scone - when the USD/YEN hits 50 there will a whole lot of exports!
The BoJ will make Ben look like a self-publisher of poetry until the exporters are still positioned on a weak(er) Yen. People seem to forget that the BoJ were sending in the Its a chopper, baby 20 years ago. I cannot imagine a world where the Japanese are willing to see 50 Yen/USD unless they have positioned themselves for handling their 10% UE of the future.
Clearly the "correct" thing for GS to do is to divert a big chunk of that bonus pool to the Obama 2012 campaign. I believe that would be considered appropriate moral suasion in the Kleptocratic State of Amerika.
"[We have] one crisis every three years," Summers said. "Surely a system that produces this many accidents and accidents this severe is a system that is in very much need of reform."
Excellent point, though lately it doesn't seem like we're getting our fair share of years when the financial world isn't in crisis.
However, real reform of corps should probably include strict limits on setting up subsidiary (wholly owned) sub-corporations and (quite probably) prohibition of off-balance sheet entities. That's a longer discussion which I won't go into here. The legal hiding places for fraud or misinformation that corps engage in need to be fumigated and then fire-bombed.
I'm actually kinda in favour of reducing protection shareholders receive from liability. Just imagine if we tweaked the law to hold all investors in a corporation liable to double their investment. Or even 15% of their investment. Wouldn't that cause people to take a fundamentally different view of the companies they were investing in?
This has led to the commoditization of investing. The idea that the only thing I need to know about a company before plugging money into it or sucking money out of it is the stock ticker abbreviation creates all sorts of perverse incentives.
"I do not understand how financial institutions could think they could take taxpayer money and turn around and act like it's business as usual," Warren says. "I don't understand how they can't see that the world has changed in a fundamental way - it's not business as usual. All I can say right now is they seem to be winning this argument."
O/T: charts, nebulous but in favor of stock market bulls The International Center for Finance at the Yale School of Management
"Confidence that there will be no stock market crash in the succeeding six months generally declined", compares individuals and institutional investors. Tobin's Q as calculated from FRB Flow of Funds, projected Q3 numbers using 4 quarter trend for net worth (-7% I think) and S&P500 for market capitalization (+22%). Obviously net worth ignores the sea of unrecognized but certain losses, but that's not the point of Tobin's Q because that has happened before
but then why did Summers and his team support these institutions even when they made it clear that if there were restrictions in place, they would not play ball?
sorry, these words are empty, the policy decisions made by the Obama economic team are quite different from their words
Shill, I enjoy reading Fisher's speeches, but I find them more entertaining than enlightening. He is very funny ... and has been very wrong. Obviously he doesn't carry the same weight at the Fed as Bernanke, Kohn, Dudley or even Yellen. But he comes up with the best lines (He was the guy that called the pessimists "Eeyores" - that made for good fun)
This has led to the commoditization of investing. The idea that the only thing I need to know about a company before plugging money into it or sucking money out of it is the stock ticker abbreviation creates all sorts of perverse incentives.
Mutual funds would need to really do DD? Wow. I'd call you unAmerican, but...
Summers is all hat and no cattle. There is zero chance that anything meaningful will come from the administration in terms of regulation, reforms, or nationalization.
I wonder if these guys are aware of the anger and violence that is building in this country?
Talk is cheap, BUT talk is the food of politics. So now, "the talk" will be chewed by the media, regurgitated by the sycophants, digested by the peasants, and pooped out for (somebody).
"For most of this decade, nobody rocked that fake economy — especially the faux housing market — better than Bear Stearns. In 2004, Bear had been one of five investment banks to ask the SEC for a relaxation of lending restrictions that required it to possess $1 for every $12 it lent out; as a result, Bear's debt-to-equity ratio soared to a staggering 33-1. The bank used much of that leverage to issue mountains of mortgage-backed securities, essentially borrowing its way to a booming mortgage business that helped drive its share price to a high of $172 in early 2007."
Talking about Iceland...they actually did all the right things, threw the bums out from their government and banks unlike Americans or Brits. Now they are doing quite ok in their little island, unemployment is high but they have a reality based PLAN (backed up by IMF and other Nordics) to get out of the mess unlike some other earth dwellers...
The real SHTF times are just about to begin in US and in UK. They already suffered theirs...
I'm actually kinda in favour of reducing protection shareholders receive from liability. Just imagine if we tweaked the law to hold all investors in a corporation liable to double their investment.
The original stock corporations in the UK and Netherlands did not exempt shareholders from financial liability, and that led to all kinds of kinks in the flow of capital. Lloyds of London, for instance, had joint and several liability until very recently, I think. (could be wrong, may still). The problem is the treatment of those who loan to corps versus the sharholder owners, particularly in bankruptcy. Too often the shareholders are placed ahead of other claimants (pension funds, for instance.)
Shareholder financial liability would destroy the stock corporation and be a legal morass of the first order in our times of near instant buys and sells. The original idea of holding for the long run is long gone, and without that, liability becomes impossible to determine. Some other limits could help though: limits on the the ability of aggregate investors (mutual funds, insurance companies, hedge funds, etc. to determine the board composition and elect the CEO. The little investor has no control, since the big guys always vote with management, and management selects the board, not the shareholders. Its a mess.
I'm beginning to ask how much Summers has 'lost it'
Whether it is screwing up Harvard's endowment, or censoring Romer's $1.2tn stimulus recommendation...
He thinks his capabilities are much more than they really are, and that is reinforced by having a Secretary of the Treasury who is the worst at dealmaking or politicking in history to measure himself against
He can't accept that his best hope is a double-dip well before 2012 elections
"It's important to point out that not only is normal short-selling completely legal, it can also be socially beneficial. By incentivizing Wall Street players to sniff out inefficient or corrupt companies and bet against them, short-selling acts as a sort of policing system; legal short- sellers have been instrumental in helping expose firms like Enron and WorldCom. The problem is, the new paperless system instituted by the DTC opened up a giant loophole for those eager to game the market. Under the old system, would-be short-sellers had to physically borrow actual paper shares before they could execute a short sale. In other words, you had to actually have stock before you could sell it. But under the new system, a short-seller only had to make a good-faith effort to "locate" the stock he wanted to borrow, which usually amounts to little more than a conversation with a broker:
Evil Hedge Fund: I want to short IBM. Do you have a million shares I can borrow?
Corrupt Broker [not checking, playing Tetris]: Uh, yeah, whatever. Go ahead and sell.
There was nothing to prevent that broker — let's say he has only a million shares of IBM total — from making the same promise to five different hedge funds. And not only could brokers lend stocks they never had, another loophole in the system allowed hedge funds to sell those stocks and deliver a kind of IOU instead of the actual share to the buyer. When a share of stock is sold but never delivered, it's called a "fail" or a "fail to deliver" — and there was no law or regulation in place that prevented it. It's exactly what it sounds like: a loophole legalizing the counterfeiting of stock. In place of real stock, the system could become infected with "fails" — phantom IOU shares — instead of real assets.
If you own stock that pays a dividend, you can even look at your dividend check to see if your shares are real. If you see a line that says "PIL" — meaning "Payment in Lieu" of dividends — your shares were never actually delivered to you when you bought the stock. The mere fact that you're even getting this money is evidence of the crime: This counterfeiting scheme is so profitable for the hedge funds, banks and brokers involved that they are willing to pay "dividends" for shares that do not exist. "They're making the payments without complaint," says Susanne Trimbath, an economist who worked at the Depository Trust Company. "So they're making the money somewhere else."
Financial institutions that have benefited from government support
The problem with that is the government has benefited from support of financial institutions. If the government wants to kiss its deficit spending goodbye it's up to them.
Immediately after receiving their humongous annual "performance bonuses", America's banksters declared an 11 month moratorium on excessive compensation.
black dog,
I'm not throwing in the towel. Buying into the stock market is stupider than it was buying in 3 months ago, which itself was a stupid thing to do. I'm not in the game of trying to be the least stupid amongst a crowd of stupid, unless I know I specifically have an advantage knowing their limits or being able to react faster.
That said, I'm not going to ignore alternatives. Only we can deceive ourselves
Some other limits could help though: limits on the the ability of aggregate investors (mutual funds, insurance companies, hedge funds, etc. to determine the board composition and elect the CEO. The little investor has no control, since the big guys always vote with management, and management selects the board, not the shareholders. Its a mess.
The current system is working so well that heaven forbid we make it more complicated by having laws of unintended consequences cause heart burn to the larger players in the game? Where can I vote with my 12 shares for that idea?
The little investor has no control, since the big guys always vote with management, and management selects the board, not the shareholders. Its a mess.
Right, and every time there's a "shareholder rights" movement (agitation) this is portrayed in the media as class warfare or the commie barbarians at the gates attempting to oppress the honest hardworkin bidness leaders of Merica with MORE REGULATIONS!
Enough of the masses read stuff like this and the stock market vaporizes. Rolling Stone makes sense as a venue because their readership core is aging boomers. There would appear to be little difference between NYSE and the Pink Sheets.
[We have] one crisis every three years," Summers said. "Surely a system that produces this many accidents and accidents this severe is a system that is in very much need of reform."
The number of crises coming out of the mouths of politicians far outnumbers those coming from the mouths of bankers. Pot , kettle.
The little investor has no control, since the big guys always vote with management, and management selects the board, not the shareholders. Its a mess.
I agree, and I'm completely aware that my 'solution' was greatly over-simplified. But I think we all recognize that the form needs to be changed, and I'm very much in favour of examining your suggestion that we start by restricting the ability for a corporation to create wholly-owned subsidiaries, or entities that exist only on a balance sheet or in a computer file.
Make a rule that every corporation has to have a physical place of business that is not shared with another corporation, even if it's a one-room office in a house somewhere. No more post office-boxes. Meeting that requirement alone might be enough to cure our CRE and Housing overhang
The obvious answer is to bring back Glass-Steagall, but since the government panicked and forced the final shotgun marriage of commercial and investment banking last year, this seems highly unlikely
Also, given that around 90% of all residential mortgages are written by 3 insolvent government entities, ie. there is no private mortgage market in the US anymore, small to medium business credit is still frozen and cmbs are about to resemble the aftermath of a neutron bomb, I'd say the next credit crisis is closer to 2 months than 2 years away.
If your native currency is $USD, you have to play the game on some level, or watch your savings evaporate. For the moment, it's a bit easier for Canadians, so you may be able to sit it out for a while.
Talk, talk, talk....Summers is one of the biggest effing liars in DC. It is disgusting to hear him say these words knowing that he was a willing participant and benefactor of the deregulation he helped to promulgate. FU( K YOU LARRY.
Make a rule that every corporation has to have a physical place of business that is not shared with another corporation, even if it's a one-room office in a house somewhere.
Well, that would certainly help the CRE problem in Nevada. Other states, I'm not so sure...
"The time has come," the Summers said,
"To talk of many things:
Of shoes--and ships--and sealing-wax--
Of cabbages--and kings--
"O taxpayers," said the Bernanke,
"You've had a pleasant run!
Shall we be trotting home again?'
But answer came there none--
And this was scarcely odd, because
They'd eaten every one.
I have no evidence for this, but the Summers statement today may be the revelation of Obama's disgust with 'biz as usual' - as he looks ahead at legislation and re-election. O's statement to Wall Street a couple weeks back (the meeting boycotted by all the big bank CEOs) made it clear that the out of control greed party may have a new bartender.
On the other hand, the appointment of yet another Glodman playa to the SEC is a bad sign.
My guess: now that health care may be in the final strokes, Obama's going to turn the cannons on global climate change and financial industry reform. This is the overture, not the first act, to the opera.
sm_landlord
Buy disused industrial land near ports and railways? The American trade deficit will continue shrinking in any case
Most people don't have a lot of capital though, so they just have to make sure they have a good support network of friends & family and then wait. If they have the chance, investing in a skill or knowledge that is globally in demand would be good
Yeah, I'm sure this is all it will take for banks to "do what's right for their country".
I was going to type out a well-considered articulate response (my first for the day, yay!), but then I saw your handle and I got all flustered and distracted. Damn this giant book on grass, it'll be the death of me.
Summers is reduced to playing the role of cheerleader, so that's what he's doing.
I'd like to see him make similar statements, and get a little coverage, every time the House Financial Services Committee votes out a new regulation. The pressure against doing anything will continue every day going forward. He can at least balance that pressure with support of Congressional action.
We're very early in this game. The tough parts will happen in the Senate next year.
"Clearly the "correct" thing for GS to do is to divert a big chunk of that bonus pool to the Obama 2012 campaign. I believe that would be considered appropriate moral suasion in the Kleptocratic State of Amerika. "
@ Turbo:
That wouldn't be the "correct" thing to do. It would leave a roughly 50/50 chance of backing the wrong horse. They'll divert half to Obama and half to his Republican opponent.
Whiskey,
I'm saying that Summers on a certain level is not stupid, he definitely does charm many around him with general conversation.
He's like a little boy that thinks he can fly. Just as good as any other little boy fundamentally, but disastrous when he tests his flying abilities.
"No bank should be systemically that important and TBTF" . We ought to make a list of people who have said that on record:
CR
E Warren
Volcker?
Reich?
Greenspan???
He's like a little boy that thinks he can fly. Just as good as any other little boy fundamentally, but disastrous when he tests his flying abilities.
Fortunately, he doesn't have to be able to fly. He's not in charge of any aerodynamic details. He can just sing the praises of flying in general while others work to make it happen.
The time for regulation was back in the spring/summer while the banksters were backpedaling.
You can count on one thing - the more time you put between the crisis and new regulation the more watered down and lobbyist written it will become.
Completely agree, as to when reform was optimum, but I think Obama/Geithner/Summers/Bernanke didn't think the super-fragile financial situation could handle it without greater dangers arising.
It probably doesn't matter, since the Senate can only do one thing at a time (and often not even that), and healthcare was a key campaign committment and social need that couldn't be delayed. The Senate will be tied in knots on anything Wall Street related (except giveaways and more debt).
Obama's going to turn the cannons on global climate change and financial industry reform
I would guess the Smart Amoral Party scum-bags will turn the cannons on "global climate change" as that will keep the peasants from both political-types at each other's throats diverting their tiny brains from the real problem, which is: who is getting how much loot from Merica.
ot-check out the ron paul vintage video when you have time I posted link above especially part 2 and 3...even brings up how bill abolishing fed reserve would be hard to pass......depression call was early but it was smothered over by last 20 years of monetary policy and games....
I agree Noob, nothing like a Phalaris Arundinacea to set one's point of view straight.
Damn that mexican riverbank grass...actually, this book doesn't have a whole lot on that entry:
P. arundinariae Trin. ex E. Fourn. (Panicum arundinariae Trin. ex Steud.; Panicum breviramosum Swallen; Panicum conchatum E. Fourn.; Panicum virgultorum Hack.)
Mexico. Along streams, riverbanks and streamlets, see Nomenclator Botanicus. Editio secunda 2: 253. 1841, Mexicanas Plantas 2: 25. 1886 and Österreichische Botanische Zeitschrift 51: 369. 1901, Contr. U.S. Natl. Herb. 15: 215. 1910, Contributions from the United States National Herbarium 29(9): 419. 1950, Brittonia 23(3): 293-324. 1971.
EDIT: It's funny that a big expensive book has less useful information than Google, which tells me it's Reed Canary Grass and gives a pretty picture. However, I'm sure this book has examples not found on google, so I'll withhold judgment for now.
It probably doesn't matter, since the Senate can only do one thing at a time
It will be interesting to see how many new regulations come out of the House this year and how they are handled in the Senate next year. I'm not optimistic about the eventual outcome, but they are keeping the ball in play and it's right for Summers to speak out in support. He's just a well paid adviser in this game.
"In calling for financial-services companies to accept new regulations, Summers said bank executives and other financial-industry managers should consider the recent financial crisis within the context of a broader set of crises that have occurred in recent years"
Go to your room and think about how you should be punished. But only if you want to.
"My guess: now that health care may be in the final strokes, Obama's going to turn the cannons on global climate change and financial industry reform. This is the overture, not the first act, to the opera"
HA ! Delusional. In 3 years we'll be hearing, "are you better off now than when the bullshitter took office" and after 3 more years of double digit UE and sawwtooth ratchet down of the economy (if climate change doesn't take hold otherwise it'll be step function moves lower), any campign contribution bet on Obama now is wasted $$$$$.
Whiskey,
I'm saying that Summers on a certain level is not stupid, he definitely does charm many around him with general conversation.
He's like a little boy that thinks he can fly. Just as good as any other little boy fundamentally, but disastrous when he tests his flying abilities.
Larry Summers is exactly the kind of person the U.S. system of government is designed to elevate; erudite, career-driven (i.e. corrupt), and with a keen instinct for staying within the narrow ideological boundaries of the "vital center." That he's lousy at his job is immaterial. How many formidable intellects are there working in the government, anyway?
President Romney will reverse via Executive Order all the climate legislation before they can do any permanent harm. After his fourth term however there's no telling what could happen.
How many formidable intellects are there working in the government, anyway?
Or at the top of major public corporations? As senior managements sole job now is to screw the stockholders. Middle-management are the ones with the traditional job of figuring out how to screw the customer better.
Those are good first steps - as is regulating derivatives - but the key is that no bank should be “systemically important” or "too big to fail".
Once upon a time we had something called the FTC and the USDOJ Anti-Trust division....in fact, we still kind of do, on paper, precisely to deal with this kind of thing.
I suspect that we could just, you know, re-fund them and actually hire non-revolving-door-insiders, and presto: no more too-big-to-fail Trusts.
I know a lot of folks carp about regulatory capture, but it seems to me that the EU has an effective and seemingly independent regulatory body. Unless this is an artifact of the relatively decentralized Federal model the EU zone represents, we ought to be able to duplicate such a thing. Yes, their banks got into trouble too, but...
Clearly the "correct" thing for GS to do is to divert a big chunk of that bonus pool to the Obama 2012 campaign
That's sort of what Summer's words suggested to me: hey guys it's payback time, we bailed you out, so it's time for you to make a few gestures (donations, throw the names of some easily convicted underlings to the DOJ, etc.) to show you "care", -- know you gotta change your evil ways. Then shunt 5-10 billion my way. Call it baksheesh-- or would it be the sale of indulgences?
President Romney will reverse via Executive Order all the climate legislation before they can do any permanent harm. After his fourth term however there's no telling what could happen.
To be fair, the republicans were a little butt-hurt after Obama's 12th year in office, and it was completely understandable that they changed term limits from four years to 12 months.
Rob Dawg wrote:
President Romney will reverse via Executive Order all the climate legislation before they can do any permanent harm. After his fourth term however there's no telling what could happen.
To be fair, the republicans were a little butt-hurt after Obama's 12th year in office, and it was completely understandable that they changed term limits from four years to 12 months.
That's sort of what Summer's words suggested to me: hey guys it's payback time, we bailed you out, so it's time for you to make a few gestures (donations, throw the names of some easily convicted underlings to the DOJ, etc.) to show you "care", -- know you gotta change your evil ways. Then shunt 5-10 billion my way. Call it baksheesh-- or would it be the sale of indulgences?
Or even: Could you guys PA-LEEEZ pretend you love Merica so we can finish this looting job and get the hell out of here before the place burns down.
"And I want everybody to know who are standing in the way of progress: I'm not tired. I'm just getting started. You can throw whatever you want at me -- keep it coming, we're going to get this done."
NEW YORK (AP) -- A billionaire hedge fund boss was among five men and a woman arrested by federal authorities Friday in a hedge fund insider trading case that prosecutors say reaped $20 million in illegal profits.
A billionaire? For pocket change like $20 million? Is the SEC actually serious about this stuff?
A billionaire? For pocket change like $20 million? Is the SEC actually serious about this stuff?
Al Capone was caught for income tax evasion. This ain't 'bout the $20m. 'Taint even 'bout this guy. This is about sending the other cockroaches scurrying.
You can't have EVIL GOVERNMENT LIBERAL BERCRATS REGULATIN the honest hardworkin bidness leaders of MERICA. Bidness knows what's best for Merica. (President Romney from his speech in 2050 from the Presidential Old Peoples home and resort spa)
Or at the top of major public corporations? As senior managements sole job now is to screw the stockholders. Middle-management are the ones with the traditional job of figuring out how to screw the customer better.
The sociopath/clueless/loser pyramid discussed by RibbonFarm applies. Summers, CEO's, etc. are all "sociopaths" whose main skills are maneuvering to the tops of hierarchies. For many it is their only skill. Even now, the argument for more regulation is a note-perfect political statement that implies a great deal more than it actually says, and it may be just the thing to keep the clueless, or Congress, from acting up.
Al Capone was caught for income tax evasion. This ain't 'bout the $20m. 'Taint even 'bout this guy. This is about sending the other cockroaches scurrying.
I was in the midst of typing almost that exact response.
Damn these sausage-like fingers, I'm just not quick enough...
Ha ha ha -- he's pleading on bended knee for the banks to let enough toothless regulation through their lobbyists in Congress so his boss doesn't go home empty-handed.
Good luck with that -- the banks have no reason to play nice, now.
Lots of insight in your exchange with alybaba yesterday. Insights not found in MSM. Very volatile region, more so than Iran and Israel. If there is another attack on India, India has made it clear, it will have to attack back. In a big way.
Larry making the right noises, but so far his history (i.e. his entire carreer) does not lend much hope to the supposition that it will translate into actions. The origional fin'l reform proposals were very good first steps in the right direction, not nearly sufficent, but good first steps. Now the bank lobby has gotten a hold of them, and what got reported out of Barney's committee is going to be the functional equivelent of the Senate Finance committee HC bill, reform in name only. And that is out of Barney's committtee in the House. Just wait and see how far it gets watered down in the Senate where everyone is required to bow down and worship at the feet of Mt Olympia. The loopholes in the derivatives regulation part are big enough to sial a supertanker through.
We need a return to Glass Stegal, and proof of an insurable interest for any CDS. ALL derivatives should be standardized and exchange traded. If that means a few businessees will have risks they can't hedge, or the hedges will not be perfectly efficient, so what.
Yes thank you RD, I did not want to disappoint NotRealAmerican, he is a
( cough ) buyer.
Ohhhh.... My condolences. At least those kinds of metastasizes aren't airborne.
Reggie Middleton just went public with his BofA analysis and it was brutal. I continue to assert WFC is the TTTF poster child but he makes a compelling case.
Meta observation: I see no reason for the 19 TBTF not wiping out their common and preferred and impairing at least some of their bond obligations. They had their extend and pretend and wasted it. Time for screen and clean.
"We believe in a strong and loyal opposition. I believe in a two-party system where ideas are tested and assumptions are challenged. 'Cause that's how we move this country forward. But what I reject is when some folks decide to sit on the sidelines and root for failure."
. . . at which point he dismisses a significant percentage of CR's commentariat.
Why would Larry Summers think that banks give a damn about doing the right thing for the country or the American people? Or does he?
For the most amazing view of what banks think of America and her people, read this internal memo from Citibank. They openly acknowledge the American "plutonomy" and even celebrate its ascendancy. They're written off the average American pointing out that there is no longer an American consumer, just the rich whose spending so dwarfs the rest of the country that the rest can be safely ignored.
Banksters are not going to respond in the slightest to a little chin wagging by Larry Summers and, surely, he already knows that.
I believe in a two-party system where ideas are tested and assumptions are challenged.
I believe in a two-party system which is easier for the nobility manage, as opposed to an uncontrollable multi-party system where ideas are tested and assumptions are challenged and it's harder to control the debate.
and he was only charged because of a disgruntled employee brought the whole thing down for personal vengeance.
I don't know how reporters around the world don't have their hair on fire about the 3rd world standards of enforcement by the SEC
I am not a libertarian, but I am also not into the redistributive changes proposed by BHO, be it energy, health care, education, housing or financial services. I oppose allowing some government hack in CA deciding what type of TV I can buy, or in Washington deciding what health care services I can receive - this all reminds me of the old Wendy's commercials: YouTube - Wendy's Commercial - Soviet Fashion Show
. . . at which point he dismisses a significant percentage of CR's commentariat.
What choices does one have when looking at our country's economic (mis)management
1) rage against the thieves and idiots in charge - but nobody really cares what most of the people posting here have to say, so that's not a real option.
2) bury you head in the sand - at least you can get on with your life
3) join the kleptocracy - it's great work if you can get it.
4) grab some , turn up the snark and enjoy the show. I'm picking option 4 until I can make option 3 happen.
I agree RD, I am thinking BofA's Wachovia commerical loan position ( off the books loses of course ) has to be staggering at this point.
I'm also sensitive as to whether their Countrywide servicing structure is exposed to MERS type challenges especially given the heavy handed integration that occurred.
Larry Summers [has a] keen instinct for staying within the narrow ideological boundaries of the "vital center."
This is not a complaint that can be reasonably made about him -- if anything, his mouth has a tendency to leave the reservation at will. I find it one of his strengths.
His weakness is that politics is the art of the possible -- and he constantly fails to find ways to align his thinking with the "real-world" of what can be done. So, he tends to the ineffectual. Compare to Geithner, who has his fingerprints on lots and lots of [ahem] 'accomplishments' -- not as big a thinker, but he can sure keep the Rolodex spinning!
The dow is charging hard off of session lows.....right after lunch on the east coast. Wall street must have started to flip the switches and pull the levers after lunch to go for YET ANOTHER gain to end the week! Come on baby....we can't let these terrible earnings reports and reality bring us down....we must continue to go up!
but I am also not into the redistributive changes proposed by BHO, be it energy, health care, education, housing or financial services
Too late now. The government is the size it is. The Democrats (aka applied socialists) will use the power of its size to implement their smothering-mommy policies. The Republicans (aka friendly-fascists) will use the power of its size to implement their kick-ass-daddy policies. The insiders from both Parties have a stake in making the government bigger and bigger; controlled by the Smart Amoral Scumbag who distribute tax-payer loot to their buddies and who "know what's best for you".
As a "citizen" you get to pick which form of big-government you'd like every two years.
I'm also sensitive as to whether their Countrywide servicing structure is exposed to MERS type challenges especially given the heavy handed integration that occurred.
Without question! so we will agree that the $2 billion is window dressing.
sportsfan wrote:
Is the SEC actually serious about this stuff?
The SEC spends lots of time questioning why a filing didn't note amounts were in thousands on the Schedule of Other LT Liabilities, why is the amortization period now 3 years, not 4, etc. Lots of detail work....
Ok.. Right at the moment when I started to believe the CFO and CEO of Goldman claiming they are totally independent and deserve to give their talented folks 23 billion dollars and have no government guarantees or edge in the markets .. Larry Summers then claims....
"There is no financial institution that exists today that is not the direct or indirect beneficiary of trillions of dollars of taxpayer support for the financial system."
thankyou to Rob Dawg & stdfs among others for some great chuckles from your posts today!
OT, but may I ask a dumb very basic question of everybody? When one reads those comparisons of "price to rent versus price to buy a home", what exactly are they comparing? Are they comparing the average (or is it median?) price to rent a 3 BR apartment, in a given area? Or, is it the cost to rent a 3BR house?
The reason I ask is cuz I live in a bubble area (Hampton Roads Virginia-- formerly known as the Norfolk/Virginia Beach MSA) Anyway, our local university's economics department just released its annual "State of the Region" report, & perforce devoted a chunk of it to the local (declined but 13% from its peak in Q3 of 2007) housing market. Touting "increased affordibility", this report cites HUD data on "local market rents" to claim that rent for a 3BR house here is around $1,395, and says this is about par to paying the P&I on a median priced 3BR house.
I think this is total boosterism BS-- because unless one lives in a very pricey downtown niche area, nobody here is paying $1395 a month in rent for an average 3BR home.
Does HUD use the cost of the average rent for an apartment *when it comes up with these figures? Or does it use the average rent for a *house? And if it uses the rents charged for houses, then how does it gather its data to make these calculations, since so many houses are just rented privately by the owners, via a sign stuck in the yard?
Sorry for asking dumb questions!-- any help/info much appreciated!
This is not a complaint that can be reasonably made about him -- if anything, his mouth has a tendency to leave the reservation at will. I find it one of his strengths.
When he starts quoting from Mao's Little Red Book, let me know. Even when his arrogance runs amok, like with the execrable woman-can't-do-math statement, he articulated exactly the kind of common prejudice sure to get a "balanced" reading from the middlebrows at Slate. He even managed to get the anti-PC crowd on his side. He never leaves the reservation.
[Summers'] weakness is that politics is the art of the possible -- and he constantly fails to find ways to align his thinking with the "real-world" of what can be done. So, he tends to the ineffectual.
Fortunately he's not Treasury Secretary or in any position that requires him to deal with details or what can be done politically. He can assume the role of an intellectual gadfly and make statements in support of broad ideals without having to descend into the trenches where, I agree, he is not only useless, but counterproductive.
I stepped away from my computer to take care of my kid for a second and look -- I am astonished -- the dow has made up half of it's losses. It must be because the economy is in great shape since these adjusted operating earnings (vs. their GAAP earnings) are better than expected.
I'm so convinced that now, more than ever, this rally is real and legitimate.
I'm also sensitive as to whether their Countrywide servicing structure is exposed to MERS type challenges especially given the heavy handed integration that occurred. - RD
Without question! so we will agree that the $2 billion is window dressing.
More like salad dressing on the entree before the main course.
I remain convinced that somewhere deep in the bowels of BofA there exists a note. A note signed by Casey Serin to Countrywide for $50,000 at no interest as resolution for his defaulted second on a failed investment home purchase under false circumstances. I am convinced they carry that note to this day on their books as an asset at full face value.
The fact that no one can prove or disprove this assertion is not grounds for minimizing my concerns. It is grounds for increasing them.
"Now is the time for prominent slaveholders to drop their opposition to legislation banning the practice of burning off the feet of slaves who try to run away."
Hahah now that brings back some memories of a few years back when I was pitching over at Housing Panic.....too funny. Had a lot of laughs on that blog..and learned a lot also.
from up thread
"President Romney will reverse via Executive Order all the climate legislation before they can do any permanent harm. After his fourth term however there's no telling what could happen."
---yeah but he'll have to isssue the executive order from back in the alleghenies of western maryland or virginia as washington dc will be underwater...
and even then those who believe we can pump 30 billion tons of CO2 into the atmosphere and just say fuck it
will never be convinced that mans recklessness payed a significnt part in the destruction of the planet
but guess what
the ocean is a huge CO2 sink...been sponging up much of the CO2 we been pumpin out
but as temperatures rise the ocean will give up much of what it has absorbed
theres your tipping point
look at the climate several hundred million years ago before the huge layers and pools of coal and oil were laid down...
during the billion years of of life on earth when the carboniferous forests first covered the earth
thats what we have to look forward too,,,have a nice day
And, in no way are we saying that the bedrock of Merica isn't the hardworking honest slaveholders who made this country what is it today. What we don't need is LIBERAL regulation stifling innovation in the crucial slave industry which is so vital to Merica.
I've mentioned before that I know/knew some of the people at Countrywide. One is Mr Brilliant, helped price all manner of things having to do with MBS. You might not expect this, but extremely honest guy. The other is Ms Plodder, who was involved in risk management.
The pattern repeats elsewhere. Innovation is usually far ahead of internal risk management.
Rob Dawg,
Shame on you for calling Casey Serin a speculator! He was only hedging against his future living space needs, no one forced the market to give him those contracts and so it must have been the right thing to do. It must be nice living in your perfect world, where you can see these bubbles ahead of time
/me Federal Reserve's advocate
What have you been doing with your kid since April?
Taking him out for a walk so he can piss on a hydrant ....force of habit, My kids are older, so now I call my dog my kid hahah!........I blame the wife.
Re: "On Sept. 30, Lewis announced plans to retire from the bank by year's end, and is due to receive up to $125 million in previously accrued retirement benefits and accumulated stock holdings in the Charlotte, North Carolina-based bank."
Summers can talk, while other walk Wheres MY pony?
Re: "On Sept. 30, Lewis announced plans to retire from the bank by year's end, and is due to receive up to $125 million in previously accrued retirement benefits and accumulated stock holdings in the Charlotte, North Carolina-based bank."
Summers translation: Let bygones be bygones, what's done is done. From this day forward we need to get tough on bankster fraud. Now let's be clear, Golden Slacks isn't really a "bankster", but an important tool used by the FED.
Got to thinking about how education in Ameria is 'limited'(EHP) and it's not just the 'Cold War' that is a factor. We learned about the Founding Fathers. Who learned anything about central banking in school? Even in 'higher education'? The general curriculum in the U.S. doesn't cover this critical area of our economy IMO. Who learned about the 'founding fathers' of the U.S. central bank? Who learned anything about, for example, Edward House? Who learned anything about the Federal Reserve in their education?
If Summers means for us to take him seriously, then he just pushed the "sell" button.* Let's see what happens next.
We will finally, and soon, begin to regulate some "problematic" bank practices that have been insanely profitable for banksters and other elite, albeit extremely damaging to the real economy.
By doing so, we will render banks unable to generate the expected large sums of faux "earnings."
Ergo, you have already seen the absolute all-time peak bank earnings for the rest of forever. Banks will never again be as profitable as they have been lately.
Thus, now would be a good time to sell, sell, sell.
*It's kind of like a warning bell, or a tornado siren for the absurdly wealthy that now would be a good time to seek cover, as in "we got you a 10 handle, so what the hell are you dumb slugs waiting for?"
*It's kind of like a warning bell, or a tornado siren for the absurdly wealthy that now would be a good time to seek cover, as in "we got you a 10 handle, so what the hell are you dumb slugs waiting for?"
Why would I sell now, when the market's shooting through the roof? I might miss the top.
As far as I can see, the government's actions within the marketplace have put us at a new permanent plateau.
from chambers bros time has come
how apropos thanks JD
The rules have changed today (Hey)
I have no place to stay (Hey)
I'm thinking about the subway (Hey)
My love has flown away (Hey)
My tears have come and gone (Hey)
Oh my Lord, I have to roam (Hey)
I have no home (Hey)
I have no home (Hey)
Now the time has come (Time)
There's no place to run (Time)
I might get burned up by the sun (Time)
But I had my fun (Time)
I've been loved and put aside (Time)
I've been crushed by the tumbling tide (Time)
And my soul has been psychedelicized (Time)
Anyone here learn anything about Nelson Aldrich in school? That would be a very influential person in the lives of Americans today. The education of Americans or Mericans is very 'limited' when you think about it.
The smartest person can still make the worst decisions, and the best decisions can be derailed by random chance events. Smartness is not a good shield against black swans. Or egotism, for that matter. Thinking you're the smartest person in the room is a mistake.
Yup, it looks like the L.A. rag trade is history.
Probably soon to be followed by the last remaining holdouts of the defense industry.
And Hollywood ain't doing so good either.
Not to give anybody any ideas but what is amazing NONE of these banksters have been kidnapped and youtube tortured ("give me a pound of flesh, you dirty little sh*t"). Or are serial killer dexter wannabes just waiting for a right occasion?
NOTaREALmerican (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/16/2009 - 1:11 pm
noob goldberg wrote:
It's unfortunate he has to take such a significant hit to his personal wealth.
Great men make great sacrifices for their countries in times of crisis. A real patriot.
Sounds like he needs a statue! If I ever do something politically-aweful enough so as to get picked for statuedom, I want to ensure the statue is as lifelike as possible, and that it is clearly visible within a public park that is replete with pigeons. For exactly the reason you already suspect.
Mock, good point about the oceans being a CO2 sink, as they do however, they increase their level of acidity. Acid will eat away at calicum carbonate, which happens to be what the shells in shellfish are made of. Shell fish are a big bart of the base of the food chain. This could be as devistating as the weather impacts of GW.
The other HUGE tipping point is the melting of the premafrost realeasing massive amount of CH4 into the atmosphere. Moliclue for moliclue it is about 25x as powerful a GW gas as is CO2. It is already starting to happen in Russia, Alaska and Canada
That LA number is mind boggling.....Just think that is 13 people out of every group of 100. And that does not include the illegals, people under 18, or individuals who just don't want to work. that is pretty significant for one of the most populous counties in the country, and one of the most populous regions in the world.
Even in 'higher education'? The general curriculum in the U.S. doesn't cover this critical area of our economy IMO. Who learned about the 'founding fathers' of the U.S. central bank? Who learned anything about, for example, Edward House? Who learned anything about the Federal Reserve in their education?
Ok granted I went to a weird "School within a School" in HS, but we did cover Nck Biddle and his bank
Not to give anybody any ideas but what is amazing NONE of these banksters
Was chatting with my power-hour instructor yesterday. She's a civil-engineer in real life. Asked her about how the job was going, the project pipeline. She said it was still good, but only because state & local governments got stimulus money. She asked how my job was. I said I worked for a bank and her tax-money was keeping me employed. She laughed, and said (something like): but won't those bad loans eventually hurt you guys? I said (something like): No the government buys all our bad loans too. ha ha ha. (silence) She didn't believe me.
Moral: Nobody knows what is going on. It's way too confusing for people to figure out.
As someone who lived in LA for about 20 years, I often wondered "What do these people do?" When people would explain what they did, I often wondered how they made a living. Some of the best descriptions came from one of my serial dater friends. She met a gecko breeder, someone who tabulates votes for tv shows where the audience votes by phone, actors, real estate investors, etc.
Los Angeles also has one of the highest rates of unreported income in the US. There are a lot of people making a cash living. Ran into them frequently, as I was standing in line at stores. Modestly dressed, they would pay for things with 20s or 100s. Often, they only had a money clip, no wallet or purse.
NOTaREALmerican (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/16/2009 - 1:26 pm
No the government buys all our bad loans too. ha ha ha. (silence) She didn't believe me.
Moral: Nobody knows what is going on. It's way too confusing for people to figure out.
It's not confusing at all. It's so revolting and irrational to think about that people make the assumption that it is too complex for the common man to understand. But theft, looting and pillage are actually something almost everyone can understand.
Forget the deja vu thing, I probably couldn't tell you what it means for the future any better than I can predict anything. It's unusual, happens infrequently, and is not a collection of past memories. If you want me to say something, it would be USD up a lot and equities down a lot within a month but that's just because I don't have any other notions at the moment on the markets. I shouldn't have posted anything, but it was too weird for me to resist sharing
As someone who lived in LA for about 20 years, I often wondered "What do these people do?" When people would explain what they did, I often wondered how they made a living. Some of the best descriptions came from one of my serial dater friends. She met a gecko breeder, someone who tabulates votes for tv shows where the audience votes by phone, actors, real estate investors, etc.
Los Angeles also has one of the highest rates of unreported income in the US. There are a lot of people making a cash living. Ran into them frequently, as I was standing in line at stores. Modestly dressed, they would pay for things with 20s or 100s. Often, they only had a money clip, no wallet or purse.
I always pay with cash, I hate the digital foot print don't ya know.
Some of the best descriptions came from one of my serial dater friends. She met a gecko breeder, someone who tabulates votes for tv shows where the audience votes by phone, actors, real estate investors, etc.
As a former inmate in the City of Angles, I too often wondered what all those 15 million or so folks spread out far and wide, (the Orange Curtain might think it's isn't LA, but it is) did to justify a decent 3/2 SFH in a non-gang banger neighborhood being worth half a million clams?
CalculatedRisk,
Rolfe Winkler is liveblogging the Buttonwood conference (all the economics celebrities are there) Reuters.com
Already up so far Soros, Bair, Summers, Sachs, Altman, Roach, and more
...
best bit I liked was 65% said the syllabus for financial markets needs to be replaced, ditch the CAPM/MPT/EMT treatment.
But theft, looting and pillage are actually something almost everyone can understand.
True, but NOT looting by the honest hardworkin pillars of Merica society, the people that made this country what it is today. Not like those WELFARE QUEENS THAT LIVE OFF MY HARD EARN TAX MONEY.
No, but I read about him while I was in highschool. My father had a US history book w/lots of political cartoons & the cartoons & the attitudes they embodied persuaded me that US history was more interesting (& ribald) than I'd been led to believe (in school), so I started reading on my own.
I liked "Czar Reed" better than Aldrich. Embodied--hugely--concentration of power. LBJ was very interesting while he was in Congress too.
White House senior economic adviser Lawrence Summers 'challenged' U.S. financial institutions ... *
*...must use this moment to think about what they can do for their country
Too bad they can't all watch the Elizabeth Warren interview video (link provided in another comment), she doe a great job of laying things out clearly & simply.
Except, of course, thanks to the internet, many many people could. If they wanted, if they spent the time to look for information.
If you want me to say something, it would be USD up a lot and equities down a lot within a month but that's just because I don't have any other notions at the moment on the markets. I shouldn't have posted anything, but it was too weird for me to resist sharing.
Did you see where Comrade Rally Monkey called top wednesday?
It will be interesting to see if he will be stacked on the pyre with the rest of the bears.
re: Buttonwood,
Summers was late, probably slept in
Bair had a speech with a lot of forward looking proposals that the FDIC will not release to the public. something's afoot with her
NOTaREALmerican (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/16/2009 - 1:36 pm
True, but NOT looting by the honest hardworkin pillars of Merica society, the people that made this country what it is today. Not like those WELFARE QUEENS THAT LIVE OFF MY HARD EARN TAX MONEY.
Right on! Political maneuvering, price gouging, overpromising and underdelivering are cornerstones of an upwardly mobile middle-class. Where would we be without that contribution?
So what say ye, commentariat?
Does Summers intend to be taken seriously, and is therefore warning of an imminent withdrawal of bank suppport, or is he merely a gasbag serving up the same tired "regulatory reform" mantra warmed-up in the microwave and slapped on a paper plate?
NOTaREALmerican (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/16/2009 - 1:41 pm
There's also the problem of knowing WHAT to look for. The internet is useless unless you already know enough about a topic to filter out the garbage.
Not merely useless. Disinformational. In some cases you are better off being ignorant and relying on common sense reasoning. More of the joys of living the propaganda (oops, I mean information) society.
black dog,
That's just it, I've been wrong on my last prediction. I said 1st week of August would be the effective top, and so long as you could hold on for a 10% buffer, 20% to be extra safe, over the next 6 months that you would preside over at least a 20% fall in equities/gain in the USD (for a brief period on the latter)
Harder to quantify as one guy could knock up 20 or 30 girls,
And maybe that's the news people should be reading. All the reporter would have to do is check the birth certificates, see who got written in as the father (state wants to know who the dad is, try to get some child support payments), or could ask the mothers. Do some real investigative reporting.
It's natural to excuse the wild 5th appendage, as long as it used in the correct positions. Fornication Harlots are also historical viewed as corrupting. Probably another evolutionary response.
Summers is a funny guy. He was one of the chief architects of deregulation in the 2nd clinton cabinet that got us into this mess and is described as an inflationista by the well connected, and now he wants to preach to the choir of of his fellow wall street lowlifes?
Blah, blah, blah. It's just words. Summers should not be anywhere near cleaning up this mess, having been one that helped create it. I'll believe the Obama administration when they actually do something, but I'm not holding my breath.
For a moment I thought he was going to ask them to buy Treasuries.
T - 2 years until next crisis.
tick, tock, tick, tock...
12:11p
Dollar not a policy instrument, Fed's Fisher says
Hahaha!
I have a new slogan. "Transparency is patriotic"
this searing story in
rolling stone
underlines and doccuments exactly why, as a matter of national survival
we must take apart and re-assemble the corrupt and rotting
wall street financial fraud and ponzi machine right now
a must read
Wall Street's Naked Swindle : Rolling Stone
Now that we've allowed banks to rape five generations of future US taxpayers, maybe we should look into making some changes.
But we need to ask the banks for permission first.
The BoJ will make Ben look like a self-publisher of poetry until the exporters are still positioned on a weak(er) Yen. People seem to forget that the BoJ were sending in the Its a chopper, baby 20 years ago. I cannot imagine a world where the Japanese are willing to see 50 Yen/USD unless they have positioned themselves for handling their 10% UE of the future.
If you spray dollar bills with water and freeze them, you can use them as musical instruments, instead of their typical use as a financial instrument.
Wish Summers had said that:
"No bank should be systemically that important and TBTF" . We ought to make a list of people who have said that on record:
The same day the SEC gets taken over by G/S (GoldmanSachs) Summers suggests a return of GS (Glass-Steagall)--bizarro world.
Speed wrote:
Gotta let the sheep regrow those shinning fleeces, no?
Larry Summers == Casper Wienberger
Clearly the "correct" thing for GS to do is to divert a big chunk of that bonus pool to the Obama 2012 campaign. I believe that would be considered appropriate moral suasion in the Kleptocratic State of Amerika.
Don't Ask
Do Tell
"[We have] one crisis every three years," Summers said. "Surely a system that produces this many accidents and accidents this severe is a system that is in very much need of reform."
Excellent point, though lately it doesn't seem like we're getting our fair share of years when the financial world isn't in crisis.
After the
, JimPortlandOR wrote:
I'm actually kinda in favour of reducing protection shareholders receive from liability. Just imagine if we tweaked the law to hold all investors in a corporation liable to double their investment. Or even 15% of their investment. Wouldn't that cause people to take a fundamentally different view of the companies they were investing in?
This has led to the commoditization of investing. The idea that the only thing I need to know about a company before plugging money into it or sucking money out of it is the stock ticker abbreviation creates all sorts of perverse incentives.
/end rant
Has anyone already posted the Elizabeth Warren Video?
"I do not understand how financial institutions could think they could take taxpayer money and turn around and act like it's business as usual," Warren says. "I don't understand how they can't see that the world has changed in a fundamental way - it's not business as usual. All I can say right now is they seem to be winning this argument."
O/T: charts, nebulous but in favor of stock market bulls
The International Center for Finance at the Yale School of Management
"Confidence that there will be no stock market crash in the succeeding six months generally declined", compares individuals and institutional investors.
Tobin's Q as calculated from FRB Flow of Funds, projected Q3 numbers using 4 quarter trend for net worth (-7% I think) and S&P500 for market capitalization (+22%). Obviously net worth ignores the sea of unrecognized but certain losses, but that's not the point of Tobin's Q because that has happened before
Does someone recall a saying about "talk" and "cheap"..cant remember the quote
the rolling stone article details how
shares of stock are voted...that dont exist
shares are even 'borrowed" by influential executives and voted and then 'returned"
thus buying an election without spending a dime
selling short, at a factor of 10 times the underlying commodity or equity
and even selling and failing to deliver united states securities that do not exist
all under the blind eye of so called regulators
this is a must read that clearly sets forth the duplicity
and and the outright role of acomplice
played by our government
if we dont do someething our country is doomed to collapse
Wall Street's Naked Swindle : Rolling Stone
hmmm, I agree completely
but then why did Summers and his team support these institutions even when they made it clear that if there were restrictions in place, they would not play ball?
sorry, these words are empty, the policy decisions made by the Obama economic team are quite different from their words
In the 1850s Summers would have argued that slavery was wrong and needed more regulation.
Shill, I enjoy reading Fisher's speeches, but I find them more entertaining than enlightening. He is very funny ... and has been very wrong. Obviously he doesn't carry the same weight at the Fed as Bernanke, Kohn, Dudley or even Yellen. But he comes up with the best lines (He was the guy that called the pessimists "Eeyores" - that made for good fun)
best wishes
the key is that no bank should be “systemically important” or "too big to fail".
So you don't believe in the central banking model?
I knew you'd come around CR!
seem to be winning? they already won.
the focus is back on their earnings and shareholder vaule - just where they want it to be
not on their viability (or lack thereof without massive taxpayer assisted govt support)
noob goldberg wrote:
Mutual funds would need to really do DD? Wow. I'd call you unAmerican, but...
Summers is all hat and no cattle. There is zero chance that anything meaningful will come from the administration in terms of regulation, reforms, or nationalization.
I wonder if these guys are aware of the anger and violence that is building in this country?
Come on now....
Talk is cheap, BUT talk is the food of politics. So now, "the talk" will be chewed by the media, regurgitated by the sycophants, digested by the peasants, and pooped out for (somebody).
token bull wrote:
If it ain't the end of fractional reserves, it ain't fundamental change.
Latest observations from St Louis Fed
M1 - sept 28 $863.3B....oct 5 $863.8B
M1 multiplier - sept 23 .902.... oct 5 .883
M2 - sept 28 $8364.0B.... october 5 $8340.7B
MZM - sept 28 $9619.6B..... october 5 $9577.7B
I'm gonna hang with the deflationistas a bit longer.
I'm looking forward to the day when seigniorage is zero.
yagij wrote:
Apologies everyone for my unAmerican (or even UnCanadian) outburst.
I was reading the "CRC World Dictionary of Grasses - Common Names, Scientific Names, Eponyms, Synonyms, and Etymology" and it has a tendency to get me quite hot under the collar. I should have restrained myself.
"For most of this decade, nobody rocked that fake economy — especially the faux housing market — better than Bear Stearns. In 2004, Bear had been one of five investment banks to ask the SEC for a relaxation of lending restrictions that required it to possess $1 for every $12 it lent out; as a result, Bear's debt-to-equity ratio soared to a staggering 33-1. The bank used much of that leverage to issue mountains of mortgage-backed securities, essentially borrowing its way to a booming mortgage business that helped drive its share price to a high of $172 in early 2007."
Wall Street's Naked Swindle : Rolling Stone
Talking about Iceland...they actually did all the right things, threw the bums out from their government and banks unlike Americans or Brits. Now they are doing quite ok in their little island, unemployment is high but they have a reality based PLAN (backed up by IMF and other Nordics) to get out of the mess unlike some other earth dwellers...
The real SHTF times are just about to begin in US and in UK. They already suffered theirs...
Tarzan wrote:
Maybe the peasants there expect their government to actually address their own problems too? How quaint.
I agree CR Fisher is good for a Friday afternoon Hoot.
Thank you for all you do.
noob goldberg wrote:
The original stock corporations in the UK and Netherlands did not exempt shareholders from financial liability, and that led to all kinds of kinks in the flow of capital. Lloyds of London, for instance, had joint and several liability until very recently, I think. (could be wrong, may still). The problem is the treatment of those who loan to corps versus the sharholder owners, particularly in bankruptcy. Too often the shareholders are placed ahead of other claimants (pension funds, for instance.)
Shareholder financial liability would destroy the stock corporation and be a legal morass of the first order in our times of near instant buys and sells. The original idea of holding for the long run is long gone, and without that, liability becomes impossible to determine. Some other limits could help though: limits on the the ability of aggregate investors (mutual funds, insurance companies, hedge funds, etc. to determine the board composition and elect the CEO. The little investor has no control, since the big guys always vote with management, and management selects the board, not the shareholders. Its a mess.
I'm beginning to ask how much Summers has 'lost it'
Whether it is screwing up Harvard's endowment, or censoring Romer's $1.2tn stimulus recommendation...
He thinks his capabilities are much more than they really are, and that is reinforced by having a Secretary of the Treasury who is the worst at dealmaking or politicking in history to measure himself against
He can't accept that his best hope is a double-dip well before 2012 elections
nebulous but in favor of stock market bulls
When the last bear throws in the towel...
"It's important to point out that not only is normal short-selling completely legal, it can also be socially beneficial. By incentivizing Wall Street players to sniff out inefficient or corrupt companies and bet against them, short-selling acts as a sort of policing system; legal short- sellers have been instrumental in helping expose firms like Enron and WorldCom. The problem is, the new paperless system instituted by the DTC opened up a giant loophole for those eager to game the market. Under the old system, would-be short-sellers had to physically borrow actual paper shares before they could execute a short sale. In other words, you had to actually have stock before you could sell it. But under the new system, a short-seller only had to make a good-faith effort to "locate" the stock he wanted to borrow, which usually amounts to little more than a conversation with a broker:
Evil Hedge Fund: I want to short IBM. Do you have a million shares I can borrow?
Corrupt Broker [not checking, playing Tetris]: Uh, yeah, whatever. Go ahead and sell.
There was nothing to prevent that broker — let's say he has only a million shares of IBM total — from making the same promise to five different hedge funds. And not only could brokers lend stocks they never had, another loophole in the system allowed hedge funds to sell those stocks and deliver a kind of IOU instead of the actual share to the buyer. When a share of stock is sold but never delivered, it's called a "fail" or a "fail to deliver" — and there was no law or regulation in place that prevented it. It's exactly what it sounds like: a loophole legalizing the counterfeiting of stock. In place of real stock, the system could become infected with "fails" — phantom IOU shares — instead of real assets.
If you own stock that pays a dividend, you can even look at your dividend check to see if your shares are real. If you see a line that says "PIL" — meaning "Payment in Lieu" of dividends — your shares were never actually delivered to you when you bought the stock. The mere fact that you're even getting this money is evidence of the crime: This counterfeiting scheme is so profitable for the hedge funds, banks and brokers involved that they are willing to pay "dividends" for shares that do not exist. "They're making the payments without complaint," says Susanne Trimbath, an economist who worked at the Depository Trust Company. "So they're making the money somewhere else."
Wall Street's Naked Swindle : Rolling Stone
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
When did he ever have it? When handed the keys to Lithuania's economy, he drove it straight into a brick wall.
The problem with that is the government has benefited from support of financial institutions. If the government wants to kiss its deficit spending goodbye it's up to them.
It's a prisoner's dilemma.
"Time has come for fundemental change"...hillarious. Speaches, feigned outrage and other misc. politics will get us out of this for sure.
This might be the next crisis that no one will have been able to forsee:
BACK TO BUSINESS; New Exotic Investments Emerging on Wall Street - NY Times
In other news...
Immediately after receiving their humongous annual "performance bonuses", America's banksters declared an 11 month moratorium on excessive compensation.
black dog,
I'm not throwing in the towel. Buying into the stock market is stupider than it was buying in 3 months ago, which itself was a stupid thing to do. I'm not in the game of trying to be the least stupid amongst a crowd of stupid, unless I know I specifically have an advantage knowing their limits or being able to react faster.
That said, I'm not going to ignore alternatives. Only we can deceive ourselves
lets reminisce a little today...Ron Paul 1988 video..must watch parts 2-3..parts below the video...
ATS Video: Ron Paul - The American Power Elite: (2)
nostradamus like observations...scary how close he came to predicting the outcome....
This is as good as it gets.....
He's not what the media made him out to be....
JimPortlandOR wrote:
The current system is working so well that heaven forbid we make it more complicated by having laws of unintended consequences cause heart burn to the larger players in the game? Where can I vote with my 12 shares for that idea?
JimPortlandOR wrote:
Right, and every time there's a "shareholder rights" movement (agitation) this is portrayed in the media as class warfare or the commie barbarians at the gates attempting to oppress the honest hardworkin bidness leaders of Merica with MORE REGULATIONS!
Enough of the masses read stuff like this and the stock market vaporizes. Rolling Stone makes sense as a venue because their readership core is aging boomers. There would appear to be little difference between NYSE and the Pink Sheets.
The number of crises coming out of the mouths of politicians far outnumbers those coming from the mouths of bankers. Pot , kettle.
JimPortlandOR wrote:
I agree, and I'm completely aware that my 'solution' was greatly over-simplified. But I think we all recognize that the form needs to be changed, and I'm very much in favour of examining your suggestion that we start by restricting the ability for a corporation to create wholly-owned subsidiaries, or entities that exist only on a balance sheet or in a computer file.
Make a rule that every corporation has to have a physical place of business that is not shared with another corporation, even if it's a one-room office in a house somewhere. No more post office-boxes. Meeting that requirement alone might be enough to cure our CRE and Housing overhang
The obvious answer is to bring back Glass-Steagall, but since the government panicked and forced the final shotgun marriage of commercial and investment banking last year, this seems highly unlikely
Also, given that around 90% of all residential mortgages are written by 3 insolvent government entities, ie. there is no private mortgage market in the US anymore, small to medium business credit is still frozen and cmbs are about to resemble the aftermath of a neutron bomb, I'd say the next credit crisis is closer to 2 months than 2 years away.
Whiskey,
His strength is probably arguing both sides of issues that don't involve numbers, and don't involve repitition
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
If your native currency is $USD, you have to play the game on some level, or watch your savings evaporate. For the moment, it's a bit easier for Canadians, so you may be able to sit it out for a while.
@EHP
Sorry, didn't mean you - at the Yale study.
Turbo wrote:
You tease! If I don't get the realization of that 2 months forecast in my stocking at Xmas, I'm going to be a sad person.
Talk, talk, talk....Summers is one of the biggest effing liars in DC. It is disgusting to hear him say these words knowing that he was a willing participant and benefactor of the deregulation he helped to promulgate. FU( K YOU LARRY.
noob goldberg wrote:
Well, that would certainly help the CRE problem in Nevada. Other states, I'm not so sure...
"The time has come," the Summers said,
"To talk of many things:
Of shoes--and ships--and sealing-wax--
Of cabbages--and kings--
"O taxpayers," said the Bernanke,
"You've had a pleasant run!
Shall we be trotting home again?'
But answer came there none--
And this was scarcely odd, because
They'd eaten every one.
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
Driving into brick walls avoids that problem,eh? Either the car doesn't work or the wall is no longer there. Its a Win-Win!
Yeah, I'm sure this is all it will take for banks to "do what's right for their country".
Though I suspect our opinions don't hold much sway...
sounds like the "dinner speech" market is drying up for poor Larry.
BTW over at zero hedge there is a nice little link regarding the fairly large accumulation of Nov. $100 calls on oil.
Attack on Iran... or Market Noise? (Noise, Probably). | zero hedge
wonder what they have in store for us come early next month?
Ciao
MS
Sdtfs....great vid...thank you
Mannwich wrote:
It will sound great to the Party true-believers tho.
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
That's a strength if the situation calls for dithering and gridlock.
The guy lost it when he was running Harvard. The question is why did Obama think he was fit for public office?
I have no evidence for this, but the Summers statement today may be the revelation of Obama's disgust with 'biz as usual' - as he looks ahead at legislation and re-election. O's statement to Wall Street a couple weeks back (the meeting boycotted by all the big bank CEOs) made it clear that the out of control greed party may have a new bartender.
On the other hand, the appointment of yet another Glodman playa to the SEC is a bad sign.
My guess: now that health care may be in the final strokes, Obama's going to turn the cannons on global climate change and financial industry reform. This is the overture, not the first act, to the opera.
sm_landlord
Buy disused industrial land near ports and railways? The American trade deficit will continue shrinking in any case
Most people don't have a lot of capital though, so they just have to make sure they have a good support network of friends & family and then wait. If they have the chance, investing in a skill or knowledge that is globally in demand would be good
Mannwich wrote:
I was going to type out a well-considered articulate response (my first for the day, yay!), but then I saw your handle and I got all flustered and distracted. Damn this giant book on grass, it'll be the death of me.
Charles Kiting wrote:
The answer is the Party insiders picked him. Obama is just the President.
The Summers suppository...
Summers is reduced to playing the role of cheerleader, so that's what he's doing.
I'd like to see him make similar statements, and get a little coverage, every time the House Financial Services Committee votes out a new regulation. The pressure against doing anything will continue every day going forward. He can at least balance that pressure with support of Congressional action.
We're very early in this game. The tough parts will happen in the Senate next year.
For those playing at home, the word for the day is "titular."
"Clearly the "correct" thing for GS to do is to divert a big chunk of that bonus pool to the Obama 2012 campaign. I believe that would be considered appropriate moral suasion in the Kleptocratic State of Amerika. "
@ Turbo:
That wouldn't be the "correct" thing to do. It would leave a roughly 50/50 chance of backing the wrong horse. They'll divert half to Obama and half to his Republican opponent.
Whiskey,
I'm saying that Summers on a certain level is not stupid, he definitely does charm many around him with general conversation.
He's like a little boy that thinks he can fly. Just as good as any other little boy fundamentally, but disastrous when he tests his flying abilities.
The time for regulation was back in the spring/summer while the banksters were backpedaling.
You can count on one thing - the more time you put between the crisis and new regulation the more watered down and lobbyist written it will become.
SNAFU wrote:
But, but... Barney promised Ron Paul's audit the Fed would be in the House legislation way back in August.
It's TCTM that really bothers me. Too complex to manage.
/but disastrous when you tests his flying abilities. /
corrected that for you EHP.
noob: CRC World Dictionary of Grasses, hot under the collar
I agree Noob, nothing like a Phalaris Arundinacea to set one's point of view straight.
Most other topics pale by comparison.
Rob Dawg wrote:
Titular regulators, titular corporations, titular reform.
You're right, it is the word of the day.
Yeah, I'm sure this is all it will take for banks to "do what's right for their country".
What's good for GS is good for the country.
Like, duh.
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
Fortunately, he doesn't have to be able to fly. He's not in charge of any aerodynamic details. He can just sing the praises of flying in general while others work to make it happen.
noob goldberg wrote:
(Ecclesiastical.) a person entitled to a benefice but not required to perform its duties.
I have flying dreams fairly often. In many of them, people try to convince me I can't actually fly.
black dog wrote:
Completely agree, as to when reform was optimum, but I think Obama/Geithner/Summers/Bernanke didn't think the super-fragile financial situation could handle it without greater dangers arising.
It probably doesn't matter, since the Senate can only do one thing at a time (and often not even that), and healthcare was a key campaign committment and social need that couldn't be delayed. The Senate will be tied in knots on anything Wall Street related (except giveaways and more debt).
JimPortlandOR wrote:
I would guess the Smart Amoral Party scum-bags will turn the cannons on "global climate change" as that will keep the peasants from both political-types at each other's throats diverting their tiny brains from the real problem, which is: who is getting how much loot from Merica.
ot-check out the ron paul vintage video when you have time I posted link above especially part 2 and 3...even brings up how bill abolishing fed reserve would be hard to pass......depression call was early but it was smothered over by last 20 years of monetary policy and games....
this was done in 1988..I was blown away...
ATS Video: Ron Paul - The American Power Elite: (3)
NervousRex wrote:
Damn that mexican riverbank grass...actually, this book doesn't have a whole lot on that entry:
EDIT: It's funny that a big expensive book has less useful information than Google, which tells me it's Reed Canary Grass and gives a pretty picture. However, I'm sure this book has examples not found on google, so I'll withhold judgment for now.
it's nice to know that Ticketmaster and Live Nation (?) are too big to exist together, but JPM isn't...
JimPortlandOR wrote:
It will be interesting to see how many new regulations come out of the House this year and how they are handled in the Senate next year. I'm not optimistic about the eventual outcome, but they are keeping the ball in play and it's right for Summers to speak out in support. He's just a well paid adviser in this game.
"In calling for financial-services companies to accept new regulations, Summers said bank executives and other financial-industry managers should consider the recent financial crisis within the context of a broader set of crises that have occurred in recent years"
Go to your room and think about how you should be punished. But only if you want to.
"My guess: now that health care may be in the final strokes, Obama's going to turn the cannons on global climate change and financial industry reform. This is the overture, not the first act, to the opera"
HA ! Delusional. In 3 years we'll be hearing, "are you better off now than when the bullshitter took office" and after 3 more years of double digit UE and sawwtooth ratchet down of the economy (if climate change doesn't take hold otherwise it'll be step function moves lower), any campign contribution bet on Obama now is wasted $$$$$.
What a recovery!!!!
B. of A. posts third-quarter loss of more than $2 billion.
General Electric profit slumps 44%
Keeping up with an avalanche of troubled mortgages
Sony Ericsson loss widens to $245 million
So far today, without any bank failures until later. Thank goodness we bailed them out & passed that stimulus bill.
Almost time for
& 
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
Larry Summers is exactly the kind of person the U.S. system of government is designed to elevate; erudite, career-driven (i.e. corrupt), and with a keen instinct for staying within the narrow ideological boundaries of the "vital center." That he's lousy at his job is immaterial. How many formidable intellects are there working in the government, anyway?
shill wrote:
Only 2 billion? Hardly worth even reporting! Strong buy BofA!
President Romney will reverse via Executive Order all the climate legislation before they can do any permanent harm. After his fourth term however there's no telling what could happen.
ot-hugh hendry's latest take on market this morning..more good stuff..the hell with larry summers...video is embedded and might load slow....
Nathan's Economic Edge
Whiskey wrote:
Or at the top of major public corporations? As senior managements sole job now is to screw the stockholders. Middle-management are the ones with the traditional job of figuring out how to screw the customer better.
Those are good first steps - as is regulating derivatives - but the key is that no bank should be “systemically important” or "too big to fail".
Once upon a time we had something called the FTC and the USDOJ Anti-Trust division....in fact, we still kind of do, on paper, precisely to deal with this kind of thing.
I suspect that we could just, you know, re-fund them and actually hire non-revolving-door-insiders, and presto: no more too-big-to-fail Trusts.
I know a lot of folks carp about regulatory capture, but it seems to me that the EU has an effective and seemingly independent regulatory body. Unless this is an artifact of the relatively decentralized Federal model the EU zone represents, we ought to be able to duplicate such a thing. Yes, their banks got into trouble too, but...
shill wrote:
B. of A. admits to a third-quarter loss of at least $2 billion.
There. Fixed that for ya.
Clearly the "correct" thing for GS to do is to divert a big chunk of that bonus pool to the Obama 2012 campaign
That's sort of what Summer's words suggested to me: hey guys it's payback time, we bailed you out, so it's time for you to make a few gestures (donations, throw the names of some easily convicted underlings to the DOJ, etc.) to show you "care", -- know you gotta change your evil ways. Then shunt 5-10 billion my way. Call it baksheesh-- or would it be the sale of indulgences?
Rob Dawg wrote:
To be fair, the republicans were a little butt-hurt after Obama's 12th year in office, and it was completely understandable that they changed term limits from four years to 12 months.
FTC/DOJ anti-trust divisions have been neutered by the judiciary over the past 30 years. damn law and economics
noob goldberg wrote:
Republicans? Who said Republicans?
azurite wrote:
Or even: Could you guys PA-LEEEZ pretend you love Merica so we can finish this looting job and get the hell out of here before the place burns down.
Obama, last night, in San Francisco:
"And I want everybody to know who are standing in the way of progress: I'm not tired. I'm just getting started. You can throw whatever you want at me -- keep it coming, we're going to get this done."
5 min. YouTube
Billionaire among 6 nabbed in inside trading case - Yahoo! Finance
A billionaire? For pocket change like $20 million? Is the SEC actually serious about this stuff?
Rob Dawg wrote:
Little 'r'. The only thing that movement stood for was the ability to vote frequently.
sportsfan wrote:
Al Capone was caught for income tax evasion. This ain't 'bout the $20m. 'Taint even 'bout this guy. This is about sending the other cockroaches scurrying.
sportsfan - its optics
Basel Too wrote:
You can't have EVIL GOVERNMENT LIBERAL BERCRATS REGULATIN the honest hardworkin bidness leaders of MERICA. Bidness knows what's best for Merica. (President Romney from his speech in 2050 from the Presidential Old Peoples home and resort spa)
Yes thank you RD, I did not want to disappoint NotRealAmerican, he is a
( cough ) buyer.
NOTaREALmerican wrote:
The sociopath/clueless/loser pyramid discussed by RibbonFarm applies. Summers, CEO's, etc. are all "sociopaths" whose main skills are maneuvering to the tops of hierarchies. For many it is their only skill. Even now, the argument for more regulation is a note-perfect political statement that implies a great deal more than it actually says, and it may be just the thing to keep the clueless, or Congress, from acting up.
Rob Dawg wrote:
I was in the midst of typing almost that exact response.
Damn these sausage-like fingers, I'm just not quick enough...
Ha ha ha -- he's pleading on bended knee for the banks to let enough toothless regulation through their lobbyists in Congress so his boss doesn't go home empty-handed.
Good luck with that -- the banks have no reason to play nice, now.
"You'll get nothing -- and like it!"
sportsfan wrote:
short story: Don't be pompous, fire traders who know the details of your illegal trades, and then not expect to be busted
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
Bonuses are hush money.
Whiskey wrote:
and they are also 'take your money and run' money. Paraguay. Monaco. Find your dream.
EHP
Lots of insight in your exchange with alybaba yesterday. Insights not found in MSM. Very volatile region, more so than Iran and Israel. If there is another attack on India, India has made it clear, it will have to attack back. In a big way.
So thanks.
Larry making the right noises, but so far his history (i.e. his entire carreer) does not lend much hope to the supposition that it will translate into actions. The origional fin'l reform proposals were very good first steps in the right direction, not nearly sufficent, but good first steps. Now the bank lobby has gotten a hold of them, and what got reported out of Barney's committee is going to be the functional equivelent of the Senate Finance committee HC bill, reform in name only. And that is out of Barney's committtee in the House. Just wait and see how far it gets watered down in the Senate where everyone is required to bow down and worship at the feet of Mt Olympia. The loopholes in the derivatives regulation part are big enough to sial a supertanker through.
We need a return to Glass Stegal, and proof of an insurable interest for any CDS. ALL derivatives should be standardized and exchange traded. If that means a few businessees will have risks they can't hedge, or the hedges will not be perfectly efficient, so what.
shill wrote:
Ohhhh.... My condolences. At least those kinds of metastasizes aren't airborne.
Reggie Middleton just went public with his BofA analysis and it was brutal. I continue to assert WFC is the TTTF poster child but he makes a compelling case.
Meta observation: I see no reason for the 19 TBTF not wiping out their common and preferred and impairing at least some of their bond obligations. They had their extend and pretend and wasted it. Time for screen and clean.
Whiskey wrote:
Ditto golden parachutes -- the legal agreements have explicit clawback provisions if you later don't "play nice".
Thanks for the link, Jim. Obama also said:
. . . at which point he dismisses a significant percentage of CR's commentariat.
Why would Larry Summers think that banks give a damn about doing the right thing for the country or the American people? Or does he?
For the most amazing view of what banks think of America and her people, read this internal memo from Citibank. They openly acknowledge the American "plutonomy" and even celebrate its ascendancy. They're written off the average American pointing out that there is no longer an American consumer, just the rich whose spending so dwarfs the rest of the country that the rest can be safely ignored.
Banksters are not going to respond in the slightest to a little chin wagging by Larry Summers and, surely, he already knows that.
So who's the real audience for this speech?
Citigroup Oct 16, 2005 Plutonomy Report Part 1
Sorry, not sure how to establish link.
Speaking of Air-born
http://diversitylane.files.wordpress.com/2009/10/diversitylane_balloon_for-blog.jpg?w=510&h=726
Barley wrote:
Oh how I hate that word. "Optics".
sportsfan wrote:
I believe in a two-party system which is easier for the nobility manage, as opposed to an uncontrollable multi-party system where ideas are tested and assumptions are challenged and it's harder to control the debate.
The Raj/Galleon filing is an unbelievable read Galleon Group Founder Charged With Securities Fraud - Dealbreaker - A Wall Street Tabloid - Business News Headlines and Financial Gossip
The guy did nothing but insider trading.
Investment arm of Intel, board of directors for peoplesoft, PR firm handling Google's earnings, acquisition of Hilton via Moody's, Polycom top executive, upper management at AMD and Akamai, ... leaks from everywhere.
and he was only charged because of a disgruntled employee brought the whole thing down for personal vengeance.
I don't know how reporters around the world don't have their hair on fire about the 3rd world standards of enforcement by the SEC
I agree RD, I am thinking BofA's Wachovia commerical loan position ( off the books loses of course ) has to be staggering at this point.
I am not a libertarian, but I am also not into the redistributive changes proposed by BHO, be it energy, health care, education, housing or financial services. I oppose allowing some government hack in CA deciding what type of TV I can buy, or in Washington deciding what health care services I can receive - this all reminds me of the old Wendy's commercials: YouTube - Wendy's Commercial - Soviet Fashion Show
Founder of hedge-fund firm Galleon charged with insider trading
Sweeping insider-trading case rocks Galleon - MarketWatch
Shocking!...I think we need another Martha Stewart type fall guy/gal....anyone? show of hands.
Mike in Long Island wrote:
Not as much as I hate the word 'coordinates'. As in "it was great to meet you, let me give you my coordinates".
EHP, at least it's corporate names we've heard before.
I got a little tired when the only indictments coming down were some one-man shops in Riverside writing bad mortgages.
. . . at which point he dismisses a significant percentage of CR's commentariat.
What choices does one have when looking at our country's economic (mis)management
, turn up the snark and enjoy the show. I'm picking option 4 until I can make option 3 happen.
1) rage against the thieves and idiots in charge - but nobody really cares what most of the people posting here have to say, so that's not a real option.
2) bury you head in the sand - at least you can get on with your life
3) join the kleptocracy - it's great work if you can get it.
4) grab some
shill wrote:
I'm also sensitive as to whether their Countrywide servicing structure is exposed to MERS type challenges especially given the heavy handed integration that occurred.
With all due respect to Mr. Summers, the Chickens do not ask the Fox what it can do to protect them.
It starts being over when they outlaw the sale of Asset Backed Securities in all shapes and forms. Anything until then is window dressing.
Of course, picking up the pieces as a result of what happens when they do do that is going to be entertaining as all hell.
-- w
We need volunteers to spearhead the coordination around the synergies of optics and communication.
Whiskey wrote:
This is not a complaint that can be reasonably made about him -- if anything, his mouth has a tendency to leave the reservation at will. I find it one of his strengths.
His weakness is that politics is the art of the possible -- and he constantly fails to find ways to align his thinking with the "real-world" of what can be done. So, he tends to the ineffectual. Compare to Geithner, who has his fingerprints on lots and lots of [ahem] 'accomplishments' -- not as big a thinker, but he can sure keep the Rolodex spinning!
The dow is charging hard off of session lows.....right after lunch on the east coast. Wall street must have started to flip the switches and pull the levers after lunch to go for YET ANOTHER gain to end the week! Come on baby....we can't let these terrible earnings reports and reality bring us down....we must continue to go up!
warlock wrote:
It's fiat all the way down!
Terry wrote:
Too late now. The government is the size it is. The Democrats (aka applied socialists) will use the power of its size to implement their smothering-mommy policies. The Republicans (aka friendly-fascists) will use the power of its size to implement their kick-ass-daddy policies. The insiders from both Parties have a stake in making the government bigger and bigger; controlled by the Smart Amoral Scumbag who distribute tax-payer loot to their buddies and who "know what's best for you".
As a "citizen" you get to pick which form of big-government you'd like every two years.
Without question! so we will agree that the $2 billion is window dressing.
sportsfan wrote:
Is the SEC actually serious about this stuff?
The SEC spends lots of time questioning why a filing didn't note amounts were in thousands on the Schedule of Other LT Liabilities, why is the amortization period now 3 years, not 4, etc. Lots of detail work....
Ok.. Right at the moment when I started to believe the CFO and CEO of Goldman claiming they are totally independent and deserve to give their talented folks 23 billion dollars and have no government guarantees or edge in the markets .. Larry Summers then claims....
"There is no financial institution that exists today that is not the direct or indirect beneficiary of trillions of dollars of taxpayer support for the financial system."
Now what am I suppose to think?
Winston wrote:
Join the debate over what should be done to eliminate financial corruption in the future.
Those who have nothing to say but "Obama = Fail" are just wasting bandwidth.
thankyou to Rob Dawg & stdfs among others for some great chuckles from your posts today!
OT, but may I ask a dumb very basic question of everybody? When one reads those comparisons of "price to rent versus price to buy a home", what exactly are they comparing? Are they comparing the average (or is it median?) price to rent a 3 BR apartment, in a given area? Or, is it the cost to rent a 3BR house?
The reason I ask is cuz I live in a bubble area (Hampton Roads Virginia-- formerly known as the Norfolk/Virginia Beach MSA) Anyway, our local university's economics department just released its annual "State of the Region" report, & perforce devoted a chunk of it to the local (declined but 13% from its peak in Q3 of 2007) housing market. Touting "increased affordibility", this report cites HUD data on "local market rents" to claim that rent for a 3BR house here is around $1,395, and says this is about par to paying the P&I on a median priced 3BR house.
I think this is total boosterism BS-- because unless one lives in a very pricey downtown niche area, nobody here is paying $1395 a month in rent for an average 3BR home.
Does HUD use the cost of the average rent for an apartment *when it comes up with these figures? Or does it use the average rent for a *house? And if it uses the rents charged for houses, then how does it gather its data to make these calculations, since so many houses are just rented privately by the owners, via a sign stuck in the yard?
Sorry for asking dumb questions!-- any help/info much appreciated!
sportsfan wrote:
There is no debate needed when the corrupt financial players own the government. What is the point?
The Smartest Amoral Scumbags are SUPPOSED to run societies. They won. All we can do is stand in awe and congradulate our new rulers.
You have to wonder what's happened to alumni tithing to Harvard in this post tech bubble, post Summers, post housing bubble, post credit bubble.
Summers is just one of those screw ups that manages to be out of the blast zones he creates.
DCRogers wrote:
When he starts quoting from Mao's Little Red Book, let me know. Even when his arrogance runs amok, like with the execrable woman-can't-do-math statement, he articulated exactly the kind of common prejudice sure to get a "balanced" reading from the middlebrows at Slate. He even managed to get the anti-PC crowd on his side. He never leaves the reservation.
Besides I just made
mock turtle wrote:
rolling stone
good read!
groan
tis true. But it's going to be the bounce under the x-axis of the money supply that's going to really hurt.
divide by zero errors are never good.
-- w
DCRogers wrote:
Fortunately he's not Treasury Secretary or in any position that requires him to deal with details or what can be done politically. He can assume the role of an intellectual gadfly and make statements in support of broad ideals without having to descend into the trenches where, I agree, he is not only useless, but counterproductive.
Rob Dawg wrote:
and he would have hastened to add, "Having said that, I don't think we should act in haste to change things."
One would hope that the remedy for the current financial mess is less painful that the one for slavery.
I stepped away from my computer to take care of my kid for a second and look -- I am astonished -- the dow has made up half of it's losses. It must be because the economy is in great shape since these adjusted operating earnings (vs. their GAAP earnings) are better than expected.
I'm so convinced that now, more than ever, this rally is real and legitimate.
Pls. note the sarcasm.
shill wrote:
What have you been doing with your kid since April?
How many times has the Dow broken 10k this week?
I'm told it's a very big deal every time it happens
shill wrote:
More like salad dressing on the entree before the main course.
I remain convinced that somewhere deep in the bowels of BofA there exists a note. A note signed by Casey Serin to Countrywide for $50,000 at no interest as resolution for his defaulted second on a failed investment home purchase under false circumstances. I am convinced they carry that note to this day on their books as an asset at full face value.
The fact that no one can prove or disprove this assertion is not grounds for minimizing my concerns. It is grounds for increasing them.
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
Hats, buttons, pins, lots of Dow 10k flare, for sure!
"Now is the time for prominent slaveholders to drop their opposition to legislation banning the practice of burning off the feet of slaves who try to run away."
Hahah now that brings back some memories of a few years back when I was pitching over at Housing Panic.....too funny. Had a lot of laughs on that blog..and learned a lot also.
from up thread
"President Romney will reverse via Executive Order all the climate legislation before they can do any permanent harm. After his fourth term however there's no telling what could happen."
---yeah but he'll have to isssue the executive order from back in the alleghenies of western maryland or virginia as washington dc will be underwater...
and even then those who believe we can pump 30 billion tons of CO2 into the atmosphere and just say fuck it
will never be convinced that mans recklessness payed a significnt part in the destruction of the planet
but guess what
the ocean is a huge CO2 sink...been sponging up much of the CO2 we been pumpin out
but as temperatures rise the ocean will give up much of what it has absorbed
theres your tipping point
look at the climate several hundred million years ago before the huge layers and pools of coal and oil were laid down...
during the billion years of of life on earth when the carboniferous forests first covered the earth
thats what we have to look forward too,,,have a nice day
Whiskey wrote:
And, in no way are we saying that the bedrock of Merica isn't the hardworking honest slaveholders who made this country what is it today. What we don't need is LIBERAL regulation stifling innovation in the crucial slave industry which is so vital to Merica.
mock turtle wrote:
This is just science tho.
I've mentioned before that I know/knew some of the people at Countrywide. One is Mr Brilliant, helped price all manner of things having to do with MBS. You might not expect this, but extremely honest guy. The other is Ms Plodder, who was involved in risk management.
The pattern repeats elsewhere. Innovation is usually far ahead of internal risk management.
Rob Dawg,
Shame on you for calling Casey Serin a speculator! He was only hedging against his future living space needs, no one forced the market to give him those contracts and so it must have been the right thing to do. It must be nice living in your perfect world, where you can see these bubbles ahead of time
/me Federal Reserve's advocate
mock turtle wrote:
So you're saying it would be a good idea to buy up a lot of northern Canadian wilderness on the cheap?
...it's up to you, but if you just want to wear the minimum amount of pieces of Dow 10k flare, you may not be right for this market...
noob goldberg wrote:
ROFL!! Funniest post of the day.
tncubsfan wrote:
Let's not jump to conclusions here...
Taking him out for a walk so he can piss on a hydrant
....force of habit, My kids are older, so now I call my dog my kid hahah!........I blame the wife. 
PS. The dog is worse than the kids sometimes!
Summers can talk, while other walk
Re: "On Sept. 30, Lewis announced plans to retire from the bank by year's end, and is due to receive up to $125 million in previously accrued retirement benefits and accumulated stock holdings in the Charlotte, North Carolina-based bank."
mock turtle wrote:
Wall Street's Naked Swindle : Rolling Stone
Good stuff, mock, thanks for the link.
noob goldberg wrote:
Call it pre-positioning for the luxury travel trade complete with anticipated Inuit gaming licenses and you can IPO for billions.
I thought he turned down the money this morning?
he turned down the salary and bonuses for 2009, not his retirement package.
1:50pPhiladelphia Stock Exchange halts floor trading
Whats this all about?
LA County unemployment at 12.7%.
Los Angeles Times -- Business, Technology, Real Estate, Hollywood, Economics, News - latimes.com
shill wrote:
They still have floor trading at PHLX?
I think somebody just gave the Boys of Summers the steal sign...
Wait till next season, Dem Bums
Summers translation: Let bygones be bygones, what's done is done. From this day forward we need to get tough on bankster fraud. Now let's be clear, Golden Slacks isn't really a "bankster", but an important tool used by the FED.
Got to thinking about how education in Ameria is 'limited'(EHP) and it's not just the 'Cold War' that is a factor. We learned about the Founding Fathers. Who learned anything about central banking in school? Even in 'higher education'? The general curriculum in the U.S. doesn't cover this critical area of our economy IMO. Who learned about the 'founding fathers' of the U.S. central bank? Who learned anything about, for example, Edward House? Who learned anything about the Federal Reserve in their education?
Basel Too wrote:
It's unfortunate he has to take such a significant hit to his personal wealth.
I weep for his losses.
If Summers means for us to take him seriously, then he just pushed the "sell" button.* Let's see what happens next.
*It's kind of like a warning bell, or a tornado siren for the absurdly wealthy that now would be a good time to seek cover, as in "we got you a 10 handle, so what the hell are you dumb slugs waiting for?"
Here some slop for the piggies in DC
YouTube - The Chambers Brothers - Time Has Come Today
noob goldberg wrote:
Great men make great sacrifices for their countries in times of crisis. A real patriot.
What's the political thermometer at in the USA? I've suddenly noticed an increase in squabbling about Bush v Obama as adjudicated by the stock market
threetorches wrote:
Why would I sell now, when the market's shooting through the roof? I might miss the top.
As far as I can see, the government's actions within the marketplace have put us at a new permanent plateau.
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
Are you a ferner?
NOTaREALmerican wrote:
There's still room on Rushmore, I've been told.
from chambers bros time has come
how apropos thanks JD
The rules have changed today (Hey)
I have no place to stay (Hey)
I'm thinking about the subway (Hey)
My love has flown away (Hey)
My tears have come and gone (Hey)
Oh my Lord, I have to roam (Hey)
I have no home (Hey)
I have no home (Hey)
Now the time has come (Time)
There's no place to run (Time)
I might get burned up by the sun (Time)
But I had my fun (Time)
I've been loved and put aside (Time)
I've been crushed by the tumbling tide (Time)
And my soul has been psychedelicized (Time)
I believe I'm what you call an iceback
Favorite quote from the Rolling Stone piece:
"Our economy is so completely fucked, the rich are running out of things to steal."
Thanks for the link!
Anyone here learn anything about Nelson Aldrich in school? That would be a very influential person in the lives of Americans today. The education of Americans or Mericans is very 'limited' when you think about it.
Feckless Ness (homepage, profile) wrote on Fri, 10/16/2009 - 2:14 pm replyIgnore userFavorite quote from the Rolling Stone piece:
"Our economy is so completely fucked, the rich are running out of things to steal."
Thanks for the link!
I second that! Good story....funny line.
The smartest person can still make the worst decisions, and the best decisions can be derailed by random chance events. Smartness is not a good shield against black swans. Or egotism, for that matter. Thinking you're the smartest person in the room is a mistake.
Why Did 1 Of 8 Girls Get Pregnant At Robeson High?
1 In 7 Girls At Robeson High School Got Pregnant - cbs2chicago.com
Black Monday still coming this coming Monday? It would help cover my shorts
Feckless Ness wrote:
Yup, it looks like the L.A. rag trade is history.
Probably soon to be followed by the last remaining holdouts of the defense industry.
And Hollywood ain't doing so good either.
Not to give anybody any ideas but what is amazing NONE of these banksters have been kidnapped and youtube tortured ("give me a pound of flesh, you dirty little sh*t"). Or are serial killer dexter wannabes just waiting for a right occasion?
merchants of fear wrote:
Never heard of him. I just looked him up. Sound like one-a-them commies to me!
noob goldberg wrote:
Yes. And all trading - both system and open outcry is halted.
Market System Status
Sucks to have system problems on expiration Friday.
I just had a solid minute of detailed déja vu
it's happening again
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
Go on... regarding...
Series: UEMP15OV, Civilians Unemployed - 15 Weeks & Over
St. Louis Fed: Series: UEMP15OV, Civilians Unemployed - 15 Weeks & Over
NOTaREALmerican (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/16/2009 - 1:11 pm
noob goldberg wrote:
It's unfortunate he has to take such a significant hit to his personal wealth.
Great men make great sacrifices for their countries in times of crisis. A real patriot.
Sounds like he needs a statue! If I ever do something politically-aweful enough so as to get picked for statuedom, I want to ensure the statue is as lifelike as possible, and that it is clearly visible within a public park that is replete with pigeons. For exactly the reason you already suspect.
Mock, good point about the oceans being a CO2 sink, as they do however, they increase their level of acidity. Acid will eat away at calicum carbonate, which happens to be what the shells in shellfish are made of. Shell fish are a big bart of the base of the food chain. This could be as devistating as the weather impacts of GW.
The other HUGE tipping point is the melting of the premafrost realeasing massive amount of CH4 into the atmosphere. Moliclue for moliclue it is about 25x as powerful a GW gas as is CO2. It is already starting to happen in Russia, Alaska and Canada
History lesson in economics 101:
'...he had declared a similar measure communistic a decade earlier.'
Nelson Aldrich: the Rockefeller's Middle Man who crafted the Income Tax and the Central Federal Reserve System
Jeez, why not just remove the taxpayer teat?
A good first step would be for Larry Summers to resign. A better first step would be for Barry to fire him.
Now that we have fundamental change out of our systems. How about some bank failure Friday?
Yancey Ward wrote:
mastectomies for all....
That LA number is mind boggling.....Just think that is 13 people out of every group of 100. And that does not include the illegals, people under 18, or individuals who just don't want to work. that is pretty significant for one of the most populous counties in the country, and one of the most populous regions in the world.
noob goldberg wrote:
Rubs, hands, wipes bald pate, says; "Exxxceeeelent!" Why indeed? Heh heh heh (cough)!
[Yes, I knew you were snarking.]
merchants of fear wrote:
Ok granted I went to a weird "School within a School" in HS, but we did cover Nck Biddle and his bank
I've noticed the desperation lever has been up to 11, lately.
Tarzan wrote:
Was chatting with my power-hour instructor yesterday. She's a civil-engineer in real life. Asked her about how the job was going, the project pipeline. She said it was still good, but only because state & local governments got stimulus money. She asked how my job was. I said I worked for a bank and her tax-money was keeping me employed. She laughed, and said (something like): but won't those bad loans eventually hurt you guys? I said (something like): No the government buys all our bad loans too. ha ha ha. (silence) She didn't believe me.
Moral: Nobody knows what is going on. It's way too confusing for people to figure out.
The Galleon Gang has been arrested, the apparently there's a Moody's connection:
The Galleon Insider-Trading Charges: The Moody’s Connection - Deal Journal - WSJ
I just had a solid minute of detailed déja vu
it's happening again
mock,
There was no need to change the lyrics, and it segued nice with the Major Major Major Majordomo's bank shot, back pocket.
Rex Nutting reports:
Industrial output grows the most in four years - Production up 5.2% in third quarter on autos, metals, high tech
But a commenter points out:
'As Jim Rogers says, "if you invest based on statistics from the government, you will go bankrupt".'
shill wrote:
Yabut. REAL Mericans know who these people are. GET A JOB YOU LAZY BUMS, I DON'T GET WELFARE!!!!
Nelson Aldrich was Rocky's other Gandpa as I recall. Rocky as in the NYS Gov and VP under Ford
the government buys all our bad loans too. ha ha ha.
Some day, the TPTB are gonna look back and realize what boneheads they all were. I smell mega book deals.
noob goldberg wrote:
So will you start posting under the goob noldberg handle again? Man those were some crazy posts - I can dig up the links if you give me a few...
Shill,
As someone who lived in LA for about 20 years, I often wondered "What do these people do?" When people would explain what they did, I often wondered how they made a living. Some of the best descriptions came from one of my serial dater friends. She met a gecko breeder, someone who tabulates votes for tv shows where the audience votes by phone, actors, real estate investors, etc.
Los Angeles also has one of the highest rates of unreported income in the US. There are a lot of people making a cash living. Ran into them frequently, as I was standing in line at stores. Modestly dressed, they would pay for things with 20s or 100s. Often, they only had a money clip, no wallet or purse.
Mike in Long Island wrote:
No no, I totally thought I was posting as a malevolent former treasury secretary.
It's passed now. Weird.
And a McKinsey connection as well...one of the key tip-passers mentioned in the court document was a McKinsey consultant.
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
No. Past performance is for winners. Investing based upon past performance is for losers.
Funny how the headline is never, "X of Y boys at Robeson highschool decide to become fathers"
some investor guy wrote:
I found it greatly amusing that you put 'real estate investors' in with 'gecko breeders' and 'tv show vote tabulators'.
NOTaREALmerican (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/16/2009 - 1:26 pm
No the government buys all our bad loans too. ha ha ha. (silence) She didn't believe me.
Moral: Nobody knows what is going on. It's way too confusing for people to figure out.
It's not confusing at all. It's so revolting and irrational to think about that people make the assumption that it is too complex for the common man to understand. But theft, looting and pillage are actually something almost everyone can understand.
Forget the deja vu thing, I probably couldn't tell you what it means for the future any better than I can predict anything. It's unusual, happens infrequently, and is not a collection of past memories. If you want me to say something, it would be USD up a lot and equities down a lot within a month but that's just because I don't have any other notions at the moment on the markets. I shouldn't have posted anything, but it was too weird for me to resist sharing
I always pay with cash, I hate the digital foot print don't ya know.
We'll just lose all the finance business to countries that support slavery and readily accept our mobile slaveowners.
You can never eliminate slavery completely.
Just what we need, another regulatory agency.
The market will correct for slavery on its own.
Blah, blah, individual freedom to risk owning slaves, blah, blah.
It's getting harder and harder for me to write parody when the people I'm supposed to be ribbing are already self-parodies.
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
Don't take my post as condescending toward your intuition, EHP.
I'm the greatest fan of intuition you've ever met, so whatever you do, don't ignore your gut...
shill, its higher than stated....
some investor guy..
but la is different
this is what they do
YouTube - LA Story Ordering Coffee
azurite wrote:
Harder to quantify as one guy could knock up 20 or 30 girls, but with girls its one girl one pregnancy. Also the dads dont have to be from the school
azurite wrote:
It's those fornicating harlot's ya gotta worry about. They're causing the moral destruction of Merica ya-know.
I have to revert back to this chart......
...scary for sure.
http://cryptogon.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/fredgraph.png
As a former inmate in the City of Angles, I too often wondered what all those 15 million or so folks spread out far and wide, (the Orange Curtain might think it's isn't LA, but it is) did to justify a decent 3/2 SFH in a non-gang banger neighborhood being worth half a million clams?
CalculatedRisk,
Rolfe Winkler is liveblogging the Buttonwood conference (all the economics celebrities are there)
Reuters.com
Already up so far Soros, Bair, Summers, Sachs, Altman, Roach, and more
...
best bit I liked was 65% said the syllabus for financial markets needs to be replaced, ditch the CAPM/MPT/EMT treatment.
@ Hoops -- hi there, hope you're enjoying your classes? Still in doctor prep mode?
ResistanceIsFeudal wrote:
True, but NOT looting by the honest hardworkin pillars of Merica society, the people that made this country what it is today. Not like those WELFARE QUEENS THAT LIVE OFF MY HARD EARN TAX MONEY.
No, but I read about him while I was in highschool. My father had a US history book w/lots of political cartoons & the cartoons & the attitudes they embodied persuaded me that US history was more interesting (& ribald) than I'd been led to believe (in school), so I started reading on my own.
I liked "Czar Reed" better than Aldrich. Embodied--hugely--concentration of power. LBJ was very interesting while he was in Congress too.
EvilHenryPaulson wrote:
Is this like an out of body thing? Bright lights? If so, I'm all in!
NOTaREALmerican wrote:
You think it's easy filling out those forms? I EARNED that money, dammit.
juvenile delinquent
oops ..did i change the lyrics (is that what you are saying??) if i did , it was not intended
ok wait a minute i think i get it...
u r just saying hey the lyrics fit perfect as they were
yeah, so true
White House senior economic adviser Lawrence Summers 'challenged' U.S. financial institutions ... *
*...must use this moment to think about what they can do for their country
What's he been drinking?
Too bad they can't all watch the Elizabeth Warren interview video (link provided in another comment), she doe a great job of laying things out clearly & simply.
Except, of course, thanks to the internet, many many people could. If they wanted, if they spent the time to look for information.
I'm considering giving up irony, as it's so prevalent that it hardly has any shock value nowadays...
If you want me to say something, it would be USD up a lot and equities down a lot within a month but that's just because I don't have any other notions at the moment on the markets. I shouldn't have posted anything, but it was too weird for me to resist sharing.
Did you see where Comrade Rally Monkey called top wednesday?
It will be interesting to see if he will be stacked on the pyre with the rest of the bears.
re: Buttonwood,
Summers was late, probably slept in
Bair had a speech with a lot of forward looking proposals that the FDIC will not release to the public. something's afoot with her
NOTaREALmerican (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/16/2009 - 1:36 pm
True, but NOT looting by the honest hardworkin pillars of Merica society, the people that made this country what it is today. Not like those WELFARE QUEENS THAT LIVE OFF MY HARD EARN TAX MONEY.
Right on! Political maneuvering, price gouging, overpromising and underdelivering are cornerstones of an upwardly mobile middle-class. Where would we be without that contribution?
azurite wrote:
There's also the problem of knowing WHAT to look for. The internet is useless unless you already know enough about a topic to filter out the garbage.
H1 news from ap...
Yahoo! 404 - Page Not Found
I might have a stock play for this...and its not sva or nvax
Finally someone is speaking out...watch Kaptur and Johnson video..great stuff
Bill Moyers Journal . Watch & Listen | PBS
scone, hell no.
Back to agriculture and plant science mode.
So what say ye, commentariat?
Does Summers intend to be taken seriously, and is therefore warning of an imminent withdrawal of bank suppport, or is he merely a gasbag serving up the same tired "regulatory reform" mantra warmed-up in the microwave and slapped on a paper plate?
NOTaREALmerican (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Fri, 10/16/2009 - 1:41 pm
There's also the problem of knowing WHAT to look for. The internet is useless unless you already know enough about a topic to filter out the garbage.
Not merely useless. Disinformational. In some cases you are better off being ignorant and relying on common sense reasoning. More of the joys of living the propaganda (oops, I mean information) society.
black dog,
That's just it, I've been wrong on my last prediction. I said 1st week of August would be the effective top, and so long as you could hold on for a 10% buffer, 20% to be extra safe, over the next 6 months that you would preside over at least a 20% fall in equities/gain in the USD (for a brief period on the latter)
Harder to quantify as one guy could knock up 20 or 30 girls,
And maybe that's the news people should be reading. All the reporter would have to do is check the birth certificates, see who got written in as the father (state wants to know who the dad is, try to get some child support payments), or could ask the mothers. Do some real investigative reporting.
because of this prehaps?
Forbes.com File Not Found
Live by the
, die by the 
!!!!
Ask what your country can do for you, not what you can do for your country.
I'll wager the banksters sleep at night with visions of Sheila's LOC with the Treasury dancing in their dreams.
azurite wrote:
It's natural to excuse the wild 5th appendage, as long as it used in the correct positions. Fornication Harlots are also historical viewed as corrupting. Probably another evolutionary response.
Juvenal Delinquent wrote:
Yesterday, Yogi was unhappy with one of my posts because it did not contain double irony.
We all just have to work harder!
Tarzan,
Check this out:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1194891/Pensioners-kidnap-financial-adviser-lost-2m-batter-Zimmer-frames.html
Jonathan wrote:
Wow, that poor poor man. The humiliation he had to endure.
uffda
record
Summers is a funny guy. He was one of the chief architects of deregulation in the 2nd clinton cabinet that got us into this mess and is described as an inflationista by the well connected, and now he wants to preach to the choir of of his fellow wall street lowlifes?
I was reading this morning of celebrities defending that rapist Polanski - they must think he's a banker.
rosethorn wrote:
The masses don't read. If you want to hide something from the American people put it on the front page of the NY Times or Washington Post.
Blah, blah, blah. It's just words. Summers should not be anywhere near cleaning up this mess, having been one that helped create it. I'll believe the Obama administration when they actually do something, but I'm not holding my breath.
noob goldberg wrote:
How else will you know where to call in the airstrike?
Rob Dawg wrote:
No, it's about not being a Born-and-Bred 'Merican cockroach.
Are you reaching out to them?