seems like most everything gets the downward shift.

but wont everything be revised downward in a month or two.?

Of course. There are leading and concurrent indicators that are still declining. The economy has not yet bottomed, Pollyanna opinions to the contrary.

From the BEA report linked by CR, here's some color on "Wages and Salaries", which suggests a weak non-farm Payrolls report next week:

Wages and salaries: Private wage and salary disbursements decreased $11.2 billion in September, in contrast to an increase
of $10.1 billion in August. Goods-producing industries' payrolls decreased $7.8 billion, compared
with a decrease of $6.3 billion; manufacturing payrolls decreased $1.5 billion, compared with a
decrease of $4.1 billion. Services-producing industries' payrolls decreased $3.4 billion, in contrast
to an increase of $16.4 billion. Government wage and salary disbursements increased $0.2 billion
compared with an increase of $2.4 billion.

Now those are non-SA numbers, but the only positive change in that bunch was a "slower rate of decline" in manufacturing. Everything else is

Purchases of nondurable goods increased 0.5 percent
in September, compared with an increase of 0.9 percent in August. Purchases of services increased 0.1 percent, compared
with an increase of 0.2 percent.

PCE price index -- The price index for PCE increased 0.1 percent in September, compared with an increase of 0.3
percent in August. The PCE price index, excluding food and energy, increased 0.1 percent, the same increase as in August.

I need a translation please. and Oh please see heath insurers profits reported yesterday through increased premiums (and likely massive DOS attack on their policy holders). This extends into Medicare recipients of course via supplemental coverage which is NOT optional today.

Nanoo-Nanoo wrote:

I need a translation please.

Cash-for-Clunkers came with a hangover?

Is it Christmas yet! The death of American retail and with it the CRE that houses it.

Oh but for us peasants those lofty salaries are good for us!

Did you read that section really closely? I think there's something in the fine print...

“(a) Outpatient Hospitals – (1) In General – Section 1833(t)(3)(C)(iv) of the Social Security Act (42 U.S.C. 1395(t)(3)(C)(iv)) is amended – (A) in the first sentence – (i) by inserting $18 billion for AIG (which is subject to the productivity adjustment described in subclause (II) of such section)” after “1886(b)(3)(B)(iii); and (ii) by inserting $6 billion for GMAC “(but not below 0)” after “reduced”; and (B) in the second sentence, by inserting “and which is subject, beginning with 2010 to the productivity adjustment described in immunity for Hank Paulson section 1886(b)(3)(B)(iii)(II)”.

Next will be Banker Bonus bonanza to boost Real Estate Market......you read it here in CR first.

The cliff diving in private wages has moderated due to government deficit spending. So where are we? Well, private wages and salaries are down ~7.5% yoy. Moreover, private wages and salaries are at the same level they were three years ago (Q 3, 2006).

And, personal income less government transfers is at the same level it was at in Q2, 2005.

It's a recovery on Wall St. - record bonuses thanks to the treasury and the fed. Main St. is facing a depression due to excessive household debt.

No way should the creditors on the other side of the ledger from all that bad household debt be bailed out from their actions. No way.

LOL...this is great. I've not been here all that long so if someone else said this I'm not trying to rip them off. Every time I see greenspan I see Mr. Burns of the Simpson, he even has age spots in all the right places! Coincidence? lol.

BTW, it looks like the data entered on briefing.com do not match the BEA report. At least, briefing.com is reporting a -0.5% drop in PCE prices, which isn't in the BEA report (BEA has +0.1%). That's a heck of an error (over 7% annualized) in the direction of massive deflation! This applies also to the economic calendar at yahoo.com, which gets its feed from briefing.com.

Briefing.com: Economic Calendar

Economic Calendar: Financial Calendars - Yahoo! Finance

That data error may throw a bit of deflation scare into the masses today...

In the event you're tired of all the happy news of the last few days:

The Economy Grows! Don't Rejoice, Forecaster Charles Nenner Says Things Will Sour Again in 2010

As he predicted at the end of 2007, Nenner still believes deflation remains the major economic problem "for another year." However, that deflationary cycle will be followed, Nenner claims, by 30-years of inflation. With that in mind, he recommends house hunters should lock in low long-term mortgage rates now because "soon interest rates will be much higher."

Dear Senator Dodd:

You are so full of shit I can't understand how your hair is not brown.
Please resign, with Geithner and Bernanke, for the good of the American people.

Cinco-X (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/30/2009 - 8:20 am

I think not-

They only appear to be age spots - in reality they are subcutaneous injections of tiny -like parasites that will grow and multiply at an exponential rate until they eventually devour their host's voluntary nervous system and replace it with their own, in effect controlling the dead husk.

LOL.

But, why are people complaining? WE elected lawyers as legislators. WE deserve what we get.

If it ends up being another dud season, January should be quite exiting, with this years round of retailer BKs crushing CRE.

Even with a decent season, the winners will be online stores that have an increasing sales tax advantage over bricks-and-mortars stores. Retail CRE won't be pretty.

Nanoo-Nanoo wrote:

Every time I see greenspan I see Mr. Burns of the Simpson

I see someone totally different.

YouTube - Magoo's Surprise Party

I don't think the issue is so much increasing sales taxes as declining store inventories. It's a lot easier to decide to order online when the local stores don't have what you want.

I just saw on Minyanville that Kevin Depew said that despite yesterday's rally, according to the P&F bullish percent indexes, all bullish percents for the major indexes declined, which means supply was internally outstripping demand. I'm adding to my SPY puts today.

Nanoo-Nanoo (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/30/2009 - 8:27 am

You mean like spiders? Those SPX/ETF indexes?

I did, originally, but I got a better idea and changed motifs on you. Sorry.

Ouch! What is going on at CIT?

Slumdog,

The U.S. has LOTS of real wealth. As long as that is the case, our Government is not broke. I see no reason to dilute real wealth in an attempt to preserve the value of bad debt. It is immoral, unconstitutional and counterproductive to long term growth.

Numerous other actions could have been taken to stabilize the economy while allowing losses to accrue to banks and creditors. Instead, the fed is punishing the innocent and rewarding the guilty. The Fed did not regulate banks as required under its charter and is now papering over its own failures. Bernanke allowed trillions in non-economic debt to poison the system. More than anything, Bernanke is hiding the Fed's prior incompetence. Bernanke is bailing out the Fed (and the banks that own the fed) first and foremost.

Bernanke and the other fed governors should be fired.

BK: Posted some junk about that earlier: GS is making out like a bandit as usual servicing their bonds and debt. They are a BHC but didn't get TARP, now they will be assimilated.

They are a BHC but didn't get TARP,

CIT got the first round of TARP. what they didn't get was an exemption from either the Fed or FDIC to stuff crap assets from their consumer finance division into the bank, so as to appear more solvent.

Personal income decreased $0.1 billion, or less than 0.1 percent, and disposable personal income (DPI) decreased $0.2billion, or less than 0.1 percent, in September, according to the Bureau of Economic Analysis. Personal consumption expenditures (PCE) decreased $47.2 billion, or 0.5 percent.

Ahhhhh.... the sweet smell of economic recovery.

I guess we're going to get the... "So you wanna get rid of TARP?" minicrash?

From your lips to 's ears

Ah, the sweet smell of financial sector recovery of parasitic blood-sucking.

I don't even know what positions I have anymore... Gold and a bunch of defunct puts that have no hell in going itm...

Thanks for the clarification Basel Too.

Personal disposable income perhaps fell due to this?

Aetna Profits rise 18%.

By Alex Nussbaum

Oct. 29 (Bloomberg) -- Aetna Inc., the third-largest U.S. health insurer, said higher premiums and enrollment helped profit beat analysts’ estimates even as medical costs rose to treat swine flu and jobless workers.

Third-quarter net income climbed 18 percent to $326.2 million, or 73 cents a share, the Hartford, Connecticut-based company said today in a statement. At the same time, Aetna narrowed its prediction for full-year earnings to $2.75 a share, at the low end of its prior forecast, citing increased costs.

In contrast to declines for larger rivals UnitedHealth Group Inc. and WellPoint Inc., Aetna said membership in its medical plans jumped 7.6 percent to 19 million from a year earlier. Chief Executive Officer Ronald Williams said in July that Aetna’s rates, still lower relative to competitors, made it harder to cover costs and would be adjusted for 2010.

Aetna reported a “solid third quarter,” with medical costs, reserves and other measures “better than we have see in over a year” from the company, said Josh Raskin, an analyst with Barclays Capital Inc. in New York, in a note. “It appears that Aetna is again taking a conservative approach to its outlook.”

Me again: WellPoint wasn't allowed sell anymore policies for a period of time as they in their supplemental insurance to Medicare recipients that included Part D:

Overcharged the government.
Overcharged for premiums.
Denied payment for critical medications.

Don't know if they are selling again now.

oops Edit to add citation: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=ancdQvCVzayQ

Goldman Sachs cut the size of the CIT rescue loan.

And charged CIT a fee for doing so. The always gets paid.

wonder if golden sacks is going to pick up the "good parts" after the bk ?

It's wonderful that the health insurers are taking a bigger slice from doctors and patients.

They'll grow obese from swallowing more of the smaller pie and will create jobs for personal trainers and dieticians.

Happy days, Obama has created OR saved 650,000 jobs, though the White house says it's closer to a million.

Happy days, Obama has created OR saved 650,000 jobs, though the White house says it's closer to a million.

( Crickets Chirping )

where? we're losing 200 jobs here,maybe more.who knows.

We just have to cut corporate and capital gains taxes and poof, the "private" sector will have everyone employed [or dead] in no time.

I just spent a grandido, buying sporting goods for the backcountry along with a bunch of freeze-dried food, from a well-known online retailer that was offering 20% off on everything, free shipping and no sales tax.

If I was to buy the same goods @ REI (the only real outdoors store around here, sorry Big 5 and Sports Chalet, you don't count) I couldn't, because REI which stocks an awful lot, wouldn't have had about 1/2 of what I ordered. The idea that the nearest REI is about $30 in gas (to & from) away, really seals the deal online for me.

The only visceral difference is that I can't try on clothes, or actually touch and feel the merchandise, for about 35% savings?

[re: CIT] They are a BHC but didn't get TARP

(amounts below are in millions)
Date ... Company ...... Type ......................... Headquarters....... Investment....... Funds awarded
Dec. 31 CIT Group..... Specialty lender........... New York............ $2,330............. Yes

Tracking the $700 Billion Bailout - The New York Times