These are excellent and long overdue improvements. I was getting tired of the same colored lipstick all this time.

Rob Dawg wrote:

I was getting tired of the same colored lipstick all this time.

you'd look better in a bad light

I believe we could see all of these changes happening after a long slow agonizing debate. Not to worry though, they'll gut any provisions that might be a hinderance to the market a week later.

One day we may see a LAW requiring a minimum 20% down. Adequate margins tend to prevent systemic collapse.

The US is bankrupt on every level.

Bail until fail!

You are ier than usual Gnomester.

Is there a reason?

If they devalue enough that 30 year FHA mortgage is golden.

Liz<
No reason.
Saints go 10 and 0 for the season!

The LAW should apply to ALL originations.

Is that good?

Liz<

For me it is...$$$

plus, Mrs. Gnome made scrambled eggs, ham and Grand Marnier syrup for our French Toast this morning!

You must be one round gnome.

(I kid I kid. Great food is more satisfying and usually causes less consumption.)

JD<
If you're lurking out there; I see the Bills once again snatched defeat from the jaws of victory.

Rob Dawg wrote:

I know.

Vikings are 9-1. Watch out Saints. Were coming for ya.

Vikings are 9-1. Watch out Saints. Were coming for ya.

How ironic it would be if new Orleans was brought down by a Cajun QB?

Hey, it's duck risotto night here. So there.

Now I feel like I have to cook something that smells really really good
to compete.

Garlic focaccio bread?

Pumpkin spice cookies. Luckily I stocked up on the
canned pumpkin stuff a while ago.

Florida was in the front and not protected once they did circle the wagons. Florida is the future for other states once they realize their solutions are brute force but flimsy delays

A 3.5% down payment means they are immediately underwater, even without a price decrease.

FHA should make the down payment large enough to prevent such an obvious problem.

I would also like to see a requirement for 3-6 months mortgage or living expenses after closing costs as well, but that is just wishful thinking.

STD's for sure; another reply on last thread-

HomeGnome wrote:

Grand Marnier syrup

Ahhhh, I understand now.

Thousands line up for free Thanksgiving groceries near downtown L.A. - Los Angeles Times

Thousands line up for free Thanksgiving groceries near downtown L.A. | L.A. NOW | Los Angeles Times

Volunteers clapped and smiled as men, women and children collected their meals. Several people began standing at 2 p.m. Friday. "It's unprecedented," Barnett said. "We've never seen anything like that before." The center gave away about 1,800 turkeys.

[snip]

"You know, lately some families don't have jobs and if you don't have a job, you can't have a Thanksgiving meal," she said. "But thankfully you can get one here." Chica said she had been cleaning three to four houses a month, but now goes weeks without work because her former employers have lost their jobs.

How about if you want an FHA, you have an escrow account, where
you have to contribute 500 Bucks a month for a year, never late,
no hiatuses. And then have your 3.75% down and no more than 5.5%
concessions and the rest same, and you get it back in x years. Or,
you lose it to the lender if you default in, say 5 years.

broward<

It is sooooo good.
Yum.

Rob Dawg wrote:

Don't need no stinkin' law. If it weren't fer FedGov in the market that's what legitimate lenders would insist upon

I understand your hatred of government but do you let fact interfere with your analysis? As I recall the sub prime mess was primarily a private sector affair. While the right wing wants to lay blame on liberals for requiring extension of credit to discriminated minorities I have yet to see one study that supports that view as being the primary cause. This was pure private sector greed and alchemy that thought they could convert junk into gold.

What am I think - I forgot that AIG and Lehman Brothers and Bear Sterns, WAMU , Country wide , Wachovia were all government run before they went belly up.

Free turkeys... How unAmerican. Let them eat cake.

This was pure private sector greed and alchemy that thought they could convert junk into gold.

And had they been allowed to go belly up all by themselves, all would be better? Of course.

if you don't think there is an expensive housing policy, look at one of the later cities to burst like Seattle. not everyone busted at the same time
Seattle Home Prices and Heat Map - Trulia.com
Local Unemployment Still Over Nine Percent | Seattle Bubble — News & discussion about real estate & the housing bubble in the Seattle area.
they fell hard and fast for a year, but expansion of expensive housing policies arrested the fall despite the rapidly deteriorating economic conditions
6x income is the new 3x income, hooray!
now to wait for some delinquent properties to be foreclosed, and tax hikes must really make those service cuts feel worthwhile
has there been any progress on relieving freeway traffic jams and/or replacing the Alaskan Way viaduct waiting for just one more earthquake to pancake it? that would have been a good TARP project

FinCriAdvisor -
Email Newsletter Signup

An FDIC examiner actually speaks! Do not miss this once in a lifetime opportunity to hear from a real live FDIC person besides Shampoo Sheila Bair... the topic is IT which is not exactly a regulatory priority at the moment... but worth a read.

I suppose Charlotte NC would have been a better counterpoint to Miami though, Case-Shiller Home Price Index Increases in August
down 11.3% from peak vs Miami at -46.9% by the same measure

Only marginally OT...but friggin hilarious (if you can really laugh at this).

Live from Beijing

cd

"I think the most likely changes are higher insurance premiums, lower seller concessions, and tougher standards."

I agree. The one change that would most effectively reduce the risk in the program, and make it much more economically rational, is a significant increase in the minimum downpayment requirement. So, of course, that is the one thing that is off the table. Thanks again, Congress.

CaptainMorgan wrote:

probably have limited credit histories, and an interest rate break

this mess started an continues to be perpetuated by two myths

that home ownership is a good thing

the political correctness that makes us believe that everybody can be home owner if we give them access to credit just like everybody can be brain surgeon if we give them access to education.

Home ownership requires discipline- and some people have the necessary discipline and other won't. The whole point of a down payment (besides protecting the lender although I think that is the least reason for it) is that it required people to be disciplined and save for the down payment. It required contemplation of home ownership including what it would entail before actually becoming a home owner. It was a way of determining who would have the discipline and who would not.

Bearded Spock wrote:

Don't need no stinkin' law. If it weren't fer FedGov in the market that's what legitimate lenders would insist upon.
Preach it, Brother!

Where have you guys been the last 10 years? All it takes is ONE big lender being irresponsible and the rest follow like new duckies. Name me a 'legimate lender' since 2003 (that did more than 3-5% of originations or purchases of mortgages)?

Instead of railing against the Feds trying (too desparately) to save the nation from financial collapse caused by those 'legimate lenders', why not just say what you appear to believe: "All that counts for lenders is that they make fat profits and bonuses, the hell with the economy"

Allen C wrote:

Imagine home prices with 20%. Real affordability...

Yes, but first imagine a Congress without some key advocates of easy govt-supported home lending..... I know, can't ever happen.

to Cinco-x

and

Lobbyist BenDover

on the previous thread

after the pig

i replied to your reply to my reply , that i replied to right before the pig cut short my reply to you last reply

( ...the thread that will not die...)

crazyv wrote:

that home ownership is a good thing...Home ownership requires discipline

I don't disagree at all, we sold out in 2006, and intended to buy way sooner than next year, which is when we intend to.

We have had very few down sides to renting, many upsides including being able to stash away the money we have saved renting over buying. I spend my weekends doing something besides farming a lawn and cleaning gutters. I actually enjoy gardening and miss that, but not that much.

The people I personally see taking advantage of the $8k tax credit convince me they are marginal buyers and will result in another leg down. At the very least, the 3.5% down payments will end up being a thorn in their side. Too many young single people get on a kick to buy, without realizing completely what is involved, and end up trading for something later on generating nice revenue for realtors.

Houses are high carrying costs and high transaction costs vehicles, and paying 6% every time you move is not the path to financial success.

Sanity will return some time after it blows up. Team Keynes seems destined to continue the madness until the bitter end.

mock turtle wrote:

i replied to your reply to my reply , that i replied to right before the pig cut short my reply to you last reply

Back at'cha, but I gotta go soon, so I'll leave it to Ben Dover to fight the good fight-

So if/when delinquencies/foreclosures reach 20%, can we presume the banking system is insolvent?

OT:
I encourage our regular posters to maintain a sense of respect for their fellow posters; lest CR become just another "flame war board".
Alright, you hosers?

Allen C wrote:

What is the Fed going to do once the MBS QE budget is used up?

They are drawing from a bottomless pool. It ends when the Fed computers buying Treasuries and MBS run out of electrons, sometime around the end of the universe, or after 15 years of elevated inflation.

Thirteen Defendants Charged in $19 Million Bank Fraud
Cases Relate to the Collapse of Desert Sun Development in Bend, Oregon

Federal Bureau of Investigation - The Portland Division: Department of Justice Press Release

Calm down, volker.
aight?
http://www.rte.ie/vikings/ragnar.bmp

Thank you for your tireless efforts Ken!

lets go back to when FHA was profitable: loans maxed at $417k

yogi, ignore is your friend. Just sayin'

keeps the blood preassure down -

"Always go to other people’s funerals, otherwise they won’t come to yours."
http://azwagners.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/yogi-berra1.jpg

10-20% down on a still overpriced bubble home in a 'boom/bust' area is too much for the buyer to risk however...sidelines are good...caveat emptor...

noob goldberg wrote:

Effective hosers are absolutely essential when fighting a drawn-out flame war.

I find it hard to respect someone who is bent on turning the US into North Korea. Which of course is the inevitable outcome of a debate on health care.

1 currency now-yogi

i enjoy arguing, debating with LBD and Cinco-x

i cant remember either one getttin nasty or callin me names or calling me out

i try to treat my right wing friends on this blog with respect even tho we may disagree to the max

so we are ok

do i agree with you that they are inveterate right wingers most (not all) of the time)..yep

but it gives me a chance to make the argument back at what the 400+ 'guests" out there are thinking

but they dont register as users...or uh i mean associates"

so otherwise i would never get the chance

GS is hungry...
http://onthecurb.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/ap_squid_061222.jpg

Hurrah, FFDIC!!!

sdtfs wrote:

I find it hard to respect someone who is bent on turning the US into North Korea. Which of course is the inevitable outcome of a debate on health care.

Oh, sure... of course that's the inevitable outcome!

Thousands line up for free Thanksgiving groceries near downtown L.A

What a way to disguise a run on the banks! Free turkeys, uh, yeah, that's it,...they're all here for free turkeys.

Good evening, all
Not sure if this has been reported here, but given a small reported scale of the incident it is apparently not a front-page news

The Associated Press: NRC investigating radiation at Three Mile Island

MIDDLETOWN, Pa. — The U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission is sending investigators to the Three Mile Island nuclear power plant after a small amount of radiation was detected there.
About 150 employees were sent home Saturday afternoon after the radiation was detected at the central Pennsylvania plant.
Officials say there is no public health risk.
Exelon Nuclear spokeswoman Beth Archer says investigators are searching for a cause of the release. She says the radiation was quickly contained.
Tests showed the contamination was confined to surfaces inside the building.
The unit has been shut down for refueling and maintenance since Oct. 26. Officials are testing workers for radiation exposure.
A partial meltdown occurred in Three Mile Island's Unit 2 reactor in March 1979.

See also Three Mile Island radiation leak investigated - CNN.com

thomas Jefferson said

"i have nothing but contempt for any man who knows only one way to spell a word"

hey homegnome

i cant spell either

and

i have "mild" dyslexia so often i cant even see the mis spellings when my wife points at the mistake and spells the word right for me

yikes

1 currency now -yogi wrote:

I'm trying real hard, Ringo.

Good schooling shines through

Rajesh,ty

I get PMI... what I don't get is Govvie funded mortgages requiring insurance....in essence...the people are the insurance.

lawyerliz wrote:

How bout if a Seller wants to carry back a 100% loan?

There are lots of good ways to set up incentives for adequate downpayments. Two are:

1. Homeowner tax deductions for interest on home loans are limited to 80% of the value of the home per the loan appraisals.
2. Holders of the home loan must hold additional capital to the extent that total home loans to the homeowner exceed 80% of the home's value (per the loan appraisals, again)

I like #2 best, because it puts pressure where it belongs - on the people taking on the risk of losses. (Of course, nowadays the taxpayers take on almost all the loss risk, but that ought to change, and a capital rule such as #2 would help enable that change.)

Many, MANY years ago, my children, in the land of
once upon a time, it actually was--I was there--that if
the people in your fha cohort (or whatever they called it)
were good little payers, when you paid off your fha loan,
and allllll the insurance hadn't been expended, you got your
money back. I don't remember the details, how long it had
to be etc, but some people actually did.

My first loan was fha.

Comrade Rally Monkey wrote:

Govvie funded mortgages

The banks fund the mortgages; the government insures them. The banks didn't use to like FHA because of the paperwork and the low profit margin. But now they see FHA-guaranteed mortgages as risk free assets on their balance sheets and they can't get enough.

You are right: the taxpayers are the ultimate insurers; as such they are allowed to collect a (too low) premium for providing that insurance.

I assume Yagij, Bearded Spock, are under 40, so they're worth the effort.

President Palin will fix it by Gawd!
Either that or Billy is interested in tea bagging.

ASHEVILLE, N.C. (AP) -- Former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin is visiting western North Carolina to have dinner with the Rev. Billy Graham.

The Asheville Citizen-Times reported Sunday that a spokesman with the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association said today that Palin would join Billy Graham and his son Franklin for dinner tonight at Graham's home near Asheville.

Graham spokesman Jeremy Blume said Palin, who's on a tour promoting her new book, "Going Rogue," is scheduled to arrive around mid-afternoon Sunday.

Blume said Graham heard Palin was in the Asheville area for her book tour and invited her to dinner.

Barfly- at least in the case of FNM/FRE we the tax payers ended up owning 80% of any future profit I believe it is the same in the case of AIG. What we should have done is end up owning 80% of the future profit in GS, JPM, Citibank, Bof A etc. This "what should we have let me explode" is total straw man. I just object to the nationalization the losses but not the profits.

Rob Dawg wrote:

These are excellent and long overdue improvements. I was getting tired of the same colored lipstick all this time.

I've been predicting higher down payments were required for years. The Federal government has prevented that forever.

Unfortunately, I must agree with Calculatedrisk in that politically, most favor a low down payment. I'd like to see more 'meat in the game.' 5% down with a cap on seller concessions sounds right. If the place needs more work... let the seller either do the work 1st or discount the price.

Man, if 20% down was required and we went back to historical down payments on 'conforming jumbos' and true jumbos...

Step aside, there would be a shockwave and mushroom cloud from the implosion.

Got ?
Neil

neil wrote:

Man, if 20% down was required and we went back to historical down payments on 'conforming jumbos' and true jumbos...
Step aside, there would be a shockwave and mushroom cloud from the implosion.

Phase it in over 5 years. At the end, we'd have a functioning financial system.

Once again, lo these many years ago, banks actually
sent someone out to the site to see what was going
on. Sometimes they even sent out people like semi-retired
engineers. But the newest mail room employee could report
back that nothing at all was being done.

Mock turtle,

Already replied to you on the other thread. I am hard to convince as I really believe that if everybody is agreeing nobody is thinking. Many liberal commentors haven't a clue how to make a dollar with out a job. Their position's are very emotional confused as rights. Their comments are loud and clear. I am not here to win or lose but to learn and find a better way. Most are real nice and I try not to get mad,Testing at times.

higher down payments means less money financed, which means less profit.

I just knew someone would say something about Umpqua being fabulous.

And people over 40 are hopeless?

All it takes is ONE big lender being irresponsible and the rest follow like new duckies. Name me a 'legimate lender' since 2003 (that did more than 3-5% of originations or purchases of mortgages)?

Instead of railing against the Feds trying (too desparately) to save the nation from financial collapse caused by those 'legitimate lenders', why not just say what you appear to believe: "All that counts for lenders is that they make fat profits and bonuses, the hell with the economy.

It's no the banks, it's the Gov and the Fed! If the markets set the interest rates, they would've been higher and speculation wouldn't have caused systemic risk. If their wasn't the moral hazard of government bail-outs, the "TBTF" banks wouldn't have taken those risks. They wouldn't be TBTF in the first place. If it wasn't for the distortions in the housing market of the Mortgage interest deduction for income taxes and all the other incentives, there wouldn't have been an oversupply of houses.

Don't blame this crap on the free market. We haven't had a free market in our lifetimes.

LBD

thanks for the reply...got it

as for the liberals and makin a buck

you know therre are liberals and then there are liberals

i have never been afraidd of hard physical work and never needed more money than i had...my friends too

you know there are two kinds of conservatives too...the small businessman or woman and the independant etc...they make it happen

...and then there are those who have hardly never got dirt neath their nails and act like royalty

each has its detrctors

Barney will agree to increase FHA down payments to 3.51%.
Take it or leave it, that's the policy.

Jingle mail, jingle mail, jingle mail loss
Jingle mails sing and jingle mails sink
Snowing and blowing up bushels of funds
Now the jingle flop has begun.

Jingle mail, jingle mail, jingle mail loss
Jingle mails chime in jingle mail time
Dancing and prancing in jingle mail square
In the frosty despair.

What a fright time, it's the right time
To give the house away
Jingle mail time is a swell time
To stop paying on a SFH, eh?
Giddy-up jingle house, pick up your feet
Jingle around the clock
Nix a mortgage with your jingling feet
That's the jingle mail,
That's the jingle mail,
That's the jingle mail loss.

Good article in the NYT by Thomas Friedman:

OP-ED COLUMNIST; Advice From Grandma - NY Times

Some relevant points:

1. "The standard answer is that we need better leaders. The real answer is that we need better citizens. We need citizens who will convey to their leaders that they are ready to sacrifice, even pay, yes, higher taxes, and will not punish politicians who ask them to do the hard things. Otherwise, folks, we’re in trouble. "
2. "things have come together to fracture our public space and paralyze our ability to forge optimal solutions:......The Internet, which, at its best, provides a check on elites and establishments and opens the way for new voices and, which, at its worst provides a home for every extreme view and spawns digital lynch mobs from across the political spectrum that attack anyone who departs from their specific orthodoxy."

,rad Gnome,

I believe we are close to perfecting the come from ahead loss.

patientrenter wrote:

Otherwise, folks, we’re in trouble.

we're not in trouble

we're way past trouble

we're freakin doomed!

Plantagenet wrote:

Glod snaps to 1158 as the Asian markets open.

Not to worry, that's only $40 from Slumdog's short strike.

I am more of a fiscal conservative and really have some liberal social views. As education goes I really like the IB concept and would like to take it farther to the point that an advanced student could graduate with both a HS and AA degree. Problem I ran into was the union. It simply taught me that it was more important to have butts in the seats (money) that they would lose to the local community college. Lots of things should be addressed but the controllers have the ball. More grease under my nails then dirt but picked fruit as a kid.

Bearded Spock wrote:

We haven't had a free market in our lifetimes.

I agree because like the workers paradise it does not exist. A plutocracy captures the system. Until the plutocracy limits it's take things have no hope for improvement.

OK, time for more chocolate chip cookies and tea. I hope you guys enjoy the political pissing contest, and maybe even the occasional non-partisan economics commentary.

.The Internet, which, at its best, provides a check on elites and establishments and opens the way for new voices and, which, at its worst provides a home for every extreme view and spawns digital lynch mobs from across the political spectrum that attack anyone who departs from their specific orthodoxy."

Self-contradictory blather.

Rodney was a cheap gold buyer, loved low-premium stuff like 100 Coronas, 50 Pesos, etc.

Rodney was a traveling salesman

paint

I agree because like the workers paradise it does not exist. A plutocracy captures the system. Until the plutocracy limits it's take things have no hope for improvement.

In every system, the plutocracy gains control of the government. Then they form a cartel. This is why we need to end monopoly government. Force the plutocrats to compete with each other in a way that benefits the consumers of their "services."

State sovereignty is just another word for exclusive market territories. Break the monopoly and the consumers (citizens) win.

One has the same admiration for the Squid and it's proposed $500 Million giveaway to small business, as one would have for the mafia saying that from now on, $50 million of the take from it's numbers game, will be given back to the players.

That's it.
I'm calling the Italian Anti-Defamation League!

I quit show business in 1953. I'm the only one I knew who quit. In fact, when I quit, I was the only one who knew.

Groooooooaaannnnnnnn.

HomeGnome wrote:

I'm calling the Italian Anti-Defamation League!

Good call! The Mafia was Sicilian, dammit!

I suggest the squid give half the bonuses to
the small business types. I would be silghtly mollified then.

Slightly.

gee, would I be one of those small business types???

Rodney - "So the other day someone asked me what kind of man I was. A leg man? A breast man? You know, what part of a woman's body gets me going. So I thought about it and realized I must be an ass man. 'Cause people are always yelling at me "Your an ass man!".

Moby-Squid didn't get to be that big thanks to the give, and the band played on, aboard the Pequod, as per Cap'n Ahablankfein's orders...

lawyerliz wrote:

I'm going to go see if my garlic foccacia has riz.

Does your husband know?

Oh, it looks good on you, though.

lawyerliz wrote:

gee, would I be one of those small business types???
Yes. And Spockmeyer was right. A guy who regularly blasts insults at half the readership without supporting data or rational argument to support his "theses" -- that guy deserves ridicule. His huffy exclamations of distress when called on it shouldn't fool anyone into excessive evenhandedness for the sake of avoiding a "flame war".

Bearded Spock wrote:

We haven't had a free market in our lifetimes.

When have we had one? Is there just one market? If there was a free market someplace, wouldn't it make sense for the smart amoral scumbags to capture it and manipulate it for their own benefit?

My doctor said I have six months to live, I told him I couldn't pay the bill.

He gave me another six months!

Man: Doctor, doctor, it hurts whenever I pay the mortgage on my underwater house!

Doctor: Well, then, stop doing it!

We all live in a mortgage submarine, a mortgage submarine.

Lobbyist Ben Dover wrote:

Many liberal commentators haven't a clue how to make a dollar with out a job. Their position's are very emotional confused as rights.

"Liberals" (which don't really exist anymore, but I'll assume you mean any guild ridden "ism" person) are incomprehensible to you because they (the “liberal”) assume that most people in the US are part of "the big US tribe". The political type 1's & 3's (me) don't look at other Mericans this way. I could personally care less what happens to people as long as they don't riot and ruin my favorite restaurant.

There is no way for a "conservative" person (small-tribe paranoid-of-outsiders) to comprehend the motives or a liberal (big-group-hug) .

pavel.chichikov wrote:

Warming's impacts sped up, worsened since Kyoto - Yahoo! News

Stagnating Temperatures

,rad pavel,

I've enjoyed your work...

How long have you been writing poetry?

MBS depth charges set to explode in 3....2....1.

Bearded Spock wrote:

Don't blame this crap on the free market. We haven't had a free market in our lifetimes.

So if we all clap our hands and say we believe, will Tinker Bell come back to life and we'll all frolic in Randian bliss forever after amen?
I'm all in on the faith based approach!

tg wrote:

Stagnating Temperatures: Climatologists Baffled by Global Warming Time-Out - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News - International

Global Warming debate ignores people reproducing like rabbits, icecaps continue to melt, rising sea levels don't impair Stuporbowl, world rejoices.

pavel.chichikov wrote:

Warming's impacts sped up, worsened since Kyoto - Yahoo! News

Rising sea levels means more Miami property is beach front, right?

U.S.S. Economy down 30 degrees on my mark.

I miss fishing.
My wife died while I was at sea, you know.

TB Apple wrote:

You guys are missing the whole debate.

Yes, the Democrats (applied socialist) and Republicans (applied fascists) are simply the Parties of the authority worshiping peasantry; appoximately 70% of the population. Nothing the remaining 30% can do about it.

thank you

is there still a place called Taps and Tabs up the hill from Hector's?

Rajesh wrote:

Rising sea levels means more Miami property is beach front, right?

In Orlando, tho.

Bearded Spock wrote:

L. Blankfein's head on a pike.

That's a damn good start, but I'd add Bernanke and Geitner.

Bernanke and Geitner's heads on a pike, too. The same pike.

There was a free market in the late 1800s. But big businesses in a variety of fields got tired of the competition. It was too hard. So they formed trusts, fixed prices, respected each others' territories. Then life was easier. For the trusts.

No business wants to compete if it have to power to get around it. Absent external regulation, a few large players will always get together and fix things for their own benefit.

lawyerliz wrote:

Wouldn't it it be ironic if the global warmers are correct, but it's
preventing a Maunder Minimum?

I'm open to that one, but I'll need more proof.

Not that I know of.

I was at Hector's about two weeks ago, the place was busy as ever.

don't be silly. Everyone knows the "warmers" are full of hot air.

The last few years I've felt like I"m an hour into a 400mcg trip.

tg: can I laugh while I'm telling you that was a bad joke?

some investor guy wrote:

Of course, you could have much higher interest rates or more stringent underwriting requirements for people who want to put less down.

It's not really equivalent. The risk introduced into the system with low downpayments is hard to manage, and higher interest payments certainly don't decrease it. More stringent underwriting standards help, but aren't a substitute. The truth is that low downpayment loans (say, less than 20%) should always be limited to a small portion of the total market, maybe 10%.

rich wrote:

Bernanke and Geitner's heads on a pike, too

Co-conspirators.

Crime? Looting the UST

Wow, I go off for dinner, and the ghost of Rodney Dangerfield commandeers the commentariat.

I'd say "Well done Mr. Dangerfield", but that would be dangerously close to a sign of respect.

It's not just a matter of beach front property. We don't know precisely what the planet will be like in a few decades if it continues to warm, but it's not likely to be like the one we live on now.

"If all the ice cubes melted in your refrigerator, you're the kind of person that would assume it was getting warmer inside. Jeez."

If the mercury in your thermometer rose towards the top, you would conclude that it was measuring an increase in the ambient temperature.

Bearded Spock wrote:

We let the socialists and fascist kill each other off so we'll be the last ones standing

Unfortunately, I think it's a genetic thing that 70% of the peasants are socialists or fascists. Worshiping authority is neccessary for a society to function. If everybody doubted that motives of the smart amoral scumbags running things, the entire world would be unrecognizable.

*> @ crazyv (profile) wrote on Sun, 11/22/2009 - 2:30 pm
CR- you are an optimist if nothing else *

In some way, shape, or form this is tied to 'extend and pretend' driven by bought and paid for Congressiters ( on both sides of the aisle ) who continue to kick the can down the road.

These assclowns are just too greedy and too transparent

Bearded Spock wrote:

In the absence of state intervention, it is difficult if not impossible to capture a market.

Hahahahahaha! Oh, thanks...

Bearded Spock wrote:

Sure there is. We let the socialists and fascist kill each other off so we'll be the last ones standing

Man, you just don't get it. We're the first to go!

Worshiping authority is neccessary for a society to function.

There is no evidence of this. It might be necessary for THIS society to function.

If everybody doubted that motives of the smart amoral scumbags running things, the entire world would be unrecognizable.

You say that like it's a bad thing.

"Absent external regulation"

Or revolution

While it wasn't the best so far, it was still pretty damn good.
It's a school night so no wine, which it was desparately crying out for.

I assume Mrs Gnome coq-au-vin was superb?

Edit: Or I was crying out for wine, at least.

patientrenter wrote:

Some of us try to just make our specific economic points

Often times, the "economic points" include some form of "solution" to our economic "challenges". However, all solutions require politics. Unfortunately, the same people deciding economic "solutions" also are deciding if GW is real or not. Personally, I have a very tough time taking people seriously that would claim nothing is happening to the environment and then trusting their opinion on "solving" the economy. Reality should be interchangeable.

Note: I don't personally want to "fix" the environment. I know it's changing. I don't care.

TB Apple wrote:

Or revolution

are you advocating revolution?

pavel.chichikov wrote:

True, it's directly off-topic to discuss climate change, but I think our present economic concerns may seem trivial compared to the problems and crises generated by climate change.

...compared to the problems and crises generated by the climate change agenda.

V the V:

Just observing history

Mr Slippery wrote:

generated by the climate change agenda

Unless the icecubes in the refrigerator are melting. Which they appear to be.

pavel.chichikov wrote:

If the mercury in your thermometer rose towards the top, you would conclude that it was measuring an increase in the ambient temperature.

My own hobglobin is a peakinese

To be sure, the fond hope is that 'green energy', notably the non-hydro or 'new' renewables, and to some extent energy saving could quite quickly replace or economize oil in the economy. Selling this to a recalcitrant mass consumer public totally hooked on oil-based consumer goods and services supposedly requires the big stick of Climate Apocalypse fantasy, rather than informing the same public of peak oil reality. In turn, this makes the likely failure of the COP15 'climate summit' problematic for the image management of OECD political leaderships, terrified of losing face.

"COP15 Failure and Peak Oil Success" by Andrew McKillop. FSO Editorial xx/xx/2009