shill wrote:
I disagree.
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
That can't be true, that probably just number of visits, not individuals, and I'm responsible for a huge number of those.
Yeah, well, at least you didn't fall for this one -
Rockstar Development Manager/Architect - Activetrainer.com
Do our work for us!
noob goldberg wrote:
Positive feedback loop. Any system that features them is inherently unstable. Whether the system is currently in or out of control is irrelevant.
You can't engineer your way around a system containing positive feedback loops. You need a complete redesign. Or ... you can nudge it out of equilibrium and see how much stress it can take before shutting down.
Obama holds bipartisan talks on jobs - CNN.com
"Top Republicans emerged from the meeting expressing cautious optimism that an agreement could be reached on a "small package" to help lower the country's 9.7 percent unemployment rate."
McConnell [R] stressed traditional GOP priorities such as nuclear power, off-shore oil drilling, and clean coal technology. He also urged passage of stalled trade agreements with Colombia, Panama and South Korea.
Such measures, he argued, would be "jobs generators."
"Charles Schumer, D-New York, and Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, aids any private sector employer who hires a worker who's been unemployed for at least 60 days. That employer is absolved of paying the 6.2 percent share of the employee's Social Security payroll tax for the rest of 2010."
employers who keep these workers on the payroll continuously for a year would be eligible for a $1,000 tax credit on their 2011 tax returns.
JP wrote:
Any more rib cage showing and I'd say she needs a sandwich!
Presumably it was 51 million humans, not trained apes that logged onto the site.
I am reading that the Bailout of Greece is BS......anyone?
noob goldberg wrote:
It's not like he respected you before this latest spat. We all stay with the abuser thinking we can make him better or get him to show his good side, but we all know it's a lie.
shill wrote:
That's the current rumor. If you don't like it, just wait a few minutes.
Eric wrote:
Great. Investing is being compared to the weather now? No chaos or uncertainty there!
Eric wrote:
Choose the form of your reality.
shill wrote:
More like "the Pagent needs some human beings" What were those.....things????
broward wrote:
CHOOSE THE FORM OF THE DESTRUCTOR.................
Mook wrote:
What equilibrium?
...when you can have a front row seat at the downfall of Western civilization?
No reserved seats when all seats are in the front row.
Mmm as suspected even KD is saying the bailout is bunk....soooo! what up with the 200 plus rise in the DOW?
Sure our Markets are not manipulated......I question why I even have money left in there....yes I am one of the stupid.
yagij wrote:
I volunteer. Ms. France can be the other slice of bread.
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
Spock, "A difference which makes no difference, is no difference."
Presumably it was 51 million humans, not trained apes that logged onto the site.
That would require 51 million peanuts.
Baklava to the future.
Nah, that "jobs proposal" isn't nearly complicated enough or fraught with nearly enough BS paperwork for snail-mail filing with federal offices.
We need to think big, here, with a whole new federal "jobs" czar with a jobs staff and a jobs budget and a suite of offices in DC and lots of lucrative contracts to award to connected K Street buddies.
Mr Slippery wrote:
THIS Equilibrium...
YouTube - Clip from Equilibrium Movie
If you weren't long in 2009, you missed your chance...2010 will be a year of many hard choices, one's we'd like to pretend will never have to be made.
yagij wrote:
I think weather is exactly the right way to approach it and model it. Lots of chaos and uncertainty. There are no efficient markets.
ZH is reporting that the Germany is denying bailout of Greece. Conflicting reports but Greece may be treated like to a state wide bankruptcy.
Step right up, who's gonna be the Creditanstalt this Great Depression?
McConnell [R] stressed traditional GOP priorities such as nuclear power, off-shore oil drilling, and clean coal technology.
Nuclear power and clean coal are worthy climate change ideas, as long as the coal mines don't destroy surrounding environment. Why do we need off-shore drilling?
Mook wrote:
Excellent description, thank you. Related to the inherent instability of smooth bore tankers were these trucks, especially when the tower operator stuck an extra 5 tons on the top just so my trip wasn't 'wasted':
http://www.linex.com/gallery/images/24/16.%20Fertilizer%20Truck.jpg
TB Apple wrote:
Schroedinger's bailout.
As long as it's never observed, everything stays okay.
broward wrote:
Two good fight scenes in that movie, but that's it. I was sadly disappointed with the rest.
Why is everyone obsessing on this old John Travolta movie? GOOG is announcing their Twitter Killer!
...not sure if we need any more proof that this market is fully manipulated. SOMEONE is spilling out totally b.s. news...other morons are reporting this unsubstantiated news...market explodes.
make note: this news came out at EXACTLY 11.31 am......THE low of the market. SOMEONE is making some serious $ on this manipulated crap. it's no longer a market of buyers and sellers...just a market of who can screw others the most wins....a microcosm of the country as a whole.
broward wrote:
Galloping Gertie anyone?
pavel.chichikov wrote:
To secure his job?
Perception of a bailout seems to be more important right now than if there's really a bailout or more importantly IF it will turn things around wherever the bailouts are used to stop deflation.
shill wrote:
I think it would be infinitely funnier if the 'source' for the story had said it because he had just bought a bunch of stocks prior to the announcement. How wonderfully lopsided it would be if todays multi-billion dollar market move was precipitated on one guys $500 bet.
"Schroedinger's bailout.
As long as it's never observed, everything stays okay."
It probably must come, and there's no chance it will not be observed.
YouTube - The Doors 1968 Live at Hollywood Bowl 07 Horse Latitudes
.........and I thought fraud was only allowed by the FedGov..........now the markets too?..........Hoocoodanode?
.....So, is the Bail-out ON or OFF? Inquiring minds want to know.........
threetorches wrote:
We need to think big, here, with a whole new federal "jobs" czar with a jobs staff and a jobs budget and a suite of offices in DC and lots of lucrative contracts to award to connected K Street buddies.
Indeed. Is there, in truth, no problem that limitless money and bloated bureaucracies with no accountability can't fix?
http://www.automatedtrader.net/real-time-news/31605/rumor-mongering-making-it-a-volatile-day-to-trade-eur
Is Accounting Gimmickry Going on in Greece? -- Seeking Alpha
Worries over eurozone spell opportunity for investors
To secure his job?
Maybe. I'd hesitate to ask, though.
Black Star Ranch wrote:
Yes.
pavel.chichikov wrote:
Because without offshore drilling the natural seepage would contaminate the natural environment. Better extracted and controlled than washing up on shore. At least that has been the SoCal experience.