"As a Loan Sale Advisor for the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation ("FDIC"), First Financial Network, Inc. ("FFN") is pleased to provide FDIC the opportunity to acquire certain assets offered from time to time. The portfolio consists of 722 Performing and Non-performing loans totaling $485MM that were originated by the recently closed Silver State Bank, Henderson, Nevada for which the FDIC is acting as receiver.
The majority of the loans are located in Arizona and Nevada and over 76% of the portfolio is currently performing. The loans will be pooled according to performance, collateral type, borrower relationship and location. Additional information will be posted as received."
So, the pensions are the actual owners of the Detroit autos. If they were smart, they would demand liquidation to send them into recivership so that someone compentent could take the helm.
That would allow entities both public and private to refund their pension funds as well as keep more workers on the payroll ... \t mmckinl | \t \t \t \t01.09.09 - 7:35 pm | #How about VA for all? From what I hear, the most efficient healthcare system in America -- at providing healthcare, not extracting cash.
How about VA for all? From what I hear, the most efficient healthcare system in America -- at providing healthcare, not extracting cash.
Bob Dobbs
~~~~~~~~~~
Only Medicare has the manpower to move forward ... Of course the whole system would have to be reformed to cut our health care bill from 17% of GDP to 10% of GDP.
How about this !
A RADICAL PLAN TO REDUCE UNEMPLOYMENT
Just maybe it is time to lower the workweek from 40 hours to say 36. We've done this before when we enacted the law and it has worked all these years.
By implementing Medicare for All employers could then give 10% raises too compensate for the raise in pay ...
By reducing the work week 10% that would give us at least 6-8% more jobs right away! This would help part timers that want more work too.
Almost a year ago, the PBGC announced they were increasing exposure to diversified equity investments in their $55 Billion portfolio. I wonder how that has worked out for them?
I say we give 10k to every legal US resident over 18 (as long as they made less than 100k in 08). Cheaper than bailing banksters (more than 8.6 Trillion committed till date).
That and universal health care.. screw the AMA, other health professional lobbies and insurance companies.
Cutting the work week from 40 to 36 sounds great. Except all the places I've worked for at least the last decade made workers work nights and weekends w/o overtime (which is why I like being a contractor). Does anybody get overtime anymore outside of the govt and unionized manufacturing?
How about giving anyone who needs a job a pony, and then paying them to ride it around in circles? Oh wait, Keynes already thought of that one (though I think his idea was burying money and then paying people to dig it up).
How many of you realize that we have probably lost a bit more than 3 million jobs this year (and over 2 million of them were in the last 3 months). Add the job loss among illegal immigrants in low wage industries and that is a lot of hurt!
I think we should lower wages and use monthly profit bonuses. That puts labor in a more competitive place and could share more in the effort.
joe after the 12 pack | 01.09.09 - 7:48 pm | #
I agree in principle, but there are too many ways to monkey with "profit." Should be tied to outcomes the employee can control.
How about giving anyone who needs a job a pony, and then paying them to ride it around in circles? Oh wait, Keynes already thought of that one (though I think his idea was burying money and then paying people to dig it up).
MLM
~~~~~
I see you are getting dizzy , better get off the pony ...
I guess that is why I liked the auto service business. All of the mechanics got paid on production. I got what I paid for. The best made out real well and the marginal got what they deserved.
Feckless Ness writes:
I think we should lower wages and use monthly profit bonuses. That puts labor in a more competitive place and could share more in the effort.
joe after the 12 pack | 01.09.09 - 7:48 pm | #
I agree in principle, but there are too many ways to monkey with "profit." Should be tied to outcomes the employee can control.
Feckless Ness | 01.09.09 - 7:51 pm | #
Piecework. Yeah, that's it!
Million job losses per month....pension timebombs waiting to explode....housing tanking, CRE implosion, treasury debt boondoggles coming, tax reciepts cratering, municipal and state govt's BK coming, and the industries of (at a minimum) finance and insurance, housing, auto, airlines, retail, raw material, energy and oil, consumer discretionary and the entire lower, middle and upper middle classes on the ropes, with the required feedback loops feeding into and intensifying all of the above......2009 should be a doozy.
I like a final solution to this unemployment problem better. We use all the mothballed commercial jets (and new but unsold Boeing jets coming off the assembly line) to economically cleanse the US of newly unemployed, discouraged workers (and their kids) and social security recipients: ship them to the west bank bantustan next to Israel and let the Israeli's blockade supplies, declare war against them and refuse to listen to UN resolutions that call for a cease fire.
None of these partial solutions (like concentration camps) will work. We need final solutions.
I watched Jim Lehrer and the discussions were calm and reasoned(I also watch Charlie Rose).
Afterwards surfed the commercial stations and was shocked by how load and aggressive the hosts were - Lou Dobbs, Mathews, Kudlow, the ESPN guy (back,back,back), and Billy Mills screaming about cheap crap(I don't watch Fox). It is amazing how loud TV has become.
While I am on a rant, the "Championship" game last night took 3 1/2 hours. No way a college football game should exceed 2 1/2 hours - unwatchable.
I see you are getting dizzy , better get off the pony ... mmckinl | 01.09.09 - 7:52 pm | #
The problem isn't more jobs, it's more worthwhile work. Having every employer do the equivalent of a 10% layoff and then rehire untrained people may not be the best idea you've ever had -- bank holidays I'm a little more sympathetic to.
"I agree in principle, but there are too many ways to monkey with "profit." Should be tied to outcomes the employee can control.
Feckless Ness | 01.09.09 - 7:51 pm | #
Piecework. Yeah, that's it!
001 | 01.09.09 - 7:55 pm | #"
I personally think anybody who screwed with a real profit sharing will screw themselves real fast now days. Then there are those who will.
Meanwhile in Canada.. Vancouver might go broke without federal help.
Vancouver could be on hook for $875-million for athletes village
FRANCES BULA
Globe and Mail Update
January 9, 2009 at 7:02 PM EST
VANCOUVER The lender financing the Olympic athletes village has refused to provide any money since September, according to a special city of Vancouver briefing Friday.
That has put the city in the position of having to cover the developers' bills $100-million as of this month.
And the city has no guarantee that the lender, Fortress Investment, will come back to the table.
As well, according to the briefing, the city has a legal obligation to finish the project according to the original plans. That means coming up with another $458-million.
//It's only just begun. Consumers will get scared and start the belt tightening. With 70% of GDP consumer goods.... Ouch!
Blackhalo | 01.09.09 - 8:00 pm | #//
Something to consider. If housing is over valued and consumers stop buying, profits gone, then there is a chance labor has to be layed off and new lower cost labor brought in.
How about all the employees take a hit and not have massive lay offs?
So how is Vancouver going to come up almost a billion in spare change? I think that it will be the first major city in Canad to require a federal lifeline or go bankrupt.
lucifer(Unrated) writes:
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins, Did you notice that the non-seasonally adjusted unemployed numbers went up from 10.015 million in Nov 08 to 10.999 (odd) in Dec 08?
"Does anybody get overtime anymore outside of the govt and unionized manufacturing?"
max flatow | 01.09.09 - 7:47 pm | #
I work for a major non union company. We get ot pay. For the last 6-7 years there was little to no ot available for our dept. Now that we decreased new truck purchases I am working 55+ hours a week keeping older trucks running...My job happens to be very counter cyclical.
If housing is over valued and consumers stop buying, profits gone, then there is a chance labor has to be layed off and new lower cost labor brought in.
How about all the employees take a hit and not have massive lay offs? joe after the 12 pack | 01.09.09 - 8:02 pm | #
The problem isn't more jobs, it's more worthwhile work. Having every employer do the equivalent of a 10% layoff and then rehire untrained people may not be the best idea you've ever had -- bank holidays I'm a little more sympathetic to.
MLM
~~~~~
Then the employers train the people ... like they should anyway ... We've done this before ... as soon as the shift is made it will get much easier.
Lucifer,
Smart recognizes when cold becomes cruel, and acts first. Smart recognizes that the Euro is tied to the dollar.
Other folks don't quite get that. Where do you stand ?
lucifer writes:
I have.. more than few times.. unless you are suggesting that it is already bankrupt.
Lucifer I don't believe you. I think your full of crap. Relate in some detail one experience you have had in Vancouver... and make an intelligent informed comment on Vancouver Real Estate.
Automaker pensions have been underfunded for years, if not decades. This is a blinding flash of the obvious to anyone who might have even glanced at their financials in recent years. Just BK GM and Chrysler and get it over with. The taxpayer is on the hook already.
This week has seemed like the post Christmas bad news dump a thon. I'm sure there's more to come.
That way depression lies. 40hrs is fine. Gov taking the healthcare burden off of employers would be HUGE.
Blackhalo
Without radical action on jobs depression is coming anyway...
The jobs that were based on consumption aren't coming back any time soon if at all. We need to transition these people to new jobs. By cutting the work week jobs open up in the right areas of work. Otherwise get ready for years of budget breaking government subsidy.
By reducing the work week 10% that would give us at least 6-8% more jobs right away! This would help part timers that want more work too
That's what's happened twice before. There's a fair number of people here who haven't actually read the history of 1935 or the post-Civil War period.
Two other things have to happen, though. The counter-ballast of federal & state employment has to be gutted, and real estate has to drop low enough to compensate for the 10% reduction in takehome wage.
I've seen very few economists that are thinking in terms of quantitative equations. Consumption has to balance production. The guys owning real estate and companies are skimming off too much take now via oligopic formations to maintain consumption.
The equation is going to balance one way or another. It would nicer if people in charge figured it out and did it voluntarily but they won't.
.
Well, the US consumer is (and will be for some time) the biggest source of demand in the world, so I guess the rest of the world is linked to the USD for now.
// Smart recognizes that the Euro is tied to the dollar.
Universal healthcare IS coming. And I am very happy about that.
It is good for people, and it is good for american business. Your healthcare should not depend on where you work, and businesses shouldn't have to provide this non-cash benny.
And the whole system of managed care parasitism needs to be scrapped out.
I've seen very few economists that are thinking in terms of quantitative equations. Consumption has to balance production. The guys owning real estate and companies are skimming off too much take now via oligopic formations to maintain consumption.
.
Broward Horne
~~~~
Agree completely, same folks that out sourced much of our manufacturing then back office.
But you still have the problem of mercantilist countries ballooning our trade deficit.
Pictures of real estate development as I drove from Capitol Hill to the Space Needle. I could easily have done 3-4x more pictures of cranes and new buildings along other routes.
Agree completely, same folks that out sourced much of our manufacturing then back office.
But you still have the problem of mercantilist countries ballooning our trade deficit
I've pondered that and I personally don't consider it a problem. It's more of an issue for the free marketeers.
The plain truth is that there's very little "comparative advantage" going on with foreign trade. It's a function of currency manipulations, current position in the credit cycle and temporary price differentials.
If you go back to the post-Civil War period, they did the opposite of 1929, they kept opening up trade and they got two depressions spanning over a 20 year period.
Tariffs are a chimera & bogeyman of the free marketeers who don't want to actually THINK or apply MORAL reasoning. They just want to toss all it all into a big magic bucket labelled "free trade" and abandon all responsibility for anything.
I've truly grown to hate their rhetoric and ignorance over the past fifteen years and I started off as one of them.
They're greedy & short-sighted and morally deficient.
.
8 years in Vancouver can be a cycle and a half. You don't understand Vancouver. The condo market is a casino. Anyone with mature experience in Vancouver RE knows that. It does not reflect the real economy. There is more HK made wealth in the pockets of residents West of Granville, than in 2/3 of the rest of the Country combined. The Indian community is not so hard off either..
Highlands Union Bank official commits suicide in Abingdon office
By Staff Report
Published January 9th, 2009 | 1 Comments
Highlands Unions chief operating officer appears to have committed suicide in the bank's office on Thursday morning.
Abingdon Police say the body of Tom Riffe was found about 7:30 a.m. in a second floor office of Highlands Union Bank, 340 West Main Street.
Riffe, 55, of 847 Old Airport Road, Bristol, Va., died of an apparently self-inflicted gunshot wound. Police say the office was secured until investigators arrived.
A firearm was found at the scene and collected as evidence. Surveillance video from the bank shows that Riffe arrived at the bank alone around 3:30 a.m.
The victims body was taken to the state crime lab in Roanoke for an autopsy. Abingdon Police are still investigating the incident.
Mot-
if everyone would go with extension to oct.15th, claim exempt or if they can go 1099...it would give us dopes the best chance at getting this country back..
I'm already on board....
my thoughts are throw me in jail, that way I can learn how to be corrupt, greedy and hang out with Madoff at lompoc...I bet I come out rich....
of course all of nest egg is untraceable starting now.....
Pissed, I will get back to you on the msg in bangkok,
also is it a flight to phuket or drive?
in some ways Jas is right, the crooks running the show have now taught us how to be crooks and not pay....
I'm a good learner.....
Popeye, I went opposite you yesterday and made good change...see last thread
yesterday....
to many bulls and people calling bottom....means bears are gonna roar....this tarp request solidifies it...
"Pissed, I will get back to you on the msg in bangkok,
also is it a flight to phuket or drive?"
We flew between Bangkok, Chang Mai, Phuket and one other city I can't remember.
Very easy and cheap. You can book flights while you are there. There are buses/trains but a very long journey and not worth the money you save as all the flights were probably around $50 each way.
Thanks....any recommendations you have on place to stay on beach would be most appreciated.....or any others...damn I love thai food, getting hungry now thinking about it.....
Per the other thread. Fascinating story about the Pioneers, and a brilliant idea on the part of Vietnamese government.
It looks like the boomer generation is going to get wiped out. Maybe a few perks left. Their kids will get even less. Not a good time to be age 40 or over for a lot of people.
"I assume that the meek chinese are going to accept starvation and poverty, after seeing the good life. sarcasm"
They're not. And my wife is of the opinion the government will use major force as they have in the past. The PBOC will hold the country together at all costs regardless of what the West says of it's methods; if things get bad enough.
I do not doubt that the government will use a lot of force - "the stick". The real question is "what is the carrot"?
//They're not. And my wife is of the opinion the government will use major force as they have in the past. The PBOC will hold the country together at all costs regardless of what the West says of it's methods; if things get bad enough.
Pissed Off In California | 01.09.09 - 8:39 pm | #
//
Went to Whistler in August 2008. The sea-to-sky highway was an absolute disaster (drove it within a week of the reopening after the landslide washout near Horseshoe). At five points, traffic was stopped to the point where people were out of their cars pissing by the side of the road, eating, smoking and yakking at others. This is the main traffic artery to the ski/snow events and if it's done on time (bet the NO FUCKING WAY line on this) where exactly are all the people going to stay/go/park up there?
Vancouver is no doubt a great, but wildly unaffordable city. Real estate is only the most obvious problem.
Prediction : Vancouver will limp to the finish line for the Olympic start, wash over the myriad of problems at the venues both in and out of town, and declare a success.
Then, people up there will sober up and realize what a large bag they have in their hands, and how truly awful the stench is.
"Thanks....any recommendations you have on place to stay on beach would be most appreciated.....or any others...damn I love thai food, getting hungry now thinking about it.....
cd | 01.09.09 - 8:38 pm | # "
Did you try Isan food last time you were there? Native, tribal food; very spicy. Local Bangkok Thais like it a lot; my wife loved it but by the end I couldn't handle it anymore; upsetting my stomach.
You only find it in the little hole in the wall places though. Let me know if you are going to Bangkok and I can ask my brother for the name/location of some good local places.
Actually one of the best places to get food in Bangkok is go to the food malls in all the malls there. Tons of different stalls, all the locals eat there. Very cheap, nutritious and tasty. Plus a lot of eye candy as well!!
I don't remember the name of the island we stayed at. It was about a 15 minute ride by long boat from the mainland around Phuket. Much better place to stay then Phuket, very laid back. But very limited with the food.
Tariffs are a chimera & bogeyman of the free marketeers who don't want to actually THINK or apply MORAL reasoning. They just want to toss all it all into a big magic bucket labelled "free trade" and abandon all responsibility for anything.
I've truly grown to hate their rhetoric and ignorance over the past fifteen years and I started off as one of them.
They're greedy & short-sighted and morally deficient.
.
Broward Horne
~~~~
I agree completely with your post ... The question is : What do we do now ?
I for one want tariffs ... We should dump the WTO. The WTO has turned into a guarantee for Big Pharma and other patent holders profiteering. The WTO also forbids quite a few environmentally friendly initiatives ...
On trade I'm open to suggestions. I think the situation is fluid and that Business has used up its' positions.
Don't count out Arsenio Hall. Remember, people thought Howie Mandell was outre in the mid80's, with the squeaky voice comedy, and blowing up a balloon over his head. But then Bobby's World came along, then "deal or no deal" and now "Howie Do it".
SOMETHING IS DEEPLY WRONG AND I CAN'T QUITE PUT MY FINGER ON IT.
Pre-TARP, it was at least arguable all those programs you mentioned were "different". Post-TARP, they all essentially devolve to the same bet on Treasuries.
pissed, I will pick your brain at various times..dont want to personalize thread...plus food is on...
thanks again...funny thing about that eye candy is when I'm on irving street, local supermarket or in downtown its all over too...helps to be tall and only blonde around..
definitely the minority here....
I lived last 2 yrs in fremont and the new delhi crowd was just getting to me....easily worst drivers in world there...plus they are about as friendly as a cornered badger...they dont have much trust in us white boys...
Public Defined Benefit Pension Plans are toast and the taxpayers are stuck. Just one more sinking ship to observe. There is no way out of this. No belly up banks today?
The bankruptcy of Lehman Brothers in September and other financial catastrophes have completely broken consumer confidence, said Chief Executive Officer Mike Jackson of AutoNation Inc., the biggest U.S. new-car retailer. People are losing money in ways never thought possible. Theyre shook up.
Gary writes:
Ha! My wife asked me the other day, Why is Howie Mandel famous? I couldn't remember either. I think he was on Comic Relief . . . and then . . . what?
Gary | 01.09.09 - 8:53 pm | #
Ok that's it. Gary you've taken off-topic to the level of high art.
Joe AT6 Pack: the auto services industry is games just like everything else. The mechanics with the direct line to the service manager cherry pick the best paying, easiest jobs and can gross 4x what everyone else makes.
Vancouver could be on hook for $875-million for athletes village...
That situation is getting a little disturbing for us locals. It's not really a $1B sink hole - even with a serious collapse in housing prices the max liability is ~$400M - but that's still a big ole pile of money and is ~$1B swing in what was supposed to be a net gain and a cornerstone in the "no taxpayer funding!" promise for hosting the olympics.
But again - everybody knew the city was making this deal without disclosure or public input - nobody gave two shits until real estate went tits up. It's just another example of the citizenry getting exactly what they voted for.
It will also be interesting to see how many out of towners show up for the games. The moronic ticket lottery ensured that potential visitors were unable to get ticket commitments to enough events to make the trip worthwhile. They may come anyway and buy scalped tickets - or they may stay home and watch it all in high def - nobody knows at this point.
MLM / Popeye - I'd expand on the fear / paranoia equation: it's about vigilance. Not clouding emotional states or psychopathologies, but due and reasonable planning and position-taking based on the usual unholy cocktail of facts and sentiment.
Easy!
Trade well..
I'll just sit in my RM and strategy committees wondering where the modeling geniuses went wrong.
Why is Howie Mandel famous? I couldn't remember either. I think he was on Comic Relief . . . and then . . . what? Gary | 01.09.09 - 8:53 pm | #
No, no. He did St. Elsewhere, stand up and then a string of HBO specials where he would pull a surgical glove over his head and inflate it by blowing out via his nose. Then he did Bobby's World. Comic Relief was Williams, Goldberg and Crystal
mmckiml..oops..I posted eary this week, the largest furniture myf. in our county had been leaving for China for the last five years and had their building up for sale.
Bro. is county comm. and told me the building sold to a China Company last week.
The China factories will be relocating back in US as a sub and get all the tax breaks for bringing in new jobs.
Big pharma should be shunned by the American people just by refusing to take anything not myf.'ed in US.
Counterpointer writes:
MLM / Popeye - I'd expand on the fear / paranoia equation: it's about vigilance. Not clouding emotional states or psychopathologies, but due and reasonable planning and position-taking based on the usual unholy cocktail....
Uffish Thought writes:
Joe AT6 Pack: the auto services industry is games just like everything else. The mechanics with the direct line to the service manager cherry pick the best paying, easiest jobs and can gross 4x what everyone else makes.
Uffish Thought | 01.09.09 - 9:01 pm | #
Pretty much any businessman is there to make money and will maximize the best talent he has. I owned independent shops and yes I catered to who was the best and most profitable. That is the value of knowing your craft and proving it. Dealerships were to political for me I worked at one for a month hated it.
The Olympics are a great television event. And internet event. Since the games are on over-the-air HD, and synched to the US time zones, I wouldn't bother attending live unless I had plenty of free time and free money. People will still buy tickets, but most of them are really going to the TicketKing et al. brokers in hopes of making a killing. They won't, and the bath will be a macrocosm of the Police World tour last year. IOW : Bathville.
Besides, the point of going to the events live is hoping to score some tail in the Olympic village. When the reality hits that it's just a bunch of Canucks lurching around bitching that they didn't win any gold medals this time either, it's gonna be gloom city. On the plus side, all the Roots stuff will be 75% off in no time flat.
I'm just about ready to put my foot down on this whole fiasco. No more sunspots for anybody till you dismantle the Federal Reserve, stop all this happy horseshit, and start living within your means. And one more thing, abide by the Constitution I gave you. DailyTech - Sun Makes History: First Spotless Month in a Century
...Jeeze....I leave my 'puter for the day and you guys let everything go to Hell in a hand-basket. Stocks are down, Big-3's pension plans are upside down BIG-TIME, Boeing is contributing to the employment crash, and a million people are REALLY out of work this month. I'm glad I didn't leave for the weekend, otherwise things could have REALLY gotten bad. Well, Florida beat the pants off the Sooners - that's at least some good news.
Mr. T. writes:
Million job losses per month....pension timebombs waiting to explode....housing tanking, CRE implosion, treasury debt boondoggles coming, tax reciepts cratering, municipal and state govt's BK coming, and the industries of (at a minimum) finance and insurance, housing, auto, airlines, retail, raw material, energy and oil, consumer discretionary and the entire lower, middle and upper middle classes on the ropes, with the required feedback loops feeding into and intensifying all of the above......2009 should be a doozy.
Anony - yeah, looks ok this weekend, just some interesting RM stuff to get across. I'm still in finance, and same outfit, it's just a bit different going forward. Less strategy, more RM. Frankly the strategy dudes have potentially a bigger problem than I do. But, erm, one that is very challenging.
So I can goof around a bit, thusly ... of course the Mustang must be saved:
Just to reiterate a point made a few days ago. It is a FALLING Dollar that helps finance a huge deficit. So the question remains what will happen to the Dollar with a 1.2 trillion+ deficit in 2009...
From Across the Curve ... The Japanese economy is mired in the same morass as the rest of the industrial worls. The Japanese economy has a huge export component and anything that makes exports less competitive is frowned on.If the Japanese do intervene that would mean purchases of Treasuries and generally in the front end of the Treasury curve.
Quite in contrast to Germany, where underfunded (private) pension plans (e.g. employee pension funds) are "verboten". (So wie es sich gehört.)
So, my pension is save. Hihi.
For those that are advocating a shorter work week, the work week has shrunk to it's lowest level ever according to the data.
The average work week shrank to a record-low 33.3 hours from 33.5 hours, todays figures showed. Average weekly hours worked by production workers dropped to 39.9 hours from 40.3 hours, while overtime decreased to 3 hours from 3.3 hours. That brought the average weekly earnings down by $2 to $611.39.
I'm kinda glad I don't have a pension or any type of retirement, at least I haven't lost anything...This is getting depressing...I guess that's why they call it a re...errr..depression...
cant think of one single thing mock turtle | 01.09.09 - 9:28 pm | #
Plenty of food. Fantastic productivity as a result of tech advances. It is bad, but not that bad. The fabulously wealthy may have to work for a living afer all. Boomers get to retire at 78.
Gary, Broward. The choice is division of labor or central planning by bureaucrats. Think West Germany vs East Germany 1950-1990.
Try to have some faith in 6 billion individual human beings, we are not all idiots. The problem lies with bureaucratic do-gooders who are playing God with other people's hard-earned fruits of labor and capital. Destroy division of labor through a destruction of the medium of exchange and socialism/corporatism and society will fall apart.
IWannaknow writes:
mmckiml..oops..I posted eary this week, the largest furniture myf. in our county had been leaving for China for the last five years and had their building up for sale.
Bro. is county comm. and told me the building sold to a China Company last week.
The China factories will be relocating back in US as a sub and get all the tax breaks for bringing in new jobs.
Big pharma should be shunned by the American people just by refusing to take anything not myf.'ed in US.
IWannaknow | 01.09.09 - 9:04 pm | #
~~~~
Thanks for the info ... So now we will be paying Chinese companies for jobs they create here.
What's to stop other countries from coming here and putting all our domestic companies out of business with tax rebates ? Oh, and you know those southern states will kick in legal bribery for their presence ...
popeye - what's 885 or spit? Is that equities stuff? I don't do equities - I analyse equities all day - but personally do currencies. Last play was 98% upside return.
Wahooooya.
Will have another crack in Feb and April. Returns may be down but still very tasty.
mock turtle writes: \tthe maple has a face value of 5 dollars canadian!! mock turtle | 01.09.09 - 9:32 pm | # ----- You laugh, but that is one reason I stock up on a higher percentage of SCMLs than I do ASEs.
I try to stock up on Kookaburras, Eagles, and Maple Leafs, but for an American, I'm rather fond on the Canadians' silver coin for bulk collecting. If Silver ever does tank to some lower-than-dirt value, I still have some forex play in 'em.
(My favorite looking silver coin are the Kookaburras.)
C
The "modeling geniuses" are gonna have to start studying The Gravitational Effects of Noncompact Extra Liabilities.
I think the economic string theorist modelers went wrong when they refined their model by claiming that the strings vibrated in ten dimensions, six of which were curled into manifolds too small to see.
It also did not help when they ignored the classic Einstein quote "...And thus we drift toward unparalled catastrophe."
No one needs to tout fear - If you are not scared, you are either stupid or short.
Popeye
I seriously don't see what good being short is in relation to fear. Yeah, you are probably going to make some nice returns...But if it's as bad as many of us fear, what will your "cash" be worth anyway. Unless your long beans, rice and ammo; you should probably be terrified.
Blackhalo
Plenty of food. Fantastic productivity as a result of tech advances. It is bad, but not that bad. The fabulously wealthy may have to work for a living afer all. Boomers get to retire at 78.
Blackhalo | 01.09.09 - 9:31 pm | #
i cant argue with the tech argument...you are probably right!
and i cant argue with the schaudenfrued the Xers feel about seeing the boomers work till death
but as for the food thing
talk to me in 6 months
food production has been takeen over by the mega corporations and most people dont have a clue how to grow a potato
all hail ADM
---how bout this
we were a net exporterr in 29
importer today
we loaned money to the world in 29
we borrow a billion a day just to survive
the fed gov didnt owe much to anybody least of all foreigners
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins writes:
...Praise no pension until it has seen your widow to her grave...
Well yes, that is true. Since nothing in life (except the laws of nature) is for sure, I may still run into problems there. But not funding problems for the employee pension. Our government pension (which is practically mandatory for any employee, since not everyone has an (additional) employee pension) however is the same Ponzi-Scheme as your Social-Security and may run due to Germanys low birth rate into problems.
This economy is so fundamentally out of whack that, lacking appropriate intervention, it's headed for a depression. So, the meaning of "appropriate intervention" becomes important.
It's becoming increasingly clear to me that policymakers 'thought' they knew how to prevent one, but are now questioning as to whether that's actually the case.
We have Paulson, admitting "there is no plan," and we have Bernanke engaged in massive Friedman-style quantitative easing that Krugman has already--and thoroughly--debunked.
So, it seems that good old-fashioned Keynesian stimulus is about the only way to prime the pump, and it seems that what Obama is planning will not be enough assuming, that is, you believe the CBO numbers.
Boys and girls, I suggest everyone pull their prayer rugs, secret decoder rings and rabbits' feet out of the closet and hope for some good luck.
Sadly, no. I'm not big on organized religion although I understand the power of prayer on the human psyche. Prayer is probably a good idea at this point, it couldn't hurt but I can't help seeing the hypocrisy in asking for help after the primrose path we've chosen.
mp, good evening to you and Conjure, I hope you are both well.
mmckinl...I'm in one of those southern states...Toyota has put off their plant underconstruction near Tupelo with no future date for restart..Things are as they have never been in my lifetime..It's only my opinion, but there will be no money from any states for any ECON. Development
China has DOLLARS and don't need any help from any state to get here and set up, just set back and watch.
Super Robot Taisen Original Generation is a great game that manages to make a giant robot anime come alive in a turn based tactics format. Had great fun playing this afternoon, and in just a few minutes. =)
Comrade Kristina writes:
...I'm kinda glad I don't have a pension or any type of retirement...
Comrade Kristina, as hard as it may be, you may better take a serious look at it, for that is not an irrelevant subject.
For a retirement you usually need the power of "compound interest", so you need to start early ! (and also, don't underfund.)
Later, when you need your retirement money you will be glad to have it.
Werner, that's why I married a man almost ten years my Junior...He is my retirement account. Seriously though, thanks, I know what you are saying and you are right.
mock, chicken's are great. You can make so many wonderful dishes with eggs. My personal favorite is the Frittata I learned to make as a girl (Italian American family). I was in charge of "picking' eggs from the families chickens.
"lawyerliz writes:
I read that Madoff's crime equalled 2 or 3 years of normal crime. So assuming 3 years of crime, crime will have quadrupled last year."
Yeah, reminds me of those analogies/anecdotes about Extremistan. When the mean value of fraud is, say $600, and one fraud case comes and blows away the mean so it's now $2400...
75% of American workers are not eligible for a pension when they retire. Why is it that 75% who don't get one have to guarantee through their taxes the 25% who do. This would be a good starting point for a revolt.
Time to watch Eagle Eye. Those video cameras they got pointed at my face at intersections are beginning to bug me.
By "universal health care", I hope you don't mean "medicare for everyone". There are many specialties that would just walk away. There would be no anesthesiologists. Hope you have a high pain tolerance, mmckinl.
Lawyerliz, I think with stack gardening you could pull it off if you focus on veggies that can well. We had Rhode Island Reds and they were great layers. Here in Florida we should be well off so far as growing, we have a super long growing season and fish.
Exactly liz. Besides, we can grow in the cooler months as well, greens grow great in the late fall. Trust me, we have it great compared to what the Northern cities will endure.
By "universal health care", I hope you don't mean "medicare for everyone". There are many specialties that would just walk away. There would be no anesthesiologists. Hope you have a high pain tolerance, mmckinl.
dr munch | 01.09.09 - 10:15 pm | #
Here's an instructional video for future reference. It's too cool.
lawyerliz(Excellent) writes: Prolly not. Work too hard.
Key component of hardscrabble affluence -- shiftless relatives.
The economic value of spinsters and bachelors is quite considerable both in childrearing and in household chores like watering the garden and other cottage industry.
You totally need one or more friends / relatives who can't hold jobs malingering around and working for you. If they can milk the goats, run the cheese press, rob the hens, waer the garden, do smallholding farming ancillary work, and put dinner on the table most days, that's a massive infusion of productivity into the household economic unit.
The nuclear family is a twisted creation of suburbia and car culture. You need grannies and 17 y/o girls who won't hold with their ma any more and come live with auntie. The bigger the household, the bigger the prosperity, so long as it's kept in hand.
Not enough money in the world to service the debt with the depression, stimulus needs, and sovereign debt services. For all the lending Japan and China did the US Treasuries, they are much more indebted. Too many BIG borrowers, not enough lenders. Bonds will skyrocket and then fail.
Yes, they could print, but how to keep the lid on and how to distribute. Distribution, even by helicopter, will only assist debt service and velocity at the margins.
It is too late. Something big must default. Something else big must fail. Something must die. Soon.
Sing China home.
"Well I woke up this mornin'
Looked outdoors
I can tell my milk cow
I can tell by the way she lows
If you see my milk cow
Please drive her on home
Cuz I ain't had no milk and butter
Since That cow been gone" YouTube - Eddie Cochran - Milk Cow Blues
We may have discovered that the present global financial and economic systems are intrinsically unstable, poorly put together.
This economic disaster is going to spread out into other, personal spheres and public domains. We'll be lucky to avoid General War within a year or so (he's looking for us now).
Israel is throwing tons of HE around a heavily populated area. It looks to me like a slow-rolling 9-11.
Ukraine is being slowly but inexorably crushed.
The NATO commander in Afghanistan has just stated that the alliance may have to pull out of the country because of the global financial crisis. But there is no bellum interruptus.
The nuclear family is a twisted creation of suburbia and car culture. You need grannies and 17 y/o girls who won't hold with their ma any more and come live with auntie. The bigger the household, the bigger the prosperity, so long as it's kept in hand.
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins
if you cant make work for your two holed corn pickers....you need to create more eggs, and layers get pissy in the winter.
Or, in the spirit of Rev. Wright, God Damn President Obama!!
Morocco Bama | Homepage | 01.09.09 - 10:28 pm | #
Uhm no, that would be "God damn America"...and really, who could argue at this point? We've brought the entire world down with us with our arrogance and excess...
Bush Prepares to Ask for Second Tranche of Bailout Funds max flatow | 01.09.09 - 10:30 pm | #
Please, pretty please tell me that ship has sailed. Giving that level of power and influence to this administration, this late in the game would not seem smart.
First?
first loser!
Who isn't underfunded these days?
I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is taking place on these premises.
When the inconvenient reality of BK comes we will get the retirement bill anyway.
Stick a TARP in 'em.
The PBGC is another bailout waiting to happen. - CR
Understatement of the day.
Did anyone see the <b>Fiscalis</b> on PBS Nightly Business Report.
So, how do we make this an asset?
My kids college 529 statement came in the mail today. It's underfunded too.
My 401k is underfunded.
Social Security is underfunded.
My daughter's public school is underfunded.
The city budget is underfunded, so are the cops, firemen, and parks.
My checking account is underfunded.
I don't have enough to live the life I thought I was entitled to.
SOMETHING IS DEEPLY WRONG AND I CAN'T QUITE PUT MY FINGER ON IT.
"Who isn't underfunded these days?"
BK lawyers
It's the government's fault, they forced the banks to make risky loans. That's what Sean Hannity told me anyway.
Got a link for theFiscalis on YouTube
<a href=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jnc0PbRr2VE>
Fiscalis - NBR's Fiscal Stimulus Commercial</a>Its hilarious, of a sort.
SOMETHING IS DEEPLY WRONG AND I CAN'T QUITE PUT MY FINGER ON IT.
Average Person
lol
Got a link for theFiscalis on YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jnc0PbRr2VE
Fiscalis - NBR's Fiscal Stimulus Commercial</a>Its hilarious, of a sort.
How many of you missed the real news that BLS numbers for non-seasonally adjusted unemployment show that we lost almost a million jobs in Dec 08?
Larry Flynt's underfunded.
With Pleasure:
"As a Loan Sale Advisor for the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation ("FDIC"), First Financial Network, Inc. ("FFN") is pleased to provide FDIC the opportunity to acquire certain assets offered from time to time. The portfolio consists of 722 Performing and Non-performing loans totaling $485MM that were originated by the recently closed Silver State Bank, Henderson, Nevada for which the FDIC is acting as receiver.
The majority of the loans are located in Arizona and Nevada and over 76% of the portfolio is currently performing. The loans will be pooled according to performance, collateral type, borrower relationship and location. Additional information will be posted as received."
@lucifer: link please for BLS numbers?
So, the pensions are the actual owners of the Detroit autos. If they were smart, they would demand liquidation to send them into recivership so that someone compentent could take the helm.
What does everyone think the chances of a Tax Revolt is based on the govwenment lunacy?
Is cash and trade coming back to America?
Its BFF, right? Sheila better get off her ass this week.
million jobs in Dec 08
Might explain all that national crashing of unemployment phones/websites.
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins,
Did you notice that the non-seasonally adjusted unemployed numbers went up from 10.015 million in Nov 08 to 10.999 (odd) in Dec 08?
Medicare for All ...
That would allow entities both public and private to refund their pension funds as well as keep more workers on the payroll ...
lucifer - it was a rounding thingy
Might explain all that national crashing of unemployment phones/websites.
Speed | 01.09.09 - 7:34 pm | #
Merry Christmas, Happy New Year, don't come back... Kind of like Chryler shutting down factories for the holidays. The will be dark for a while.
Ministry of Truth,
I'm about ready to join the tax revolt. I'm looking to do it legally, at least initially.
If they give a tax-refund bailout to the homebuilders, I might dispose with the legality issues.
Does Mexico or India export their fully equivalent fiscalis, with only maybe a pill shape change?
I need a cheaper ficalis than the patented US version, to keep up with demand for my services.
mmckinl(Unrated) writes:
\tMedicare for All ...
That would allow entities both public and private to refund their pension funds as well as keep more workers on the payroll ...
\t mmckinl | \t \t \t \t01.09.09 - 7:35 pm | #How about VA for all? From what I hear, the most efficient healthcare system in America -- at providing healthcare, not extracting cash.
Tax Revolt is based on the government lunacy
Let's start with a spend-in, where we stop buying things we don't need. Less of a chance of ending up in court that way.
Read an article recently about two couples who decided to buy everything "used" for a year, sans food, toothpaste, etc.
Table A1, sixth line of data (unemployed - not seasonally adjusted)-PDF version of BLS report.
--
@lucifer: link please for BLS numbers?
max flatow | 01.09.09 - 7:34 pm | #"
--
McMansions will come in handy when Granny & Grandad's pension checks stop coming and they have to move in with their kids.
A RADICAL PLAN TO REDUCE UNEMPLOYMENT
Just maybe it is time to lower the workweek from 40 hours to say 36. We've done this before when we enacted the law and it has worked all these years.
By implementing Medicare for All employers could then give 10% raises too compensate for the raise in pay ...
By reducing the work week 10% that would give us at least 6-8% more jobs right away! This would help part timers that want more work too.
More than a million people lost their jobs in Dec 08.. ouch!!! The jedi will feel this one..
mmckinl - how about for every week of paid vacation, the government pays for an additional week...
By implementing Medicare for All employers could then give 10% raises too compensate for the raise in pay ..
mmckinl | 01.09.09 - 7:39 pm | #
I'm thinking I would prefer U.S. labor to be more competitve globally, not less.
@lucifer: thanks - wow indeed!
Just maybe it is time to lower the workweek from 40 hours to say 36.
mmckinl | 01.09.09 - 7:39 pm | #
Why not 35? It's worked so well for the French.
Really, how much of a pounding can the fragile USD take, before it caves ?
How about VA for all? From what I hear, the most efficient healthcare system in America -- at providing healthcare, not extracting cash.
Bob Dobbs
~~~~~~~~~~
Only Medicare has the manpower to move forward ... Of course the whole system would have to be reformed to cut our health care bill from 17% of GDP to 10% of GDP.
How about this !
A RADICAL PLAN TO REDUCE UNEMPLOYMENT
Just maybe it is time to lower the workweek from 40 hours to say 36. We've done this before when we enacted the law and it has worked all these years.
By implementing Medicare for All employers could then give 10% raises too compensate for the raise in pay ...
By reducing the work week 10% that would give us at least 6-8% more jobs right away! This would help part timers that want more work too.
"The PBGC is another bailout waiting to happen."
Almost a year ago, the PBGC announced they were increasing exposure to diversified equity investments in their $55 Billion portfolio. I wonder how that has worked out for them?
In Policy Shift, PBGC Turns to Stock Market - Capital Markets - CFO.com
When do you left coasters get News Hour w/Jim Lehrer tonight?
Good stuff on economics tonight.
I say we give 10k to every legal US resident over 18 (as long as they made less than 100k in 08). Cheaper than bailing banksters (more than 8.6 Trillion committed till date).
That and universal health care.. screw the AMA, other health professional lobbies and insurance companies.
Barley writes:
mmckinl - how about for every week of paid vacation, the government pays for an additional week...
~~~~
Many people have no paid vacation and quite a few have 6 weeks ... wouldn't work unless you mandated vacation time.
As long as other countries produce more than they can consume, the US consumer is very important.. and therefore...
--
Really, how much of a pounding can the fragile USD take, before it caves ?
bearly | 01.09.09 - 7:42 pm | #
--
I'm thinking I would prefer U.S. labor to be more competitve globally, not less.
Blackhalo
~~~~
Tariffs ... they are coming anyway ... It's the only way we stop a 6% trade deficit.
By your reasoning we should go the other direction to 60 hour workweeks ... how would that work for employment?
Cutting the work week from 40 to 36 sounds great. Except all the places I've worked for at least the last decade made workers work nights and weekends w/o overtime (which is why I like being a contractor). Does anybody get overtime anymore outside of the govt and unionized manufacturing?
How about giving anyone who needs a job a pony, and then paying them to ride it around in circles? Oh wait, Keynes already thought of that one (though I think his idea was burying money and then paying people to dig it up).
When do you left coasters get News Hour w/Jim Lehrer tonight?
Good stuff on economics tonight.
Outsider | 01.09.09 - 7:44 pm | #
6 p.m. PST. Thanks for the heads up, O.
"Why not 35? It's worked so well for the French."
I think the French bailed on that last year due to uncompetitiveness.
The 40hr work week came from The first depression. It was a maximum allowed.
I think we should lower wages and use monthly profit bonuses. That puts labor in a more competitive place and could share more in the effort.
As long as other countries produce more than they can consume, the US consumer is very important
This is key to note. US production is overseas, so when consumers stop consumers, the pain is exported.
Don't underestimate the USD. Take a look at Germany's last bond auction.
How many of you realize that we have probably lost a bit more than 3 million jobs this year (and over 2 million of them were in the last 3 months). Add the job loss among illegal immigrants in low wage industries and that is a lot of hurt!
This cannot be a good omen..
Just maybe it is time to lower the workweek from 40 hours to say 36.
mmckinl | 01.09.09 - 7:39 pm | #
Why not 35? It's worked so well for the French.
MLM
~~~~~
I seriously think that the leaders of the G7 could work to lower the workweek .... They all have problems.
And of course France has over a month off every summer and weeks of personal time during the year ...
I think the French bailed on that last year due to uncompetitiveness.
joe after the 12 pack | 01.09.09 - 7:48 pm | #
Sorry, I realized after I hit the publish button that I should have added the "snark" tag.
I think we should lower wages and use monthly profit bonuses. That puts labor in a more competitive place and could share more in the effort.
joe after the 12 pack | 01.09.09 - 7:48 pm | #
I agree in principle, but there are too many ways to monkey with "profit." Should be tied to outcomes the employee can control.
Where's mine?
I'm a nice guy.
I didn't shake down the Congress for 750 B.
How about giving anyone who needs a job a pony, and then paying them to ride it around in circles? Oh wait, Keynes already thought of that one (though I think his idea was burying money and then paying people to dig it up).
MLM
~~~~~
I see you are getting dizzy , better get off the pony ...
Pound Sand My Fiends..... pound sand.
I guess that is why I liked the auto service business. All of the mechanics got paid on production. I got what I paid for. The best made out real well and the marginal got what they deserved.
Feckless Ness writes:
I think we should lower wages and use monthly profit bonuses. That puts labor in a more competitive place and could share more in the effort.
joe after the 12 pack | 01.09.09 - 7:48 pm | #
I agree in principle, but there are too many ways to monkey with "profit." Should be tied to outcomes the employee can control.
Feckless Ness | 01.09.09 - 7:51 pm | #
Piecework. Yeah, that's it!
Million job losses per month....pension timebombs waiting to explode....housing tanking, CRE implosion, treasury debt boondoggles coming, tax reciepts cratering, municipal and state govt's BK coming, and the industries of (at a minimum) finance and insurance, housing, auto, airlines, retail, raw material, energy and oil, consumer discretionary and the entire lower, middle and upper middle classes on the ropes, with the required feedback loops feeding into and intensifying all of the above......2009 should be a doozy.
Time to go long I guess.
I like a final solution to this unemployment problem better. We use all the mothballed commercial jets (and new but unsold Boeing jets coming off the assembly line) to economically cleanse the US of newly unemployed, discouraged workers (and their kids) and social security recipients: ship them to the west bank bantustan next to Israel and let the Israeli's blockade supplies, declare war against them and refuse to listen to UN resolutions that call for a cease fire.
None of these partial solutions (like concentration camps) will work. We need final solutions.
[/snark, for the unconscious]
Re: PBS Newshour
I watched Jim Lehrer and the discussions were calm and reasoned(I also watch Charlie Rose).
Afterwards surfed the commercial stations and was shocked by how load and aggressive the hosts were - Lou Dobbs, Mathews, Kudlow, the ESPN guy (back,back,back), and Billy Mills screaming about cheap crap(I don't watch Fox). It is amazing how loud TV has become.
While I am on a rant, the "Championship" game last night took 3 1/2 hours. No way a college football game should exceed 2 1/2 hours - unwatchable.
Jim
I see you are getting dizzy , better get off the pony ...
mmckinl | 01.09.09 - 7:52 pm | #
The problem isn't more jobs, it's more worthwhile work. Having every employer do the equivalent of a 10% layoff and then rehire untrained people may not be the best idea you've ever had -- bank holidays I'm a little more sympathetic to.
Popeye writes:
Pound Sand My Fiends..... pound sand.
When the only thing you see ahead is fear, you have become prey.
In the end, it is just logic.
Tariffs ... they are coming anyway ... It's the only way we stop a 6% trade deficit.
mmckinl | 01.09.09 - 7:47 pm | #
That way depression lies. 40hrs is fine. Gov taking the healthcare burden off of employers would be HUGE.
"I agree in principle, but there are too many ways to monkey with "profit." Should be tied to outcomes the employee can control.
Feckless Ness | 01.09.09 - 7:51 pm | #
Piecework. Yeah, that's it!
001 | 01.09.09 - 7:55 pm | #"
I personally think anybody who screwed with a real profit sharing will screw themselves real fast now days. Then there are those who will.
When the only thing you see ahead is fear, you have become prey.
Popeye | 01.09.09 - 7:56 pm | #
Only the paranoid survive, Popeye.
Meanwhile in Canada.. Vancouver might go broke without federal help.
Vancouver could be on hook for $875-million for athletes village
FRANCES BULA
Globe and Mail Update
January 9, 2009 at 7:02 PM EST
VANCOUVER The lender financing the Olympic athletes village has refused to provide any money since September, according to a special city of Vancouver briefing Friday.
That has put the city in the position of having to cover the developers' bills $100-million as of this month.
And the city has no guarantee that the lender, Fortress Investment, will come back to the table.
As well, according to the briefing, the city has a legal obligation to finish the project according to the original plans. That means coming up with another $458-million.
Vancouver taxpayers on hook for $875-million athletes village - The Globe and Mail
This cannot be a good omen..
lucifer | 01.09.09 - 7:49 pm | #
It's only just begun. Consumers will get scared and start the belt tightening. With 70% of GDP consumer goods.... Ouch!
"When the only thing you see ahead is fear, you have become prey.
Popeye | 01.09.09 - 7:56 pm | #
Only the paranoid survive, Popeye."
And the sober.
Also called "The sum of all fears"
//It's only just begun. Consumers will get scared and start the belt tightening. With 70% of GDP consumer goods.... Ouch!
Blackhalo | 01.09.09 - 8:00 pm | #//
--
Something to consider. If housing is over valued and consumers stop buying, profits gone, then there is a chance labor has to be layed off and new lower cost labor brought in.
How about all the employees take a hit and not have massive lay offs?
Consumers will get a lot more than scared.....try jobless and broke.
What is it Obi Wan?
I sensed a disturbance in the BLS . . . as if a million voices cried out at once.
So how is Vancouver going to come up almost a billion in spare change? I think that it will be the first major city in Canad to require a federal lifeline or go bankrupt.
Who started that 'left' coast thing anyway...was that Bush too? Every time i see that, I wince, like hearing chalk screech. Must be Bush...
mmckinl writes:
How about giving anyone who needs a job a pony, and then paying them to ride it around in circles?
Let's make it simple with this stimulus program. Give each person a shovel in the morning then cash in the evening.
No way a college football game should exceed 2 1/2 hours - unwatchable.
NC Jim | 01.09.09 - 7:56 pm | #
1.5 hrs of commercials. Never again.
No kidding.. It is additional 5 million in the next 6 months, that scare me..
//I sensed a disturbance in the BLS . . . as if a million voices cried out at once.
Gary | 01.09.09 - 8:03 pm | #//
Left coast has been around since before Bush.
Vancouver going BK...hahahaha... you've never been to Vancouver obviously..
And the sober.
Pissed Off In California | 01.09.09 - 8:00 pm | #
Oh, well I'm fucked then.
I laugh with and at us all. But when I smell fear on the street, I'm inclined to spend.
You all can hold out for more fear if you want to, but stupid is as stupid does.
Did you hear that Europe is freezing ? Are you cognizant ?
lucifer(Unrated) writes:
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins,
Did you notice that the non-seasonally adjusted unemployed numbers went up from 10.015 million in Nov 08 to 10.999 (odd) in Dec 08?
Can you give me a pointer for that?
"Does anybody get overtime anymore outside of the govt and unionized manufacturing?"
max flatow | 01.09.09 - 7:47 pm | #
I work for a major non union company. We get ot pay. For the last 6-7 years there was little to no ot available for our dept. Now that we decreased new truck purchases I am working 55+ hours a week keeping older trucks running...My job happens to be very counter cyclical.
Chris
Kondratieff canuk,
I have.. more than few times.. unless you are suggesting that it is already bankrupt.
If housing is over valued and consumers stop buying, profits gone, then there is a chance labor has to be layed off and new lower cost labor brought in.
How about all the employees take a hit and not have massive lay offs?
joe after the 12 pack | 01.09.09 - 8:02 pm | #
How then do they pay for houses?
Who started that 'left' coast thing anyway
Kondratieff canuk | 01.09.09 - 8:04 pm | #
My money is on Rush or one of his dittoheads.
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins,
Look at Table A1, sixth line of data (unemployed - not seasonally adjusted)in the PDF version of BLS report.
--
Can you give me a pointer for that?
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins | Homepage | 01.09.09 - 8:06 pm | #
I never thought left coast was a political allusion, rather a directional one.
Oh wait, Keynes already thought of that one (though I think his idea was burying money and then paying people to dig it up).
MLM
MLM, I posted a warning a few threads ago that anyone bringing up this canard was due for a ball-kicking. You have been warned!
The problem isn't more jobs, it's more worthwhile work. Having every employer do the equivalent of a 10% layoff and then rehire untrained people may not be the best idea you've ever had -- bank holidays I'm a little more sympathetic to.
MLM
~~~~~
Then the employers train the people ... like they should anyway ... We've done this before ... as soon as the shift is made it will get much easier.
Where's the Bank Holiday ?
"How then do they pay for houses?
Blackhalo | 01.09.09 - 8:07 pm | # "
From their savings they probably don't have. Problem with edge living. One should save 20% of their gross earnings.
Lucifer,
Smart recognizes when cold becomes cruel, and acts first. Smart recognizes that the Euro is tied to the dollar.
Other folks don't quite get that. Where do you stand ?
lucifer writes:
I have.. more than few times.. unless you are suggesting that it is already bankrupt.
Lucifer I don't believe you. I think your full of crap. Relate in some detail one experience you have had in Vancouver... and make an intelligent informed comment on Vancouver Real Estate.
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins,,
I think your idea of 20% U6 by end of Mar 09 looks more likely than before.. though I still think that TSWHTF between April-July09.
I had thought that Sep-15-08 would occur around May 08.. I was off by a few months.
Lucifer,
I know you are not quick, so I will point out that Euro economics depends upon Russian fuel. That was me being nice.
Automaker pensions have been underfunded for years, if not decades. This is a blinding flash of the obvious to anyone who might have even glanced at their financials in recent years. Just BK GM and Chrysler and get it over with. The taxpayer is on the hook already.
This week has seemed like the post Christmas bad news dump a thon. I'm sure there's more to come.
Cut the Work Week !
That way depression lies. 40hrs is fine. Gov taking the healthcare burden off of employers would be HUGE.
Blackhalo
Without radical action on jobs depression is coming anyway...
The jobs that were based on consumption aren't coming back any time soon if at all. We need to transition these people to new jobs. By cutting the work week jobs open up in the right areas of work. Otherwise get ready for years of budget breaking government subsidy.
By reducing the work week 10% that would give us at least 6-8% more jobs right away! This would help part timers that want more work too
That's what's happened twice before. There's a fair number of people here who haven't actually read the history of 1935 or the post-Civil War period.
Two other things have to happen, though. The counter-ballast of federal & state employment has to be gutted, and real estate has to drop low enough to compensate for the 10% reduction in takehome wage.
I've seen very few economists that are thinking in terms of quantitative equations. Consumption has to balance production. The guys owning real estate and companies are skimming off too much take now via oligopic formations to maintain consumption.
The equation is going to balance one way or another. It would nicer if people in charge figured it out and did it voluntarily but they won't.
.
Well, the US consumer is (and will be for some time) the biggest source of demand in the world, so I guess the rest of the world is linked to the USD for now.
// Smart recognizes that the Euro is tied to the dollar.
Popeye | 01.09.09 - 8:11 pm | #//
Lucifer,
I can repost my tutorial on exchange rates, if you've hade too many martynyssss.
Universal healthcare IS coming. And I am very happy about that.
It is good for people, and it is good for american business. Your healthcare should not depend on where you work, and businesses shouldn't have to provide this non-cash benny.
And the whole system of managed care parasitism needs to be scrapped out.
I've seen very few economists that are thinking in terms of quantitative equations. Consumption has to balance production. The guys owning real estate and companies are skimming off too much take now via oligopic formations to maintain consumption.
.
Broward Horne
~~~~
Agree completely, same folks that out sourced much of our manufacturing then back office.
But you still have the problem of mercantilist countries ballooning our trade deficit.
Kondratieff canuk,
A few examples, out of many..
1] On my last visit to Van in July 00, TD was offering 107% MEW.
2] I looked at a few condos (for fun), and a coal harbor 550 sq foot condo was going for just over a million.
3] I have read statistics on income in Canada (including Van). Price-Income ratio is very askew.
Pictures of real estate development as I drove from Capitol Hill to the Space Needle. I could easily have done 3-4x more pictures of cranes and new buildings along other routes.
http://www.realmeme.com/roller/page/realmeme?entry=capitol_hill_to_space_needle
.
MinisterofTruth...Tax revolt would have to be all or none...
Two many fed/state/county/city/employee's.
But it appears no revolt will be needed, no one is gonna have a job.
Those that make the decisions for us have yet to figure that out yet.
mmckinl writes:
How about giving anyone who needs a job a pony, and then paying them to ride it around in circles?
Let's make it simple with this stimulus program. Give each person a shovel in the morning then cash in the evening.
asl hearts lenin
~~~~~
I'm using my shovel right now. To bury your leavings ...
Sure..
But exchange rate equations work under ordinary steady state conditions. I am not sure that we are living in one right now.
//I can repost my tutorial on exchange rates, if you've hade too many martynyssss.
Popeye | 01.09.09 - 8:17 pm | #//
I last visited Van in July O8 (sorry for the typo)
lucifer writes:
Sure..
But exchange rate equations work under ordinary steady state conditions. I am not sure that we are living in one right now.
Ok, then. We understand each other.
Agree completely, same folks that out sourced much of our manufacturing then back office.
But you still have the problem of mercantilist countries ballooning our trade deficit
I've pondered that and I personally don't consider it a problem. It's more of an issue for the free marketeers.
The plain truth is that there's very little "comparative advantage" going on with foreign trade. It's a function of currency manipulations, current position in the credit cycle and temporary price differentials.
If you go back to the post-Civil War period, they did the opposite of 1929, they kept opening up trade and they got two depressions spanning over a 20 year period.
Tariffs are a chimera & bogeyman of the free marketeers who don't want to actually THINK or apply MORAL reasoning. They just want to toss all it all into a big magic bucket labelled "free trade" and abandon all responsibility for anything.
I've truly grown to hate their rhetoric and ignorance over the past fifteen years and I started off as one of them.
They're greedy & short-sighted and morally deficient.
.
8 years in Vancouver can be a cycle and a half. You don't understand Vancouver. The condo market is a casino. Anyone with mature experience in Vancouver RE knows that. It does not reflect the real economy. There is more HK made wealth in the pockets of residents West of Granville, than in 2/3 of the rest of the Country combined. The Indian community is not so hard off either..
Highlands Union Bank official commits suicide in Abingdon office - Kingsport Times-News Online
Highlands Union Bank official commits suicide in Abingdon office
By Staff Report
Published January 9th, 2009 | 1 Comments
Highlands Unions chief operating officer appears to have committed suicide in the bank's office on Thursday morning.
Abingdon Police say the body of Tom Riffe was found about 7:30 a.m. in a second floor office of Highlands Union Bank, 340 West Main Street.
Riffe, 55, of 847 Old Airport Road, Bristol, Va., died of an apparently self-inflicted gunshot wound. Police say the office was secured until investigators arrived.
A firearm was found at the scene and collected as evidence. Surveillance video from the bank shows that Riffe arrived at the bank alone around 3:30 a.m.
The victims body was taken to the state crime lab in Roanoke for an autopsy. Abingdon Police are still investigating the incident.
Lucifer,
Trade well - - think -- and trade well.
in other words
they raided the pension funds
would be a crime
if your name was made-off
Kondratieff canuk,
I last visited Vancouver in July 2008.. (sorry for the first typo). I am not sure the traditional asian buyer is going to come around this time.
I think William Gibson, the author, is going to be more accurate than many economics gurus on what we have to look forward to.
Pensions? I weep for those who think they have one. I can see a politican using as a slogan "Old Folks Deserve 1 Meal a Day!"
Mot-
if everyone would go with extension to oct.15th, claim exempt or if they can go 1099...it would give us dopes the best chance at getting this country back..
I'm already on board....
my thoughts are throw me in jail, that way I can learn how to be corrupt, greedy and hang out with Madoff at lompoc...I bet I come out rich....
of course all of nest egg is untraceable starting now.....
Pissed, I will get back to you on the msg in bangkok,
also is it a flight to phuket or drive?
in some ways Jas is right, the crooks running the show have now taught us how to be crooks and not pay....
I'm a good learner.....
Popeye, I went opposite you yesterday and made good change...see last thread
yesterday....
to many bulls and people calling bottom....means bears are gonna roar....this tarp request solidifies it...
good trading, belvedere lemon drop about ready..
YEA BH...You said it well.
Awesome pictures, Broward. Tower cranes have always been a good sign to me. I just hope their not a sign of hubris in this case.
Lucifer,
The question here is time. In all fairness, I think you are about out of that resource.
We stand at odds.
That's just a fact.
their =they're. oops
I do not trade currencies.. but as a system- we are running out of time.
//Lucifer,
The question here is time. In all fairness, I think you are about out of that resource.
//
"Pissed, I will get back to you on the msg in bangkok,
also is it a flight to phuket or drive?"
We flew between Bangkok, Chang Mai, Phuket and one other city I can't remember.
Very easy and cheap. You can book flights while you are there. There are buses/trains but a very long journey and not worth the money you save as all the flights were probably around $50 each way.
lucifer(Unrated) writes:
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins,
Look at Table A1, sixth line of data (unemployed - not seasonally adjusted)in the PDF version of BLS report.
Thanks Lucifer.
As for things blowing out, a friend with connects in China tells me that Canton saw 600,000 layoffs.
This week.
cd,
You are a good mind. You took no money from me.
I'm pleased you won.
We are at or near bottom. All money is time. This time you won without hurting me.
If/when I win, I hope it will not hurt you.
Trade well.
Mock, you made it back from the liquor store!
I assume that the meek chinese are going to accept starvation and poverty, after seeing the good life. sarcasm
//As for things blowing out, a friend with connects in China tells me that Canton saw 600,000 layoffs.This week.//
Pissed,
Thanks....any recommendations you have on place to stay on beach would be most appreciated.....or any others...damn I love thai food, getting hungry now thinking about it.....
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins
Per the other thread. Fascinating story about the Pioneers, and a brilliant idea on the part of Vietnamese government.
It looks like the boomer generation is going to get wiped out. Maybe a few perks left. Their kids will get even less. Not a good time to be age 40 or over for a lot of people.
"I assume that the meek chinese are going to accept starvation and poverty, after seeing the good life. sarcasm"
They're not. And my wife is of the opinion the government will use major force as they have in the past. The PBOC will hold the country together at all costs regardless of what the West says of it's methods; if things get bad enough.
popeye,
to you as well, in fact I would hope all here win..
I do not doubt that the government will use a lot of force - "the stick". The real question is "what is the carrot"?
//They're not. And my wife is of the opinion the government will use major force as they have in the past. The PBOC will hold the country together at all costs regardless of what the West says of it's methods; if things get bad enough.
Pissed Off In California | 01.09.09 - 8:39 pm | #
//
The Vancouver Olympics will be interesting.
Went to Whistler in August 2008. The sea-to-sky highway was an absolute disaster (drove it within a week of the reopening after the landslide washout near Horseshoe). At five points, traffic was stopped to the point where people were out of their cars pissing by the side of the road, eating, smoking and yakking at others. This is the main traffic artery to the ski/snow events and if it's done on time (bet the NO FUCKING WAY line on this) where exactly are all the people going to stay/go/park up there?
Vancouver is no doubt a great, but wildly unaffordable city. Real estate is only the most obvious problem.
Prediction : Vancouver will limp to the finish line for the Olympic start, wash over the myriad of problems at the venues both in and out of town, and declare a success.
Then, people up there will sober up and realize what a large bag they have in their hands, and how truly awful the stench is.
"Thanks....any recommendations you have on place to stay on beach would be most appreciated.....or any others...damn I love thai food, getting hungry now thinking about it.....
cd | 01.09.09 - 8:38 pm | # "
Did you try Isan food last time you were there? Native, tribal food; very spicy. Local Bangkok Thais like it a lot; my wife loved it but by the end I couldn't handle it anymore; upsetting my stomach.
You only find it in the little hole in the wall places though. Let me know if you are going to Bangkok and I can ask my brother for the name/location of some good local places.
Actually one of the best places to get food in Bangkok is go to the food malls in all the malls there. Tons of different stalls, all the locals eat there. Very cheap, nutritious and tasty. Plus a lot of eye candy as well!!
I don't remember the name of the island we stayed at. It was about a 15 minute ride by long boat from the mainland around Phuket. Much better place to stay then Phuket, very laid back. But very limited with the food.
"I do not doubt that the government will use a lot of force - "the stick". The real question is "what is the carrot"?"
In China I think sometimes not actually using force is the "carrot".
Tariffs are a chimera & bogeyman of the free marketeers who don't want to actually THINK or apply MORAL reasoning. They just want to toss all it all into a big magic bucket labelled "free trade" and abandon all responsibility for anything.
I've truly grown to hate their rhetoric and ignorance over the past fifteen years and I started off as one of them.
They're greedy & short-sighted and morally deficient.
.
Broward Horne
~~~~
I agree completely with your post ... The question is : What do we do now ?
I for one want tariffs ... We should dump the WTO. The WTO has turned into a guarantee for Big Pharma and other patent holders profiteering. The WTO also forbids quite a few environmentally friendly initiatives ...
On trade I'm open to suggestions. I think the situation is fluid and that Business has used up its' positions.
Pensions will go the way of the Dodo bird and Arsenio Hall.
CBR
occifer occifer
i am not under the afluence of incahol
With an excess of 20 million guys + internet (even if it is censored) + exposure to the good life, a real carrot might be necessary.
//In China I think sometimes not actually using force is the "carrot".
Pissed Off In California | 01.09.09 - 8:46 pm | #
//
Don't count out Arsenio Hall. Remember, people thought Howie Mandell was outre in the mid80's, with the squeaky voice comedy, and blowing up a balloon over his head. But then Bobby's World came along, then "deal or no deal" and now "Howie Do it".
The Dodo bird, though, I'll concede.
F Vancouver !
SOMETHING IS DEEPLY WRONG AND I CAN'T QUITE PUT MY FINGER ON IT.
Pre-TARP, it was at least arguable all those programs you mentioned were "different". Post-TARP, they all essentially devolve to the same bet on Treasuries.
So yeah - something is deeply, deeply wrong.
Larry Flynt's underfunded.
No worries, TARPagra will take care of that.
pissed, I will pick your brain at various times..dont want to personalize thread...plus food is on...
thanks again...funny thing about that eye candy is when I'm on irving street, local supermarket or in downtown its all over too...helps to be tall and only blonde around..
definitely the minority here....
I lived last 2 yrs in fremont and the new delhi crowd was just getting to me....easily worst drivers in world there...plus they are about as friendly as a cornered badger...they dont have much trust in us white boys...
Ha! My wife asked me the other day, Why is Howie Mandel famous? I couldn't remember either. I think he was on Comic Relief . . . and then . . . what?
lucifer writes:
With an excess of 20 million guys + internet (even if it is censored) + exposure to the good life, a real carrot might be necessary.
Lol.... Lucifer.... LOL,
For a small fee, I'll teach you the term "married". But, in the mean time, enjoy.
Mr. America writes:
F Vancouver !
You're a little busy right now doing that in the Middle E and Afghanistan, and at home, with what you do own. Be content for awhile.
Public Defined Benefit Pension Plans are toast and the taxpayers are stuck. Just one more sinking ship to observe. There is no way out of this. No belly up banks today?
U.S. Drivers Keep Autos Longer, Shun Showrooms on Job-Loss Risk
U.S. Drivers Hold On to Autos, Shun Showrooms on Job-Loss Risk - Bloomberg.com
ya think..
The bankruptcy of Lehman Brothers in September and other financial catastrophes have completely broken consumer confidence, said Chief Executive Officer Mike Jackson of AutoNation Inc., the biggest U.S. new-car retailer. People are losing money in ways never thought possible. Theyre shook up.
mike jackson is auto industries bill gross
shill!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Public Defined Benefit Pension Plans
Whenever I ask people whether their pensions are defined benefits or defined contribution, they generally stare at me (It could just be me).
Gary writes:
Ha! My wife asked me the other day, Why is Howie Mandel famous? I couldn't remember either. I think he was on Comic Relief . . . and then . . . what?
Gary | 01.09.09 - 8:53 pm | #
Ok that's it. Gary you've taken off-topic to the level of high art.
Pissed Off In California wrote:
And the sober.
Pissed Off In California | 01.09.09 - 8:00 pm | #
Damn, there goes my single malt!
Joe AT6 Pack: the auto services industry is games just like everything else. The mechanics with the direct line to the service manager cherry pick the best paying, easiest jobs and can gross 4x what everyone else makes.
And what's the deal with airline food?
Vancouver could be on hook for $875-million for athletes village...
That situation is getting a little disturbing for us locals. It's not really a $1B sink hole - even with a serious collapse in housing prices the max liability is ~$400M - but that's still a big ole pile of money and is ~$1B swing in what was supposed to be a net gain and a cornerstone in the "no taxpayer funding!" promise for hosting the olympics.
But again - everybody knew the city was making this deal without disclosure or public input - nobody gave two shits until real estate went tits up. It's just another example of the citizenry getting exactly what they voted for.
It will also be interesting to see how many out of towners show up for the games. The moronic ticket lottery ensured that potential visitors were unable to get ticket commitments to enough events to make the trip worthwhile. They may come anyway and buy scalped tickets - or they may stay home and watch it all in high def - nobody knows at this point.
MLM / Popeye - I'd expand on the fear / paranoia equation: it's about vigilance. Not clouding emotional states or psychopathologies, but due and reasonable planning and position-taking based on the usual unholy cocktail of facts and sentiment.
Easy!
Trade well..
I'll just sit in my RM and strategy committees wondering where the modeling geniuses went wrong.
C
Why is Howie Mandel famous? I couldn't remember either. I think he was on Comic Relief . . . and then . . . what?
Gary | 01.09.09 - 8:53 pm | #
No, no. He did St. Elsewhere, stand up and then a string of HBO specials where he would pull a surgical glove over his head and inflate it by blowing out via his nose. Then he did Bobby's World. Comic Relief was Williams, Goldberg and Crystal
mmckiml..oops..I posted eary this week, the largest furniture myf. in our county had been leaving for China for the last five years and had their building up for sale.
Bro. is county comm. and told me the building sold to a China Company last week.
The China factories will be relocating back in US as a sub and get all the tax breaks for bringing in new jobs.
Big pharma should be shunned by the American people just by refusing to take anything not myf.'ed in US.
This kid's a go-getter
Tips for Getting Rich: Knock on Mansion Doors, Invade Privacy - Bloomberg.com
Counterpointer writes:
MLM / Popeye - I'd expand on the fear / paranoia equation: it's about vigilance. Not clouding emotional states or psychopathologies, but due and reasonable planning and position-taking based on the usual unholy cocktail....
.... did someone say coctail ??
Thanks C, point taken.
Counterpointer
Can we still expect you to make your posts this weekend?
-a fa
Uffish Thought writes:
Joe AT6 Pack: the auto services industry is games just like everything else. The mechanics with the direct line to the service manager cherry pick the best paying, easiest jobs and can gross 4x what everyone else makes.
Uffish Thought | 01.09.09 - 9:01 pm | #
Pretty much any businessman is there to make money and will maximize the best talent he has. I owned independent shops and yes I catered to who was the best and most profitable. That is the value of knowing your craft and proving it. Dealerships were to political for me I worked at one for a month hated it.
The Olympics are a great television event. And internet event. Since the games are on over-the-air HD, and synched to the US time zones, I wouldn't bother attending live unless I had plenty of free time and free money. People will still buy tickets, but most of them are really going to the TicketKing et al. brokers in hopes of making a killing. They won't, and the bath will be a macrocosm of the Police World tour last year. IOW : Bathville.
Besides, the point of going to the events live is hoping to score some tail in the Olympic village. When the reality hits that it's just a bunch of Canucks lurching around bitching that they didn't win any gold medals this time either, it's gonna be gloom city. On the plus side, all the Roots stuff will be 75% off in no time flat.
UB
Long shrimp-peeling machines...
C
C
885 or spit.
But hey - all is ok in Vancouver - I'll be at Sundin's home "opener" in an hour.
Zivot dalje tece...
I'm just about ready to put my foot down on this whole fiasco. No more sunspots for anybody till you dismantle the Federal Reserve, stop all this happy horseshit, and start living within your means. And one more thing, abide by the Constitution I gave you.
DailyTech - Sun Makes History: First Spotless Month in a Century
CP: hehe. Anything-peeling machines these days.
Vancouver will be fine. Every Olympic venue gets crushed pre-games and comes out fine. OTOH, the whole NW real estate market hasn't poped yet.
BTW, only the Alpine/Nordic Ski and sliding events are at Whistler.
Snowboarding / freestyle ski is at Cypress: Latest News At Cypress Mountain | Cypress Mountain. This is what the cool kids want to see
...Jeeze....I leave my 'puter for the day and you guys let everything go to Hell in a hand-basket. Stocks are down, Big-3's pension plans are upside down BIG-TIME, Boeing is contributing to the employment crash, and a million people are REALLY out of work this month. I'm glad I didn't leave for the weekend, otherwise things could have REALLY gotten bad. Well, Florida beat the pants off the Sooners - that's at least some good news.
Ahh, St. Elsewhere. thanks Blackhalo. I'm out. have a good night all. I've got a couple of Magic Hat's at home with my name on them.
Mr. T - I love this. Nicely done:
Mr. T. writes:
Million job losses per month....pension timebombs waiting to explode....housing tanking, CRE implosion, treasury debt boondoggles coming, tax reciepts cratering, municipal and state govt's BK coming, and the industries of (at a minimum) finance and insurance, housing, auto, airlines, retail, raw material, energy and oil, consumer discretionary and the entire lower, middle and upper middle classes on the ropes, with the required feedback loops feeding into and intensifying all of the above......2009 should be a doozy.
Time to go long I guess.
Anony - yeah, looks ok this weekend, just some interesting RM stuff to get across. I'm still in finance, and same outfit, it's just a bit different going forward. Less strategy, more RM. Frankly the strategy dudes have potentially a bigger problem than I do. But, erm, one that is very challenging.
So I can goof around a bit, thusly ... of course the Mustang must be saved:
YouTube - Swervedriver - Son Of Mustang Ford
C
Blackhalo writes:
I have placed my bets. I have offered my rationale.
Popeye | 01.09.09 - 7:41 pm | #
I would argue that TPTB have been bending over backwards to put as much lipstick on this pig as they can until the new admin come into power.
Blackhalo,
It is with that thought in mind that I repeat .... I have placed a very serious.... very short term trade.
I am playing the middle bump in the W, and I know it. Don't follow my bets if you don't know what that means.
Just to reiterate a point made a few days ago. It is a FALLING Dollar that helps finance a huge deficit. So the question remains what will happen to the Dollar with a 1.2 trillion+ deficit in 2009...
From Across the Curve
... The Japanese economy is mired in the same morass as the rest of the industrial worls. The Japanese economy has a huge export component and anything that makes exports less competitive is frowned on. If the Japanese do intervene that would mean purchases of Treasuries and generally in the front end of the Treasury curve.
...Automaker Pensions Underfunded...
Unsurprisingly for america!
Quite in contrast to Germany, where underfunded (private) pension plans (e.g. employee pension funds) are "verboten". (So wie es sich gehört.)
So, my pension is save. Hihi.
i would ask anybody who can
to put up a statistic or a trend or a situation that is all about todays crisis
that is any better than 1929
seems like a challenge to me
cant think of one single thing
For those that are advocating a shorter work week, the work week has shrunk to it's lowest level ever according to the data.
The average work week shrank to a record-low 33.3 hours from 33.5 hours, todays figures showed. Average weekly hours worked by production workers dropped to 39.9 hours from 40.3 hours, while overtime decreased to 3 hours from 3.3 hours. That brought the average weekly earnings down by $2 to $611.39.
Werner(Excellent) writes:
So, my pension is save. Hihi.
Praise no pension until it has seen your widow to her grave.
So I have a stupid question: where do we get all this money again?
I'm kinda glad I don't have a pension or any type of retirement, at least I haven't lost anything...This is getting depressing...I guess that's why they call it a re...errr..depression...
cant think of one single thing
mock turtle | 01.09.09 - 9:28 pm | #
Plenty of food. Fantastic productivity as a result of tech advances. It is bad, but not that bad. The fabulously wealthy may have to work for a living afer all. Boomers get to retire at 78.
Gary, Broward. The choice is division of labor or central planning by bureaucrats. Think West Germany vs East Germany 1950-1990.
Try to have some faith in 6 billion individual human beings, we are not all idiots. The problem lies with bureaucratic do-gooders who are playing God with other people's hard-earned fruits of labor and capital. Destroy division of labor through a destruction of the medium of exchange and socialism/corporatism and society will fall apart.
IWannaknow writes:
mmckiml..oops..I posted eary this week, the largest furniture myf. in our county had been leaving for China for the last five years and had their building up for sale.
Bro. is county comm. and told me the building sold to a China Company last week.
The China factories will be relocating back in US as a sub and get all the tax breaks for bringing in new jobs.
Big pharma should be shunned by the American people just by refusing to take anything not myf.'ed in US.
IWannaknow | 01.09.09 - 9:04 pm | #
~~~~
Thanks for the info ... So now we will be paying Chinese companies for jobs they create here.
What's to stop other countries from coming here and putting all our domestic companies out of business with tax rebates ? Oh, and you know those southern states will kick in legal bribery for their presence ...
Mock,
My friend, at best, we were only promised a rhyme; not a copy ± paste reprint.
.... it's an adventure.
RE
i dont like the dollar either
the dollar is toast
but so are allotta other currencies
im partial to the one ounce silver canadian maple leaf
unlike the american silver eagle with a face value of 1 USD
the maple has a face value of 5 dollars canadian!!
i know i know...grasping at straws
the
Didn't someone post that the pizza shops in Cali would be busy today? I want my BFF
domestic companies out of business
mmckinl | 01.09.09 - 9:31 pm | #
Right, the guys who are outsourcing, you are worried about getting hurt by backsourcing. Fuck 'em.
Taiwan.
World upended
Big knot
popeye - what's 885 or spit? Is that equities stuff? I don't do equities - I analyse equities all day - but personally do currencies. Last play was 98% upside return.
Wahooooya.
Will have another crack in Feb and April. Returns may be down but still very tasty.
C
No one needs to tout fear - If you are not scared, you are either stupid or short.
mock turtle writes:
\tthe maple has a face value of 5 dollars canadian!!
mock turtle | 01.09.09 - 9:32 pm | #
-----
You laugh, but that is one reason I stock up on a higher percentage of SCMLs than I do ASEs.
I try to stock up on Kookaburras, Eagles, and Maple Leafs, but for an American, I'm rather fond on the Canadians' silver coin for bulk collecting. If Silver ever does tank to some lower-than-dirt value, I still have some forex play in 'em.
(My favorite looking silver coin are the Kookaburras.)
C
The "modeling geniuses" are gonna have to start studying The Gravitational Effects of Noncompact Extra Liabilities.
I think the economic string theorist modelers went wrong when they refined their model by claiming that the strings vibrated in ten dimensions, six of which were curled into manifolds too small to see.
It also did not help when they ignored the classic Einstein quote "...And thus we drift toward unparalled catastrophe."
Garsh, chick, garsh.
No one needs to tout fear - If you are not scared, you are either stupid or short.
Popeye
I seriously don't see what good being short is in relation to fear. Yeah, you are probably going to make some nice returns...But if it's as bad as many of us fear, what will your "cash" be worth anyway. Unless your long beans, rice and ammo; you should probably be terrified.
One Hot Chick - like it. Einstein also had a great line about compound interest, which I'm too lazy to link to.
C
Blackhalo
Plenty of food. Fantastic productivity as a result of tech advances. It is bad, but not that bad. The fabulously wealthy may have to work for a living afer all. Boomers get to retire at 78.
Blackhalo | 01.09.09 - 9:31 pm | #
i cant argue with the tech argument...you are probably right!
and i cant argue with the schaudenfrued the Xers feel about seeing the boomers work till death
but as for the food thing
talk to me in 6 months
food production has been takeen over by the mega corporations and most people dont have a clue how to grow a potato
all hail ADM
---how bout this
we were a net exporterr in 29
importer today
we loaned money to the world in 29
we borrow a billion a day just to survive
the fed gov didnt owe much to anybody least of all foreigners
11 trillion in debt half to japan and china alone
God help us
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins writes:
...Praise no pension until it has seen your widow to her grave...
Well yes, that is true. Since nothing in life (except the laws of nature) is for sure, I may still run into problems there. But not funding problems for the employee pension. Our government pension (which is practically mandatory for any employee, since not everyone has an (additional) employee pension) however is the same Ponzi-Scheme as your Social-Security and may run due to Germanys low birth rate into problems.
Growing things small scale is not that hard. Growing enough to actually live off of is something else altogether.
This economy is so fundamentally out of whack that, lacking appropriate intervention, it's headed for a depression. So, the meaning of "appropriate intervention" becomes important.
It's becoming increasingly clear to me that policymakers 'thought' they knew how to prevent one, but are now questioning as to whether that's actually the case.
We have Paulson, admitting "there is no plan," and we have Bernanke engaged in massive Friedman-style quantitative easing that Krugman has already--and thoroughly--debunked.
So, it seems that good old-fashioned Keynesian stimulus is about the only way to prime the pump, and it seems that what Obama is planning will not be enough assuming, that is, you believe the CBO numbers.
Boys and girls, I suggest everyone pull their prayer rugs, secret decoder rings and rabbits' feet out of the closet and hope for some good luck.
The US economy is going to need it.
Counterpointer writes:
popeye - what's 885 or spit? Is that equities stuff?
I'll answer, so long as you promise not to laugh. 885 is the spx 50 day moving average. It's a TA thing. I placed a bet on this mark; that's all.
God help us
mock turtle | 01.09.09 - 9:43 pm | #
If there is one, why should he?
Ken Lewis
Toaster Salesman
Quits Post (very soon)
ever been a better time to post a conjure clock.
11 trillion in debt half to japan and china alone
mock turtle | 01.09.09 - 9:43 pm | #
I'm just a tad less worried than these clowns should be.
Bens helicopter pratice over highsea
The moment $3million was parachuted to Somali pirates
Five Somali pirates drown as they squabble over their $3million ransom | Mail Online
5 lost at sea while swiming for money
"If you are not scared, you are either stupid or short."
That's certainly a testosterone-fueled remark.
Comrade Kristina
good point
we dont deserve much do we
Anyone got any good news?
I have know about the pension stuff for years before I ever started blogging.
Were the pension funds EVER fully funded?
we dont deserve much do we
mock turtle
Sadly, no. I'm not big on organized religion although I understand the power of prayer on the human psyche. Prayer is probably a good idea at this point, it couldn't hurt but I can't help seeing the hypocrisy in asking for help after the primrose path we've chosen.
mp, good evening to you and Conjure, I hope you are both well.
mp writes:
"If you are not scared, you are either stupid or short."
That's certainly a testosterone-fueled remark.
mmckinl...I'm in one of those southern states...Toyota has put off their plant underconstruction near Tupelo with no future date for restart..Things are as they have never been in my lifetime..It's only my opinion, but there will be no money from any states for any ECON. Development
China has DOLLARS and don't need any help from any state to get here and set up, just set back and watch.
"Anyone got any good news?"
Yes. My new electrical service went in today, and it is awesome.
At what point is it cheaper to pay your debts in blood rather than cash
locust: The anchorlady on AlJazeera right now is gorgeous.
What are those airburst shells that Israel is using? The ones that spray an inverted funnel of something. What's the something? Phosphorus?
11 trillion in debt half to japan and china alone
mock turtle | 01.09.09 - 9:43 pm | #
I'm just a tad less worried than these clowns should be.
Blackhalo | 01.09.09 - 9:47 pm | #
If the USG is the largest creditor to itself, should we be more or less worried then Japan and China?
"Anyone got any good news?"
Yes, I still have a job...for now.
"Were the pension funds EVER fully funded?"
Even if they were, the Pension Real Estate Association saw to it that it didn't last for long.
Phosphorus?
Uncle Billy, Mental Widget
Depleted Uranium?
locust(Unrated) writes:
Anyone got any good news?
Super Robot Taisen Original Generation is a great game that manages to make a giant robot anime come alive in a turn based tactics format. Had great fun playing this afternoon, and in just a few minutes. =)
"If you traded, you'd have known exactly what I said."
I know exactly what you said, and I'm telling you that it was a testosterone-fueled remark.
Have a nice day.
MP wrote
Boys and girls, I suggest everyone pull their prayer rugs, secret decoder rings and rabbits' feet out of the closet and hope for some good luck.
The US economy is going to need it.
mp | 01.09.09 - 9:44 pm | #
MP im doin all that
and plus i been listenin to dr john the night tripper
gris gris gumbo ya ya
i heard he was hanging out with conjure for a time
down in the bayou
YouTube -
must be listened to loud and with voodoo in your heart
Paulson stole my testosterone like Dr. Evil stole Austin's mojo.
Uh-oh, popeye vs mp.
My bet is on mp.
Day Trader versus Prophet. It's on.
mp writes:
"If you traded, you'd have known exactly what I said."
I know exactly what you said, and I'm telling you that it was a testosterone-fueled remark.
O.K., you are probably right.
Anonymous writes:
At what point is it cheaper to pay your debts in blood rather than cash
Anonymous | 01.09.09 - 9:52 pm |
i dont know
will have to ask
the merchant of venice
Popeye writes:
Gavshire Hathaway writes:
Market seems to have a date with S&P 875. Next week gonna be interesting!
Please note, I pulled my stops.
Popeye | 01.09.09 - 4:06 pm |
Bluto writes:
"Please note, I pulled my stops."
clown
Bluto | 01.09.09 - 4:09 pm |
Popeye | 01.09.09 - 9:51 pm |
----long and looking for information.
I read it all day people.......
Was Obama a Boy Scout? How about Shrub? Hillary? Howie Mandel?
Ha Lawyerliz, I'm with you on that one...can't imagine being on either mp's or Conjure's bad side...
Blogger Arrested In Korea For "Doom-Mongering" ... South Korean Blogger Arrested
It would appear that even immigrants have figured out the damaging effects of our culture and public schools and are voting with their feet.
Immigrants in Charter Schools Seeking the Best of Two Worlds - NY Times
Kookaburras.)
yagij | 01.09.09 - 9:39 pm | #
yagij
these aussi?
have to check it out
mock, thanks for the video, too cool.
Morocco Bama writes:
lawyerliz(Cat Loving Pasta Lover) writes....
not the last word, liz.
Don't fret
The government has not even called in the modern day Rothschild and Pierpont Morgan yet
Plus the IRS has a big chunk of $19 billion coming to it as part of the back end on that swap line to Switzerland
Blogger Arrested In Korea For "Doom-Mongering" ... http://clusterstock.alleyinsider...-doom- mongering
I hope it wasn't Jas...
"Anyone got any good news?"
Since you asked...
Daughter's year end fund statement minus 40% (ouch) Good news no exposure with Madoff
popeye - how could I laugh when my jaw is on the floor??
50 day moving averages?? OMFG.
Sorry man, like Eric says, weeping for puts ahead.
Wow.
C
2009 business week december cover: "the death of equities"
I read that Madoff's crime equalled 2 or 3 years of normal crime. So assuming 3 years of crime, crime will have quadrupled last year.
last president to be "in" scouting was carter as a scout master (was not a scout)
ford was an eagle scout
to my recollection not bush 1 or 2 nor clinton nor reagan were scouts
could well be wrong
I still watch for a conjure clock on regular schedule.....last I heard we had about 13 seconds, but in conjure time.....could be another 6 months.
whose to say but the cat?
mp, its all you......squeeze conjure by the balls and make him talk....
Comrade Kristina writes:
...I'm kinda glad I don't have a pension or any type of retirement...
Comrade Kristina, as hard as it may be, you may better take a serious look at it, for that is not an irrelevant subject.
For a retirement you usually need the power of "compound interest", so you need to start early ! (and also, don't underfund.)
Later, when you need your retirement money you will be glad to have it.
Yea SRS was up today...I think it's good news
Jas is asleep...Was out verrry early this morning. Nity nite Jas..
Nosey would be asllep to if not for the coffee she had with desert.
Good news today...worked hard...brought money home.
Werner, that's why I married a man almost ten years my Junior...He is my retirement account. Seriously though, thanks, I know what you are saying and you are right.
mp, I hear ya. How will we pay for it?
By popular demand, Conjure's Clock
CONJURE'S GLOBAL DEPRESSION CLOCK
The time is now:
11:59:54
Conjure says, "Kristina already knows what time it is."
lawyerliz
you are so right
my wife and i tried hard as we might to grow all the food we could last summer
i mean we put 3000 sq feet of ground under the till plus an orchard of 18 trees
still coudnt grow more than half of what we "needed" (wanted)?
getting chickens for eggs this spring
Ha mp, I was thinking that very thing... tapping foot wondering why everyone else is tardy
MSM Death watch continues :Seattle P.I.Newspaper
Yahoo! 404 - Page Not Found
mock, chicken's are great. You can make so many wonderful dishes with eggs. My personal favorite is the Frittata I learned to make as a girl (Italian American family). I was in charge of "picking' eggs from the families chickens.
"lawyerliz writes:
I read that Madoff's crime equalled 2 or 3 years of normal crime. So assuming 3 years of crime, crime will have quadrupled last year."
Yeah, reminds me of those analogies/anecdotes about Extremistan. When the mean value of fraud is, say $600, and one fraud case comes and blows away the mean so it's now $2400...
"How will we pay for it?"
Peronista, another way of putting that question might be:
How and will the rest of the world pay for it?
75% of American workers are not eligible for a pension when they retire. Why is it that 75% who don't get one have to guarantee through their taxes the 25% who do. This would be a good starting point for a revolt.
Time to watch Eagle Eye. Those video cameras they got pointed at my face at intersections are beginning to bug me.
My egg growing friend can't figure why her hens lay sporadically.
I wonder if the hub and I could grow enough on 2 1/2 acres to feed ourselves. Prolly not. Work too hard.
JFK was the first scout to become president.
By "universal health care", I hope you don't mean "medicare for everyone". There are many specialties that would just walk away. There would be no anesthesiologists. Hope you have a high pain tolerance, mmckinl.
Conjure - six seconds to midnight? And no thread muzic? Lawd.
Ok, we'll try to make up.
C
Lawyerliz, I think with stack gardening you could pull it off if you focus on veggies that can well. We had Rhode Island Reds and they were great layers. Here in Florida we should be well off so far as growing, we have a super long growing season and fish.
Counterpointer, mock gave us some, I'm still istening to Dr. John, way cool...I'm hooked
YouTube - The Legendary Dr. John
Yeah, but I would have to figure out tropical veggies. Meaning what would I be willing to cook and eat?
It is too friggin' hot in summer. I guess starving is worse than sweating and getting eaten by mosquitoes.
mp, if we all devalue enough it might not blow up. The world is relative. The experts are watching USD vs Yen vs Euro vs Yuan on a daily basis.
It took Spain 400 years to get from the top to absolute bottom.
Peronista - A clueless fellow who is working day and night to keep the boss happy.
Canning--now there is an almost lost art. I've seen it done, but never done it.
Exactly liz. Besides, we can grow in the cooler months as well, greens grow great in the late fall. Trust me, we have it great compared to what the Northern cities will endure.
An acquaintance of mine married Dr. John a few years ago. He is quite the, as he would say, "char-ak-ter."
So, is wave four over? I figured it would crap out either a.) today (w/ jobs report) b.) 2-3 +/- innauguration c.) Springtime (March opex).
Thoughts?
By "universal health care", I hope you don't mean "medicare for everyone". There are many specialties that would just walk away. There would be no anesthesiologists. Hope you have a high pain tolerance, mmckinl.
dr munch | 01.09.09 - 10:15 pm | #
Here's an instructional video for future reference. It's too cool.
jerry lewis without anethesia - Google Videos
One Hot Chick, meet Hoopajoops LTD
Nitey nite all.
lawyerliz(Excellent) writes:
Prolly not. Work too hard.
Key component of hardscrabble affluence -- shiftless relatives.
The economic value of spinsters and bachelors is quite considerable both in childrearing and in household chores like watering the garden and other cottage industry.
You totally need one or more friends / relatives who can't hold jobs malingering around and working for you. If they can milk the goats, run the cheese press, rob the hens, waer the garden, do smallholding farming ancillary work, and put dinner on the table most days, that's a massive infusion of productivity into the household economic unit.
The nuclear family is a twisted creation of suburbia and car culture. You need grannies and 17 y/o girls who won't hold with their ma any more and come live with auntie. The bigger the household, the bigger the prosperity, so long as it's kept in hand.
I've explained my market position - obviously too well. I stand back now.
Trade well.
Night Liz.
So, is wave four over?
I sold oil and energy on Monday after PCA constant hammering.....
Until the tax code is changed the stimulus plans
are doomed. Time to eliminate the payroll tax.
we gaurantee SS why not private pensions?
we gaurantee SS why not private pensions?
Because we don't determine the benefits?
Yes, night liz.
Not enough money in the world to service the debt with the depression, stimulus needs, and sovereign debt services. For all the lending Japan and China did the US Treasuries, they are much more indebted. Too many BIG borrowers, not enough lenders. Bonds will skyrocket and then fail.
Yes, they could print, but how to keep the lid on and how to distribute. Distribution, even by helicopter, will only assist debt service and velocity at the margins.
It is too late. Something big must default. Something else big must fail. Something must die. Soon.
Sing China home.
"Well I woke up this mornin'
Looked outdoors
I can tell my milk cow
I can tell by the way she lows
If you see my milk cow
Please drive her on home
Cuz I ain't had no milk and butter
Since That cow been gone"
YouTube - Eddie Cochran - Milk Cow Blues
We may have discovered that the present global financial and economic systems are intrinsically unstable, poorly put together.
This economic disaster is going to spread out into other, personal spheres and public domains. We'll be lucky to avoid General War within a year or so (he's looking for us now).
Israel is throwing tons of HE around a heavily populated area. It looks to me like a slow-rolling 9-11.
Ukraine is being slowly but inexorably crushed.
The NATO commander in Afghanistan has just stated that the alliance may have to pull out of the country because of the global financial crisis. But there is no bellum interruptus.
Momentum may gather until it's out of control.
God help President Obama.
we guarantee banker's bonuses why not private pensions?
The nuclear family is a twisted creation of suburbia and car culture. You need grannies and 17 y/o girls who won't hold with their ma any more and come live with auntie. The bigger the household, the bigger the prosperity, so long as it's kept in hand.
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins
if you cant make work for your two holed corn pickers....you need to create more eggs, and layers get pissy in the winter.
not a snark./
God help President Obama.
Or, in the spirit of Rev. Wright, God Damn President Obama!!
Right, the guys who are outsourcing, you are worried about getting hurt by backsourcing. Fuck 'em.
Blackhalo
~~~~
I'm worried about jobs ... I don't want a business tax deduction for new job creation ...
and like you say f the guys that are out sourcing ...
Time to eliminate the payroll tax.
sporkfed | 01.09.09 - 10:24 pm | #
What? The elete would not stand for it.
Or, in the spirit of Rev. Wright, God Damn President Obama!!
Morocco Bama | Homepage | 01.09.09 - 10:28 pm | #
Uhm no, that would be "God damn America"...and really, who could argue at this point? We've brought the entire world down with us with our arrogance and excess...
Good Lord help us...
Bush Prepares to Ask for Second Tranche of Bailout Funds
Bush Prepares Request for Rest Of Bailout Funds - washingtonpost.com
not a snark./
ham_lines | 01.09.09 - 10:26 pm | #
Made me laugh anyway...
You'll want to wish the new POTUS the best of luck, if only because your own future depends on it.
LOL Blackhalo, it's amazing the things I find amusing anymore...
Black Halo
about that food thing
BBC NEWS | Science & Environment | Heat may spark world food crisis
check out the spinning globe half way down
modeling where the shiznet really hits the fizan
dr david battisti hails from the u of dub seattle but i anint never heard nothin bout dis
hat tip yves smith over at naked capitalism where i runned across it
max flatow writes:
Good Lord help us...
Bush Prepares to Ask for Second Tranche of Bailout Funds
and Popeye bets on a moving average
Where will it all end..... where will it all end ???
you wanna put a floor under CRE?
of course not, if you really wanted to, you would roll back depreciation on Commercial to pre 86 IRS levels....
FUCK COMMERCIAL,. COLLECT A PHANTOM TAX......
and Im done. night all....
never been a better time to buy and sell unemployed two holed corn pickers.....
locust writes:
Anyone got any good news?
~~~~
I have enough food for at least 3 days ...
Where's the Bank Holiday ?
Bush Prepares to Ask for Second Tranche of Bailout Funds
max flatow | 01.09.09 - 10:30 pm | #
Please, pretty please tell me that ship has sailed. Giving that level of power and influence to this administration, this late in the game would not seem smart.