Does not bode well for Christmas retailers, I fear.

Isn't that when cards like Chase started raising minimum payments to levels that no one could afford?

Edit: Or was that when Citicards jacked some of their rates to 29.99%?

CalculatedRisk wrote:

BTW, tons of data tomorrow ...

Mmm... data... nom nom nom nom nom!

It's times like this that millions are grateful they took all that dead money sitting in house equity and invested it in high yielding granite counter tops.

Yeah, but that means that "Good News: Credit Card Delinquencies Are Falling".

And positive quarters at HP, et al have nothing to do with laying off huge swaths of their workforce.

CR wrote:

At noted in the article, credit card defaults tend to track unemployment

That makes credit card defaults a lagging indicator! Nothing to see here, move along.

This seems to go against the TransUnion report this morning that showed serious delinquencies falling. the key difference is the TU report was about 90+ day delinquent accounts (1.10% in 3Q down from 1.17% in 2Q, and 1.09% a year ago). More people missing short term, ie 30 days past due, fewer blowing off CC bills altogether.

Looks like a jogless recovery, people are so out of shape, they have a hard time making it from the front door to the car without getting winded.

everybody wants a countertop that keeps the food warm

Write-offs may peak at 12 percent to 13 percent in 2010

So will unemployment. Hey, are they just using the same numbers?

Spunkmeyer wrote:

Is this pretty much the last "big week" of data that will have a substantial effect on the overall holiday shopping season?

Pretty much, except for those that receive layoff notices...

About as well as airports today compare to the airports of the 1880's. CC's were not invented until the 50's and really didnt take off until the 60's

I skimmed the Black Friday pre-releases,...I don't think they'll bring in higher traffic numbers or sales.

sdtfs wrote:

Write-offs may peak at 12 percent to 13 percent in 2010

Yeah, but that's because the CC companies will have finally slowed down lending to people that can't pay it back. It would be interesting to see the total $$ figure charged on cards vs time.

Dirk van Dijk wrote:

This seems to go against the TransUnion report this morning that showed serious delinquencies falling. the key difference is the TU report was about 90+ day delinquent accounts (1.10% in 3Q down from 1.17% in 2Q, and 1.09% a year ago). More people missing short term, ie 30 days past due, fewer blowing off CC bills altogether.

Also, Moodys was one month (October vs. September), and TU was Q3 vs. Q2.

Juvenal Delinquent wrote:

Sergeant Hulka: When I tell you move, you'll move fast. When I tell you to jump, you're gonna say, "How high?"

We all look like Mrs. Obama now.

sdtfs wrote:

I skimmed the Black Friday pre-releases,...I don't think they'll bring in higher traffic numbers or sales.

I've seen lots of featured ads for flat screen TVs, but I'd still consider those a big ticket item compared to the $25 DVD player you end up being trampled for at Wal-Mart. And, the DTV conversion earlier this year probably pulled forward a lot of demand for new TVs.

NOTaREALmerican wrote:

Maybe THIS Christmas IS the final battle.

More like the Final Countdown! (YouTube)

Citizen AllenM writes:
"Guess I have been here too long. I imagine I am now a "long time resident"

We're all mad here.

Hoopajoops LTD wrote:

mad here

But, not the mad cow kinda mad... Another kind.

Rob Dawg wrote:

Does anyone default without having maxed out the limit?

Prior to the bankruptcy reform, you bet they maxed out the cards prior to BK. After the reform, more debtors are forced to file a Ch 13, so they usually have to pay something on the CC debt unless they are out of work and can file the Ch7.

my parents are aiming for the 40 1080p LCDs for $500 at costco. quite a difference from the $6K that my uncle dropped for one about 5 years ago...

Didn't we lose a shopper, last Black Friday?

Terry wrote:

sales tax collections are down more than sales.

Many states do not tax "food". This has been the one area of sales growth that has made Walmart look good compared to other retailers.

(Seriously OT) What to know what kind of would bring true fear and capitulation to my family law tainted heart? This scenario.

Rom Houben was misdiagnosed as being in a vegetative state after a car crash left him totally paralysed. For the whole time, he was trapped in his own body with no way of letting friends and family know he could hear every word they were saying. The 46-year-old, who can now tap out computerised messages and read books on a device above his hospital bed, has revealed: "I screamed, but there was nothing to hear.

'Price-fixing schemes'

http://www.springerlink.com/content/t03576548640k684/fulltext.pdf?page=1

'Some Parallels Between Currency and banking Crisis'

'Indeed, the government assets backing the exchange rate and bank deposits can ultimately be the same assets.
Once the asset backing is gone, or the government chooses to halt its further depletion, price-fixing schemes collapse.'

...Price-fixing schemes collapse.

yagij wrote:

What to know what kind of would bring true fear and capitulation to my family law tainted heart?

Waking up with a cougar in Vegas and a marriage certificate?

yep. sales tax collection is a huge problem for the states right now, simply because too many merchants are commingling funds for operations. a tax preparer i know has been bombarded with nasty letters from the state, telling her to remind all clients of the deadline. wouldn't surprise me if states start to move towards prepay, though that would be the end of a lot of merchants.

Brick & mortar rigis. It was a 1-2 combo punch that did them in, online competition and the great unravelling of business, in the early 21st century. Strangely enough, the online retailers mostly went out of business as well also, until there was just one store to buy things from, the G.U.M. in the central city.

That is quite the conundrum...

1. Sales on the internet not being taxed
2. Crappy data - either sampling error (survivor bias attributed to sales growth) or 'leaning on the scale'
3. Food sales as percentage of total sales increasing and reducing tax take
4. ???

delinquent sales tax collection.

Dirk van Dijk wrote:

This seems to go against the TransUnion report this morning that showed serious delinquencies falling.

see:

transunion strong point is Texas market...I wouldn't read to much into what they say outside of texas market.....most people who use credit reports are not big fans of TU

That is quite the conundrum...

1. Sales on the internet not being taxed
2. Crappy data - either sampling error (survivor bias attributed to sales growth) or 'leaning on the scale'
3. Food sales as percentage of total sales increasing and reducing tax take
4. Delinquent sales tax collection (ht Basel Too)

energyecon wrote:

Food sales as percentage of total sales increasing and reducing tax take

Restaurant traffic certainly supports this factor.

L8TR - got to head home and walk the dogs.

Basel Too wrote:

it is amazing that the government is typically the low man on the creditor totem pole.

Not a tax lawyer, but I am sure some states pin the business owers personally for not remitting the sales taxes. Of course, that is the case for payroll withholdings, too.

energyecon wrote:

That is quite the conundrum...

as long as we're trying to fence in the answer, what about small retailers who are collecting sales tax but failing to pay it to the taxing authority on time because they dipped into that to meet payroll or an order for inventory?
It's a big gap though, is it a thousand little things like failure to collect sales taxes or is it a smaller number of big impacts like internet/food sales tax exemptions, or data with poor accuracy?

Oddjob Alert

Was it Goldfinger or Bond who ended up with Pussy Galore?

"wouldn't surprise me if states start to move towards prepay,"

Non-starter. Not death and taxes, but death by taxes.

EvilHenryPaulson wrote:

what about small retailers who are collecting sales tax but failing to pay it to the taxing authority on time because they dipped into that to meet payroll or an order for inventory?

They would be complete idiots is my first thought, but it depends on the setup and the state. I would imagine inter-mingling state taxes with private funds willingly would be like messing with an escrow account. It works until it doesn't, and when it doesn't, the buck is going to stop on the owner's head.

I was out where Jesus lost his sandals, on Hwy 58 in the high desert of the Mojave, when I passed a gas station with a sign that has those changeable letters-like the numbers on the sign that gives the different prices for gasoline, and it proclaimed:

"Try Are Costa Ricon Coffee"

"Try Are Costa Ricon Coffee"

Well, they tried.

If'n I was a small retailer that was on the verge of not making it like all of em' are, i'd consider using the 10% loan from the state in the guise of tax collections not passed on, if push>met<shove.

What happens in a game of monopoly when one player wins all the assets?

pavel.chichikov wrote:

What happens in a game of monopoly when one player wins all the assets?

Where I'm from, the other players kill him.

What happens where you're from?

energyecon wrote:

Delinquent sales tax collection (ht Basel Too)

Actually, josap mentioned it first on this thread, though Basel had a bit more detail.

I think what they were both saying or intending was "remittance" not "collection."

josap (profile) wrote on Mon, 11/23/2009 - 4:06 pm

Some small retailers have a choice, make payroll or pay sales tax. They are thinking they can make up the tax with holiday sales.

They win of course!!

Juvenal Delinquent wrote:

if push>met<shove.

Lots of small retailers are already past push and shove.
January will see more vacant space.

"Meredith Whitney came out this week and said that since the stock market highs last year, there has been $1.5 trillion of available credit removed from the consumers, and she went on to say that another $1.2 trillion more will evaporate. This has, and will, continue to hamper consumer spending"

The Mean Old Investor

pavel.chichikov wrote:

What happens in a game of monopoly when one player wins all the assets?

You don't "win" the assets, you earn them. Chance: [Bank Error in their favor. Pay $14T]

hahahahahahahahahahah

In the Wall*Street version, it doesn't matter how the dice roll, you just have the Fed loan you 10x the amount of money outstanding on the table, and end up owning everything.

In the regular version when one player wins all the assets, everybody is usually tired and goes to bed. The winner always had to put the game away, in our household.

Northeastern ends football after 74 seasons - College Football - Rivals.com

I expect there will be a few more stories like this.

Basel Too wrote:

wouldn't surprise me if states start to move towards prepay,

I have heard, though I can't confirm, that the State of California has done some preliminary work with CC companies towards having the sales tax portion of a CC sale sent directly to the state, not to the merchant's account, once the transaction clears.

All it would take is inputting the sales number and tax number separately. Certainly the technology is there to do it now.

yagij wrote:

I screamed, but there was nothing to hear

I wonder if a "brain scanner machine" can see Yes's and No's? If so, wouldn't it be great to start selling "kits" to prevent you (and your loved ones) from being trapped in a "vegetative state" inside your own skull? I'm thinking, for only $29.99 a month (for 6 months), we could "create" something that would allow you (or your loved one) to train their brain to generate Yes & No signals which could be picked up by a "brain scanner machine". You'd never need to worry about being trapped in a "vegetative state" again.

This offer is not available in any stores. Operator are standing by. The first 20 callers receive a free copy of "The Illustrative guide to do-it-yourself brain surgery".

sportsfan wrote:

All it would take is inputting the sales number and tax number separately. Certainly the technology is there to do it now.

feels like a VAT, sounds like a VAT, when will we see it if comes out as a VAT?

The other players throw away what little money they had left and play another game, while the monopolist is left holding worthless scraps of paper.

The game ends, play is no longer possible, because no one has assets to contribute to the play except the winner. The more closely we approach that outcome the more critical the situation. In real life the winners may be a select group, or the state. But according to the rules of the game in any mass society so far this outcome is possible.

Where do I send a thank you letter for GE? Is it the White House, or some e-mail list? I wouldn't think it appropriate to send it to Immelt considering GE the company isn't paying the $700k towards rink refurbishment in exchange for advertising/space rental
CBC News - British Columbia - Vancouver's Robson Square skating rink reopens

pavel.chichikov wrote:

In real life the winners may be a select group, or the state.

No economic system has a pleasant reset button. Only the"flip the monopoly board up in the air and pull out the six-shooters" ending (usually after the camera shows close-ups of the players eyes, real quick. Need good music too).

sdtfs wrote:

didn't you guys ever win one?

No, the other guys always pulled the six-shooters first. It's THEIR fault.

rosethorn wrote:

Northeastern ends football after 74 seasons - College Football - Rivals.com
I expect there will be a few more stories like this.

Ahh one of the many institutions of higher education that ultimately suggested i pursue academic excellence elsewhere.

Reading the article is an exercise in reading twixt the lines. Ultimately it was about money. $4m per year. That's probably as much as they spend on white glazed bricks.

IMO, an early indicator of the higher ed bubble popping.

Well if enough small retailers don't send on the taxes,
will it turn out like uncollectible mortgages? Not that I
am saying that anybody should do this.

My hub prosecuted a gas station owner who didn't send on the taxes.

"Can't the "winner" loan the other players assets with a lien on their future earnings?"

Yes. But will future earnings suffice to pay off the loan? That depends on variables, such as technological and scientific innovation, educational opportunity, social stability, expansion of markets, demographic increase, developments in exploitation of resources, administrative efficiency, et. al. A mass society is not a simple machine.

Lawyerliz,

Saw a show last night about a mob guy from NYC who ended up in Miami. Made a fortune by opening a series of gasoline wholesalers who didn't pay their gas taxes. Said he just did one after another and went out of business. At one point was skimming 8 or 9 million dollars a week in taxes he didn't pay on to the state. Got the Key to the City from the Mayor of Miami before they finally caught up to him after about a decade of the scam. RICO conviction I think.

pavel.chichikov wrote:

"Can't the "winner" loan the other players assets with a lien on their future earnings?"
Yes. But will future earnings suffice to pay off the loan? That depends on variables, such as technological and scientific innovation, educational opportunity, social stability, expansion of markets, demographic increase, developments in exploitation of resources, administrative efficiency, et. al. A mass society is not a simple machine

I was trying to relate things to our present situation; looks like you did a better job than I-

pavel.chichikov wrote:

But will future earnings suffice to pay off the loan?

It would require jobs too. The non-winners would need jobs to pay the interest payments to the final winner. Unless we can find somebody to lends us some money. Hu would do that...

Yeah, I remember now; it was called a charge-a-plate.

but you did get credit for a month.

Monopoly allows mortgages, but when I was a kid, house rule
was we didn't do that. In the game, if you had to pay a mortgage,
you were a loser already.

We used to call it monotony, but it's still around!!

Never Again II wrote:

I thought that's how all games ended.

Unless the winner can create a story for the losers. It would have to be REALLY good story, believable to the losers. About how the winner is really winning for everybody. Na... that could NEVER work, could it?

Dad to high school senior.

Son, I know we put your older brother through college, but times have changed. We can't get another loan on the house, mom's hours at work have been cut and the credit card payment doubled. So you will either have to work to pay for your education or get a loan on your own.

Kid: Well, there aren't many jobs. How much would I have to borrow?

Dad: About $160,000.00 total.

Son: But, but - I could by the REO across the street for that!!!! I'm just going to get a job at the fast food place and use the FTHB credit to buy the house.

Dad: Good plan son. This spring when the house payments increase your mom and I will need a place to move into.

sales tax collections are down more than sales.
...............................

disproportionate decrease in sales of big ticket items

pavel.chichikov wrote:

is social stability based on free choice

Or social stability based on BS. I'll go with the BS.

Basel Too wrote:

the new monopoly games have debit cards instead of cash

Gotta train the new up-and-coming consumer

lawyerliz wrote:

has a metal card

That was called a charge card. Originally, stores knew their customers; the better customers would have an account and they could put purchases on their account and pay it at their convenience. When the number of customers grew larger and they didn't know them all by name, they invented the charge card, which allowed them to track the account number of the customer; they could then send regular statements. Charge cards were still the stores extending credit. You had to establish credit with each store (though often stores would work together to simply the experience for the customers.) The stores don't get paid for their merchandise until the customer writes the check.

With the credit card, a bank extends the credit to the consumer, the store gets paid for their good very quickly by the bank. The bank takes the risk of late payments or defaults and usually charges a transaction fee to the store.

Now, if everybody did that, we wouldn't have
any ccs, would we? Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Hungry.

Citizen AllenM wrote:

I love extend and pretend!!!!
The party continues!!!
Crush Your Creditor!!!

The lessons learned from this, and a million stories like it, will make this country strong, and a better place for our children.

That wasn't snark, was it patient?

I'm really hungry.

Should I pay cash or charge din-din???

lawyerliz wrote:

That wasn't snark, was it patient?

Beauty, and snark, are in the eye of the beholder, LL.

My bet is that in 3 months, today's market will seem cheap. Just my opinion.

I think that they are sort of an inhouse law firm.

Client who went to a hearing for his mom, said that they were suing
left and right, even people who only owed $300.00.

Don't mess with Chase!! Maybe that's the point.

lawyerliz wrote:

Should I pay cash or charge din-din???

Just don't pay.

Rob Dawg wrote:

Reading the article is an exercise in reading twixt the lines. Ultimately it was about money. $4m per year. That's probably as much as they spend on white glazed bricks.

IMO, an early indicator of the higher ed bubble popping.

My take was quite the opposite. It is pretending to kill something that will cause large donations to "save".

What about small business people? Aren't they up the creek?

No fear on the streets?

josap wrote:

my sister did that once when I was winning.

Everybody's sister did that one while we were winning.

josap wrote:

Dad: Good plan son. This spring when the house payments increase your mom and I will need a place to move into.

What was the classic O/N line for a while back: "Who pays the mortgage? Whoever can pay it this month."
.
(Paraphrased and not nearly as funny)

ll,

I am lawyer in Texas. I represent a lot of federally insured financial institutions these days in collections suits. Background is partner in biglaw doing corporate securities/corporate finance deals up to half a billion in transaction value, some securitizations, but not many. Can't believe lawyers or law firms would take such suits.

Also, last year moved my business accounts to chase and immediately got a hundred grand line of credit. I think I have put maybe 5 and on it once or twice. Honestly, I don't even think they ran a credit report. Credit analysis was non-existent in my case, but I suppose they were pretty well cash collateralized as they could offset my deposit accounts.

lawyerliz wrote:

No fear on the streets?

In CaLi? I don't see it. There are still restaurants opening in the college town I live in. Somebody is STILL doing restaurant loans. One opened 3 weeks ago. Converted two story house in the downtown area. Place is huge (and packed).

A bunch of in house lawyers are doing it together with at least 5 paralegals
and a receptionist. I know 'cause I talked to them.

Hackman wrote:

Is Chase suing on Credit Cards in Florida? Is this a summary proceeding? Lawyers are taking credit card suits? Wow!

Collection agencies, probably not Chase???

It's in the Glossary:

Spunkmeyer wrote on Thu, 11/5/2009 - 10:03 pm Lobbyist Ben Dover wrote: | How does it work if the kids and grand kids live at home with the Boomers? I guess they take turns not paying the mortgage.

yagij wrote:

What was the classic O/N line for a while back: "Who pays the mortgage? Whoever can pay it this month."

It was Spunkmeyer, and he said something like: "Maybe the extended family can move in together and take turns not paying the mortgage."

Terry wrote:

The IRS wants the CC companies to report merchant card sales so they can make sure the merchants are paying all the federal taxes that are owed.

No doubt the IRS wants everybody to report everything they ever do with everyone else.

I doubt the CC companies are anxious to comply since they realize there would be fewer transactions as a result.

Hackman wrote:

Were you going to pay at the Cuban restaurant anyway?

I didn't realize I hadn't paid until I walked in the next day!! Sure I would
have paid, if I had realized.

No Chase, either a separate firm who is at the Chase number, no
kidding, or in house lawyers. Really. When I was helping a lady whose
SS they garnished, (a no-no), I called a lot before straightening it out.

Bottom line was Wa-Mu employee couldn't read the new computer
screens at chase.

actually same here, so I am not so sure of their in-house-ness.

But they certainly are on the Chase phone line.

??

This one is going to hurt: "Freddie Mac could be exposed to more than $1 billion in potential losses from the failure of Taylor, Bean & Whitaker Mortgage Corp. and Colonial Bank, the company disclosed Monday in a securities filing."

HomeGnome wrote:

Do you think they will let me live in Montana?

You'll be fine. If they start shooting as you cross the border, tho, maybe not...

lawyerliz wrote:

??

Hunt for Red October .

Terry wrote:

This one is going to hurt: "Freddie Mac could be exposed to more than $1 billion in potential losses

Just add it to the tab. I don't think Freddie is worried.

Did we establish that Taylor, Bean had more than one bank account??

It seems so long ago.

I am really really hungry.

Hackman wrote:

good deal on a Recreational Vehicle right about now.

a very good deal - you can get the Home Buyers Credit for a RV.

For the working man everywhere:

Cinderella story. Outta nowhere. A former greenskeeper, now, about to become the Masters champion. It looks like a mirac... It's in the hole! It's in the hole! It's in the hole!

It doesn't say why they cancelled.

Do you get the 8k credit if you own rental property. I don't think
so, but weird things can happen.

HomeGnome wrote:

For the working man everywhere:

HomeGnome - feels like we are playing Scene It

My you deserve to live forever!!

I've just reviewed the CR posts for the day . . . . No time to read comments.

Accessing here BS free analysis in the midst of this madness is a treasure. Going CR-less for any more than a day, is to be convinced that I am crazy.

Much appreciated again, Calculated Risk!

LL, no it didn't, and the radio report didn't either.

From what I gather the 8k tax credit may go down as the most abused tax credit ever. I don't think rental properties qualify but from what I hear you can buy a house on behalf of your, yet unborn, child and get the tax credit.

I haven't checked closely, but the $6,500.00 is for any buyer.
You just have to explain how you are going to rent out your current house to cover the mortgage or whatever to make the double payments.

No, I don't mean buying rental property, I mean, you've already owned the
rental property for years, and it really is rental and you intend for real to live
in the house you are buying.

True, but she's expecting 8k!

Well, monday is health club hottie night, so I'm out-a-here.

Cinco-X wrote:

Basel Too wrote:
the new monopoly games have debit cards instead of cash
Gotta train the new up-and-coming consumer

Way past time for a monopoly game reality update: mortgages, MBS, CDOs, CDSs, et. al. Why learn/practice obsolete processes? Learn the ins and outs of strategic default, jingle mail, residence without payment, etc.

+1

Calling it an "audit" may be glorification. It can be as simple as request for documentation by mail.

The tortoise lays on its back, its belly baking in the hot sun, beating its legs trying to turn itself over, but it can't. Not without your help. But you're not helping.

What do you mean, I'm not helping?

Why is that, Leon?
They're just questions, Leon. In answer to your query, they're written down for me. It's a test, designed to provoke an emotional response... Shall we continue?

lawyerliz wrote:

Client who went to a hearing for his mom, said that they were suing
left and right, even people who only owed $300.00.

Don't mess with Chase!! Maybe that's the point.

Is that in small claims court? If they try that stuff in California, they're going to get a whole lot more than they bargained for. I'm sure there are more than a few people who can think of ways of making that backfire.

Yep it's in small claims court.

Why would it backfire?

JP wrote:

Calling it an "audit" may be glorification. It can be as simple as request for documentation by mail.

They key with the IRS is to never draw attention to yourself. Unless they owe me big -- which I try to avoid -- I also always file an extension, because nearly all random audits occur on taxes filed on or before March 15th.

HomeGnome wrote:

They're just questions, Leon. In answer to your query, they're written down for me. It's a test, designed to provoke an emotional response... Shall we continue?

As I recall, there was a violent response to the line of questioning.

What did you have in mind?

Time to make some phone calls.
Later taters.

yagij wrote:

(Paraphrased and not nearly as funny)

I think it was more like "Whose turn is it not to pay the mortgage this month"

IRS=HomelandSecurity=Secret Service

Black Star Ranch wrote:

profits this third quarter are from decreasing costs

Don't forget tax savings due to not having profits as high as last year!

while sales are still falling.......anyone else notice that?

Yep. The falling sales stick out like a sore thumb. For the 12 months ending 9/30/09, S&P 500 sales are off a mere 1.46 trillion.

lawyerliz wrote:

He worked for Janet Reno, who is
both honest and fearsomely intelligent.

Yeah. I'm sure she's great, except for that whole burning children alive thing.

patientrenter wrote:

Crispy. Add BBQ sauce.

E. Gonzalez wasn't burned only abducted in a raid with armed men.

Bearded Spock wrote:

Yeah. I'm sure she's great, except for that whole burning children alive thing.

+10

I like them well done, myself. Fundamentalists are special too.

Blackwaterwannabe wrote:

Bearded Spock wrote:
Yeah. I'm sure she's great, except for that whole burning children alive thing.
+10
I like them well done, myself. Fundamentalists are special too.

Best of all: fundamentalist folks, prepared pulled-pork style. On a hard roll.

U.S. dollar no longer a one-way bet
| Reuters

"A lot of good news is already priced in. For the dollar to meaningfully break below these levels, we'll probably have to see something that adds significantly to the already upbeat outlook for the global economy," said Omer Esiner, senior market analyst at Travelex Global Business Payments in Washington.

Since when has good news for the economy meant the dollar must go lower? This situation we're in is so surreal.

I've seen horrors... horrors that you've seen. But you have no right to call me a murderer. You have a right to kill me. You have a right to do that... but you have no right to judge me. It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror. Horror has a face... and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not then they are enemies to be feared. They are truly enemies.

HomeGnome wrote:

I've seen horrors... horrors that you've seen. But you have no right to call me a murderer. You have a right to kill me. You have a right to do that... but you have no right to judge me. It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror. Horror has a face... and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not then they are enemies to be feared. They are truly enemies.

I hope the movie was better than the dialog.

patientrenter wrote:

I hope the movie was better than the dialog.

, but:
From Apocalypse Now.

Citizen AllenM wrote:

Got Chase on the phone and tried to get a discounted payoff, no dice, instead, they extended and pretended and cut my monthly payment on the closed account to 2% per year on a 5 year payout! W00T!!!

Been following your saga. Enlighten, please....are you not still employed? What, if anything, changed other than the collapse in your house value? n
Not trying to pick a fight, just in the same boat as many, hiked to usurious rates by -insert Co. here- and wondering best way to fight back. Do you still have a fall-back CC, or are you cash only now?