Maybe ya'll should move to a non CS-20 city.

token bull wrote:
If you just shelled out $450K for a cape, be prepared to stay there a while.
The term "Debtor's Prison" may make a colloquial resurgence!

CR sez...

The impact of the massive government effort to support house prices led to small increases in prices over the Summer, and the question is what happens to prices as these programs end over the next 6 months. I expect further price declines in many cities. I'll have more ...

Maybe we'll be back to where there won't be any transactions to compare so prices won't fall. That was fun for awhile.

It would be a great mistake to suppose that the statesmen
of France, or the French people, were ignorant of the
dangers in issuing irredeemable paper money; No matter
how skillfully the bright side of such a currency was ex-
hibited, all thoughtful men in France remembered its dark
side. They knew too well, from that ruinous experience,
seventy years before, in John Law's time, the difficulties
and dangers of a currency not well based and controlled.
They had then learned how easy it is to issue it; how difficult
it is to check its overissue; how seductively it leads to
the absorption of the means of the workingmen and men of
small fortunes; how heavily it falls on all those living on
fixed incomes, salaries or wages; how securely it creates
on the ruins of the prosperity of all men of meagre means
a class of debauched speculators, the most injurious class
that a nation can harbor...

From Fiat money inflation in France

dryfly wrote:

Maybe we'll be back to where there won't be any transactions to compare so prices won't fall. That was fun for awhile.

Ya. There was a funny bit in one of the articles previewing this morning's release where some analyst said "sales are up so prices must be up." A bit foggy on the fundamentals there....

(They seem to have taken the article down after the actual release came out, or I'd post a link.)

Nanoo-Nanoo wrote:
Good thing there a Starbucks, Home Depot, Walmart, super duper mega grocery store, Sams, Target, CVS, mall, tanning salons, hair salons, nail salons, dentists and Immediate Care on every block!
At least if TSHTF, the urban masses will be able to huddle for warmth... it may serve to build a sense of community instead of personal bubble-universes.

This sum—four hundred millions, so vast in those days—
was issued in assignats, which were notes secured by a
pledge of productive real estate and bearing interest to the
holder at three per cent. No irredeemable currency has ever
claimed a more scientific and practical guarantee for its
goodness and for its proper action on public finances. On the
one hand, it had what the world recognized as a most prac-
tical security,—a mortgage on productive real estate of
vastly greater value than the issue. On the other hand, as
the notes bore interest, there seemed cogent reason for
their being withdrawn from circulation whenever they be-
came redundant.

As speedily as possible the notes were put into circula-
tion. Unlike those issued in John Law's time, they were
engraved in the best style of the art. To stimulate loyalty,
the portrait of the king was placed in the center; to arouse
public spirit, patriotic legends and emblems surrounded it;
to stimulate public cupidity, the amount of interest which
the note would yield each day to the holder was printed in
the margin; and the whole was duly garnished with stamps
and signatures to show that it was carefully registered and
controlled.

From: Fiat money inflation in France

badger wrote:

People expecting further price declines need to come up with a reason for why a seller would sell.

To move to a job?

We've been waiting on the sidelines in metrowest boston and/or north shore mass for a dog's age... See some movement in prices and some inventory clearing, but still pretty frozen on both fronts. Some specific cases of friends of family are that the high end is not moving at all... Lots of people stuck with million plus homes who thought it would be a breeze to sell.

Pitch

Pitch, this is what I am seeing--$400K+ has been dead for the last several months. But make no mistake, the high end is cracking. I've seen a few mid-level homes sell for less than starter homes here. That is a sure sign that the declines will continue.

It is just too damn expensive for most of the families here.

The first result of this issue was apparently all that the
most sanguine could desire: the treasury was at once greatly
relieved; a portion of the public debt was paid; creditors
were encouraged; credit revived; ordinary expenses were
met, and, a considerable part of this paper money having
thus been passed from the government into the hands of the
people, trade increased and all difficulties seemed to vanish.
The anxieties of Necker, the prophecies of Maury and Ca-
zalès seemed proven utterly futile. And, indeed, it is quite
possible that, if the national authorities had stopped with
this issue, few of the financial evils which afterwards arose
would have been severely felt; the four hundred millions of
paper money then issued would have simply discharged the
function of a similar amount of specie. But soon there came
another result: times grew less easy; by the end of Sep-
tember, within five months after the issue of the four hun-
dred millions in assignats, the government had spent them
and was again in distress.

The old remedy immediately and naturally recurred to
the minds of men. Throughout the country began a cry for
another issue of paper; thoughtful men then began to recall
what their fathers had told them about the seductive path
of paper-money issues in John Law's time, and to remember
the prophecies that they themselves had heard in the de-
bate on the first issue of assignats less than six months
before.

At that time the opponents of paper had prophesied that,
once on the downward path of inflation, the nation could not
be restrained and that more issues would follow. The sup-
porters of the ñrst issue had asserted that this was a
calumny; that the people were now in control and that they
could and would check these issues whenever they desired.

From: Fiat money inflation in France

What promotion could be worth realizing a $100K+ loss? If you are unemployed, you were already a high risk of default and your default has been priced in.

token bull wrote:
It is just too damn expensive for most of the families here.
+1 for conciseness in stating the obvious problem hiding behind all the chicanery.

The great majority of Frenchmen now became desperate
optimists, declaring that inflation is prosperity. Throughout
France there came temporary good feeling. The nation was
becoming inebriated with paper money. The good feeling
was that of a drunkard just after his draught; and it is to
be noted as a simple historical fact, corresponding to a
physiological fact, that, as draughts of paper money came
faster the successive periods of good feeling grew shorter.

Various bad signs began to appear. Immediately after
each new issue came a marked depreciation; curious it is
to note the general reluctance to assign the right reason.
The decline in the purchasing power of paper money was in
obedience to the simplest laws in economics, but France had
now gone beyond her thoughtful statesmen and taken refuge
in unwavering optimism, giving any explanation of the new
difficulties rather than the right one.

From: Fiat money inflation in France

From: Fiat money inflation in France

I'm going to have to read that again. It's such a good road map for the "future".

BBC News - Secret mobile phone codes cracked

"A German computer scientist has published details of the secret code used to protect the conversations of more than 4bn mobile phone users. The work could allow anyone - including criminals - to eavesdrop on private phone conversations. "

and of course...
"The GSM Association (GSMA), which devised the algorithm and oversees development of the standard, said Mr Nohl's work would be "highly illegal" in the UK and many other countries. "

token bull wrote:

Don't fool yourself into believing that owning will eliminate the "depression".

I agree, the home owner friends and relatives seem to be always occupied mentally with their present homes. Is it time to trade up, shall we renovate and get sales ready and on and on and on... Like a big weight around their necks, always keeping up to date where the neighborhood prices are going etc. etc. Don't know if that is a good way to live. imho. Btw, what is TCO?

SNAFU wrote:
Don't know if that is a good way to live. imho. Btw, what is TCO?
Total cost of ownership - including property taxes, maintenance fees, homeowners' insurance, HOA fees, etc.

In spite of all the paper issues, commercial activity grew more and more spasmodic.

Very nice description of the past 11 years.

token bull wrote:

SNAFU: TCO = Total Cost of Ownership. By my reckoning, if you compare a 20% down 5.5% and 0% price appreciation with renting a comparable place with 1% CD or some such, you are saving at least $5000/year in insurance, maintenance, utilities (water), and opportunity cost of cash. I'm currently saving around $10,000. And my weekends are free.

Thanks, I should have recognized that, not enough caffeine yet. Also in the NYT:

- NY Times

"In the last three months, prices in San Francisco increased at a 25 percent annual rate while Minneapolis was up 17 percent and Los Angeles rose 11 percent. Phoenix, long a laggard, rose 13 percent."

Will make the natives go out and spend some more $ today! Phoenix rising from the ashes.

Since we have clearly gone off topic and are attacking paper money in this thread (which deserves to be attacked), I will post my favorite quote on the subject:

"One of the evils of paper money is that it turns the whole country into stock jobbers. The precariousness of its value and the uncertainty of its fate continually operate, night and day, to produce this destructive effect. Having no real value in itself it depends for support upon accident, caprice, and party; and as it is the interest of some to depreciate and of others to raise its value, there is a continual invention going on that destroys the morals of the country."

Thomas Paine
Complete Writings of Thomas Paine, edited by Philip Foner, Citadel Press, 1945, pp. 405ff

Mish's Global Economic Trend Analysis: The Most Redeeming Feature of Capitalism is Failure

Clever title and a good read.................

CS is fairly lagging, due to its two month lagging, three month moving average nature (meaning the data released today includes the HPI from August), and based on the pattern of the 3 mo moving average, unless we get a significant pop in HPI in November, the next number will almost certainly show a decline in the 3 month moving average as of November, since the August number showed an increase that was very likely above today's average.

In any case, flat to stable house prices while delinquency inventory continues to skyrocket, and incomes and jobs are flat? Good luck maintaining that pattern, especially with rising mortgage rates.

A century from now when some economic historian writes a history of money I suspect the most salient feature of this era will be the decline of paper money. Not its loss of value, but its loss of significance. For the first time in history, monetary transactions don't involve the exchange of a tangible substance.

200 years ago fiat paper was a novelty. The discussions of it on these pages seem hopelessly dated, to me....

BSR, I agree that if you pay for cash, that is true. I'm taking a more mainstream approach for people in expensive areas: 20% down. It is extremely hard to scrape together $450,000 for a decent house in an expensive area before you are 60 years old. For mortgage holders, it is almost always cheaper to rent. Whether the benefits of a stable house/neighborhood is worth the cost is a subjective call.

What's Wrong with the Utility Function?

Mises Daily: Tuesday, December 29, 2009 by Predrag Rajsic

Utility is the importance that we attach to things. We make choices on the basis of this importance. Indeed, in economic terms, "utility," "importance," and "value" are synonyms. We choose what is more important to us and give up what is less important. Utility is subjective.

Carl Menger (1840–1921) is the father of this subjective theory of value. He states, "value is therefore nothing inherent in goods, no property of them, but merely the importance that we first attribute to the satisfaction of our needs, that is, to our lives and well-being."

There is no economist — except those who adhere to the failed labor theory of value — who denies this proposition. However, it seems there are many who, along the way, have forgotten what Menger meant by "diminishing marginal utility."

This essay is based on the following postulates of the subjective theory of value: (1) utility is always marginal, and (2) something has utility only if it satisfies a human end.

The law of diminishing marginal utility simply states that every additional unit of a homogeneous good or service is worth less than the previous unit. This law follows directly from the fact that we attach different value to different things, the fact that we choose more valuable things over less valuable things, and the fact that we exist in time. The first unit of a homogeneous good or service is the most valuable because we use it for the satisfaction of the most important end.

If I'm able to write the script that keeps the minions punching the clocks that make the world turn, why would I ever give that up to you and your childish notions of value ?

Rob Dawg wrote:

Were it not for the volume and price supports induced by FedGov incentives the cliff edge and second leg down would already be obvious. It is important to remember that even prior to this blatant meddling we were already being influenced by interest rate intervention. So, now with no more rate stimulus to apply and an end to the incentives it is entirely possible that this next leg down mat be more brutal than what we've seen so far.

Speaking of a second (or next) leg down:
Shorting the Economic Recovery - Interview with Kevin Duffy and Bill Laggner - Barrons.com

"Capitalism is primarily attacked by two groups: utopians who wish to impose a more "compassionate" system, and political capitalists who want to enjoy the fruits of success without bearing the pain of failure. They use the coercion of the state to gain privileges, at the expense of everyone else."

Even worse than this was the breaking down of the morals of the country at large, resulting from the sudden building up of ostentatious wealth in a few large cities, and from the gambling, speculative spirit spreading from these to the small towns and rural districts. From this was developed an even more disgraceful result,—the decay of a true sense of national good faith.

From: Fiat money inflation in France

Juvenal Delinquent wrote:

From: Fiat money inflation in France

We get it.

At the outset, in the discussions preliminary to the first issue of paper money, Mirabeau and others who had favored it had insisted that patriotism as well as an enlightened self interest, would lead the people to keep up the value of paper money.

The very opposite of this was now revealed, for there appeared, as another outgrowth of this disease, what has always been seen under similar circumstances. It is a result of previous, and a cause of future evils. This outgrowth was a vast debtor class in the nation, directly interested in the depreciation of the currency in which they were to pay their debts.

From: Fiat money inflation in France

Just took a closer look at the SA data - it is almost a certainty that house prices have dropped in October, which would be consistent with the LP index. Here are the Comp 20 SA numbers for the past few months. remember these are a 3 month moving average.

Jan 147.62
Feb 144.88
March 141.76
April 140.52
May 140.32
June 141.38
July 142.96
Aug 144.57
Sept 144.96
Oct 145.36

Note the big pop in August. That means a big number entered the index. Most likely a number above the current index value.

Based on the pattern, it is almost a sure thing the Comp 20 SA index will decline in November - the SA number added this month would be below the 3 month ma.

JD,

If you're looking do a serialization, at least have the decency nova did to make it optional rather a repetitive excercise...get a blog, entice us with a tidbit and give it a rest...

Nuke wrote:

I have a terrible feeling we are being set up for intervention in Yemen.

The House of Saud will be ever so grateful, dontcha know...

Words written in 1912 about something that happened 120 years prior, are just as timely as today.

This message board is like a bell--it doesn't matter what kind of post CR hits it with, it rings at its resonant frequency.

OT: anyone have a guess why ^TNX isn't updating on Yahoo Finance? Hasn't updated since Xmas eve.

Juvenal Delinquent wrote:

Words written in 1912 about something that happened 120 years prior, are just as timely as today.

ALL of them?

This message board is like a bell--it doesn't matter what kind of post CR hits it with, it rings at its resonant frequency.

Haha...

Yahoo! broken is.

200 years ago fiat paper was a novelty. The discussions of it on these pages seem hopelessly dated, to me....

Paper money and the computer blips signifying wealth dancing around inside your computer, are both financial instruments based upon faith-nothing more, only updated for easier usage.

Goldman- vs. China.

Put 'em in the ring. Couldn't think of a more amusing
set of adversaries.

Money of Account!! Useful as a concept when you can actually pull it out and spend it.

Now dead electrons.

Ooooooh, Ahhhhhhhh.

adornosghost wrote:

Chinese firm says won't pay Goldman on options losses

Hu eats ?

SNAFU wrote:

Only whole grain, farmers market fruits and vegies , ocean fish and organic yogurt. Not much else(beer is exempt).

Leave out the grains, as they are destroying the planet. Pollan makes a good case for that.

OT rant: With the new toy safety regs, I know have to unscrew every stinking battery cover. Grr!!!

MS wrote:

OT: Kind of makes ACORN look tame

Hahahaha....no, no, no!!!! It's different...the Tea Party is a spontaneous movement of independent patriots seeking to return us to first principles!!!! It's only astro-turf when those liberals pay street people to vote for them.

You know, you have to admire Dick Armey's entrepreneurial instincts and timing.

(OT) and (Kind of Boring) Juvenal Delinquent said: "The parallels with our Reign of Error & the French Revolution are extraordinary, just wanted to share them..."

Except for the key ones: That the government, the clergy and the nobles confiscated most of the income of the masses, on top of the fact that they owned about 80% of everything already, and the masses had no recourse and no hope of ever rising from their station.

And the clergy paid zero taxes, with the nobles often being able to avoid them.

And the fact that the clergy and nobles only made up about 130,000 people in a country of 25 million, representing a stunning maldistribution of wealth that doesn't exist in this country.

Other than that...

Sebastian

Comrade Scott wrote:

...the Tea Party is a spontaneous movement of independent patriots seeking to return us to first principles!!!!

There just isn't enough toilet paper to respond to that.

,rad ee,

It's a fun one, this oncoming train-wreck. It looks like so many historical epochs, but the icing on the cake was the Xmas Eve giveaway, which made us look most like the French Revolution all over again.

In lieu of pikes, pitchforks and scythes, the hoi ploy today is a bit more armed and dangerous....

badger wrote:

OT rant: With the new toy safety regs, I know have to unscrew every stinking battery cover. Grr!!!

Get the corded model like Maria uses - problem solved.

BSR Gets it! +100. The high price of housing is fueled by debt slaves.

Well, I can think of one thing that might help prices at the higher end in 2010 - the one year repeal of the estate tax. No forced selling to satisfy the tax man.

ghostfaceinvestah wrote:

Note the big pop in August. That means a big number entered the index. Most likely a number above the current index value.

Nice catch...I find the sideways motion in the published numbers...reassuring insofar as it matches my expectations. I feel that the bump was a sure sign we were just pushing forward a lot of demand, and that the shadow inventory wasn't being depleted...I think the next leg down starts shortly and CS will lag and follow the coming news about November prices...down, down, down.

Cheers!

2 points to the party that also uses fiat to explain the fall of the Habsburgs. Folks are confusing effects with causes.

Confusion fills skies after attempted bombing - Yahoo! News

Ait Travel is definitely not fun anymore; bring back the micro mini , please.
"
On Continental Flight 1788 from Cancun, Mexico, to Newark, three airport security agents frisked everyone at the gate, including babies, prompting one to scream loudly in protest. On the plane, crew announced that the toilets would be shut down the last hour of the flight and passengers would not be able eat, drink, or use electronic devices.

The warning that the bathrooms would be shut down led to lines 10 people deep at each lavatory. A demand by one attendant that no one could read anything either elicited gasps of disbelief and howls of laughter.

In-cabin screens normally showing the plane's location and flight path were switched off on an Air France flight Saturday from San Francisco to Paris. Flight attendants said they were turned off as a security measure.
"

Eric wrote:

In other word, exactly like today.

LOL, at first I thought this was a snark, then I read it was authored by Sebastian... the top 5% own about 80% of everything and inflation-adjusted incomes for the bottom 4 quintiles have seen miniscule gains over at least 30 years. The capitalist class specializes in tax avoidance and under GWB, lowered cap gains tax below income tax, while it is all but obvious that the top predators in the government/FIRE system pay no or few taxes. 130k/25M is the 0.5% of the true elites... This doesn't just rhyme, it borrows whole stanzas.

SNAFU wrote:

Ait Travel is definitely not fun anymore

Next on the security spiral: mandatory anal/vaginal searches. (but you can't bring KY because it is a liquid which is forbidden.)

Is the book you are quoting your own work? Or in the public domain? (This is not at all clear from the format you were using. If not, you went way over fair use.

"I think the next leg down starts shortly and CS will lag and follow the coming news about November prices...down, down, down."

Based on my reverse engineering of the components of the 3 month moving average, house prices have already started declining in October, which again would be consistent with the Loan Performance index (which uses basically the same methodology as CS).

IMHO the problem continues to be the high (and growing) level of delinquencies, which rots away the entire housing market. Worse, thanks to the government, that delinquency inventory has become self-perpetuating.

Once this widely-followed index starts showing further declines, even on a seasonally adjusted basis, I am afraid the combination will be toxic.

Anonymous Bosch (profile) wrote on Tue, 12/29/2009 - 9:19 am
Hu tells from Hell to go pound sand

plus China has been signaling more intent on canceling America's credit card. However, the MSM won't touch it because it would scare too many Mericans that is a joke and perhaps have ugly consequences.

Yalt wrote:

Retail consumers routinely creating money with the touch of a button. There's no historical parallel.

Slightly semantic disagreement--they create credit at the touch of a button. Only the Fed can "create" money. There is a difference. As JP Morgan said in 1907 to the Senate, "Gold is money, that's it."

JimPortlandOR wrote:

Next on the security spiral: mandatory anal/vaginal searches.

That ought to propel our finest to find Bin Laden in a hurry!

In another OT

Big tourist draw, Sea lions have vanished from Pier 69 in San Francisco. In October there were a record population. Big problem for the young mayor.

I bought some SRS about 6 months ago in the teens, also with gambling money- and well I can't quite grasp it, but its performing poorly. Maybe 2010 will wake up investors. Sure glad I didn't bet the farm on it though, "the market can stay wrong, longer than you can stay solvent."

On another note, I saw a comment about a lot of people being on the sidelines. All I have to say to that is, I have been "on the sidelines" since 2004 or so, and I refuse to buy until the numbers start making sense and that CS curve is back down near 100, preferably lower. At this point, it doesn't matter much to me, I am over owning. While a few of my friends are getting killed by their mortgage + taxes, I am socking away into my savings account. By the time prices get to a reasonable level, I might be able to buy a modest place in cash. The OER ratios in the NYC and metro area are insane.

Samsung's former Chairman pardoned, again -- Engadget

After being convicted of tax evasion netting a $110 million fine and a deferred 3-year prison sentence, Lee Kun-hee, the former chairman of Samsung Group, has been pardoned by the South Korean government -- his second presidential pardon after first being convicted in 1996 of bribing former South Korean president Roh Tae-woo. Why the reprieve? Easy, so the 67 year old can help the country pursue a bid for the 2018 Winter Olympics.

SNAFU wrote:

JimPortlandOR wrote:
Next on the security spiral: mandatory anal/vaginal searches.
That ought to propel our finest to find Bin Laden in a hurry!

"Ms. Pelosi, it is noble that you chose not to avoid the safety search as an example to the little people but this is your third time in line!"

ghostfaceinvestah wrote:

Worse, thanks to the government, that delinquency inventory has become self-perpetuating.

Government has little to do with it.

Crashing the market would have same issues only faster and in a more disruptive way.

Thats right, but if I remember it is best to be loved and feared...maybe my Death Star can have a free beam too.

Here in the northwest suburbs of Chicago, the number of homes listed on the MLS at asking prices > $600k is 72. The number of sales recorded as of Dec. 3 for 2009 at or above that price is 26. It seems safe to assume that there is a substantial shadow inventory of foreclosures that are not on the MLS, and another substantial shadow inventory of homes people really want to sell but have delisted in despair.

The Case-Shiller prices for the mid- and high-end here are being set by the relatively tiny number of homes actually selling in this environment, at a pace at which we have multiple years of inventory. These are not market-clearing prices, and so do not reflect the true nature of the market.

energyecon wrote:
the issues relate to human nature and trust (at the core of your quotes) - the countervailing force is the "bread and circuses," will they keep the hoi polloi sleepwalking per NaRM?
You can't eat propaganda so I hope they can keep up on the "bread" part. Transitioning the US to an official "dole" will be interesting though.

It doesn't take much to incite the hoi ploy, their emotions are easily set off, like a hair-trigger.

And they are all copy-cats, they do and say whatever the herd does...

"I take it the Fannie delinquencies fit your expectations nicely? "

Yeah, not surprised at all.

Unlike CR and others, I don't think principal reductions are in the cards, at least not next. Next step, which should be announced in mid-Jan (or maybe NYE), will be that HAMP mods that are current but have not submitted docs, will not have to submit docs. i.e. stated income mods.

That way, despite falling prices, the Admin will be able to point to the "good news" of falling delinquencies.

This move, of course, will lead more people to default to get a lower payment without the documentation requirement.

And, of course, it will require portfolio room and capital for Fannie and Freddie as they finally buy the mods out of MBS.

And of course it will just prolong the economic malaise in this country, which is just fine with TPTB.

Vonbek777 wrote:

My fortune cookie yesterday told me the new year would bring interesting times. I tried to return it, they wouldn't let me.

ruh roh Raggie...

My New Year's resolution is to learn how to make bread in as many different ways as possible. We have a breadmaker (get one, if you don't have one) and it's the bomb, but I want to figure out other avenues, as well.

Sebastian wrote:

And the fact that the clergy and nobles only made up about 130,000 people in a country of 25 million, representing a stunning maldistribution of wealth that doesn't exist in this country.

130k/25m is 0.5%, So there .5% owned 80%. Here (supposedly) the top 1% own half. So, you are right about the concentration being higher but at what point (percentage) does the society stop being democratic? Perhaps 1% owning half is too much? Perhaps 10% owning 90% is too much?

and the masses had no recourse and no hope of ever rising from their station.

Depends how you define masses and station. In the US we're told that Bill Gates and the Google-Guys PROVE that peasants can move to nobility. I'm wondering, however, if you subtract out the extremes how much migration takes places from the bottom to the top. As you've said, the peasants don't have access to the same class of schools that we do, so the losers with the bad schools are kinda screwed (on average, but - yes - the "black-swan" people will always succeed, probably even in back then).

And the clergy paid zero taxes, with the nobles often being able to avoid them.

Substitute corporation for clergy and see how this sounds.

I need to knead!

Bill Gates was hardly from peasant stock. Upper middle class
dad I believe.

JD,
My father told me over Christmas that when he was over in Iraq the Iraqi army had a morale issue over bread. Seems the US mess halls didn't know how to make real bread...so the compromise was to give them the ingredients directly. The preferred method of making pita bread was in super heated 50 gallon drums. Just take the dough, stick it to the side of the barrel for a few seconds, and it was done. Olive oil used liberally. Dad said it was quite simple and quite delicious.

Looks like we'll be at the top of the list again in 2010 when BFF starts back up...
Troubled Georgia Bank List Grows - News Story - WSB Atlanta
"The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reports that each bank is saddled with bad loans. For example, Piedmont Community has $26 million in severely delinquent loans, compared to just $6 million a year ago." ---A 433% increase YOY.

...The reason I find that loss of Fed independence to be a source of alarm is the observation that every hyperinflation in history has had two ingredients. The first is a fiscal debt for which there was no politically feasible ability to pay with tax increases or spending cuts. The second is a central bank that was drawn into the task of creating money as the only way to meet the obligations that the fiscal authority could not. Every historical hyperinflation has ended when the fiscal problems got resolved and independence of the central bank was restored....

Econbrowser: Concerns about the Fed's New Balance Sheet

How do you guys make comments italicized, or bold for that matter?

,rad V777,

If I have fresh bread, all is well. Can't eat concrete.

piqued wrote:

Slightly semantic disagreement--they create credit at the touch of a button. Only the Fed can "create" money. There is a difference. As JP Morgan said in 1907 to the Senate, "Gold is money, that's it."

"Money" is whatever is commonly accepted as a medium of exchange. You'll find it loses its value as an analytic concept if you try to restrict its definition to some insignificant fraction of economic transactions.

Next we'll be analyzing Iraq in terms of musket and cannon and linear tactics.

House Prices: Stress Test, Price-to-Rent, and More

ResistanceIsFeudal wrote:

Are you surprised it isn't ending well?

No, I think it's all historically predictable.

The US runs on lies, who the best liar is and who is friends with what liars.

I've seen it explode over the past fifteen years. It's in corporations, gov't, everywhere.

It's all about gladhanding and lying, which is why we have a lot of fake financials and loan defaults, etc, etc.

Lies.
Lies.
Lies.
Scams, padding contracts, double-billing, covering your boss's double-billing ass, etc.

Cinco-X wrote:

America has been a living revolt against that pagan idea, ever since the founders of America declared that "all men … are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights" and "that among these rights are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."

Nice, rousing, and didn't mean S**t if you were black. I tend to ignore any discourse that starts from there......

In my Galileo's daughter book, the daughters seem to be ok as far as
clothes and shelter were concerned (lengths of silk being shared were mentioned)
but the letter-writing daughter keeps complaining of not enough food. Until at the
end when someone left the convent a farm as a legacy.

The daughter mentions this over and over again, somewhat to my bewilderment,
since he seems to have sent her money when she wanted to buy into a better
convent room. Then in reading the Great Wave, there were a lot of years with
not much food grown.

She died at only 33 or 34. And SHE PULLED OUT HER OWN TEETH, including
a specifically mentioned rotten molar. I suspect she has severe, multiple
nutritional deficiencies, which were probably so common as to be unremarkable.

Maybe she would have had to share any food with her numerous sisters that dad sent and it would have been
prohibitvely expensive to feed them all.

broward wrote:

Lies.
Lies.
Lies.

Lies are a perfectly good survival trait in humans. Lying wasn't invented fifteen years ago. I think you just "woke-up" to it. People like you (and me) have a difficult time accepting that duplicity is a sign of maturity in people and these mature people rule the earth. I haven't done this myself, but people like us can only survive by accepting lying as good. In the end, to fit into any society, a person needs (no exceptions NEEDS) self-delusion (the ability to live more than one parallel "perfect moral" life) or duplicity. I think it might be easier to develop self-delusion than duplicity.

Juvenal, Re: Fiat Money In France
How about some stories of "Wildcat Money" in the US of A? The printing of paper money by any and all banks back in the day was really interesting. The panics were also very interesting.

NOTaREALmerican wrote:

I haven't done this myself, but people like us can only survive by accepting lying as good.

NaRm, I've had to come to a different accommodation than that. The genuine harm is done where the lying isn't recognized or, sometimes, where it's needlessly pointed out. I'm rather better at noting dishonesty as time goes on, and far better at keeping my counsel when I do see it.

burnside wrote:

where it's needlessly pointed out.

Yeah, that done make more sense. I guess I'd rephrase my sentence to say: "... survive by accepting lying as necessary."

"Big tourist draw, Sea lions have vanished from Pier 69 in San Francisco. In October there were a record population. Big problem for the young mayor."

I almost blew my coffee over the keyboard picturing the poor bastard boat owner in some other marina in SF finding those big bastards using his boat for a place to poop.

Seb,
It doesn't surprise me considering how much of the productive capacity of America they own. Maybe they should pay the government even more protection money?

similar anecdote, different venue: Paid Public Storage through end of year in about July, about 2C/mo. End up $24 short in Dec due to undercharge or something. After the 15th get slapped with penalty and get card saying rental will be terminated at end of month if don't pay up. Go down and pay through end of June 2010. Had been late in 2008 and no letter threatening the boot.

Must have a lot of people abandoning their stuff in the storage lockers.