Why don't they try the Swedish model? 
At least it is crisis tested and proven to work.

Timmmy probably has another trillion dollar plan ready for execution.

You can't have a working plan that costs less than a trillion, can you?

Bugabe should throw away those helis, we need flying oil tankers.

So the Brits will follow the American plan which was scrapped to follow the Brits plan which didnt work, so the Brits are trying what the Americans didnt, so if it works, the Americans will be said to be following the Brits but in reality only following themselves?

God, I love Paulson.

Ok, the suspense is over. The next bubble will be the bailout bubble.

1) It is artificially inflating the economy

2) It shoves money to unproductive activities

3) In the long run it will fail, because it is unsustainable.

Rather than separating the good assets from the bad assets, how about separating the good bankers from the bad bankers? Unless, of course, they're inseparable -- two halves of the same debased coin.

Doppelbänkers?

Gerkinov, I think the UK government capitalized the banks by buying preferred shares, but they don't have any voting rights. They don't set policies at the banks, they just own part of them.

Generalisimo Elect Gerkinov - 9:54 am |

yeah, i'm not strongly pushing the idea that there will be no more bubbles. i do think that all this injecting and detoxifying is going to have long term consequences. i'll suggest that the next series of bubbles that we'll blow in the distant future(50yrs) will be smaller than our last bubble.

can these manias keep getting bigger?

Detoxify:

http://www.official-detox-pads.com/

Has anyone ever went to borrow money and the bank just said, "we're out of money."

Not that there was any problem, just that they couldn't locate any more money. That they'd already reduced their deposit base to it's limits and they didn't want to correspond on any loans so that they were just "out" for the time being?

No? Then there's the problem.

Like politicians, bankers are the only group of market actors that can always seem to scare up more money than they ought to have at their disposal at any given time.

Can shortsighted greed be kept in check?
Generalisimo Elect Gerkinov | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 10:07 am |

maybe it can. maybe it cannot. at some point though won't the scale of future bubbles strain the monetary system to the breaking point? never mind ecological limits for now.

the scale of this last bubble -- with its siv's, cdo's, mbs's, what else? is impressive to say the least. i'm no expert but i can't imagine the financial chicanery that would be needed to blow a bigger bubble.

Why don't they try the Swedish model?

Tiger Woods says it works great.

wetzel | 01.03.09 - 10:20 am | #

kin to Lewis Wetzel, famous Indian fighter from early days of West Virginia?

ce: Maybe we'll just print it and be done, screw the transactional nature of it all, just print, print, print. Me? I'm going to trade school to become a journeyman pressman.

Obama says untemployment will hit 10% and elements of industrial production are at 1948 levels. Auto sales are in the tank. Who the heck is creditworthy enough to get a loan? This is such a classic example of pushing on a string. It will be UKistan and USAistan stumbling in to the new year.

ce: Maybe we'll just print it and be done, screw the transactional nature of it all, just print, print, print. Me? I'm going to trade school to become a journeyman pressman.
Volker the Viking | 01.03.09 - 10:40 am | #

Comma zero zero zero comma zero zero zero decimal point enter.

We may actually see the perverse circumstance of a shortage of physical scrip to power the underground economy as the Fed cannot print and distribute the actual toilet paper to wipe this particular bum. 

Not sure whether this source is MSM or not, but this guy is forcasting the end of the recession.

When Will This Recession Finally End? at SmartMoney.com

There are some important signals along the same lines coming from bond markets. The extremely high yields on corporate bonds have started to come down, indicating that investors no longer think they need extraordinary interest rates to compensate for lots of expected defaults.

And in credit markets, closely watched indicators of default risk such as the TED-spread, the swap spread and the price of credit default swaps have all relaxed considerably over the last few weeks.

I'm not agreeing with him. I just pointing out that it's out there.

Morocco Bama writes:
Everyone I've spoken to over the holidays is convinced that the recovery will be late 2009. When I queried them as to why they thought that, they said that's how recessions work. When I asked where they heard that, they cited the MSM, including CNBC. I didn't argue with them....it's futile arguing with sheep.

isnt it funny that in every Investor Prospect is the Disclaimer " past performance is NO indication to the future"?? and yet the bozzo experts claim historical it has to be a recovery soon???

So let's get this straight.

Paulson dumped his original plan in favour of the first British plan because his original plan didn't work. Now the Brits have dumped their first plan that has since been adopted by Paulson because it didn't work in the UK, and are now going to use Paulson's original plan which failed in the US.

We're all f****d!

Timothy Leary's dead.
Rob Dawg | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 10:41 am | #

I saw him speak at UVa, in, oh... 1986 or so.

Said he considered it his patriotic duty as an American try try every illegal drug at least once a year.

Sure looked to me like he was living up to that.

It is the Satanson Plan.
Elvis | 01.03.09 - 10:47 am | #

The Bride of Hankenstein.

Marx proved Capitalism cant work..
Mises proved Socialism cant work..

so instead of fixing this wich cant work they should divert the resources to something new!! but that means the digged in "Parasites that decide"have to change wich would be too much to ask...
ergo Revolution will take place..
my guess short after Hyperinflation knocks on the door..

And a little something for Broward from last night

Timothy Leary - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"When Leary arrived in prison, he was given psychological tests that were used to assign inmates to appropriate work details. Having designed many of the tests himself...,Leary answered them in such a way that he seemed to be a very conforming, conventional person... Leary was assigned to work as a gardener in a lower security prison, and in September 1970 he escaped"

You can't write fiction like that.
Leary was awesome.

i really want to know how bb plans to avoid rampant inflation..

all this bailout money will hit the street when the supply is really low from the deflation squezze...

it has to be ugly..

BBC NEWS | Europe | Slovakia becomes eurozone member

hehe brits will go green with envy..

i have if from a source they will rename the Pound to "gramm sterling"

i really want to know how bb plans to avoid rampant inflation..

all this bailout money will hit the street when the supply is really low from the deflation squezze...

it has to be ugly..
Yoringe | 01.03.09 - 11:09 am | #

bb plans to withdraw as he goes along, at least that's what I heard.

But blonderengel has it right, it's from a previous thread toward the bottom, but it's about a return of capital to its source. Like some have said, wiping out all but the elite.

And this is nothing new. But it is certainly interesting as a participant on the suffering end. And yakking about it with other semi-enlightened folk is too, for as long as they allow it.

Volker the Viking.

well there is the fly in this plan.. the 95% of the ppl who get shafted..

actual we can well live without the other 5% , but they cant without us..

the resistance i see is consume strike .. to ground this system complette..

these guys new in 1999 )

YouTube
- Broadcast Yourself.

call it the Hollywood solution..

...the toxic assets, blamed for poisoning the financial system, would be parked in a state vehicle or “bad bank” that would manage them and attempt to dispose of them while “detoxifying” the main-stream banking system.....

SIV of the govt. Govt copying bankrput tactic of the useless bankers!!

wait thats the link..

YouTube
- Broadcast Yourself.

Comrade NSA: There's another street game where you take three cups and put a small rubber ball under one. It may help you answer your question.

Imagine someone high up from where you are behind some glassed in enclosure. This person holds up both hands making two fists with the pinky finger extended. This person wiggles the pinky.

And that is how easy it is to control the masses. Helpful?

What are those giraffes doing in the right hand bottom corner of the note?
REBea

aiming at a higher denomination??

Both the UK plan and the original Paulson plan fail because they attempt to shield uninsured bank debtholders from loss. That debt is bad, like so much debt currently floating around, and there's no escaping reality, which is why all attempts so far have failed. The government can, of course, throw away taxpayer money unnecessarily to benefit these (mostly wealthy) bondholders; but the scale of this particular problem is so enormous even the governments will shudder under the burden if Paulson/Geithner and Darling/Mandelson manage to make them bear it.

The honest and effective solution is to seize the banks, create a good bank/ bad bank setup, and convert an appropriate amount of uninsured debt into bad bank equity. The bad bank should carry no debt, only equity, tiered as necessary to deal with debt priority. Banks would be freed of onerous and indeterminate debt and the taxpayer cost held to a minimum.

Of course this is the Swedish model all the sensible folks have been calling for since the word go and in addition to all the various corruption influences pushing them to rob the taxpayers for bank owners, managers, and creditors TPTB would also have to acknowledge they were wrong in rejecting it months ago. So I'm not holding my breath.

OT, but in the past we have wondered whether the government was refilling the Strategic Petroleum Reserve now that oil prices have fallen. It turns out that they have not been doing so, due to meddling by congress. However, it seems that they have belatedly started filling 'er up again now that a law has expired at the end or 2008.

U.S. Aims to Fill Oil Reserve - WSJ.com

i really want to know how bb plans to avoid rampant inflation..

Probably the same way he avoided a deflationary depression. First, deny it's a possibility. Second, enact ineffective or even counterproductive countermeasures. Third, be shocked when it happens.

Fair Economist writes:
Both the UK plan and the original Paulson plan fail because they attempt to shield uninsured bank debtholders from loss. That debt is bad, like so much debt currently floating around, and there's no escaping reality, which is why all attempts so far have failed. The government can, of course, throw away taxpayer money unnecessarily to benefit these (mostly wealthy) bondholders;

Are you sure that's not the plan in the first place?

.

From eco's link ...

Q Have we learned anything from past economic cycles?

Tells it like it is.

For the uninitiated, 'proroguing parliament' means that Haitian hotty Michelle Jean gets to tell Canadians they can't throw Harper out on his ass.

.

To properly assess whether the "banks aren't lending", we need more information-are individuals and businesses being turned down for loans because they are credit worthy or not?

You want decisions to be made on facts? What a wierdo. The Fed of course understands that you get better decisions by denying critical facts to the public .

"Has anyone ever went to borrow money and the bank just said, "we're out of money."

Well, yes, but not at a bank. There are a lot of other lenders and investors who have been saying this over the past year, especially since around September.

Sometimes they mean "we've used up all of our allocation for this market segment, come see us in three months". Other times, they mean "our investors are withdrawing too much money and we can't get into anything new". Worse, they might mean "We've lost too much money and we need all the liquidity we can get."

The Spotted dick Paulson plan...
Spotted dick - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A little more from eco's link [Jarislowsky interview in the Financial Post]:

Q. Are you saying we need to fight the crisis with inflation?

A. Unfortunately, you have to create inflation to get rid of the debt. The only way to get housing to go up again is through inflation, by reducing the value of the mortgages. The only way to get the consumer back purchasing things is to get rid of their debts and that can only be done through inflation. I'm not somebody who believes in inflation. I think it's an awful thing, but there's no alternative.

As Jarislowsky was quoted in the previous link:

"I never underestimate the stupidity of mankind,"

And he's a prime example.

"Morocco Bama writes:
Everyone I've spoken to over the holidays is convinced that the recovery will be late 2009. When I queried them as to why they thought that, they said that's how recessions work. When I asked where they heard that, they cited the MSM, including CNBC. I didn't argue with them....it's futile arguing with sheep."

While I do agree with you that their explanation of causation is pretty weak, they could still be right: the recovery might start at the end of 2009.

For those of us who believe we have a regular recession superimposed on a collapsing set of asset bubbles, the end of 2009 doesn't sound that strange. People who still have jobs will be saving. People with auto loans will be paying them off an not getting a new car for a while (for those of you with leases, um, try to extend for a year). Lots of prices will be coming down.

Of course, most of the bank failures are still ahead. Most of the corporate failures too. Don't forget a few more countries defaulting on debt.

Any other thoughts on future crime consequences on the economy?
asl hearts lenin | 01.03.09 - 12:15 pm | #

Oh uh, I can hear the survivalists/gun nuts clambering out of the closets as I type ...

New Year and I still cannot spell or type.
clam=clap
earileir=earlier

I think The Paulson Plan is an annuity stream from the Treasury to failing banks. I don't think they have any end in mind for these bailout funds. This is going to prevent healthy banks with sound business practices from growing and taking the place of the sick banks. Failure is rewarded. The failed banks will have to continue their practices and healthy banks that want a federally guaranteed income stream will have to imitate the business practices of the failed institutions.

Paulson's plan is based on Wall St's business model; collect fees and distribute bonuses. I don't think Paulson understands how productive businesses operate.

Paulson's plan is based on Wall St's business model; collect fees and distribute bonuses. I don't think Paulson understands how productive businesses operate.
lama | 01.03.09 - 12:21 pm | #

Perfect.

Dawg--that Moody Blues song went through my head also with the Timothy L comment. I was tempted to post it, but didn't.

Like, wow, man.

Oh and remember that “No One Saw It Coming” — REALLY?

Anonymous writes:
Gulf Cooperation Council leaders yesterday concluded their 29th annual summit meeting in Muscat, Oman with a final approval for the creation of a single currency for the six-nation economic bloc, still targeted for 2010.

Been hearing this for about a decade. I'll believe it when I see it.

Citizen,

I've officially called a bottom. I'm going to buy an iphone.

I bet Barter makes a comeback. That did not work out so well last time. A clearinghouse like ebay to match up services for a percentage. Only problem was everyone padded the bill.

It's a building tidal wave of inflation that's heading our way. They're sitting on it right now, but when they start circulating it, down goes the dollar, and us with it.
Morocco Bama | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 10:35 am | #

this seems simple enough to me, and I think it's what bankers have done throughout history.

withholding large amounts of cash and drying up credit deflates assets and results in foreclosures etc, which become owned by the banks. pain and suffering, lots of unemployment, widespread bankruptcy of businesses. banks continue to hold until prices are low enough we call it a depression. banks buy up distressed assets. banks release the floodgates and we're suddenly awash in credit to buy back assets from the banks. asset prices inflate. the bank buys low, then sells high.

Take a look at the countries that make up the lion's share of the CAD (China, Japan, Saudi Arabia). What have they done since this started -- scrambled like crazy to try to maintain the status quo, because the alternative is politically unpalatable in the extreme. And once they have the dollars, the numbers are so big that there's really nowhere else for them to go but Treasurys. I'm not defending it, because it's clearly insane long term, but there it is.

MLM | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 12:41 pm | #

Who was it that said, "If you owe a hundred dollars, it's your problem, but if you owe a million dollars, it's the bank's problem"?

.

@ meta-
re: "cost of land delta"...

What layer of the business are you in?

"....most of the bank failures are still ahead. Most of the corporate failures too [will any be defined as "too big to fail"? Of course.]. Don't forget a few more countries defaulting on debt.....AND most of the job losses..."

Lets also not forget the states and smaller municipal failures and many under-funded pension plans.....

All of this the FedGov will backstop?

It seems the FedGov has a serious cash-flow problem in itself. Too many of its supporters are either "not playing", moving off-shore, or have nothing left to give........

We're only 175 pages into this 1000 page version of "Atlas Shrugged, 2008"

Bubblisimo Gerkinov writes:

Who was it that said, "If you owe a hundred dollars, it's your problem, but if you owe a million dollars, it's the bank's problem"?

J. Paul Getty

What Quote: Vast archive of quotes by famous personalities from all over the world - "If you owe the bank $100 that's your problem. If you owe the bank $100..." and other quotes by J. Paul Getty

@ meta-
re: "cost of land delta"...
What layer of the business are you in?
hong konger | 01.03.09 - 12:55 pm | #

I don't even see the applicability.  The cost of the retail square footage UK v US doesn't have any effect on the savings to be realized when the ratio is 8:1.  Tthe US could lose 2.5 sq ft per person and still be 7 times more over retailed vice UK whereas 2.5 sq ft per person in the UK is the entirety of their retail space. 

JR(Very Good) writes:
\tAnd the scariest and most depressing part is that this was probably not a conspiracy, in total, but rather just the way human nature works.

A person's view changes as they increase in wealth, until they realize that they are nature's winners and those with less money are just whiny, grasping usurpers. This phenomenon is too weird to believe unless you've seen it, which is probably why the world endlessly cycles through disasters.
JR | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 12:41 pm | #
Read Chomsky.  He doesn't believe in conspiracy either.  Rather - to succeed in those "areas" you have to already have incorporated the values necessary to perform and exist in that realm.

CR, I hope you won't mind some amateur sociology.
Making the bed this morning, I noticed a tear in one of the sheets. I thought, "I can patch that" and then mentally stepped back in surprise--I don't patch stuff. At least, I haven't since I was a starving grad student.
Question for most of you, I'm curious...what are you doing differently now than you were this time last year, in terms of spending?
If you're holing up on a farm off the grid and stockpiling ammo, ok, but please don't riff on that. This question is aimed more at the average CR reader. I'm curious about the more subtle changes.

This nation is only governable when the people consent. California's million little Atlases are on the verge of saying no.
Rob Dawg | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 12:45 pm | #

Dawg - how so?

An average CR reader , I suspect, works in a city at a white collar job (or retired from), is older than 30, and does not have noticeably advanced subsistence skills (hunting, gathering, sharpening flints)

....this past week we had an enormous amount of looky-loo traffic. More walk-in traffic this past week than during the past two months. Most looking for small lots (1.25 acres - thereby allowing a well) and ANY kind of structure.

There's a worry out there - ppl are looking for cheap land with sun & water.

Rob Dawg(Good) writes:
\t  The cost of the retail square footage UK v US doesn't have any effect on the savings to be realized when the ratio is 8:1.  Tthe US could lose 2.5 sq ft per person and still be 7 times more over retailed vice UK whereas 2.5 sq ft per person in the UK is the entirety of their retail space. 

yes but aren't you looking at the wrong metric?  if one were to consider the impact of declining retail on two different economies why look at sq. ft?  development patterns are not comparable.  my point was simply that the costs to buy the land, build, have employees, and be taxed are all more important than total sq. ft.  I didn't say s.f. was irrelevant.

Jes -

I was always frugal. Until I can learn to live w/o food, I'm spending as much as always.

Doc at the Radar Station writes:
"To properly assess whether the "banks aren't lending", we need more information-are individuals and businesses being turned down for loans because they are credit worthy or not?"

All I know is that I got a call from one of my credit card companies the other day - practically begging me spend money on their card. I'm one of those deadbeats that doesn't carry a balance, so I guess they are just hoping for the fee income. I have no idea what my credit score is, but it's probably pretty OK.

Another round for the house!
Earthstrange | 01.03.09 - 12:34 pm | #

Bottoms up!

An average CR reader , I suspect, works in a city at a white collar job (or retired from), is older than 30, and does not have noticeably advanced subsistence skills (hunting, gathering, sharpening flints)
Jes | 01.03.09 - 1:35 pm | #

So what? Me and my frightened neighbors are well armed, mostly military veterans and willing to defend our homes. Not with flint and steel, just organization and ammo.

Harndog: any notion on your part that you will succeed against the US Govt and Fed is wrong (makes wiggling gesture with pinkies)

This nation is only governable when the people consent. California's million little Atlases are on the verge of saying no.
Rob Dawg | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 12:45 pm | #

Dawg - how so?
Feckless Ness | 01.03.09 - 1:32 pm | #

I'm seeing it so far in little things.  Shifting to internet purchases to avoid sales taxes.  Tax consequence questions being asked as part of my proposals.  Professionals not working as hard for the last dollar when half gets taken away.  Off the books transactions.  I also hear my friends talking about investing anywhere except California.  But most of what I hear is about the current fiscal crisis that is up to $45 billion.  There is no willingness to adsorb our fair share.  And it isn't just this massive crushing debt being placed on us, it is the breaking of the social compacts.  I've been paying CA taxes for a quarter century in part because I supported the idea of free higher education.  This years' free education at UCLA is costing $17k.  Next year is going to be much much more.  Break the compacts and you lose the consent of the governed.  What are they gonna do?  Recall the National Guard from the 'Stan, give them live ammo and explain to them that their new jobs are to enforce tax confiscation because their old jobs are gone anyway?  Which way do you think they'd point those guns? 

well if the system was actually open about what they were really doing I think people would be able to stomach these things. It's not, and has never been, about credit....it's about solvency.

Truly we would be able to have a legitimate recovery if the system allowed itself to take the losses and fessed up to it's gorging of itself for those all important fee collection.

This will need to be done several more times just this year alone.

Can't have a real bottom without it.

Ciao
MS

Real hunters use spears with stone points. While wearing boarskin loincloths.

Re medical records - there's a surprising amount of manual labor. For instance, it might cost $22/claim for processing alone. Also, an automated standardized metric makes fraud detection easier.

Like click- fraud, there are incentives for most parties to look the other way, or misrepresent the true level of fraud.

the financial system must be un locked

"We" should create the

Bank of the United States of America

by-pass the banks that have become the whores of the shadow banking world...

and loan directly to, individuals, businesses, students borrowing money to go to trade schools or colleges, etc

Investment banks could borrow money from the Bank of the United States of America under strict terms

betcha Gordon Browne would like to have all that gold he sold for about $300 an ounce back for this.

I think he was put in charge because of that bone-headed move. You sold it so you deal with not having it.

Ciao
MS

What are they gonna do? Recall the National Guard from the 'Stan, give them live ammo and explain to them that their new jobs are to enforce tax confiscation because their old jobs are gone anyway? Which way do you think they'd point those guns?
Rob Dawg | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 1:48 pm | #

Remember Kent State? Most cops on the job now are too young to have learned that lesson. I know first-hand that cops behave like good soldiers. They follow orders and they don't challenge authority. There are some 800,000 cops in the U.S., all trained to respond to conflict with force.

Cops don't have a lot of conflict resolution skills in their toolbag. If civil protest breaks out, it will require uncommon leadership on both sides not to escalate into a dangerous situation.

Regarding the question of how long this will take.  naked capitalism referenced a paper by Reinhart & Rogoff a couple days ago.  Trough to peak unemployment for the average financial crisis is 4.8 years.  Average peak to trough home price declines are 6 years.  Peak to trough equity price declines are 3.4 years.  And average peak to trough real per capita GDP declines are 1.9 years.

Of course, those are averages and this crisis would look to be global and therefore considerably worse than average.

10 page pdf:
http://ws1.ad.economics.harvard.edu/faculty/rogoff/files/Aftermath.pdf

Morocco Bama: didja remind him that the thing works differently from the movies, that you actually have to load it and when the rounds have been spent, reloaded?

When they shut down the cell phones and internet, maybe enough of them will come up out of the ether and do something about it.

John R(Va) writes: I am puzzled by what the Obama folks will be doing that will reward good behavior.

Wha? Man, dey gwynne be like spit on a hot griddle, no time for thinking things through. Just do. Then get on the idiot box and make 'em feel good about it. Shit, it'll all work out, relax.

The 8-1 ratio of retail space between the US and the UK is obviously not an apples to apples comparison because land is much cheaper in the US, due to lower population density and laxer greenbelting policies.
Fair Economist | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 2:10 pm | #

Yes and no.  "Land" is cheaper except when it isn't.  Our retail isn't all in the outer zone.  Is Rodeo Drive reall that much cheaper than Saville Row?  The UK has the population density of Conneticut.  Is Conneticut over retailed?  Are their land use policies that much laxer?

People remember Leary for LSD but he was an Internet pioneer, too.

"the most dangerous man in America" - Richard Nixo

Morocco Bama 2:27 pm |

"That's overcapacity. It'll only take a second for a cluster bomb to eviscerate you, or a couple of seconds for a tank to crush your head."

that why asymmetrical war was invented

Feckless Ness(Excellent) writes:
Depends on the type of incident as to how many cops are on the job. Cops couldn't get to work after Katrina - police stations and vehicles were all under water. Communication systems down. There is no command and control in that situation.

It'll be great fun shooting the poor and the disenfranchised and singing "America Fuck Yeah!" for a few days. Then there's that whole "nobody cares and "the money ran out" aspect. How many months will your troops fight without pay?

We've had local protests that went well because the organizers kept the cops in the loop

I bet being largely affluent and white helped a lot too.

Groups can stay organized via cell phone, GPS, etc., and even move out of the way when cops need to isolate" troublemakers.

Don't you work for the cops? What are you protesting, negroes roaming free outside of prisons and bantustans?

This is the kind of leadership I'm referring to - a willingness to work together to keep everybody safe.

And by safe, you mean, under control and doing what they're told.

many will drop the pretense and join the defense of community
Volker the Viking | 01.03.09 - 2:27 pm | #

I concur.

Question Rob-

If one could package up the largest 30 MSAs in America, what would the artificial land mass's area encompass?

A few Western European countries, I would guess.

Now, add the secondary and tertiary markets that encompass the bulk of our country's land mass and you'd probably get an equilibrium ratio of 5:1 with UK.

Not that equilibriums mean anything in near time, of course.

Gotta scoot, thanks meta, rob and FE.

The momster just spent 3 or 4 days in the hospital at taxpayer expense, including putting in a pacemaker, which she had been thinking about anyhow before the mugging. How much did this cost? I dunno, got no bill. $20-30 grand, I assume; she was in the intensive care unit. Maybe twice that. Now, if that much money was spent on crime investigation after the first flimflam success (and there were some clues to go on), watching her house etc, methinks the bad guys would have been caught. At far lower an expense.

And, as to the let 'em go judge. Hah, I'd just like them to be caught so we knew who they are.

Just as the banks are insolvent, the justice system is right here, right now broken and getting worse. Do we not have anarchy because the cops are not staring us in the face or because most people follow the real rules (as opposed to what you read in the criminal statutes) most of the time? I think the latter. I also think that the authorities will provide enough food to avoid starvation, which is often the trigger for riotous behavior.

Someone paid Egypt a lot of something?

ground assault in Gaza

YouTube - The Doors - The end 

over by Monday, just a weekend news cycle event kicked off (pun intended) just prior to NFL playoffs

bread and circus and all that

Byz, I'm not expecting my CalPERS pension to survive, nor do I expect Social Security to be there.

I don't recall insulting you. Why so touchy?

BTW - I work for a cop shop, but I'm about as different from their culture as one can be. This must be what Margaret Meade felt like.

Thanks, Mock. It sure beats the alternative. ; )

Feckless Ness, don't take it personally, at least he rated you "Excellent". And good luck with the 3% @ 50.

You have identified the situation as clearly untenable - yet is your expectation that it will continue indefinitely?
citizen energyecon | Homepage | 01.03.09 - 2:25 pm | #

I absolutely do not expect it to continue indefinitely.  But looking at the situation, I expect the straw that breaks the camel's back to come from some other direction, not FCB's suddenly going on buyer's strike.  Not sure yet what direction that is, but it's out there lurking.

Feckless Ness(Excellent) writes:
I don't recall insulting you. Why so touchy?

You're a willing servant of a corrupt state? As the armed robbers say, you're "holding down the crowd" while Ben and Hank clean out everyone's wallets.

Look around you, your nation is a corrupt, racist prison camp watched by millions of cameras. You should contemplate suicide every night if you're part of that.

I mean, get a grip on the world around you. Nobody but other cops, cop-fanciers and a bunch of aging white racists thinks of the police as their friends. Everyone else has become your enemy because you hold them in captivity while their children's futures are looted.

What are you thinking? Don't you have some kind of actual talent other than spending money you don't have to lock people up in living death in prisons you can't afford?

Israeli spokesman on CNN now. Notice yellow tie. It's a signal to superiors back home.

Feckless Ness,
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins writes:
"Feckless Ness(Excellent)... You're a willing servant of a corrupt state?"

Am I the only one enjoying the irony in this? Don't feel picked on, he says the same stuff about other professions he doesn't like.

But Feckless, I thought CalTrans workes were considered "Public Safety Workers", at least another Caltrans poster said so. Just want to have my facts straight, what is DBP formula for Caltrans, and does it include COLAs?

Don't be a bully, Byz. It's unbecoming.