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IOUs.. What do we owe anyway? and to whom? what good is an IOU if you cannot collect it?
Hasta la vista, baby!
I bet he wishes he'd never given up acting.
He could act?
//I bet he wishes he'd never given up acting.//
Hey, who stomped on all the Green Shoots?
Interesting times we live in... California is debating cutting health care for low-income kids. Citi bankers get a 50% pay raise.
Now California state workers can scrach their asses and be useless at home one more day a month instead of coming into the office and doing it at taxpayer expense.
You mean those painted brown shoots?
//Hey, who stomped on all the Green Shoots?//
Tinfioil hat firmly in place, but if this really goes through (CA IOUs backstopped by the USGOV), what sort of craziness breaks out?
I WILL quit my job if I can live at equal better means by living on the dole.
That saddens me I can't or want to rely on my skills in the labor market to make someone money.
Buy they are not people! Only banksters are people.
//California is debating cutting health care for low-income kids.//
Too many want too much for doing too little. The balance of payments will be settled in I-owe-you's which may or may not have any intrinsic worth. And at this point, the present situation transforms into a moral conundrum. Which, to those without a conscience, means the problem goes away.
And a headache too...
YouTube - "It might be a tumor"
Interesting times we live in... California is debating cutting health care for low-income kids. Citi bankers get a 50% pay raise.
Solution is self-evident: Hire the low-income kids as Citi bankers.
They might do a better job...
Maybe the low-income parents of low-income kids should get their friggin' tubes tied.
I heard today that Madoff did not pay employees' state and federal taxes. Is that true? I also heard that Madoff has pancreatic cancer. Is that true? After following this blog for almost a year, I think someone here knows the answers to these questions. Kind regards.
They did not get the memo on green shoots.. damm!
Australia’s Trade Deficit Widens as Exports Drop (Update1)
Australia’s Trade Deficit Widens as Coal Exports Drop (Update2) - Bloomberg.com
By Victoria Batchelor
July 2 (Bloomberg) -- Australia’s trade deficit widened in May by more than economists estimated as exports of coal, wheat and natural gas fell.
The shortfall was A$556 million ($448 million) compared with a revised A$282 million deficit in April, the Bureau of Statistics said in Sydney today. The median estimate in a Bloomberg News survey of 20 economists was for a A$125 million gap.
Cool; that YouTube URL has "BANk" in it.
Coincidence?
Are California IOU's considered good enough collateral for the Discount Window? If so, I think Arnie just figured out how to print his own currency.
I know about a famous expat austrian that had similar ideas.
//Maybe the low-income parents of low-income kids should get their friggin' tubes tied.//
The depression will not be televised but it will be blogged in better than real time.
We can still avoid a depression but the last four years have been such a complete abandonment of all the things that made us and kept us that I hold out little hope that the hands off policy necessary to avoid a depression can be enforced.
Get to the choppa.....quiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiick!!!!!!
WASHINGTON (AP) -- California Sen. Dianne Feinstein said Wednesday that she has asked for federal assistance to refill food banks in the state's agricultural regions to respond to a massive increase in demand.
She blamed three years of below-normal precipitation in California, which has led to fallowed fields, and a high unemployment in many Central Valley communities. The jobless rate has been as high as 40 percent in some areas.
In a letter sent Tuesday to Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack, the California Democrat said the problem is worst in Fresno County, where more than 450,000 acres of farmland may be affected by water cutbacks.
"Annual crop fields have been fallowed, tree orchards have been plowed under, and those that remain are being given the bare minimum of water," Feinstein said in her letter.
Fresno County food banks need another 4 million pounds per month just to meet the existing need, she said.
Wells Fargo California jumbo mortgage portfolio is considered to be good collateral.
//Are California IOU's considered good enough collateral for the Discount Window?//
She blamed three years of below-normal precipitation in California, which has led to fallowed fields,
Return of the Dust Bowl
dawg youve really gotten more downbeat as of late. Im trying hard to be more optimistic even while i get ready to load up some shorts. The second half looks bad based on budget cuts, etc, and comm construction trends piling on top of residential. Whats ur take on biz cap investment? Must be uglier than Mine. Im sure we agree the consumer is toast.
So what about those captains of finance that are being bailed out with 13.9 Trillion? or the doctors who make 4 times what their german counterparts make?
//Maybe the low-income parents of low-income kids should get their friggin' tubes tied.//
We can still avoid a depression but the last four years have been such a complete abandonment of all the things that made us and kept us that I hold out little hope that the hands off policy necessary to avoid a depression can be enforced.
The triumph of (little) hope over experience.
Currently they are both equally useless.
//The triumph of (little) hope over experience.//
JP
You think Feinstein is going to tell the truth ?
That :
We have a broken economic model and that people are starving
while GS brokers are getting record bonuses ...
Someone needs to acquire the IOUs at a discount and bundle them into some sort of investment.
Someone needs to acquire the IOUs at a discount and bundle them into some sort of investment.
I think it has already been mentioned here: Securitized bondage for bear chits.
countrywide was actually in calabasas (and originally pasadena). what to do with the 'venco' glossary entry?
GS must be working on that one!
//Someone needs to acquire the IOUs at a discount and bundle them into some sort of investment.//
Naturally...
Philadelphia's Foreclosure Prevention Program Is Mandatory For Banks -- Unlike Obama's Making Home Affordable
Philadelphia's Foreclosure Prevention Program Is Mandatory For Banks -- Unlike Obama's Making Home Affordable
Obama is doing what the banksters tell him to do ...
Guranteed 20 mil for the autobiography ...
Hey, I have a totally original idea!
California should issue IOUs that are only redeemable for more IOUs.
Happy Days.. again!
Wall Street Pay Approaches 2007's Records: Comeback in Compensation So Far This Year Shows How Hard It Is to Break Old Habits
Big Pay Packages Return to Wall Street - WSJ.com
By AARON LUCCHETTI
Business is back on Wall Street. If the good times continue to roll, lofty pay packages may be set for a comeback as well.
Based on analysts' earnings forecasts for 2009, Goldman Sachs Group Inc. is on track to pay out as much as $20 billion this year, or about $700,000 per employee. That would be nearly double the firm's $363,000 average last year, and slightly higher than the $661,000 for the average Goldman employee in fiscal 2007, according to analyst estimates reviewed by The Wall Street Journal.
Like the US treasury?
//California should issue IOUs that are only redeemable for more IOUs.//
How about California invests in some of WFC loans with scrip or just buy a bank outright?
This won't help, either.
Home - San Jose Mercury News
Doomsite DollarCollapse - Your ringside seat for the global financial crisis collection of the Best of doom site and MSM news. One stop Dooming
Those captains should have had their ships impounded and dismantled for creating systemic risk...that used to be the law...actually, I think it still is.
//So what about those captains of finance that are being bailed out with 13.9 Trillion?//
Sorta serious question: How do IOUs skirt the "states shall not issue currency" part of the constitution?
If the "registered warrants" are tradeable, then is this not defacto issuance?
Kneale is reading CR?
Dennis Kneale Freaks Out At "Dickweed" Blogger Critics In Epic Rant (VIDEO)
Dennis Kneale Freaks Out At "Dickweed" Blogger Critics In Epic Rant (VIDEO)
Huffington Post | Nicholas Graham
Via Gawker comes this fantastic rant from CNBC host Dennis Kneale in which he rails against his "cowardly," "dickweed" blogger critics who made fun of him for basically declaring that the recession is over. Kneale is offended that these "mean-spirited bloggers" would be "jeering" at his optimism from the "dark and cozy safety of their mothers' basements," and invites them to come on and hash it out with him. One of Kneale's critics from Annuity IQ takes him up on the offer and calls into the show, although he's not given much time by the host. Kneale is not completely without sense of humor though. He acknowledges bloggers pegging him as "Beaker," from the Muppets, is "pretty funny." The whole thing is great, and you can just feel PR advisers everywhere cringing as Kneale picks a fight that he can't possibly win
GS must be working on that one!
3x ETF with lots of volatility premium.
GDD9000 (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 7:17 pm
dawg youve really gotten more downbeat as of late. Im trying hard to be more optimistic even while i get ready to load up some shorts. The second half looks bad based on budget cuts, etc, and comm construction trends piling on top of residential. Whats ur take on biz cap investment? Must be uglier than Mine. Im sure we agree the consumer is toast.
I see an investor strike. No one escapes. You are right about my recent negativism. If you remember my evolving positions you know I've always been a rip the bandaid off advocate and I have never gotten satisfaction on that one point.
There oughta be a law. My point has always been "There is."
"jeering" at his optimism
The thing is, Kneale's form of optimism is what most people would characterize as a personality defect.
what about bonds? same deal< they"re not legal tender>
How do IOUs skirt the "states shall not issue currency" part of the constitution?
If the "registered warrants" are tradeable, then is this not defacto issuance?
General obligation bonds are IOUs that are traded, but no one considers them currency. Generally, a "bill of credit" is only unconstitutional if backed only by the full faith and credit of the issuing state. In this case, the scrip is actually backed by FRN and interest... Likewise GO bonds are backed by the taxing authority, and other bonds are backed by specific sources of revenue (e.g. tolls).
Bond Girl:
I think that you can use Cali IOU warrants to pay Cali taxes. ADP and Paychex should explore buying a slug of them at a discount and then use them to pay the payroll taxes that they are processing.
Article 4. Payment - Sections 17270-17280.2 - California Government Code - California Code :: Justia
Now, I just need the city and county of San Francisco to accept them as payment for property and payroll taxes.
Financial Commission Unmanned: Both Dems, GOP Have Yet To Nominate A Single Person
News Archive - TheHill.com
They are looking hard for people who will lie through their teeth to vindicate the banksters ...
working 4 days a week with good benefits.... Kinda like France but without the goofy accents....
People usually don't like to commit suicide.
//Financial Commission Unmanned: Both Dems, GOP Have Yet To Nominate A Single Person//
B2 - what is FRN?
Save that link to the Kneale video. Should be amusing to revisit in six months or so.
Why is AIG still publicly traded?
AIG shares fall over 20% in premarket
AIG shares fall over 20% in premarket - MarketWatch
BOSTON (MarketWatch) -- Shares of American International Group Inc. (AIG 18.15, +0.07, +0.39%) were down more than 20% in premarket trading Wednesday after shareholders approved a proposal Tuesday to effect a 1-for-20 reverse stock split.
Lucifer
People usually don't like to commit suicide.
//Financial Commission Unmanned: Both Dems, GOP Have Yet To Nominate A Single Person//
~~~~
If they vindicate GS will put them on the payroll ...
Financial Exorcism.. The power of the (rigged) free market compels you!
//Save that link to the Kneale video. Should be amusing to revisit in six months or so.//
federal reserve notes
Nominations for the Financial Commission, people? Careful now, you don't want excellent bloggers being taken away from their vocation...
So I'd nominate Roubini, Markopolos, Lahde, just to get the first roll of the dice happening.
C
Thanks... That was like the fifth answer for wiki but I wasnt sure (And didnt know that for that matter
)
Lahde - LOL
What ever happened to him (Lahde)?
What about EHP?
we need a snarky glossary entry for that one...
Nominations for the Financial Commission, people?
Dennis Kneale is an obvious choice ...
He'll do the 'right thing' ...
someone mentioned today that 51% of workers are employed by government. is this close to the truth?
"about 14 percent] pay cut for state workers ..."
More green chutes. Very inflationary, and rocket fuel for the CA housing recovery.
General obligation bonds are IOUs that are traded, but no one considers them currency.
Again, why is that?
I guess my question must be answered by: What is the legal definition of currency?
"someone mentioned today that 51% of workers are employed by government. is this close to the truth?"
~~~~
who would that be ?
Now I'm really confused: From the constitution--
No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts;
From the constitional dictionary: Bill of credit
A bill of credit is some sort of paper medium by which value is exchanged between the government and individuals. Money is a bill of credit, but a bill of credit need not be money. An interest-bearing certificate that was issued by Missouri, and usable in the payment of taxes, was thus ruled to be an unconstitutional bill of credit.
The Constitutional Dictionary - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net
JP, did you understand the rest of the reply, the part about "bills of credit" and "full faith and credit"?
JP, did you understand the rest of the reply, the part about "full faith and credit"?
No, I guess not on second thought. I don't know why "full faith and credit" changes the meaning legally.
Interesting concept..
//"full faith and credit"//
Recently I have been a man of little faith....
I guess I'm wondering why Missouri's IOUs are unconstitutional... what legal tripwire did they trigger?
"full faith and credit" = fiat: the paper has value because i say it does.
Glad I got the hell outta CA. When housing in South Central start going for 1/2mm I knew the fuse was lit. It's on the verge of total collapse.
Let those rascals from Maxine's home turf of Compton run the show...
Lucifer
Interesting concept..
//"full faith and credit"//
~~~~~
Should Read :
Tax Payer by the Balls ...
Maybe the "useable in payment of taxes" is the catch phrase. If the IOU is accepted "as payable for a debt public or private" it forces the Govt into a bilateral agreeement for a parallel currecy
Maybe we should use Chuck E. Cheese tokens. They have some value.
It would only be acceptable on Cali taxes and state public debt as I understand it.... not Federal....
This is US Supreme Court case that JP referenced above.
CRAIG V. MISSOURI, 29 U. S. 410 (1830)
What is a bill of credit? What did the Constitution mean to forbid?
In its enlarged, and perhaps its literal sense, the term "bill of credit" may comprehend any instrument by which a state engages to pay money at a future day, thus including a certificate given for money borrowed. But the language of the Constitution itself, and the mischief to be prevented, which we know from the history of our country, equally limit the interpretation of the terms. The word "emit," is never employed in describing those contracts by which a state binds itself to pay money at a future day for services actually received, or for money borrowed for present use; nor are instruments executed for such purposes, in common language, denominated "bills of credit." To "emit bills of credit" conveys to the mind the idea of issuing paper intended to circulate through the community for its ordinary purposes, as money, which paper is redeemable at a future day. This is the sense in which the terms have been always understood.
The last sentence is the key.
Basel Too
"full faith and credit" = fiat: the paper has value because i say it does.
~~~
No because they say it does and they have the courts and the sheriffs to back it up ...
Overseas they have the Navy and the Marines ... and they have used them often ...
"full faith and credit" = fiat: the paper has value because i say it does.
Basel: Sorry for being dense.
Pretend we are pre 1971, so the gold standard still exists. The dollar is backed by the full faith and credit of the US, yet it is not fiat.
So again, I don't understand how that statement changes the legal standing of state IOUs vs FRNs.
Especially in the case where the state is declaring the rate of interest on the IOU, it looks like it has issued a "Bill of Credit" and has determined the value.
Now, I'm not a lawyer, so I suspect that I have tripped across a term of art (otherwise, general obligation bonds are also forbidden as you point out.)
This is a good reference:
CRS/LII Annotated Constitution Article I
Within the sense of the Constitution, bills of credit signify a paper medium of exchange, intended to circulate between individuals, and between the Government and individuals, for the ordinary purposes of society. It is immaterial whether the quality of legal tender is imparted to such paper. Interest bearing certificates, in denominations not exceeding ten dollars, which were issued by loan offices established by the State of Missouri and made receivable in payment of taxes or other moneys due to the State, and in payment of the fees and salaries of state officers, were held to be bills of credit whose issuance was banned by this section.1802 The States are not forbidden, however, to issue coupons receivable for taxes,1803 nor to execute instruments binding themselves to pay money at a future day for services rendered or money borrowed.1804 Bills issued by state banks are not bills of credit;1805 it is immaterial that the State is the sole stockholder of the bank,1806 that the officers of the bank were elected by the state legislature,1807 or that the capital of the bank was raised by the sale of state bonds.1808
Aha. Our posts crossed.
Thank you for the Missouri citation. That does help wrap my head around it.
Cali IOU maybe it can be viewed more as a call option with only one strike price
btw are you a lawyer or in the field?
studying for the bar...
Basel Too
Can't the state become a bank and loan itself the money ?
Banks create money out of thin air don't they ?
Maybe the "useable in payment of taxes" is the catch phrase. If the IOU is accepted "as payable for a debt public or private" it forces the Govt into a bilateral agreeement for a parallel currecy
Cali is sidestepping this "useable in payment of taxes" clause by requiring tax payers to give them a check for money owed, but promising not to cash it until the warrants are paid off.
I am not convinced that they won't just cash the checks by accident or on purpose. Cali tax processors have screwed up our payroll tax deposits one month in each of the last three years. There are only two employees, payroll is paid monthly, and EDD can't put the deposits in the correct account for the correct month.
Bozos.
But Governor, You Can Create Money! Just Form Your Own Bank
Ellen Brown: But Governor, You Can Create Money! Just Form Your Own Bank
Can't the state become a bank and loan itself the money ?
US Supreme Court
Darrington v. Bank of Alabama
The bills of a banking corporation, which has corporate property, are not bills of credit within the meaning of the Constitution, although the state which created the bank is the only stockholder, and pledges its faith for the ultimate redemption of the bills.
That video of Dennis is great.
He doesn't remind me of beaker (beaker is cute) but there is something just smarmy about him. All the sincerity of Billy Mayes trying to meet his quota 3 hrs before the bill is due. He's the guy you'll accept a drink from in bar, down it fast, then leave before he can walk over to your seat because if he does talk you, you're afraid it will rub off on you somehow and there isn't enough soap or a scrub brush harsh enough to get clean again.
Damn that just described the entire CNBC daytime male cast.
/shudders
I don't know who people can watch that show.
Banks create money out of thin air don't they ?
digital entry cratchit
studying for the bar...
Then why the hell are you posting here... Get back to work!
Seriously, thanks for the links, esp the cornell annotated version. (IANAL, but I like to read and understand such things.)
Professor Basel Too! (Good stuff and thanks!
)
Sometimes the most effective way to study is to
teach someone else
Basel Too
"But the state can create its own money. After all, banks do this every day. Certified, card-carrying bankers are allowed to do something nobody else can do: they can create "credit" with accounting entries on their books. As the Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas explains on its website:
Banks actually create money when they lend it. Here's how it works: Most of a bank's loans are made to its own customers and are deposited in their checking accounts. Because the loan becomes a new deposit, just like a paycheck does, the bank...holds a small percentage of that new amount in reserve and again lends the remainder to someone else, repeating the money-creation process many times.
President Obama has also acknowledged that banks create money, through what he calls the "multiplier effect." In a speech at Georgetown University on April 14, he said:
[A]lthough there are a lot of Americans who understandably think that government money would be better spent going directly to families and businesses instead of banks -- "where's our bailout?" they ask -- the truth is that a dollar of capital in a bank can actually result in eight or ten dollars of loans to families and businesses, a multiplier effect that can ultimately lead to a faster pace of economic growth.
Money in a government-owned bank could give us the best of both worlds. We could have all the credit-generating advantages of private banks, without the baggage cluttering up the books of the Wall Street giants, including bad derivatives bets, unmarketable collateralized debt obligations, mark to market accounting issues, oversized CEO salaries and bonuses, and shareholders expecting a sizeable cut of the profits. "
Kneale saw that being obstinately wrong worked for both Cramer and Kudlow and sadly thought lightning could strike him too.
But the state can create its own money.
For your post: The Fed definition of Money is not the same as Currency. The total amount of Currency in circulation can be constant and yet the total amount of Money can be changing at the same time.
Uh oh, M3 vigilantes approaching...
C
Is Kneale flashing gang signs in that video? westside! ! ! !
JP
But the state can create its own money.
For your post: The Fed definition of Money is not the same as Currency. The total amount of Currency in circulation can be constant and yet the total amount of Money can be changing at the same time.
~~~
Your point being what?
Ug that Missouri item has devils in its details.
"Ten dollars" in 1800 was what, $1K today? So Ole Miss issued bills that were "intended to circulate" in large denominations with a denoted interest rate. This is unconstitutional because:
a. They were intended to circulate
b. The denominations were not large enough
c. An interest rate was denoted.
or some combination or I missed the right one?
Very strange, and probably too subtle for me to sort out tonight...
Why ask state employees to take unpaid furlough when they can be given IOUs as well??
I wonder at what discount these IOUs will trade at?
BTW, sm_landlord asked yesterday about Mill Valley houses - here's an especially gruesome version of a blinged-out update:
160 Rose Ave, Mill Valley, CA 94941
PS, it's in foreclosure...
under federal law, state employees can't be paid in warrants.
edited: can't be paid with registered warrants. can be paid in regular warrants, with the difference being that regular warrants can be redeemed immediately.
REBear (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 8:28 pm
I wonder at what discount these IOUs will trade at?
I'm thinking of opening a chain of CA Payday warrant cashing storefronts. A boost to CRE and the State all in one. Opening bid; 93.50.
Basel Too
And what about California establishing its own bank ?
mmckinl:
creating a bank isn't going to magically put $24B in California's bank account. Even with fractional lending and the ability to "create" money, only the Fed can put money into the system without a corresponding balance sheet entry.
Basel Too
"North Dakota boasts the only state-owned bank in the nation. The Bank of North Dakota (BND) was established by the state legislature in 1919 specifically to free farmers and small businessmen from the clutches of out-of-state bankers and railroad men. The bank's stated mission is to deliver sound financial services that promote agriculture, commerce and industry in North Dakota. By law, the state must deposit all its funds in the bank, which pays a competitive interest rate to the state treasurer. The state rather than the FDIC guarantees the bank's deposits, which are plowed back into the state in the form of loans. The bank's return on equity is about 25%, and it pays a hefty dividend to the state, which is expected to exceed $60 million this year. In the last decade, the BND has turned back a third of a trillion dollars to the state's general fund, offsetting taxes. The former president of the BND is now the state's governor."
Wouldn't this work for California ?
Bulimics have their cake and eat it too.
Basel Too
mmckinl:
creating a bank isn't going to magically put $24B in California's bank account. Even with fractional lending and the ability to "create" money, only the Fed can put money into the system without a corresponding balance sheet entry.
~~~~~
$10 Billion in seed money from CALPERS would do the trick ...
$10 Billion x 9 is $90 Billion !
Wouldn't this work for California ?
No.
Folks in North Dakota are sane.
Californians only elect bozos, freaks, and fruit-loops to elective office. They would run the best thought out scheme into the ground within 3 election cycles.
The solution's obvious, privatize the entire state sector, with each entity created as a BHC with a common dark pool trading platform. Then they can all bootstrap their way to astonishing wealth through programme trades and derivatives. All employees become shareholders and are paid out of divvy. Surefire winner.
C
FUBAR and WASS LLC
Wouldn't this work for California ?
No.
Folks in North Dakota are sane.
Californians only elect bozos, freaks, and fruit-loops to elective office. They would run the best thought out scheme into the ground within 3 election cycles.
~~~~~
LOL!
In other words it is completely feasible ...
The banksters just don't want people to find out about it ...
If California can start its own bank and create money, then why didn't it think of that before, instead of issuing bonds? Isn't it silly to pay interest on long-term municipals when all the state had to do is borrow from itself? And how does California pay off its new debt to itself? In fact, under this theory, every underwater homeowner should start a bank, borrow $250,000 to pay off the mortgage, and live happily ever after.
CALPERS is already fully committed to a variety of private equity, real estate, and alternative investment deals.
When contemplating CALPERS liquidity situation, think Harvard endowment on a massive scale, but less transparency.
WASS
I f any of you plan to move to a rural area get ready for culture shock.The meaning of words can be quite different.Two examples,a "Leatherman" is a combination tool frequently carried in a belt pouch.And if you see bumper stickers saying "FFA" it refers to "Future Farmers"....
Not fists.
Dennis Kneale: As unsightly as Bill Murray, and half as smart.
FUBAR and WASS LLC (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 8:47 pm
* reply
* Ignore user
CALPERS is already fully committed to a variety of private equity, real estate, and alternative investment deals.
When contemplating CALPERS liquidity situation, think Harvard endowment on a massive scale, but less transparency.
WASS
~~~~
But it is CALPERS interest to fund California's own state bank ...
CALSTERS as well ...
Piece of cake ...
Probably working on it right now ... !
Two examples,a "Leatherman" is a combination tool frequently carried in a belt pouch.
Hell, you don't need to travel to a farm. Just visit your local IT dept, and I guarantee they'll use the same language.
sdtfs (profile) wrote (in reply to...) on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 11:00 pm reply Ignore user Maybe we should use Chuck E. Cheese tokens. They have some value.
They're gold, they jingle, and you use them to earn tickets to buy cheap Chinese merchandise. What could be more fitting?
(full disclosure: I have a lot of Chuck E. Cheese tokens hanging around the house)
Counterpointer (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 10:43 pm
The solution's obvious, privatize the entire state sector, with each entity created as a BHC with a common dark pool trading platform. Then they can all bootstrap their way to astonishing wealth through programme trades and derivatives. All employees become shareholders and are paid out of divvy. Surefire winner.
C
LOL. Pay future pension obligations out in municipal bonds. If the state does well, so do they. If the state collapses, their bonds are worthless paper. It's better to have a chance at something than a guaranteed nothing. You'd better be either one hell of a brilliant criminal or thinking long-term if the value of your retirement depends on the health of the state that's paying it.
mmckinl. You mistake money creation with naked printing.
Assume a 10% reserve requirement and $10B seed.
1: Assets $9B Loan to Cali + $1B Cash || Liabilities $10B deposits from CalPERS
2. California pays out the $9B to workers, who then deposits into the bank.
3. Assets $9B L1 + $1B Cash || Liabilities $10B CalPERS + $9B Depositors [$19B].
4. California borrows another $8.1B
5. Assets $17.1B Loans to Calif + $1.9B Cash || $19B Deposits.
6. Rinse and Repeat. In the end, California just owes a lot of money to its depositors/creditors, which is the exact same situation Cali's in right now.
the only entity that can place money on one side of the balance sheet and not the other is the Fed.
We have consensus.
Instead of those boring IOUs, California should just circulate Chuck E. Cheese tokens. You know, temporarily. Until they can replace them with real jing.
Someone call the governor.
Basel Too (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 8:54 pm
Very wrong ....
California would own the bank and the interest would be repatriated less operating costs ...
California would own the bank and the interest would be repatriated less operating costs ...
The operating cost would include every bit of capital that could be raised, borrowed, or stolen to be invested in the bank and then lent for every hair-brained scheme and politically correct fantasy the politicians and lobbyists in Sacramento could dream up. If they didn't waste it all, we would have a referendum to piss away the rest.
Wal Mart in on Government in Health Care !
"Corporate America's cheerleading for more government involvement in health care now includes Wal-Mart, that liberal paragon of social irresponsibility. The discount giant's ex-critics probably ought to be more skeptical, given that this seems to be anticompetitive special pleading in progressive drag.
This week the nation's largest employer blessed an employer mandate, aka "pay or play." This would require businesses that do not offer "meaningful coverage" -- i.e., government-approved -- to pay some percentage of their payroll to a federal insurance plan. This mandate is one of the more controversial policies in the Democratic health package, and Wal-Mart's endorsement will help it along, or at least give liberals political cover against business criticism."
Everyday Low Politics - WSJ.com
Now if they would just make the IOU's eligable for the payment of taxes and state run services they wouldnt have a budget problem. The state would be the sole issuer of the "currency" and the publics net savings of IOU's would be exactly equal to the state's deficit of IOU's.
I quite like monetary history and here's what was happening in the early 1850's, in California...
One of the items not brought to California during the gold rush was money (there were no Federal Banknotes until 1860) and it became a natural for private assayers to mint their own gold coins in the denomination of mostly $5 & $10, which looked an awful lot like Federal gold coinage.
There were about a dozen private mints operating in the San Francisco area, and somebody did an assay on various coins, and found that some contained 10-15% less gold than Federal Issues, and nobody would accept them anymore and most were melted down. (some are worth many hundreds of thousands of dollars today)
Today, nobody gives a damn that it costs a dime to print a $100 banknote...
Feds could seize Calif. parks if closed by budget
Yahoo! 404 - Page Not Found
The sites are Angel Island, a former federal military and immigration facility in San Francisco Bay; the top of Mount Diablo east of San Francisco, where the Navy once operated a microwave relay station; Point Sur State Historic Park in coastal Big Sur; and three beaches — Fort Ord Dunes near Monterey, Point Mugu State Park near Malibu, and Border Fields along the Mexican border.
FUBAR and WASS LLC (
California would own the bank and the interest would be repatriated less operating costs ...
The operating cost would include every bit of capital that could be raised, borrowed, or stolen to be invested in the bank and then lent for every hair-brained scheme and politically correct fantasy the politicians and lobbyists in Sacramento could dream up. If they didn't waste it all, we would have a referendum to piss away the rest.
~~~~
LOL ... desperate times require deperate measures eh FUBAR ?
The bank would have to follow strict operational procedures just like any other bank ...
or they would be taken over .... right ?
Here playing a little pokerstars, catching the "early" overnight threads.
California National Parks will be quite the mob scene if 220 California State Parks are closed.
The funnel effect...
Feds could seize Calif. parks if closed by budget
~~~~
The Feds could shove a beehive up their own butt ...
but I wouldn't bet on it ...
Change in NonFarm Payrolls at this point is totally dependent on the B/D model. The survey is -365K, but who knows how to factor in B/D.
The unemployment rate is estimated at 9.6%, only a jump of 0.2%. I can't see it dropping, and staying flat or only up 0.1% is unlikely as well, that could be worse than expected.
not sure what the estimate is on U6, which is the one that mostly counts.
The estimate on continuing claims is 6740K, but again that number is useless, as it only measures those collecting state unemployment checks, not those collecting extended benefits, not those who have run out of benefits, etc.
the interesting number could be average weekly hours. the estimate is for no change, but I can easily see that dropping.
Yeah.....lets have the miscreants in California Government run a bank. Makes total sense to me. This sounds like a 70s toga party with the smoke, wine, and "Lets Save The World From The Evil Establishment" all-night talkathon. Jeeminy - I'm going to bed.
Black Star Ranch
Any bank run by the state of California is going to be under unbelievable scrutiny ...
The banksters will make sure of that ...
GS will probably try to bankrupt the bank tho ...
obviously, the 'gold or silver' part in the original language was there for a reason. when that was tossed, the entire clause became a meaningless joke all more or less ignore... kind of like how the 4th amendment is treated as a total joke and the way that W reduced 800 years of habeus corpus common law to a thing of the past.
So what are the chances my SPY Sep 50 puts (currently marked at 0.02) get a decent spike before expiration?
jp,what does FFA stand for in IP lingo?,not future farmers,surely.
Hollywood, California issued gold coins within the past 20 years. They appear on ebay from time to time.
As for habeas corpus, it still exists. W is but a deposed tyrant at this point.
This is great for the many burdened by student loans and dismal job prospects.
"First, a new Income-Based Repayment program takes effect that allows borrowers to cap their monthly loan payments at just 15 percent of their income, based on their family size. Any current or future borrower whose student loan payment exceeds 15 percent of their discretionary income is eligible. After 25 years in the program, borrowers' remaining student loan debts will be completely forgiven."
Rep. George Miller: New Benefits Make Student Loan Repayment More Manageable and Affordable for Millions
"July 2 (Bloomberg) -- The dollar rose from a three-week low against the euro and erased losses versus the yen after a Chinese official said he was “not aware” of a plan to discuss a new reserve currency at a Group of Eight meeting ..."
California gold:
http://cgi.ebay.com/1986-California-Gold-1-2-ounce-Gold-Grizzly-Bear-coin_W0QQitemZ350218043202QQcmdZViewItemQQptZCoins_Bullion?hash=item518a9f3f42&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12%7C66%3A2%7C39%3A1%7C72%3A1205%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50#ebayphotohosting
Habeas corpus:
Hamdi v. Rumsfeld, 542 U.S. 507 (2004),
Hamdan v. Rumsfeld, 548 U.S. 557 (2006),
Boumediene v. Bush, 553 U.S. ___ (2008)
Want to buy some?
Auto Task Force Adviser Wilson Sees General Motors IPO in 2010
Auto Task Force Adviser Wilson Sees General Motors IPO in 2010 - Bloomberg.com
By Christopher Scinta
July 2 (Bloomberg) -- General Motors Corp., the bankrupt automaker selling most of its assets to the U.S. government, may file for an initial public offering of its stock in 2010, said an adviser to the Obama Administration’s auto task force. GM was in bankruptcy court yesterday seeking approval to sell most of its assets to the Treasury, which is paying for the company with the more than $27 billion in loans it has made to the automaker.
IBRinfo :: Help is here!
IBRinfo :: IBR Calculator
Medicare Plans to Cut Specialists' Payments
Medicare Plans to Cut Specialists' Payments - WSJ.com
By JANE ZHANG
WASHINGTON -- The Obama administration said Wednesday that it plans to cut Medicare payments for imaging services and specialists, and will use the savings to increase payments to physicians providing primary care. Under the proposal, Medicare would put specialists' payments for evaluating and managing illnesses on par with those of primary-care physicians starting in January. That, combined with other changes, would boost payments to internists, family physicians, general practitioners and geriatric specialists by 6% to 8% next year, said the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, the agency that manages Medicare, the federal insurance program for the elderly and disabled.
Lucifer (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 11:55 pm
Medicare Plans to Cut Specialists' Payments
Medicare Plans to Cut Specialists' Payments - WSJ.com
Clearly inflationary. I'm not gonna cry many tears as we watch this sector deflate.
the commemorative coins are irrelevant to my point (all of the us mint bullion is low-ball actual currency, btw)... and you forgot padilla if you're doing a proper autopsy
Dean Baker ...
Banks Own the US Government
There are smart ways to raise money and regulate the market, but Wall Street is working to kill any meaningful financial reform ...
...
"This is why it was so encouraging to see congressman Peter DeFazio's proposal to tax trades in oil options and futures. DeFazio proposed a tax of 0.02% on trades in oil futures and options as a way to make up a shortfall in the federal government's highway trust fund. This tax could raise billions of dollars each year in revenue and make speculation in the oil market a more dangerous affair.
The logic is very simple. For someone using these markets to hedge, the tax will be inconsequential. For example, a farmer that hedges a $400,000 wheat crop will pay $80 when selling a future. Similarly, airlines that hedge by buying oil futures will barely notice the higher cost. In fact, because trading costs have fallen so much in recent decades, a tax at this level would just be raising costs back to their levels of two decades ago, a point at which there was already a very vibrant futures and options market."
Medicare Plans to Cut Specialists' Payments
mmckinl,
Nice how the government exercises price controls on medicine with no regard to true costs and/or value, eh?
yes.. we spent all this money to get the best care in the world.. right?
//Nice how the government exercises price controls on medicine with no regard to true costs and/or value, eh?//
ResistanceIsFeudal (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 9:57 pm
Lucifer (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 11:55 pm
Medicare Plans to Cut Specialists' Payments
Medicare Plans to Cut Specialists' Payments - WSJ.com
Clearly inflationary. I'm not gonna cry many tears as we watch this sector deflate.
Deflate? Medicare Part B reimbursements in some cases 30% below the last schedule's already reduced rates? Nursing homes are just not going to render services under those terms. Welcome to Obamacare.
I suggest that we liquidate those who want to hold on to old models.
//Nursing homes are just not going to render services under those terms. //
TJ and The Bear
Medicare Plans to Cut Specialists' Payments
mmckinl,
Nice how the government exercises price controls on medicine with no regard to true costs and/or value, eh?
~~~
Until records are shared and best practices are discovered this is the kind of savings you get ...arbitrary ...
That's why we need Single Payer ... consolidation of records and outcomes leading to best practice ...
mmckinl,
Medicare is single payer, and nobody would ever accuse it of exercising "best practices".
Rob Dawg (homepage, profile) wrote on Thu, 7/2/2009 - 12:31 am
Deflate? Medicare Part B reimbursements in some cases 30% below the last schedule's already reduced rates? Nursing homes are just not going to render services under those terms. Welcome to Obamacare.
Obamacare is sounding more and more like natural selection. Then again that falls right in line with the elite agenda, too. Soylent Green Shoots.
I still welcome deflation in the health care sector, but not imposed by price controls.
TJ and The Bear
mmckinl,
Medicare is single payer, and nobody would ever accuse it of exercising "best practices".
~~~
Very wrong .... Medicare has been subverted by Doctors and Health Care Incorporated ... Especially Big Pharma
Best practice is NOT being implemented as records are not being used to discover treatment / outcome data.
Obamacare has but one outcome; two tiered treatment.
"but not imposed by price controls. "
here's a recent anecdote, which I've already shared, but bears mention - a friend has a natural childbirth (no IV or medication of any kind) which lasts a grand total of 20 minutes at the hospital (all of her labor was done at home). she stays at the hospital less than 24 hours, sharing a room with 3 or 4 other couples due to temporary crowding at the hospital.
the total medication involved was a tiny bit of lubricant for the birth, and a motrin afterwards. a nurse also cleaned and weighed the baby in a process that took ten minutes shortly after the birth.
the total bill to the insurance company - over fourteen thousand dollars.
Medicare has been subverted by Doctors and Health Care Incorporated
Which is exactly what would happen to "Single Payer".
TJ and The Bear (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 10:57 pm
Medicare has been subverted by Doctors and Health Care Incorporated
Which is exactly what would happen to "Single Payer".
Except this time the lawyers and bureaucrats get rich.
Rob Dawg
Obamacare has but one outcome; two tiered treatment.
~~~
Obamacare ? ... just exactly what is it ? I don't think he's even put
anything out yet ...
Having said that there will always be a two tiered or more health care system ...
Right now we have a four tiered health system ...
Those without healthcare
Those with inadequate health care coverage ...
Those with adequate coverage ...
And those like Steve Jobs that have the money to get any care they need ...
~~~~
We should have a two tiered system
Adequate healthcare and health care for those willing to pay for unauthorized treatmennts
unauthorized treatmennts
That'll be aspirin by the time they get done with it.
TJ and The Bear
Medicare has been subverted by Doctors and Health Care Incorporated
Which is exactly what would happen to "Single Payer".
~~~
Works in the other G7 countries ... why not here ....
All you are is bluster ...
How in the world can you be so credulous in governments performing efficiently? Where have you ever seen that? The government should try proving it can operate efficiently before you put all your faith in their ability to execute.
mmckinl,
You miss Dawg's point -- it won't be a truly fair system until it's the same one for everyone, including the President & Congress.
Rob Dawg
Except this time the lawyers and bureaucrats get rich.
~~~
Single Payer?
Works in all the other G7 nations ...
Half the price ... Better outcomes
Works in the other G7 countries ... why not here ....
All you are is bluster ...
And all you are is ignorant, since obviously (to you) the only difference between us and the rest of the G7 is our health plan.
Do you know what regulatory capture means?
That reminds me to ask again, mmckinl -- Why exactly do you live here again???
TJ and The Bear
mmckinl,
You miss Dawg's point -- it won't be a truly fair system until it's the same one for everyone, including the President & Congress.
~~~
The system will never be completely fair, we can only make it equitable . If someone wants to spend their own money out of pocket
they can do so , either here or overseas ...
(Dup entry removed)
TJ and The Bear
That reminds me to ask again, mmckinl -- Why exactly do you live here again???
~~~~
Care to clarify ?
E Thomas St.
How in the world can you be so credulous in governments performing efficiently? Where have you ever seen that? The government should try proving it can operate efficiently before you put all your faith in their ability to execute.
~~~
FYI
Single Payer means the government pays the bills ...
the health care itself would be privately delivered ...
There's nothing wrong with single payer as long as you don't mind the trappings of monopoly behavior. And once the single payer exercises rationing then comes vertical integration. It does not end well.
Rob Dawg
There's nothing wrong with single payer as long as you don't mind the trappings of monopoly behavior. And once the single payer exercises rationing then comes vertical integration. It does not end well.
~~~
Single Payer has been working quite well for decades in Europe ...
The privately delivered health care would require out of necessity price controls on them otherwise what is to prevent health care providers from jacking up charges ala medicare fraud? Except you know that AMA et al have regulatory capture on what the government pays for medical procedures. Doctors feel entitled to their wages and have the lobbying power to ensure them even in a single payer system.
Put it together.
One thing that needs to happen is progressive medical licensing. It is a colossal waste to have people go through med school and interning when we need twice as many with half as much training to set bones and manage blood pressure.
anecdote-
once i graduated from college, my health insurance (thru the uni) gave me the boot. Uninsured, i went to a D.O. that saw me the day after i called. Cost - 60 bucks. I went to get a scrip for an antidepressant i was taking. She gave me a 90 day scrip and 3 months worth of 'samples' she had lying around, which out of pocket would cost 300 bucks.
I thought it to be a good deal
No, don't worry about that Rob, all we need is "Single Payer" and Skittle shitting ponies will descend upon the earth. If you say Single Payer enough you'll be immune to facts and logic AND reality.
E Thomas St.
The privately delivered health care would require out of necessity price controls on them otherwise what is to prevent health care providers from jacking up charges ala medicare fraud? Except you know that AMA et al have regulatory capture on what the government pays for medical procedures. Doctors feel entitled to their wages and have the lobbying power to ensure them even in a single payer system.
Put it together.
~~~
So you are accusing te AMA of advocating Single Payer ? ROTFLOL
Is it true that if you say "single payer" three times in a cemetery the dead will rise?
In the big picture it astounds me that we are even considering taking on such a major issue. We have so many things more pressing. What's equally puzzling is just how easy everyone took it up the back side when Medicare D costs exploded. Talk about your red flags.
Rob Dawg
One thing that needs to happen is progressive medical licensing. It is a colossal waste to have people go through med school and interning when we need twice as many with half as much training to set bones and manage blood pressure.
~~~~
The great thing about best practice is that it can be implemented across the board quickly ...
New methods of diagnosis and treatment would be standardized so that old methods and treatments
that vary would be shelved saving doctors time, money and malpractice jeopardy ...
Let me try this again since you don't get it;
I'm accusing the government of being bitches to whoever gets them elected and even if we went single payer, the lobbying power of the private sector would ensure that it'd be the same shit but different day. You're naive beyond belief to think otherwise.
What about single payer changes the dynamic of too many patients not enough staff?
What's equally puzzling is just how easy everyone took it up the back side when Medicare D costs exploded.
~~~~~
That's why Big Pharma doesn't want Single Payer HR 676 ...
First many drugs would be unprescribed as unnecessary ie : nervous leg syndrome ...
Second ... Drugs would be bargained for not purchased ... Blame the Republicans for Part D
The problems with healthcare in America lies in 4 key areas: Portability, exclusions due to pre-existing conditions, competition among insurance companies, and inverse ratio of need versus have.
Allow insurance companies to operate nationally, to offer several plans at different price points to anyone anywhere in the country rather than through an employer, prevent them from denying coverage based on pre-existing conditions, and require everyone above the age of 18 to buy into the plan of their choosing and you address all of the issues while preserving the profit motive that drives research, specialization, and cost efficiency.
E Thomas St.
Let me try this again since you don't get it;
I'm accusing the government of being bitches to whoever gets them elected and even if we went single payer, the lobbying power of the private sector would ensure that it'd be the same shit but different day. You're naive beyond belief to think otherwise.
What about single payer changes the dynamic of too many patients not enough staff?
~~~~~
Maybe ... but with Single Payer you reduce the Special Interests, getting rid of Health Crea Companies
that charge 15% overhead and 20% profit while cherry picking their customers.
Gee, I wonder how much the government will decide to pay out in malpractice claims.
One thing that needs to happen is progressive medical licensing.
Just what I was thinking. I don't require my doctor's full training and when I had my physical, a nurse did 95 % of the work. It bothers me that MD time is wasted telling people antibiotics for a cold is not recommend,...when we could have a less highly trained individual do that. And I believe that quite of bit of MD time is social time for many "patients."
"Allow insurance companies to operate nationally, to offer several plans at different price points to anyone anywhere in the country rather than through an employer, prevent them from denying coverage based on pre-existing conditions, and require everyone above the age of 18 to buy into the plan of their choosing and you address all of the issues while preserving the profit motive that drives research, specialization, and cost efficiency."
~~~~
Won't work ..... Health care is a Public Good not a private good ... the incentives are upside down for private healthcare.
Health Care Companies will still deny coverage, still cherry pick customers and won't contribute to best practice ...
Rob Dawg
Gee, I wonder how much the government will decide to pay out in malpractice claims.
~~~
Nothing .... doctors cover their own liability ... but you knew that
On the other hand lousy doctors will be easy to spot and get rid of ...
3 droughts in a row... does anyone remember a guy named Hurst who was an engineer on Suez Canal?
his studies of weather led to an interesting insight into weather patterns ... I think I read an article in The Economist
way back in '91 which talked about some firms using this theory which had now morphed into something called GARCH
and was being used in investmant decisions by a firm in Sante Fe (name I can;t recall) and another one
in NYC named DE Shaw...
is this still a viable approach or had it since beenn discarded?
And I believe that quite of bit of MD time is social time for many "patients."
~~~~
Quite right and best practice will ferret out those 'patients' abusing the system .
They are quite good at it in England ...
What about single payer ensures better information about doctors to the end user of health care? You're making all these points without connecting them together...
What % of income will liability insurance cost doctors and will there be tort reform capping malpractice lawsuits?
Again, how does single payer resolve patient/resource imbalance?
Who defines best practices? The AMA?
What % of income will liability insurance cost doctors and will there be tort reform capping malpractice lawsuits?
And how much will the jury award when the single payer is found liable for one of their decisions affecting a medical outcome? Oh, that's right unlike insurance companies the government can't be held accountable.
"Won't work ..... Health care is a Public Good not a private good ... the incentives are upside down for private healthcare.
Health Care Companies will still deny coverage, still cherry pick customers and won't contribute to best practice ... "
Under your alternative single-payer plan, entire classes of ailments are denied en masse because they aren't cost effective, regardless of circumstances, end-of-life care is severely curtailed to control costs, there is zero motive to become a general practitioner, and either a black market arises for private health care or the country suffers a brain drain as people look for better opportunities elsewhere.
Utopian ideals do not hold up when applied to real life, but appealing to a person's self-interest rarely fails.
Here's my two cents.
The entire medical system in this country is a fraud and needs to be overhauled from the absolute bottom to the very top:
First, educational requirements should be changed. In England, a doctor receives a four to five year medical education straight out of "high school." It is rare to see a PhD in medicine and, when one does, it is usually a Harley Street physician catering to the wealthy on private insurance.
Second, the AMA, which currently represents approximately one-quarter of all physicians, needs to be dismantled brick by brick.
Third, the medical schools should be forced to abandon their quota system, something CBS News first documented over forty years ago. The quota system is still in effect, despite AMA's denials.
Fourth, regulate the drug companies like public utilities because they have a responsibility for the public welfare. It's something that should have been done ages ago.
The quota system, by the way, is the reason the Armed Forces College of Medicine was established. The Defense Department figured that, if they couldn't end the practice, they'd start their own medical school to ensure the service branches got the number of doctors and nurses they needed.
E Thomas St.
What about single payer ensures better information about doctors to the end user of health care? You're making all these points without connecting them together...
What % of income will liability insurance cost doctors and will there be tort reform capping malpractice lawsuits?
Again, how does single payer resolve patient/resource imbalance?
~~~
HR 676 establishes a national database of diagnosis and treatment so that the most effective treatments can be applied ...
The database would separate names from files to ensure privacy ...
Malpractise law suits are a red herring, they cost little in the scheme of things but a database would also sort out
doctors that are not up to snuff ...
mmckinl (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 11:53 pm
reply ignore user
Rob Dawg
Gee, I wonder how much the government will decide to pay out in malpractice claims.
~~~
Nothing .... doctors cover their own liability ... but you knew that
On the other hand lousy doctors will be easy to spot and get rid of ...
Two pluses for Canada. Single payer health-care and no contingency based lawsuits.
I'm interested in how many people on this board have dealt with long-term health issues in both the US and Canada and/or Europe. I hear a lot of anecdotal evidence quoted and statistics but very little based on actual personal experience.
I've dealt with the same long term issue for the last 23 years, 13 years in Canada and 10 years I'm the us.
While my care has been great under a ppo plan in the us I pay 10% out of pocket which works out to several thousand on top of my monthly plan cost. If I'm out of work my coverage is $1500 a month which is basically what ui would give me.
I'm lucky to have a vey decent job but have no idea how someone making 40k a year would survive. There is something wrong with the current system and people in this board better hope they don't find themselves in need of long term care under the current system when they are less than 65.
"Again, how does single payer resolve patient/resource imbalance?"
~~~~
I don't know exactly what you mean but doctors are now practicing defensive medicine ....
With best practice treatment is codified so if the diagnosis is correct and the treatment delivered properly the doctor
would have little to worry about ...
I'm in IT and work for a GSE and I can assure you, the Government and people in general have no idea what a database does or why they need one much less spend millions on it. The failure of IT development on the backend for government functions is obvious throughout every single level; Federal, State, Local. Again, you're making points without connecting the dots. You say database as if it would just appear, free, without issue.
How is best practice codified? It's a simple question and every answer will require a human decision.
Under your alternative single-payer plan, entire classes of ailments are denied en masse because they aren't cost effective, regardless of circumstances, end-of-life care is severely curtailed to control costs, there is zero motive to become a general practitioner, and either a black market arises for private health care or the country suffers a brain drain as people look for better opportunities elsewhere.
I'd like specific proof of the above assertations.
" entire classes of ailments are denied en masse because they aren't cost effective, regardless of circumstances,"
Which specific ailments and which country. Never heard of that in either Canada or the US.
But I did have colonoscopies each 12 months denied in the us by my HMO even though that is the recommended practice for long term ulcerative colitis.
" end-of-life care is severely curtailed to control costs,"
Again which countries and what care. I spent many weekends on rounds with my gp father in Canada and nearly every bed in emergency and long term care was persons over 70.
You are deluded if you think that rationing is not already happening in the us.
Mr Dawg has some interesting points, indeed. The idea that many of our med students don't need so much training. But this has probably been
said before but such near doctor practioners would have to be given a blanket tort protection all the way up the food chain, otherwise.
Back in the 60s my granddad who was the current mayor of my town was misdiagnosed by a doctor who was quite brilliant (studied under
John Lawrence (of Lawrence-Livermore) but also had a drinking problem - reason why he was in our town in the first place. By the time
Dr Murray figured it out it that it was hepatitis not the other thing it was too late. Nobody ever considered suing for malpractice back then. The attitude was he tried his best and that's that. But now, at the drop of the hat, you're in court with the doc and hospital.
...
what changed all that? the perception that doctors make too much money? that it's just an insurance thing? that life is more precious? a diminished belief in the here-after?
deleted...
...
E Thomas St makes some good points. I was involved with an infectious disease database
for a major gov. player and you have no idea the bureaucratic squabbles that grew exponentially
and as E Thomas highlights - the lack of understanding what Dbs can and can not do.
Say as we did you apply a Beysian Neural Net algorithm for pattern matching purposes (chained probabilities that compute in polynomial time, but not too poly
in the end the weighting schemes had to be signed off on. Each scheme produced different result sets which either set the pen to paper or lifted the pen from paper depending on dept.
...
the CDC tried to do what we did for about 4 years and finally gave up... our project is in a graveyard somewhere, wherever such projects go to die...
...
the idea of a national database... ha ha ha, now there's a gravy train I'd like to be on....
MP
I agree with all your points esp. about the AMA (a cartel) except your last point...
"The quota system, by the way, is the reason the Armed Forces College of Medicine was established. The Defense Department figured that, if they couldn't end the practice, they'd start their own medical school to ensure the service branches got the number of doctors and nurses they needed."
IMO
the Armed Forces used the presence of that cartel as a recruitment tool, how many wash out of the program and stay in the Services
anyway?
Some genteel libertarian racism showing its colors during these times of stress.
Someone has to clean the floors and I doubt it will be anyone commenting on this website.
Someone has to clean the floors and I doubt it will be anyone commenting on this website.
Well, you could be right about that. Not sure if I still did janitorial work that I'd have found this site. (Granted it was a long time ago and only for six months between other [still low paying] jobs. And granted it was at the Performing Arts Center,...so that as I was cleaning the restrooms, I could still say "Quit this job? And give up show business?!?!" At three in the morning that really cheered me up.)
the duke has been busy of late with his crew on the range yesterday firing an M-60s and m16s (crew)...
almost went with a 30 caliber monster that had a sighting wheel...
... since we have hopefully exhausted everything Cali related here's something new -
NY Times: Sharp Price Drops in Manhattan Apartments
Sharp Price Drops Found In Manhattan Apartments - NY Times
Manhattan apartment prices fell sharply during the second quarter of 2009, as the limited number of deals struck during the darkest months of the economic downturn began to close, according to a series of market reports released Wednesday.
The number of closings fell more than 50 percent, and prices in some categories were reported down as much as 25 percent, compared with the same quarter in 2008. Sale prices were also down from those reported in the first quarter of 2009.
average price v. median price problem:
One report..put the average price of a Manhattan apartment in the 2nd qtr at $1.26 million ( - 24 YOY)
It also put the median sale price at $795,000, 19 percent below the figure in the first quarter of 2008.
"A Brown Harris Stevens report found that sales of trophy apartments had shriveled during the downturn, with sales of co-ops costing more than $10 million off by 82 percent from the same period a year ago. This contributed to a sharp weakening in average prices of all co-ops, off 29 percent to $918,795, the report found."
...
Using CR's methodology what does the average price v. median price tell us? If memory serves, not a lot w/o the unit sales array...
You gotta love this line, Pamela Liebman, the chief executive at the Corcoran Group [big time NYC player], said she expected prices to stabilize and then perhaps rise “a couple of points” a year. Sellers are better off selling now than waiting, she said. “If I were a seller, I would take the risk out of the calculation,” she said. “Time does not necessarily equate to money here for the seller.”
Pam, at some point prices will stabilize. Question is when, I think she answered that by recommending Sell Now!
But Gregory J. Heym, the chief economist for Halstead and Brown Harris Stevens, said the economic outlook in New York had improved, with unemployment, so far, remaining below the national rate. “A lot of things are bottoming out,” he said.
IMO the question is not I think whether NYC has a 9% or a 11% unemployment rate, at least for RE market, but what is its composition? If in the past bankers represented say 1% but now represent 3% the question is will that 3% be replaced with bankers in the future or are those jobs GONE?
they called me for an interview once when i was working in southern california for symantec. i'm glad i never went to the interview (it was too far away from where i wanted to live)..
I actually knew 2 guys who left my company at the time to work in fields associated in mortgaes. one left to become a realtor in oxnard (he now works for myspace, and i'm sure they will fire him because he was incompetant), another left to work for ameriquest mortgages and left there jus tbefore they basically died.
The mortgage industry even afftected people working in IT security. It is crazy the impact they had. They were offering outrageously high salaries compared to actual productive companies.
FFA in IT Speak = another Freakin Female with an Attitude
as in
Hey Tran, pick up line 3
Who is it?
Keisha from the 5th floor. She is bitching about her email again
No way I am talking to her again. I told her 2 weeks ago I would take care of it
Dude, answer the phone
No, make up some shIt. I'm busy playing insert game Man, I hate FFA's
ResistanceIsFeudal (profile) wrote on Wed, 7/1/2009 - 7:09 pm
"Too many want too much for doing too little. The balance of payments will be settled in I-owe-you's which may or may not have any intrinsic worth. And at this point, the present situation transforms into a moral conundrum. Which, to those without a conscience, means the problem goes away."
That was good.
time to shove this golden cross up dennis kneale's green chute
Good morning, what ever the number may be I can say with out a doubt, layoffs continue unabated.
Briggs & Stratton -430
Printpack -27
Virgin Atlantic (UK) -600
Gannett confirms layoffs -1,400
Tennessean Newspaper -35
Mass layoffs at highest level since 1995
Dow Chemical -100
Oculina Bank -4
Zalk Joseph Fabricators -22
Integrated Device Technology (Canada) -35
Acushnet -77
Sutter Solano Medical Center -34
Chelan County, WA potential layoffs -20-30
Spin Magazine -6
Wells Fargo -50
CUNA -18
Fairfax County, VA -35
ADP: 473K private sector jobs cut in June
Hawaii state workers rally to protest furloughs
Baldor Electric Co. -120
City of new London, CT sends layoff notices -90
City of Aurora, IL Human Services -80
Paramount Pictures -31
Gannett layoff update: 1,000 to 2,000 jobs cut
State of Nebraska -7
AgCo potential layoffs -130
Chrysler Financial -240
Untitled Document
Good morrrrrnning Mary-Nam. The java is excellent. It is definitely a second half cup recovery.
Today looks like a bore except for the bond announcements. Nikki down overnight due to little better to do but wait for US jobs news, local wires saying "no cues" which means incompetent front-running by the majors because they're all packing for the long weekend.
C
just checked out the Traffic Rankings in Gongol.com... Great for CR!
OT / sorry about the 'bold' in my last comment... editing posts really sucks!
also, I mentioned my 'special crew', I had them using Heckler & Koch MP5's not M-16s...
after, we attended the genocide tribunal and listened to S-21 survivor stories...
so far, this deep in the hearing not one person ever saw Pol Pot...
watching Comrade Duch (Keng Kek Iew) break into tears when confronted
with the accusations was worth the price of admission - got some excellent footage...
will post tomorrow... my entrance along with my 2 'translators' might be a first in the
annals of Nuremberg type tribunals!
anyone see those FBI interviews in WaPo with Saddam Hussein? illuminating!
strangely, they redacted the entire final interview with him...
thanks Shill for the job numbers...
good morning everyone great thread
Another healthcare thread. I hope all ya'll are happy when we get our gov't healthcare.
The Post Office is looking at dropping Saturday delivery. One in 6 city carriers and a majority of rural carrier substitutes eliminated, along with the continuing drop in
other personnel, excluding management. In a lot of small towns, postal jobs are the best paying and most stable. Look for another 50k job reduction from the Post Office
this year.
An International Replacement for Treasury Notes Is Born
Another major step in the demise of the dollar as the world's reserve currency has just taken place.
The Executive Board of the International Monetary Fund (IMF)has approved a framework today for the issuance of notes to member countries and their central banks. The notes will not be denominated in dollars, but in SDR's and are clearly an alternative to Treasury notes for central banks and others cleared to trade in the notes.
Under the framework, members may sign agreements to purchase IMF notes up to a limit set by the member. Several members have already expressed their interest in buying IMF paper, with China signaling its intention to invest up to US$50 billion, and Brazil and Russia up to US$10 billion each.
The IMF would issue notes at times when loan disbursements are made to members receiving financial assistance from the IMF. Once purchased by member governments, or their central banks, the notes would be tradable within the official sector, which includes all IMF members, their central banks, and 15 multilateral institutions—those which are designated holders of Special Drawing Rights.
The principal of the notes will be denominated in SDR, the Fund’s unit of account, which is a currency basket composed of the U.S. dollar, Euro, Japanese Yen, and Pound sterling. Interest payments will be made quarterly, at the official SDR interest rate, which is a weighted average of 3-month interest rates in these currencies.
The notes have a maximum maturity of five years, which is consistent with the maximum maturity of IMF lending under Stand-By Arrangements and Flexible Credit Line arrangements. Commitments under such IMF lending arrangements have increased to more than SDR 100 billion (about US$150 billion) in the past year, as the Fund has responded flexibly to members’ financing needs during the global crisis.
“This framework for issuing the IMF notes marks a significant step forward in our continuing drive to make sure the IMF can respond effectively to member countries’ needs in these challenging and uncertain times,” the Managing Director Dominique Strauss-Kahn.
Good Mornnnnning C.....Drinking a cup of yesterdays brew while new pot is being made.
shill
just checked the Paramount Pictures number of -31, most of those jobs
are not gone since they're on the creative side and will be replaced by the
new production chief, last thing you need is the old guard screwing
up your future slate (I'd fire them too)...except gutting the NY literary and
production group, this has been done over and over as long as I can remember...
(but hey, I'm no Robert Osborne)
Hehe, did the same, actually spun out with last night's cocoa.
Maybe The Gubernator should call the IMF?
C
I walked into my post office last week and the postmaster pleaded with me to buy stamps @ her post office, as opposed to Costco or supermarkets, as her sales of stamps were down and there is some danger of her losing one of her 3 employees if this trend continues~
Like most everybody, I pay the odd bill or 2 using snail-mail, but haven't written a letter to anybody in probably a decade...
No Post office Saturday delivery in mainland Europe and just one delivery per day. UK still has Saturday and I think some places in UK still may get 2 deliveries per day, although that may have stopped now.
Rob Dawg, how are you able to communicate with us from post-budget-deadline CA? Is that like communicating from the Negative Zone in The Fantastic Four comics?
Never doubt the Dawg
Last week I mentioned the NetFlix contest for 1 million and its winner as reported in the NY Times...
The Netflix Prize contest has been hailed as prime example of “prize economics” and the crowdsourcing of innovation. Prize economics refers to running a contest to generate a new innovation at less cost than an in-house research and development effort, and crowd-sourcing refers to using the proverbial wisdom of crowds to accomplish a task.
a few weeks back I said one of the areas that I am interested in, albeit somewhat boutique for the rest of you. a Finance and Economics blog is new approaches to film financing.
seems the producer Ted Hope has written a fair amount on his blog about the very use of 'crowd sourcing' in filmmaking, right now his details are sketchy but look promising...
... more later...
On the healthcare discussion above.
NYer published two thoughtful articles within the past several weeks - one considering means to phase in a national program while also showing how such transitions have been managed elsewhere in the past, and the other written from a best practices perspective.
Which is not to say either presents an entire plan or, on the other hand, that neither is devoid of interest. I'm drawn to the best practices approach, but have little faith in federal-level competence to take on the task whatever shape it may eventually assume.
U.S. June nonfarm payrolls down 467,000
U.S. June jobless rate 9.5%
Last week I mentioned the NetFlix contest for 1 million and its winner as reported in the NY Times...
The contest still has three weeks to run.
U.S. June payroll drop below 325,000 expected
U.S. June retail jobs down 21,000
U.S. June workweek falls to record low 33.0 hours
U.S. June factory jobs down 136,000
U.S. weekly jobless claims down 16,000 to 614,000
U.S. 4-week avg. claims down 2,750 to 615,250
CA can raise money by starting a bidding war for product endorsement from inkjet printers.
Example:
Governator: "Our IOUS are printed using only the finest Epson ink."
More NFP news:
U6 up 0.1% to 16.5%. Anyone want to buy a bridge?
Working hours are down further; record low: "In June, the average workweek for production and nonsupervisory
workers on private nonfarm payrolls fell by 0.1 hour to 33.0 hours--the
lowest level on record for the series, which began in 1964. ...
The index of aggregate weekly hours of production and nonsupervisory
workers on private nonfarm payrolls fell by 0.8 percent in June. The
manufacturing index declined by 1.2 percent over the month. (See
table B-5.)"
this is good for Mr. Market, right? The bottom is in!
New Yorker healthcare links:
McAllen, Texas and the high cost of health care : The New Yorker
How should Obama reform health care? : The New Yorker
[BRIEFING.COM] S&P futures vs fair value: -11.30. Nasdaq futures vs fair value: -9.80. Stock futures have weakened further following the release of the latest jobs data. According to the government's official Nonfarm Payrolls report, 467,000 jobs were lost in June and the unemployment rate reached 9.5%, which is the highest level since August 1983. Economists, on average, had expected job losses to total 365,000 and unemployment to come in at 9.6%. Meanwhile, data for May was revised higher to reflect 322,000 job losses for that month. Given the revisions to the May data and the job losses for June, monthly job losses averaged 431,000 during the second quarter. On a similar note, initial jobless claims for the week ending June 27 totaled 614,000, which is in stride with the consensus forecast for 615,000 initial claims. The previous week's claims were revised slightly higher to 630,000. Continuing claims keep pulling back from record highs by coming in at 6.70 million, down from the previous week's upwardly revised 6.76 million. The latest continuing claims were expected to total 6.74 million.
U.S. nonfarm payrolls fall wider-than-forecast 467,000 in June
"Persons unemployed 15 weeks or longer as % of civilian labor force" up from 4.5 to 5.1%. Ouch.
......I knew it......I missed the recovery.........it was yesterday sometime, right?.....prolly while I was figuring out my new garden timer.
Eric
true, but the chance of beating BellKor’s Pragmatic Chaos benchmark is slim to none.... they will win!
Alex, I'll take "Heavily Manipulated Statistics" for $400...
"Alex, I'll take "Heavily Manipulated Statistics" for $400..."
....LOL....first hearty laugh of the day...thnx, WS....
Zandi was spinning the 9.5% number as a good sign. That's like eating your own poop and saying, "hey, there's a piece of corn".
The latest Will Ferrell film came in @ around 1/5th of a billion dollars, for a comedy.
The flick obviously got green-lighted years ago when Wall*Street was flush and throwing money around like so many monkeys flinging excrement in their gilded cage, but that was then and this is now.
In lieu of expensive computer graphics, might Hollywood have to turn to such mundane things as plot & dialogue?
Hourly wage growth = 0%! Work Week = 33.0, a record low.
And the Mortgage Pig is warming up over in the corner...
we're all part time now
Black Star Ranch (profile) wrote on Thu, 7/2/2009 - 12:37 pm
......I knew it......I missed the recovery.........it was yesterday sometime, right?.....prolly while I was figuring out my new garden timer.
I heard garden timing was impossible so you had to follow a "plant and hold" strategy.
Are computer graphics really expensive? I think Pixar makes out like a bandit when a film hits it big....minimal shooting & casting costs compared to traditional moviemaking.........(but I've been wrong before, once or twice....)