Because of "exceptionally tough market conditions in sales and trading". How about all of their failed investment vehicles. Don't blame it on their business practices, blame it on externalities.
Hey.......I thought last quarter was the kitchen sink quarter??? How about Douche Bank jumping into a whole and dying??? I hope they're hanging with Bear Stearns soon, I love loses!!! That goes for Citi and Chase as well, I don't need your stupid loans or credit. I'll say a prayer for you tonight and pray you go bankrupt.
And the same German Post that can't afford DHL will apparently be the proud owner of 8% of Deutsche Bank.
According to the radio news, this makes 'capitalizing' the deal of DB to buy the Postbank easier, especially in terms of accessing the same government funds that Commerzbank accessed in acquiring Dresdner.
More than a bit of kick the can shell game going on, to be honest.
But in contrast to the TARP, in Germany not only are such cozy arrangements create normal, they also tend to come with something resembling accountability.
Though what accountability means is very open to debate, it tends to still be real. Basically because failure tends to be treated harshly - as Merkle's suicide may indicate, compared to Madoff's bail.
I weep for all the puts I sold. bearly | 01.14.09 - 9:32 am | #
Eh, I'm sure the old or new administrations would never ever schedule a press conference light on news but heavy on happiness during opex week while the shit's hitting the fan.
DOW could have either a 9 or a 7 handle today. Or both.
Angry Saver wrote: Yeah, and all these write downs will be write ups when the elusive second half recovery arrives.
Angry Saver | 01.14.09 - 9:28 am | #
but the write-ups will occur on someone else's balance sheet, possibly the taxpayers'......
Angry Saver(Unrated) writes: Yeah, and all these write downs will be write ups when the elusive second half recovery arrives.
That's true, and that's because all those assets are just marked the way they are because the market's spooked. Once these stabilizing measures kick in and you see prices in the market that aren't influenced by this psychological effect then you are going to see lending pick up and activity return to the stock market.
Once these stabilizing measures kick in and you see prices in the market that aren't influenced by this psychological effect then you are going to see lending pick up and activity return to the stock market. Comrade Byzantine_Ruins | Homepage | 01.14.09 - 9:40 am | #
When Bear was going under (just before the JPM giveaway), all the wall streeters I know kept talking about the $87/share book value. I told them the true book value was negative. They literally laughed at me.
People can't let go of their false beliefs (dreams) for some reason. Just ask Joe Lewis (the billionaire currency trader that lost his fortune buying Bear on the way down).
I was trying to remember one of the numbers from the film that wasn't ludicrously short. I think there's one that's 10 seconds? But I didn't want to find the web page where someone spent some portion of their life archiving that information.
2009...Year of reality..What are all these people thinking. This is/was not normal behavior, no matter how for up on the pole and pay scale one might be.
Nortel filed for bankruptcy protection, wtf?!? Jennson | 01.14.09 - 9:45 am | #
Do you mean WTF as in, "WTF happened that they didn't get a piece of the TARP?"
I can answer that. Except for very limited circumstances, the TARP will not be used to help out Canadian telecom companies. As far as I know, that's the only type of company they aren't likely to prop up, and they may change their minds at some point later today.
I am a cheer leader, I love to sell koolaide, I love to drink koolaide, in high school I was voted biggest ass kisser, I am _____________ (insert favorite financial entertainer name) I am CNBC.
"I wish this wouldn't all unfold according to my expectations."
The Russia-Ukraine situation is beginning to look more serious than a dispute over the price of NG. But no matter how it's beginning to look, I think it always was more serious.
India is warning that tensions with Pakistan are increasing.
There will probably be geopolitical consequences of this financial crisis. Or perhaps one could put it this way: What caused the financial crisis will also have a bearing on geopolitical events. An international nervous breakdown.
Retail sales down double what was expected.
Bring out the smiley faces and decalre that it is all up from here...Buy, Buy,Buy I wonder how those talking head at CNBC sleep at night?
A repo is when you sell a bond to someone and simultaneously agree to buy it back later for a specified price. Effectively it is a loan collateralized by a bond.
Blazes Boylan(Unrated) writes: \tNow ist ze time on Shprockets vere ve FAIL. \t Blazes Boylan | \t \t \t \t01.14.09 - 10:06 am | # Blazes Boylan | 01.14.09 - 10:06 am | #
Did college in Shenandoah Valley and a place that I'd retire to. 3 1/2 seasons and wonderful place. Also lived in NW North Carolina and would serve as well for new home.
But now in good suburban/rural area and great place for families. Plus we have "the Corn Wagon" with great stuff.
The nice thing about being broke is nobody tries to trick you into pyramid schemes...I think Amway is my personal favorite though. Knew a guy that was an Amway junkie once, we used to try and help him out by saying we'd buy some products from him, of course he never had any products, he just wanted us to "join"...
It's safe to say that a substantial number of the 140,000 people in IT including 25,000 developers are about to do their final conversion. IT jobs are not easy to get, especially large mainframe banks jobs. I have some friends there, and I wish them well.
I wonder how low we need to get to start triggering the stop losses for those that thought the bottom was in and bought in the past few weeks? This could very ugly, very fast...Nothing like the smell of panic in the morning...
the other Hamedric Brorrywat writes:
Comrade Tech Sargent Chen,
I got tricked into Primerica pyramid scheme by my brother... Yes, my own flesh-and-blood!
the other Hamedric Brorrywat | 01.14.09 - 10:24 am |
For me it was in 1999. A coworker in the shipping dock I worked at (3rd shift mind you) offered to buy me lunch some day. We were friends so I thought nothing of it.
After he paid for the lunch, he suggested we stop by his 'office' since we were in the area. I looked at him with incredulity thinking, 'We work in a mofo shipping dock!'
We went to his office and voila, next thing I know I'm in this seminar room being told how joining a church is a great way to get new suckers. There were 5 people in the room, myself, my coworker, the speaker and a young couple with big fat shiny dollar signs in their eyes.
The next day I cursed Primerica, Citi and all of its manifestations.
The nice thing about being broke is nobody tries to trick you into pyramid schemes
My dad gets about 2-5 seminar invites per week that are hosted at restaurants. He always goes for the free food, and the hosts always get pissed when they realize he doesn't understand English.
Great question, IIRC there were also several articles out recently about how fast VIX was going down, indicating traders' reduced volatility expectations...
Since interest rates on savings accounts are so low, doesn't that mean Banks have been able to "borrow" money from all of us at very favorable interest rates?
Wow, serious redunancy and overstaffing. Dump it and merge the rest. It probably was never merged because the code is a patchwork - starting from 1960's. No one wanted to try unravel those hairballs
Stanford Economics professor predicts recession to end mid-2009, citing rapid drop in "uncertainty". (I think he is using the VIX as a proxy for uncertainty, it seems like unique thinking but doesn't quite make sense to me.)
There will probably be geopolitical consequences of this financial crisis. Or perhaps one could put it this way: What caused the financial crisis will also have a bearing on geopolitical events. An international nervous breakdown.
Pavel Chichikov | 01.14.09 - 10:02 am | #
Sadly, yes. Trade war and then the other kind...or we might just skip to the end.
giacutter(Unrated) writes: \tWhere's crispy and cole?
I need my Frazier fix. giacutter | 01.14.09 - 10:39 am | #
Back in the day our gang had a drink (actually just a renamed raspberry kazi) called the Frazier. Shoot it and in unison yell "Down goes Frazier!". Great fun.
Newsflash - grapevine indicates South Carolina has expended their unemployment benifit pool. Recently unemployeed are NOT getting checks. Is this covered by the TARP?
Clearly, the German people are just not confident enough. Probably their mainstream media bashing the economy. Why, oh why won't the mainstream media stop with the economy-bashing? It's like they don't even WANT a second-half recovery this year. Sheesh.
We're certainly not in Kansas anymore, and serious re-evaluations of national and international positions are underway.
When Russia "lost" the cold war, the understood feeling was not that, ok let's get back to peaceful terms and evaluate our treaties...the U.S. basically signaled that, you've lost -- now we're going to kick you in the face and take everything.
Now however, poisoned from within, the remaining hegemon has shown that we can't stop terrorism, quell insurgencies, hell we can't even take care of our internal weaknesses...
The U.S.S.A has learned the hard way that we can't go it alone. It will be news to many people.
Wow, serious redunancy and overstaffing. Dump it and merge the rest. It probably was never merged because the code is a patchwork - starting from 1960's. No one wanted to try unravel those hairballs
nova
Each business has been operating with its own back office, Pandit told investors and analysts gathered in New York on May 9. We have 140,000 people in IT and operations. We have 16 database standards. We have 25,000 developers. This results not only in waste but doesnt give us any opportunity to leverage our organization. Thats massively inefficient. Were finally going to merge it all.
"There will probably be geopolitical consequences of this financial crisis. "
Oh, there will be plenty of that, my yankee friend.
Germany/Nordics/RestOfEU combined with Russian energy. They are building that NordStream pipeline along the Baltic Sea between Russia and Germany. You pay bills on time and you'll get gas. Simple as that.
The ideologues on the left and the right don't get it. Their benefactors have blown most of their wealth. The only way to maintain their position is to punish hard working, middle class Americans.
FineWhinefrom2009(Unrated) writes: \tThe ideologues on the left and the right don't get it. Their benefactors have blown most of their wealth. The only way to maintain their position is to punish hard working, middle class Americans. FineWhinefrom2009 | 01.14.09 - 10:48 am | #
And that's different from the last 20 years or so how?
Quite a number of friends and family sold very little stock during the Sep-Nov period last year. Most cringed and hung on - firmly believing in buy and hold.
âEach business has been operating with its own back office," Pandit told investors and analysts gathered in New York on May 9. âWe have 140,000 people in IT and operations. We have 16 database standards. We have 25,000 developers. This results not only in waste but doesn't give us any opportunity to leverage our organization. That's massively inefficient. We're finally going to merge it all." take a name ass wipe | 01.14.09 - 10:44 am | #
Nostrovia,
Comrade Misean is Dope | 01.14.09 - 10:46 am | #
Math problem, old chum - if we take the high of the Dow at 14,000 then 1% is 140 points - 260 was never less than 1%...hence my tongue in cheek on the Nikkei
So let's see, tomorrow we get jobless claims and Friday we get CPI...This should be interesting...
Comrade Kristina | Homepage | 01.14.09 - 10:50 am | #
That doesn't hold water, any longer. We have seen too many times in the last several months, the market rally on bad news.
When Russia "lost" the cold war, the understood feeling was not that, ok let's get back to peaceful terms and evaluate our treaties...the U.S. basically signaled that, you've lost -- now we're going to kick you in the face and take everything. Comrade Janosik | 01.14.09 - 10:43 am | #
If you look back, you'll see that it was Clinton that "lost Russia", a case for which I've argued for a long time. By the time Bush came around, Putin was in, and there was no turning back the clock. That's not to say that Bush made good choices in his foriegn policy, just that the raod we're on was already chosen by the time he got into office, and since 9/11 happend less than a year after he got into office, the Russian situation was ignored. Let the flames begin.....I'm going back to the laboratory.
Quite a number of friends and family sold very little stock during the Sep-Nov period last year. Most cringed and hung on - firmly believing in buy and hold.
There were also many people who started dollar cost averaging because they've heard time and time again that the biggest profits are made when things seem the most dire.
so they try to be a Buffet, and started getting in during the fall.
That doesn't hold water, any longer. We have seen too many times in the last several months, the market rally on bad news.
Morocco Bama | 01.14.09 - 10:53 am | #
There were also many people who started dollar cost averaging
Yeah, I know a number of those. Not as many as the hold on tight crowd.
Since buy and hold / dollar cost averaging has been successful for decades now, I wonder how long it will take for people to understand the new axioms: namely debt fueled inflation and debt fueled deflation.
My question: How did the Treasury "pick and Choose" The Banks who got Tarp Funds.
How/what did the Treasuary say to those that were not accepted.
AP'Shadow
First question, they asked Goldman Sachs.
Second Question, they told them they were too small to count...
"If you look back, you'll see that it was Clinton that "lost Russia", a case for which I've argued for a long time. By the time Bush came around, Putin was in, and there was no turning back the clock. That's not to say that Bush made good choices in his foriegn policy, just that the raod we're on was already chosen by the time he got into office, and since 9/11 happend less than a year after he got into office, the Russian situation was ignored.
Let the flames begin.....I'm going back to the laboratory.
xxxxx | 01.14.09 - 10:55 am | # "
True, it was Clinton who reneged on the commitment that NATO would not extend toward the east...after a stunning concession on Gorbachev's part (Germany), Bush's furter expansions, dismantling of disarmament agreements, and aggressive militarism did the rest.
FDIC is making job offers via telephone without actually interviewing applicants in person hiring site unseen. That opens the door to a lot of CR bloggers in their PJs.
\t"If you look back, you'll see that it was Clinton that "lost Russia", Comrade Janosik | 01.14.09 - 11:01 am | #
Leaders lead. Mere managers clean up. I don't care who you are, or what your position: After one quarter in the job, you own the problems. And don't waste my time after that blaming the last guy -- just fix it or I'll blame you.
Don't worry about it - everyone is going to be hurting before this plays out.
rent_to_own | 01.14.09 - 10:59 am | #
Spain - short to medium term fiscally screwed. Ireland - short to medium term fiscally screwed. France - long run fiscally / politcally screwed. Italy - long run demographically (like Germany) screwed. England - (if you want to include them) short to medium term fiscally screwed.
I think the sentiment for IRA accounts might go as follows: until the summer of 08, middle-aged folks had probably built up more than they could earn in a few years.
And then they lost 25-40% of value in the fall of '08.
Now they had three options:
1) take the losses and hope to earn back their gains somewhere else (but where?)
2) take the losses and earn back their accounts by working longer (impossible in many case) or
Reading the descriptions of many of the "innovative" financial instruments of the last decade gives me the uneasy feeling that they are all zero-sum, at least with respect to any actual economic effects. Their their only effects seem to be:
1) Generate a commission each time the instrument is shifted from one hand to the other; and/or
2) Shift booked profits forward in time, and booked expenses back in time, in order to puff up this quarter's balance sheets (and bonuses).
"Leaders lead. Mere managers clean up.
I don't care who you are, or what your position: After one quarter in the job, you own the problems. And don't waste my time after that blaming the last guy -- just fix it or I'll blame you.
It's the only way to enforce true accountibility."
The comment you single out was not made by me...
Furthermore, given the current circumstances...a more cooperative avenue might have been a wiser choice in dealing with expansive, resource rich republics.
Geithner is suddenly becoming the 'bad guy' in the media. why?? I mean.. he is a piece of work, but why did the 'media sentiment' change so quickly.
lucifer
Treasury Sec. nominee didn't pay his self employment tax for 4 years while at the IMF? Screw him, throw him on the ash heap.
rent_to_own: As Finnish I would say we are even better positioned than you Germans. (And thanks for all the Stukas against Russian invasion back in summer 1944!)
History flash: Finland was part of Axis after all out invasion attack in Winter War back in 1939-1940 by Russians. For that we paid dearly to our comrades in Russia (for fighting against them?!) the same way as Germany after WW-ONE.
But we were part of Operation Barbarossa (=get even with those Russians) So Pavel for that, fuck and you! And once again, just friendly fuck and you!
Nortel Networks Corp., North America's biggest maker of telephone equipment, filed for bankruptcy protection in the U.S., a victim of the global credit crunch and declining sales. Nortel, based in Toronto, had more than $1 billion in assets and debt, according to a Chapter 11 filing of its U.S. subsidiary today in Wilmington, Delaware. Fourteen affiliates of Nortel's financing unit are seeking similar protection in Delaware. Five units filed for bankruptcy there under Chapter 15. Nortel said Canadian affiliates also will seek protection.
Treasury Sec. nominee didn't pay his self employment tax for 4 years while at the IMF? Screw him, throw him on the ash heap. take a name ass wipe | 01.14.09 - 11:11 am | #
That's not what bothers me. I can understand how anyone could make the error he made.
What bothers me is that when the error was pointed out, years ago, he fixed two of the four returns. He didn't fix the other two until after Obama''s Team's Review. That seriously smacks of "only pay taxes when you're caught not doing so".
ades-
lucifer pointed it out in my bad dream last night....that sob kept me up all night..I'm heading to st annes today to shake him and Geithner loose today....
Someone quoted Pandit at Citi:
"We have 140,000 people in IT and operations. We have 16 database standards. We have 25,000 developers. ... Thats massively inefficient. Were finally going to merge it all."
And they're going to start by firing most of the people with a working knowledge of the existing code? Good luck with that...
Barley is that the stock exchange? I'm always slow with the letters but laugh out loud when i finally figure out how obvious it was! :) This is getting more and more interesting (and scary) each day....
Re: That's not what bothers me. I can understand how anyone could make the error he made.
What bothers me is that he has been, at least nominally, in charge of the completely larcenous Maiden Lane LLCs, among others. I think that the bailouts he has been a party to should completely disqualify him from serving in the Obama administration. That his nomination is jeopardized by his alleged negligence as a taxpayer, rather than his allegedly criminal conduct toward the rest of us taxpayers, is simply some petard-hoistingly delicious irony.
"Someone quoted Pandit at Citi:
"We have 140,000 people in IT and operations. We have 16 database standards. We have 25,000 developers. ... Thats massively inefficient. Were finally going to merge it all."
And they're going to start by firing most of the people with a working knowledge of the existing code? Good luck with that...
Ken | 01.14.09 - 11:15 am | # "
They're gonna move everything to MS Access, Crystal Reports and Excel.
Those suckers scale big-time. And they're cheaper to deploy and maintain.
Trust me, the business analysts at Satyam told me this is the way to go.
Thanks Loudocracy for that "repo" bexplanation. I'm confused th..isn't a bond a loan already?
Yes. Think of it as like a bank. A bank borrows money (from you) to lend it. Implicitly, the loan is collateral for your deposit since if the bank were to go under you'd use the loan to get your money back. A repo is the same kind of thing but with the order reversed. First they make the loan, then they use the loan to borrow the money. With a repo they use the loan as explicit collateral because that way they get a better rate.
Traditionally repos are used to cover short-term funding shortfalls. Some company is rolling over a loan (for example) and they have to pay on the 15th but the new loan won't close until the 25th because the rate is better or the CEO got Dehli belly or whatever. So they use some asset for a 10 day repo to cover the gap.
Recently the Fed has been offering to buy repos to allow banks to cover and disguise permanent losses. This doesn't seem to be working very well.
Holocaust of the finance stocks here and in Europe...indeed everywhere. AXA that has withstood the downturn better than most is now giving way. How about $1 for C, for AEG, for AZ, for LYG and a number of others. That's the day I'm waiting for. LOL
did anybody see the story in Bloomberg yesterday about the disparity between implied volatility and historic volatility being huge which pointed towards a big rally!!!!
OT somewhat. I think now is the time for the Ukraine to tell NATO to pay its gas bills for it. NATO adores the Ukraine and wants it to join the club so this seems very reasonable. If it did, then Europe would be warm this winter. All that is required is a bit of money. LOL.
citizen, reason or not, if Russia got paid it could hardly turn off the gas. I think it eminently reasonable for Russia to want to get paid. The Ukraine needs to get a lesson in reality. And NATO too.
The vision of St. Brigid was a heavenly community in which all created beings were joined together in joy. This is a poem attributed to St. Brigid giving voice to this hope:
I should like a great lake of beer for the King of Kings.
I should like the angels of Heaven to be drinking it through time eternal.
I should like excellent meats of belief and pure piety.
I should like the men of Heaven at my house.
I should like barrels of peace at their disposal.
I should like for them cellars of mercy.
I should like cheerfulness to be their drinking.
I should like Jesus to be there among them.
I should like the three Marys of illustrious renown to be with us.
I should like the people of Heaven, the poor, to be gathered around from all parts.
Fair Economist, thanks much for that additional "clarification" on repos.
(Anon shakes his head and goes "muddlemuddlemuddle" and slaps himself)
"They make the loan and then use the loan to borrow the money."
Aaaaaaaaaaaabbott, if they have the money to make the loan, then why do they need to borrow money to make the loan?
I can't understand this esoteric credit stuff. good thing we have the financial experts to manage it all for us.
"And the same German Post that can't afford DHL will apparently be the proud owner of 8% of Deutsche Bank."
I don't think they "can't afford it", it's probably just "not profitable".
"in Germany [...] arrangements [...] tend to come with something resembling accountability."
For some reason "Old Europe" has not gone all the way adopting the "because I can" attitude, being "hamstrung" by all those pesky relics of old social conventions of propriety and upholding appearances. I guess that's related to why those dudes called it "Old" Europe - meant as an insult, but doubling as a compliment.
There is enough shit and favors dealing going on, but public perceptions are still considered important and are paid heed. Perhaps it's as simple as there being more "accountability" in politics, by it not being a one/two party system (though it increasingly seems to drift there).
Aaaaaaaaaaaabbott, if they have the money to make the loan, then why do they need to borrow money to make the loan?
Like I said, normally a repo is used when you have the cash today, will have it in in a few days, but because of the timing of your payments and receivables you won't have it tomorrow. The repo is a kind of bridge loan. You have to have the security for the repo, but a security isn't cash and you'd have to pay a commission to sell it and then re-buy in a few days, plus take on some market risk. The repo converts a non-cash asset into cash for a short period to cover the short-term cash shortfall.
I wish someone would revive the film of someone I knew in Moscow, Yvgeni Tsymbal. He made a film called Zashitnik Sedov [Defender Sedov], about an attorney who couldn't take it any more, and decided to defend some engineers who were about to be executed on false charges during the Great Purge.
The censor passed the film because he thought it was a sports film [zashitnik can also mean a defensive player in football].
He also made a film in which Stalin's murder, by surgical operation, of Frunze was portrayed.
I remember when Tsymbal came back from a meeting at the Film Union, where what he described as an audience of "bald heads" put him up on the stage and hurled accusations at him. When he returned home his face was pale.
"They're going to kill me", he muttered.
But then, the SU fell instead.
All those who have risked their lives for freedom may comment.
supafly73 writes:
...History is full of anomalies...
Sure looks like that way when a Finn thanks an american (ocupation-) soldier (rent_to_own, occupying Germany still after 60+ years after the end of the war) "for all the Stukas against Russian invasion back in summer 1944"!
And no, Operation Barbarossa was not about getting even with those Russians, they haven't done annything bad to the Nazies, it was a war against the ideological arch-enemy of the Nazies : Socialism (massively influenced by Jews).
And last, but not least: no need at all to get personal with Pavel !
So, supafly73, you might first learn something about history and the participants you correspond with here, before you lodge another truly hilarious post.
(btw., I am German)
Nortel filed because it is burning about $1bn in cash a year. It will go through its cash pile pretty quickly at this rate. So instead of having to pay out the nose for DIP financing, it's declaring BK while it still has cash to finance its ops.
My husband used to do a lot of consulting for finish companies in the early 90's and late 80's. After the collapse of the soviet union he traveled by volvo with his finish partners across finland to St. Petersburg. The city of ST. Pete was looking to barter some property for work on their waste water treatment plant. It was winter and it was cold. They brought to trade for services a white fish for their interperter (They later ate it in his apartment)and a black and white TV for their stay at the Astoria.
My husband meet with the Vice Mayer of ST. Pete. He described as none other than a gangster and he saw "evil" in his eyes. This man was non other than Valdimer Putin. The future Czar of Russia.
"So, supafly73, you might first learn something about history and the participants you correspond with here, before you lodge another truly hilarious post. (btw., I am German)"
Yes, and I somehow remember my grandfather stories about fighting both Russians and you Germans back in Lapland (while your troops (which were very BTW helpful against Russian troops) were retreating at the end of the war).
There were actually three wars for Finland, two against Russia and then one dirty war against YOU Germans back in Lapland in 1944-1945.
It really was a different war for Finland than for you Germans but I have to admit, both were happily going against Russia.
"rent_to_own, occupying Germany still after 60+ years after the end of the war"
Well, that is an interesting perspective, considering that I work for a German company, married to a German I met in Canada, and have never been in the military.
And that my children are both German and American citizens. Who were born and raised here, having spent less than a half year total of their lives in the U.S.
But whatever. However, the American and French left this region a while ago - the Americans 15 years ago, the French more than 5 years ago. The Canadians also left more than a decade ago, too.
But the region does have a lot of Aussiedler - on the Strassenbahn between Karlsruhe, Baden-Baden, and Achern, Russian is quite common. Certainly more common than English or French. But then, the Russian speakers are not occupiers either, they are Germans, at least according to their passports.
While the Germans living in the Alsace are neither French nor occupiers.
Very multi-culti, it seems, at least in this part of southern Germany.
I am not firm in Finland/Russian history, but if Russia really should have unprovokedly attacked Finland, I certainly can understand your anger against Russia.
But this is still not a reason to attack Pavel!
(Who btw. still owes me an answer to a question a few weeks ago, eh Pavel?)
Next time I have to move to Germany, it is either Köln or Berlin. Clearly marihuana burning straight protestant groupsexy people No more that catholic southern BS!
Well, I gathered hat you are American, and since most of Americans in Germany are indeed soldiers, and since there was once the talk about the "Käfertal" (where there are american Barracks), I (erroneously) made the uncritical inference that you are an american soldier. Sorry for that, and btw. wellcome in Germany!
Well, and since you are not military, you are certainly not an "occupier" either, nor are those Russians you mean. But the military ones were.
It's all right, it's just a warning.
This is the kitchen sink for sure tho.
B_R,
15 minutes is a bit luxurious, dontcha think...
Nostrovia,
Hope they remain solvent.
sheesh. Just 6B?
How do these "smart" guys keep losing so much money?
It makes you wonder?
sixth its a record for me.So german bank is going to collapse?
Because of "exceptionally tough market conditions in sales and trading". How about all of their failed investment vehicles. Don't blame it on their business practices, blame it on externalities.
Mein Gott!
Plosser said the Fed should set a target for the growth of its balance sheet in measuring its new policy.
Philly Fed president differs with Bernanke on new policy - MarketWatch
Rumors are flying that HSBC needs to raise $30 billion.
Good thing they weren't affected much by subprime.
Hey.......I thought last quarter was the kitchen sink quarter??? How about Douche Bank jumping into a whole and dying??? I hope they're hanging with Bear Stearns soon, I love loses!!! That goes for Citi and Chase as well, I don't need your stupid loans or credit. I'll say a prayer for you tonight and pray you go bankrupt.
"Plosser said the Fed should set a target for the growth of its balance sheet in measuring its new policy."
Plosser has always been immune to reality.
this is the kitchen sink for sure tho.
Yeah, and all these write downs will be write ups when the elusive second half recovery arrives.
I weep for all the puts I sold.
Just a reminder that the confessional remains only for the banks.
It's the guillotine for everyone else.
And the same German Post that can't afford DHL will apparently be the proud owner of 8% of Deutsche Bank.
According to the radio news, this makes 'capitalizing' the deal of DB to buy the Postbank easier, especially in terms of accessing the same government funds that Commerzbank accessed in acquiring Dresdner.
More than a bit of kick the can shell game going on, to be honest.
But in contrast to the TARP, in Germany not only are such cozy arrangements create normal, they also tend to come with something resembling accountability.
Though what accountability means is very open to debate, it tends to still be real. Basically because failure tends to be treated harshly - as Merkle's suicide may indicate, compared to Madoff's bail.
I can't remember, is $6 billion a lot, or just a nothingburger.
I weep for all the puts I sold.
bearly | 01.14.09 - 9:32 am | #
Eh, I'm sure the old or new administrations would never ever schedule a press conference light on news but heavy on happiness during opex week while the shit's hitting the fan.
DOW could have either a 9 or a 7 handle today. Or both.
Angry Saver wrote: Yeah, and all these write downs will be write ups when the elusive second half recovery arrives.
Angry Saver | 01.14.09 - 9:28 am | #
but the write-ups will occur on someone else's balance sheet, possibly the taxpayers'......
not so much for equity holders tho, LOL
Posted at 9:30 am on Marketwatch - TARP extended to Europe to cover unfortunate banks caught up by externalities.....
What happens when the confessional declares an operating loss ?
Who ya gonna confess to ?
I weep for all the puts I sold.
bearly | 01.14.09 - 9:32 am | #
I'm passing forward Eric's favor to me from a couple weeks ago and shedding a tear for your puts too.
how come citi is moving earnings release date to 16th too?
quit your whining.
this is a negative write up. we started doing negative write ups a few months ago to ensure the 2nd half recovery.
Angry Saver(Unrated) writes:
Yeah, and all these write downs will be write ups when the elusive second half recovery arrives.
That's true, and that's because all those assets are just marked the way they are because the market's spooked. Once these stabilizing measures kick in and you see prices in the market that aren't influenced by this psychological effect then you are going to see lending pick up and activity return to the stock market.
Gottschalks to Reorganize Under Chapter 11
Another one bites the dust.
that's a big big big kitchen sink.. that will extend over several quarters..
Once these stabilizing measures kick in and you see prices in the market that aren't influenced by this psychological effect then you are going to see lending pick up and activity return to the stock market.
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins | Homepage | 01.14.09 - 9:40 am | #
I'll have what he's having.
So everybody is now well positioned for the second-half recovery, right?
Franco,
Just to dispel any doubt, I was being ironical.
Here's another knee slapper.
When Bear was going under (just before the JPM giveaway), all the wall streeters I know kept talking about the $87/share book value. I told them the true book value was negative. They literally laughed at me.
People can't let go of their false beliefs (dreams) for some reason. Just ask Joe Lewis (the billionaire currency trader that lost his fortune buying Bear on the way down).
Eric(Excellent) writes:
I'll have what he's having.
Was it any good? I was trying to do my best Gasparino.
[how come citi is moving earnings release date to 16th too?
cd]
Don't you know ? Kitchen sink V 28391
Shilling goes like this. Comps getting easier. Until BK when the comps are the easiest.
So everybody is now well positioned for the second-half recovery, right?
JP | Homepage | 01.14.09 - 9:42 am | #
In the immortal words of Bartleby, "I'd rather not."
Was it any good? I was trying to do my best Gasparino.
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins | Homepage | 01.14.09 - 9:43 am | #
Not as good as Meg Ryan in the diner, but pretty good.
Nortel filed for bankruptcy protection, wtf?!?
Ben Bernanke's solution is just keep printing money ( increasing 30% + annualized )... there will be no inflation....everything will be just fine....
Paul Kedrosky: John Taylor on Increasing the Money Supply
I was trying to do my best Gasparino.
To do a proper Gasparino you have to drop some CEO names and keep repeating how "smart" they are.
Here's an example: Jamie Dimon, someone I've known personally for years and one of the smartest guys on wall street, just pre-announced huge losses.
Man from nantucket...last thread...
Cedar City, UT..
Walla Walla, Wa...
Grand Junction,CO...
Misean,
I was trying to remember one of the numbers from the film that wasn't ludicrously short. I think there's one that's 10 seconds? But I didn't want to find the web page where someone spent some portion of their life archiving that information.
2009...Year of reality..What are all these people thinking. This is/was not normal behavior, no matter how for up on the pole and pay scale one might be.
To do a proper Gasparino you have to drop some CEO names and keep repeating how "smart" they are.
You somehow how to preface everything with "I just got off the phone with..."
Gibt Es Wirklich Einen Gott
I wish this wouldn't all unfold according to my expectations.
Nortel filed for bankruptcy protection, wtf?!?
Jennson | 01.14.09 - 9:45 am | #
Do you mean WTF as in, "WTF happened that they didn't get a piece of the TARP?"
I can answer that. Except for very limited circumstances, the TARP will not be used to help out Canadian telecom companies. As far as I know, that's the only type of company they aren't likely to prop up, and they may change their minds at some point later today.
"So everybody is now well positioned for the second-half recovery, right?"
Yes, 2016 sounds about right.
Sheesh....glad this is all contained!!
Gracious, one can only wonder what really would happen if it got out of control.
NTL - gooooood bye!
I am a cheer leader, I love to sell koolaide, I love to drink koolaide, in high school I was voted biggest ass kisser, I am _____________ (insert favorite financial entertainer name) I am CNBC.
One headline caught my eye this morning....Brazil sells 1.96 Billion in repos to finance trade.
The only repo I know about is when they drag away my wheels.
What exactly is a repo? Can they be printed ad infinitum?
B_R,
ROFL...
Well off to the bit mines.
Nostrovia,
fear not.. the second half recovery is still on track.
) second half of my kid's lives perhaps)
Plosser was the Dean of my business school when I was there. really nice guy to have lunch and chat with.
CD: thanks for the towns
Where's Werner this morning? I need my daily dose of European superiority.
Ben Bernanke's solution is just keep printing money ( increasing 30% + annualized )... there will be no inflation....everything will be just fine....
Of course plunging velocity will prevent these increases from causing inflation.
But down the road when you have an economy flooded with cash and velocity returns...
Well, it might make the Great Inflation of the 70s look like a Sunday picnic, as they say.
Attempting to control this inflation Volcker style will just send the economy back into the grave it crawled out of.
MLM:
Yeah, I was wondering about Werner too.
Do the Germans have anything equivalent to FDIC?
Or do they just have a large supply of pitchforks, torches and scythes that they distribute to depositors in event of problems?
I picture Kenneth Mars as head of the German govt group for banks.
(bonus to who gets that reference - evening martinis with Misean)
Viele leute koennen Deutsch sprechen, was fur eine uberraschung!
"I wish this wouldn't all unfold according to my expectations."
The Russia-Ukraine situation is beginning to look more serious than a dispute over the price of NG. But no matter how it's beginning to look, I think it always was more serious.
India is warning that tensions with Pakistan are increasing.
There will probably be geopolitical consequences of this financial crisis. Or perhaps one could put it this way: What caused the financial crisis will also have a bearing on geopolitical events. An international nervous breakdown.
Springtime for Deutsche Bank and germany . . . .
Where is my Kenneth Mars bonus?
that's a big big big kitchen sink..
Gubbmint Cheese | 01.14.09 - 9:41 am | #
Too big for the kitchen sink; they're using the bathtub now.
"I am a cheer leader, I love to sell koolaide, I love to drink koolaide..."
You know, there's never been a better time to drink or sell Koolaide.
VIX up 8%
"Too big for the kitchen sink; they're using the bathtub now."
And next quarter it'll be the swimming pool.
In any event, it all looks like septic tanks to me.
DEUTSCHE BANK AG Share Price Chart | DB - Yahoo! Finance
The DB bankers really earned those record bonuses over the past five years.
The hard cash has been paid out to the bankers. The vault is full of toxic waste and derivatives.
Book value - hahahahahah! Good one that.
Bernanke is like typical idiotic driver on an icy road. Putting pedal to the medal ain't gonna help and you will lose the control.
And when stuck, your car will be only go deeper into snow when doing that. And the US economy is now stuck in deep snow...
Retail sales down double what was expected.
Bring out the smiley faces and decalre that it is all up from here...Buy, Buy,Buy I wonder how those talking head at CNBC sleep at night?
And the US economy is now stuck in deep snow...
supafly73
That's not snow it's stuck in...
A repo is when you sell a bond to someone and simultaneously agree to buy it back later for a specified price. Effectively it is a loan collateralized by a bond.
Now ist ze time on Shprockets vere ve FAIL.
Blazes Boylan(Unrated) writes:
\tNow ist ze time on Shprockets vere ve FAIL.
\t Blazes Boylan | \t \t \t \t01.14.09 - 10:06 am | #
Blazes Boylan | 01.14.09 - 10:06 am | #
Touch my BK - touch him!
VIX up 10%. Markets will open today at 3:55pm.
"Just a reminder that the confessional remains only for the banks ..."
How nice, bless me Ben for I have sinned.
Just heard on BBerg tv:
Some talking head said after today's retail sales, GDP 4Q will be 7 to 7.5% drop
Comrade Fubar'ed writes:
Anyone else see the charts setting up like the november expiration plummet?
Comrade Fubar'ed | 01.13.09 - 4:00 pm
anyone ?
You know what would have been great? If CR turned Sebastian's mea culpa into a confessional post.
"Sebastian Warns of $XXX Loss"
And the hits keep coming.
@Comrade Fubar'ed
I looked at the SPY for the week before opex in Nov compared to this week and didn't see what you see. What index/time period are you looking at?
Thanks Loudocracy for that "repo" bexplanation. I'm confused th..isn't a bond a loan already?
Essentially, a fancy printed promise to pay more tomorrow for that hamburger today.
Joe Shmoe:
Sorry, but no luck there.
Hint: right director, wrong film.
could this be the day that we finally see the dreaded double half Batman with the extended middle finger?
Citigroup needs a name change. Citione, Cititwo, Citiafewstragglers
Arbeit Mach Frei
Bist du frei Deutche Bank?
Nein.
Give it afew days, then you may be free and someone might buy you.
Citigroup needs a name change. Citione, Cititwo, Citiafewstragglers
MorgCiti
I liked the suggestion someone made yesterday for Citi's new name, "Citimorg"....
[How do these "smart" guys keep losing so much money?
It makes you wonder?]
Well, one reason is that they bought all the nuclear waste from Ameriquest.
That's just one example. They hold some of the worst paper on the planet.
How about Citi : Pity
Can't we just go with "ShittyGroup"?
sp500 nov 20-21
Crash - you beat me to it.. my suggestion was "shittybank"
;p
so, is the Repo zero-sum?
B.bb..bbu bbbut how was the weather in this winter? Has it been cold? Has there been snow ? The weather will be much better in the 2nd half.
2nd half recovery in the weather is IN THE BAG.
Hey, I have an idea: Let's ban shorting.
Show of hands for the people who got tricked/dragged/drugged into attending a Primerica pyramid seminar.
/raises hand
Homedad
The Producers makes far more sense than Young Frankenstein!
Come on now. You can make more money from a flop than a hit? What could be more appropriate than that?
Comrade Tech Sargent Chen,
I got tricked into Primerica pyramid scheme by my brother... Yes, my own flesh-and-blood!
family, you just don't get to pick 'em
I got tricked into Primerica pyramid scheme by my brother... Yes, my own flesh-and-blood!
the other Hamedric Brorrywat
keeps it in the family then
)
Mook(from last thread):
Did college in Shenandoah Valley and a place that I'd retire to. 3 1/2 seasons and wonderful place. Also lived in NW North Carolina and would serve as well for new home.
But now in good suburban/rural area and great place for families. Plus we have "the Corn Wagon" with great stuff.
Nortel filed for bankruptcy protection, wtf?!?
Jennson | 01.14.09 - 9:45 am | #
It's about time. What do you expect from a Canadian Co.? (sarcasm)
The nice thing about being broke is nobody tries to trick you into pyramid schemes...I think Amway is my personal favorite though. Knew a guy that was an Amway junkie once, we used to try and help him out by saying we'd buy some products from him, of course he never had any products, he just wanted us to "join"...
Rate cut tomorrow. 75 basis points
The total purses in PGA Golf Tournaments don't look they're feeling a pinch and not reflective of a downturn.
It is only paper losses, nothing here to see- move along and don't sell your bank shares.
managed to avoid the seminars here.. but have been hit on a few times..
Nice to be wanted....
ha ha ha
Citigroup IT jobs At Risk
It's safe to say that a substantial number of the 140,000 people in IT including 25,000 developers are about to do their final conversion. IT jobs are not easy to get, especially large mainframe banks jobs. I have some friends there, and I wish them well.
Mish's Global etc.
I wonder how low we need to get to start triggering the stop losses for those that thought the bottom was in and bought in the past few weeks? This could very ugly, very fast...Nothing like the smell of panic in the morning...
The nice thing about being broke is nobody tries to trick you into pyramid schemes.
Nah, they just get you through convenience stores.....beer, cigarettes and lottery tickets.
Joe Shmoe:
Try Young Frankenstein.
Mars was the village police chief responding to the villagers about the goings-on at the castle.
Nice try, though. Producers hadn't occurred to me.
the other Hamedric Brorrywat writes:
Comrade Tech Sargent Chen,
I got tricked into Primerica pyramid scheme by my brother... Yes, my own flesh-and-blood!
the other Hamedric Brorrywat | 01.14.09 - 10:24 am |
For me it was in 1999. A coworker in the shipping dock I worked at (3rd shift mind you) offered to buy me lunch some day. We were friends so I thought nothing of it.
After he paid for the lunch, he suggested we stop by his 'office' since we were in the area. I looked at him with incredulity thinking, 'We work in a mofo shipping dock!'
We went to his office and voila, next thing I know I'm in this seminar room being told how joining a church is a great way to get new suckers. There were 5 people in the room, myself, my coworker, the speaker and a young couple with big fat shiny dollar signs in their eyes.
The next day I cursed Primerica, Citi and all of its manifestations.
The nice thing about being broke is nobody tries to trick you into pyramid schemes
My dad gets about 2-5 seminar invites per week that are hosted at restaurants. He always goes for the free food, and the hosts always get pissed when they realize he doesn't understand English.
Morocco Bama(Excellent) writes:
Nah, they just get you through convenience stores.....beer, cigarettes and lottery tickets.
In Heaven there is no beer.
So we must drink it here.
CK,
Great question, IIRC there were also several articles out recently about how fast VIX was going down, indicating traders' reduced volatility expectations...
Automakers talk of stabilizing the price of gas
Automakers talk of stabilizing the price of gas - CNBC
Since interest rates on savings accounts are so low, doesn't that mean Banks have been able to "borrow" money from all of us at very favorable interest rates?
How come this never gets mentioned.
Looks like the market is tanking today...
The total purses in PGA Golf Tournaments don't look they're feeling a pinch and not reflective of a downturn.
Morocco Bama
So perhaps we should offer the recently laid off folks retraining as golf professionals!!
See what happens when we put our heads together?
How come this never gets mentioned.
char | 01.14.09 - 10:32 am | #
Because it is not the problem. Insolvency is not solved by borrowing.
@ Citibank IT
Wow, serious redunancy and overstaffing. Dump it and merge the rest. It probably was never merged because the code is a patchwork - starting from 1960's. No one wanted to try unravel those hairballs
Where's crispy and cole?
I need my Frazier fix.
Bloomberg shows -240.
OT--Recession ending in July?
Stanford Economics professor predicts recession to end mid-2009, citing rapid drop in "uncertainty". (I think he is using the VIX as a proxy for uncertainty, it seems like unique thinking but doesn't quite make sense to me.)
Good news at last? The recession will be over sooner than you think | vox - Research-based policy analysis and commentary from leading economists
In Heaven there is no beer.
So we must drink it here.
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins | Homepage | 01.14.09 - 10:31 am | #
There's plenty in hell...and the cheap shit that's nothing more than piss.
There will probably be geopolitical consequences of this financial crisis. Or perhaps one could put it this way: What caused the financial crisis will also have a bearing on geopolitical events. An international nervous breakdown.
Pavel Chichikov | 01.14.09 - 10:02 am | #
Sadly, yes. Trade war and then the other kind...or we might just skip to the end.
With all the great news, will reality finally set in? Circuit breaker Wednesday??? How many days until the circuit breakers are hit (before 1/20)??
Thoughts....
giacutter(Unrated) writes:
\tWhere's crispy and cole?
I need my Frazier fix.
giacutter | 01.14.09 - 10:39 am | #
Back in the day our gang had a drink (actually just a renamed raspberry kazi) called the Frazier. Shoot it and in unison yell "Down goes Frazier!". Great fun.
Can we start talking about capitulation again now?
Newsflash - grapevine indicates South Carolina has expended their unemployment benifit pool. Recently unemployeed are NOT getting checks. Is this covered by the TARP?
Clearly, the German people are just not confident enough. Probably their mainstream media bashing the economy. Why, oh why won't the mainstream media stop with the economy-bashing? It's like they don't even WANT a second-half recovery this year. Sheesh.
"International nervous breakdown"
We're certainly not in Kansas anymore, and serious re-evaluations of national and international positions are underway.
When Russia "lost" the cold war, the understood feeling was not that, ok let's get back to peaceful terms and evaluate our treaties...the U.S. basically signaled that, you've lost -- now we're going to kick you in the face and take everything.
Now however, poisoned from within, the remaining hegemon has shown that we can't stop terrorism, quell insurgencies, hell we can't even take care of our internal weaknesses...
The U.S.S.A has learned the hard way that we can't go it alone. It will be news to many people.
Ah, it seems like not so long ago a 260 pt drop was less than 1%...Oh the memories.
Nostrovia,
Wow, serious redunancy and overstaffing. Dump it and merge the rest. It probably was never merged because the code is a patchwork - starting from 1960's. No one wanted to try unravel those hairballs
nova
Each business has been operating with its own back office, Pandit told investors and analysts gathered in New York on May 9. We have 140,000 people in IT and operations. We have 16 database standards. We have 25,000 developers. This results not only in waste but doesnt give us any opportunity to leverage our organization. Thats massively inefficient. Were finally going to merge it all.
Mish's Global etc.
I'm thinking Eric's 7 handle might be correct...
Comrade Misean is Dope | 01.14.09 - 10:43 am | #
For the Nikkei?
LOOK! There's blood in the streets again.
We haven't heard PPT for a while. I suspect we may here it today.
"There will probably be geopolitical consequences of this financial crisis. "
Oh, there will be plenty of that, my yankee friend.
Germany/Nordics/RestOfEU combined with Russian energy. They are building that NordStream pipeline along the Baltic Sea between Russia and Germany. You pay bills on time and you'll get gas. Simple as that.
Ah, it seems like not so long ago a 260 pt drop was less than 1%...Oh the memories.
eeehem
energy,
No silly, the DOW.
Nostrovia,
Ich Bin Ein Broke.
"Ah, it seems like not so long ago a 260 pt drop was less than 1%...Oh the memories."
Did I blink and miss DOW 26,000?
Citi circling the drain...I've got a two dollar bill if anyone wants to do the deed...
my precious junk bonds! my precious!
OT- DJIA
Pretty ugly 6 day slide. Not far from that "7 Handle".
Ya', I know, the market doesn't open for another 4.5 hours....
European stock markets are getting crushed today. All down ~ 5%.
It's so comforting to keep hearing wall street tell me my treasuries are over-priced.
crude is so yesterday...
Crude Oil Chart
Mr. Gorbachev, bring down this bank!
Markets opened early today.
The ideologues on the left and the right don't get it. Their benefactors have blown most of their wealth. The only way to maintain their position is to punish hard working, middle class Americans.
Somebody yesterday had a great name for Citi:
CitiMorg(ue).
I suggested they change the name from "Citi" to "Village" or "Hamlet"
The market cap is plain old quaint now. The name Citi seems too big.
Hey, I have an idea: Let's ban shorting.
ROFL.
I'd laugh if the govt wasn't going to try it
we should also:
require all people to join a 401k and IRA.
reqiure all 401k and IRA accounts to go long
ban selling of equities
there are just so many possibilities.
Somebody care to explain why the big drop early on today? The MSM's explanations make no sense.
FineWhinefrom2009(Unrated) writes:
\tThe ideologues on the left and the right don't get it. Their benefactors have blown most of their wealth. The only way to maintain their position is to punish hard working, middle class Americans.
FineWhinefrom2009 | 01.14.09 - 10:48 am | #
And that's different from the last 20 years or so how?
Quite a number of friends and family sold very little stock during the Sep-Nov period last year. Most cringed and hung on - firmly believing in buy and hold.
Today has gotta hurt.
So let's see, tomorrow we get jobless claims and Friday we get CPI...This should be interesting...
BAC approaching single dig's!
âEach business has been operating with its own back office," Pandit told investors and analysts gathered in New York on May 9. âWe have 140,000 people in IT and operations. We have 16 database standards. We have 25,000 developers. This results not only in waste but doesn't give us any opportunity to leverage our organization. That's massively inefficient. We're finally going to merge it all."
take a name ass wipe | 01.14.09 - 10:44 am | #
Wait until they see how much "THAT" will cost
Get your C while they are hot. Under $5.00 today before it goes on the clearance table.
Cushing oil inventories hit new record of 33 million barrels
per mrkwtch
could today finally be a circuit breaker day? (It's 850 now).
Holy canoli. I wake up this morning to market devastation.
Are we going to hit the circuit breaker today?
I'm thinking that "too big to fail" is nothing more than a rhetorical device used by bailout advocates to shut down debate.
I'm living in a cardboard box.
Ha! Eric beat me to it!
energy,
No silly, the DOW.
Nostrovia,
Comrade Misean is Dope | 01.14.09 - 10:46 am | #
Math problem, old chum - if we take the high of the Dow at 14,000 then 1% is 140 points - 260 was never less than 1%...hence my tongue in cheek on the Nikkei
So let's see, tomorrow we get jobless claims and Friday we get CPI...This should be interesting...
Comrade Kristina | Homepage | 01.14.09 - 10:50 am | #
That doesn't hold water, any longer. We have seen too many times in the last several months, the market rally on bad news.
In my most recent conversation (yesterday), I had an acquaintance exclaim with some confidence that he sold nothing during the Oct-Nov market debacle.
The funny thing is...after the past 8 years...
If America collapses as we know it...most of the world will say good riddance.
It could have all been so different, but the citizenry decided their path to victory...what a waste.
That doesn't hold water, any longer. We have seen too many times in the last several months, the market rally on bad news.
Morocco Bama
There are several stages of grief, perhaps Mr. Market finally got past denial?
We have seen too many times in the last several months, the market rally on bad news.
The only thing really responds to is Mr. Margin.
Although I posted the CitiMorg handle yesterday, I actually got it from a Smith Barney friend/employee/soon to be laid off employee...the jig is up!
When Russia "lost" the cold war, the understood feeling was not that, ok let's get back to peaceful terms and evaluate our treaties...the U.S. basically signaled that, you've lost -- now we're going to kick you in the face and take everything.
Comrade Janosik | 01.14.09 - 10:43 am | #
If you look back, you'll see that it was Clinton that "lost Russia", a case for which I've argued for a long time. By the time Bush came around, Putin was in, and there was no turning back the clock. That's not to say that Bush made good choices in his foriegn policy, just that the raod we're on was already chosen by the time he got into office, and since 9/11 happend less than a year after he got into office, the Russian situation was ignored.
Let the flames begin.....I'm going back to the laboratory.
Thanks Sam, I couldn't remember who posted it, funny, nonetheless.
There are several stages of grief, perhaps Mr. Market finally got past denial?
Kristina, it sure looks like it today!
Dated, but useful:
Deutsche Bank and Cleveland
The Financial Tsunami: Sub-Prime Mortgage Debt is but the Tip of the Iceberg
Lawsuit papers posted here
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07182008/Foreclosure_Doc.pdf
Quite a number of friends and family sold very little stock during the Sep-Nov period last year. Most cringed and hung on - firmly believing in buy and hold.
There were also many people who started dollar cost averaging because they've heard time and time again that the biggest profits are made when things seem the most dire.
so they try to be a Buffet, and started getting in during the fall.
The volume of shares is impressive
321 Million shares sold down today so far.
only 5 million shares sold up.
a 99% down day. wow.
they're lucky it's only down 287 points.
When to get back? When to get back in? 6 handle?
That doesn't hold water, any longer. We have seen too many times in the last several months, the market rally on bad news.
Morocco Bama | 01.14.09 - 10:53 am | #
Yes, but the Christmas miracle didn't occur.
they're lucky it's only down 287 points.
Yearning To Learn | 01.14.09 - 10:56 am | #
Luck has nothing to do with it - they got algorithmz!
down goes Frazier anyone? ouch!
There were also many people who started dollar cost averaging
Yeah, I know a number of those. Not as many as the hold on tight crowd.
Since buy and hold / dollar cost averaging has been successful for decades now, I wonder how long it will take for people to understand the new axioms: namely debt fueled inflation and debt fueled deflation.
CR has lots of posters with lots of lurker's who has lots of first hand knowledge of bankings and researching.
My question: How did the Treasury "pick and Choose" The Banks who got Tarp Funds.
How/what did the Treasuary say to those that were not accepted.
NYSE, New York Stock Exchange > About Us > News & Events > Media Resources > Media Resources
My question: How did the Treasury "pick and Choose" The Banks who got Tarp Funds.
How/what did the Treasuary say to those that were not accepted.
AP'Shadow
First question, they asked Goldman Sachs.
Second Question, they told them they were too small to count...
"If you look back, you'll see that it was Clinton that "lost Russia", a case for which I've argued for a long time. By the time Bush came around, Putin was in, and there was no turning back the clock. That's not to say that Bush made good choices in his foriegn policy, just that the raod we're on was already chosen by the time he got into office, and since 9/11 happend less than a year after he got into office, the Russian situation was ignored.
Let the flames begin.....I'm going back to the laboratory.
xxxxx | 01.14.09 - 10:55 am | # "
True, it was Clinton who reneged on the commitment that NATO would not extend toward the east...after a stunning concession on Gorbachev's part (Germany), Bush's furter expansions, dismantling of disarmament agreements, and aggressive militarism did the rest.
FDIC is making job offers via telephone without actually interviewing applicants in person hiring site unseen. That opens the door to a lot of CR bloggers in their PJs.
We get the Fed beige book this afternoon...
We get the Fed beige book this afternoon...
citizen energyecon | Homepage | 01.14.09 - 11:02 am | #
Do not open before stiff drink.
\t"If you look back, you'll see that it was Clinton that "lost Russia",
Comrade Janosik | 01.14.09 - 11:01 am | #
Leaders lead. Mere managers clean up.
I don't care who you are, or what your position: After one quarter in the job, you own the problems. And don't waste my time after that blaming the last guy -- just fix it or I'll blame you.
It's the only way to enforce true accountibility.
rto-
actually international falls, MN could residents could use 1 ft foam insulation today....
-38 w/o wind chill
ohh San Francisco 75 on the wharf....
ah, I feel better now. Rallying off that bottom.
Don't worry about it - everyone is going to be hurting before this plays out.
rent_to_own | 01.14.09 - 10:59 am | #
Spain - short to medium term fiscally screwed.
Ireland - short to medium term fiscally screwed.
France - long run fiscally / politcally screwed.
Italy - long run demographically (like Germany) screwed.
England - (if you want to include them) short to medium term fiscally screwed.
There are others.....
...........................
on a whim....picked up 1k FAS
C is too big to fail??
No problem - we'll carve it into pieces small enough to fail OK.
Geithner is suddenly becoming the 'bad guy' in the media. why?? I mean.. he is a piece of work, but why did the 'media sentiment' change so quickly.
Clinton rulz
I think the sentiment for IRA accounts might go as follows: until the summer of 08, middle-aged folks had probably built up more than they could earn in a few years.
And then they lost 25-40% of value in the fall of '08.
Now they had three options:
1) take the losses and hope to earn back their gains somewhere else (but where?)
2) take the losses and earn back their accounts by working longer (impossible in many case) or
3) leave it in and hope hte market comes back.
Dope Alert wrote: "so, is the Repo zero-sum?"
Reading the descriptions of many of the "innovative" financial instruments of the last decade gives me the uneasy feeling that they are all zero-sum, at least with respect to any actual economic effects. Their their only effects seem to be:
1) Generate a commission each time the instrument is shifted from one hand to the other; and/or
2) Shift booked profits forward in time, and booked expenses back in time, in order to puff up this quarter's balance sheets (and bonuses).
Where's rich?
Why is gold down today?
kill_the_czar writes:
C is too big to fail??
No problem - we'll carve it into pieces small enough to fail OK.
kill_the_czar | 01.14.09 - 11:05 am | #
One, two, three times a bailout...and I love her.
Europe is cliff diving...
3) leave it in and hope hte market comes back.
Mr. Beach | 01.14.09 - 11:06 am | #
= 85% of the population. Born and Breed.....
............
VIX up 18% @ 50.91. Duck and cover.
Why is gold down today?
Brooster | 01.14.09 - 11:07 am | #
(more) Deflation is coming.
C breaks $5
"Leaders lead. Mere managers clean up.
I don't care who you are, or what your position: After one quarter in the job, you own the problems. And don't waste my time after that blaming the last guy -- just fix it or I'll blame you.
It's the only way to enforce true accountibility."
The comment you single out was not made by me...
Furthermore, given the current circumstances...a more cooperative avenue might have been a wiser choice in dealing with expansive, resource rich republics.
Lucifer,
u know why, he's your disciple..
see the resemblances here
tim
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/data?pid=avimage&iid=iIfSMQjbZGXw
father
http://wweek.com/photos/3352/large/9909.jpg
lucifer wrote: "Geithner is suddenly becoming the 'bad guy' in the media. why??"
Most people can't understand the complicated financial shenanigans covered by all these acronyms. They CAN understand not paying taxes.
Geithner is suddenly becoming the 'bad guy' in the media. why?? I mean.. he is a piece of work, but why did the 'media sentiment' change so quickly.
lucifer
Treasury Sec. nominee didn't pay his self employment tax for 4 years while at the IMF? Screw him, throw him on the ash heap.
Why is gold down today?
I hate to say "it's different this time" but I have to say that Gold has behaved differently this downturn than was predicted by many goldbugs.
My thoughts is that Gold has simply been commoditized... so it acts more like a commodity now than "real money"
either that or it's just another round of "Mr. Margin" with people selling their things of value to cover their margin requirements due to losses.
cd - LOL! How long did it take you to find that?
Goody's liquidates.
Does anyone find it peculiar that Steven Rattner, head of the PE firm Quadrangle Group (which happens to own Maxim), is going to be the auto-czar?
I guess it helps that his wife is the national finance chair for the DNC.
rent_to_own: As Finnish I would say we are even better positioned than you Germans. (And thanks for all the Stukas against Russian invasion back in summer 1944!)
History flash: Finland was part of Axis after all out invasion attack in Winter War back in 1939-1940 by Russians. For that we paid dearly to our comrades in Russia (for fighting against them?!) the same way as Germany after WW-ONE.
But we were part of Operation Barbarossa (=get even with those Russians) So Pavel for that, fuck and you! And once again, just friendly fuck and you!
History is full of anomalies
Nortel Networks Corp., North America's biggest maker of telephone equipment, filed for bankruptcy protection in the U.S., a victim of the global credit crunch and declining sales. Nortel, based in Toronto, had more than $1 billion in assets and debt, according to a Chapter 11 filing of its U.S. subsidiary today in Wilmington, Delaware. Fourteen affiliates of Nortel's financing unit are seeking similar protection in Delaware. Five units filed for bankruptcy there under Chapter 15. Nortel said Canadian affiliates also will seek protection.
Joe Stalin raised you one!
Treasury Sec. nominee didn't pay his self employment tax for 4 years while at the IMF? Screw him, throw him on the ash heap.
take a name ass wipe | 01.14.09 - 11:11 am | #
That's not what bothers me. I can understand how anyone could make the error he made.
What bothers me is that when the error was pointed out, years ago, he fixed two of the four returns. He didn't fix the other two until after Obama''s Team's Review. That seriously smacks of "only pay taxes when you're caught not doing so".
ades - that has spooked the TSE...
ades-
lucifer pointed it out in my bad dream last night....that sob kept me up all night..I'm heading to st annes today to shake him and Geithner loose today....
Someone quoted Pandit at Citi:
"We have 140,000 people in IT and operations. We have 16 database standards. We have 25,000 developers. ... Thats massively inefficient. Were finally going to merge it all."
And they're going to start by firing most of the people with a working knowledge of the existing code? Good luck with that...
Dammit, I want an obama rally. I was promised an obama rally.
Where is my obama rally!
bounce off 8150, last visited Dec 1
cd, LOL, you were primed to fire!
Just saw a helicopter fly by my building, alas, there were no bags of money being dropped...must be tied up in Congress?
The inauguration is still on, right?
Anyone know what the circuit breaker levels are?
850
Anyone know what the circuit breaker levels are?
Joe Stalin | 01.14.09 - 11:19 am | #
850, 1700 and 2600
Marketwatch: Senate panel postpones hearing on Geithner until next week
I should take out a loan with DB and default on it.
half-joker writes:
The inauguration is still on, right?
half-joker | 01.14.09 - 11:18 am | #
Actually, moving up to tomorrow.
Barley is that the stock exchange? I'm always slow with the letters but laugh out loud when i finally figure out how obvious it was! :) This is getting more and more interesting (and scary) each day....
BTW new post!
Re: That's not what bothers me. I can understand how anyone could make the error he made.
What bothers me is that he has been, at least nominally, in charge of the completely larcenous Maiden Lane LLCs, among others. I think that the bailouts he has been a party to should completely disqualify him from serving in the Obama administration. That his nomination is jeopardized by his alleged negligence as a taxpayer, rather than his allegedly criminal conduct toward the rest of us taxpayers, is simply some petard-hoistingly delicious irony.
"Someone quoted Pandit at Citi:
"We have 140,000 people in IT and operations. We have 16 database standards. We have 25,000 developers. ... Thats massively inefficient. Were finally going to merge it all."
And they're going to start by firing most of the people with a working knowledge of the existing code? Good luck with that...
Ken | 01.14.09 - 11:15 am | # "
They're gonna move everything to MS Access, Crystal Reports and Excel.
Those suckers scale big-time. And they're cheaper to deploy and maintain.
Trust me, the business analysts at Satyam told me this is the way to go.
"But we were part of Operation Barbarossa"
A catastrophe for both sides. Nothing to be proud of.
And to attack Pavel is truly barbaric.
THREAD MUSIC
YouTube - Godspeed You Black Emperor - The Dead Flag Blues
"Geithner is suddenly becoming the 'bad guy' in the media"......
"They CAN understand not paying taxes."
"Treasury Sec. nominee didn't pay his self employment tax for 4 years while at the IMF?"
....Even a dummy like ME realizes you need to pay taxes on $50K back to 2001 - AND, it wasn't paid back until the Obama guys brought it up?
That's the kind of guy I want to head the Treasury!
The interesting question though is; Will he be blown out of the job because of it???
Thanks Loudocracy for that "repo" bexplanation. I'm confused th..isn't a bond a loan already?
Yes. Think of it as like a bank. A bank borrows money (from you) to lend it. Implicitly, the loan is collateral for your deposit since if the bank were to go under you'd use the loan to get your money back. A repo is the same kind of thing but with the order reversed. First they make the loan, then they use the loan to borrow the money. With a repo they use the loan as explicit collateral because that way they get a better rate.
Traditionally repos are used to cover short-term funding shortfalls. Some company is rolling over a loan (for example) and they have to pay on the 15th but the new loan won't close until the 25th because the rate is better or the CEO got Dehli belly or whatever. So they use some asset for a 10 day repo to cover the gap.
Recently the Fed has been offering to buy repos to allow banks to cover and disguise permanent losses. This doesn't seem to be working very well.
Holocaust of the finance stocks here and in Europe...indeed everywhere. AXA that has withstood the downturn better than most is now giving way. How about $1 for C, for AEG, for AZ, for LYG and a number of others. That's the day I'm waiting for. LOL
did anybody see the story in Bloomberg yesterday about the disparity between implied volatility and historic volatility being huge which pointed towards a big rally!!!!
"A catastrophe for both sides. Nothing to be proud of.
And to attack Pavel is truly barbaric."
Hmmm, like Russian brave liberating soldiers killing border line Finnish villages point blank? Children and all? Everybody friggin body.
Book value - hahahahahah! Good one that.
Angry Saver | 01.14.09 - 10:05 am | #
Hey every Library has to have a fiction sectio
NYSE, New York Stock Exchange > About Us > News & Events > Media Resources > Media Resources
2ndpost
OT somewhat. I think now is the time for the Ukraine to tell NATO to pay its gas bills for it. NATO adores the Ukraine and wants it to join the club so this seems very reasonable. If it did, then Europe would be warm this winter. All that is required is a bit of money. LOL.
Hal | 01.14.09 - 11:37 am | #
Money is the story but it isn't the reason...
Paying taxes is unpatriotic!
Where did I hear that?
"And to attack Pavel is truly barbaric."
St. Pavel is a sanctimonious catholic whose poet shtick is getting mildly tiresome.
citizen, reason or not, if Russia got paid it could hardly turn off the gas. I think it eminently reasonable for Russia to want to get paid. The Ukraine needs to get a lesson in reality. And NATO too.
If Geithner doesn't make it, just merge Sec of State/Tresuary and put smart power Hillary into that position.
She has brought a poor Ark. boy to the Presidency and made them both untouchable wealth and power.
Smart Power/ The new word for 09.
In Heaven there is no beer.
So we must drink it here.
Comrade Byzantine_Ruins | Homepage | 01.14.09 - 10:31 am | #
Then it aint heaven, its the other place
The vision of St. Brigid was a heavenly community in which all created beings were joined together in joy. This is a poem attributed to St. Brigid giving voice to this hope:
I should like a great lake of beer for the King of Kings.
I should like the angels of Heaven to be drinking it through time eternal.
I should like excellent meats of belief and pure piety.
I should like the men of Heaven at my house.
I should like barrels of peace at their disposal.
I should like for them cellars of mercy.
I should like cheerfulness to be their drinking.
I should like Jesus to be there among them.
I should like the three Marys of illustrious renown to be with us.
I should like the people of Heaven, the poor, to be gathered around from all parts.
"Does anyone find it peculiar that Steven Rattner, head of the PE firm Quadrangle Group (which happens to own Maxim), is going to be the auto-czar?"
Makes perfect sense to me..look at all the great things Cerberus did for Chrysler
".after a stunning concession on Gorbachev's part (Germany"
He was convinced he had no choice.
Fair Economist, thanks much for that additional "clarification" on repos.
(Anon shakes his head and goes "muddlemuddlemuddle" and slaps himself)
"They make the loan and then use the loan to borrow the money."
Aaaaaaaaaaaabbott, if they have the money to make the loan, then why do they need to borrow money to make the loan?
I can't understand this esoteric credit stuff. good thing we have the financial experts to manage it all for us.
Anonymous writes:
I can't understand this esoteric credit stuff. good thing we have the financial experts to manage it all for us.
It's no more complicated than paying your taxes
rent_to_own:
"And the same German Post that can't afford DHL will apparently be the proud owner of 8% of Deutsche Bank."
I don't think they "can't afford it", it's probably just "not profitable".
"in Germany [...] arrangements [...] tend to come with something resembling accountability."
For some reason "Old Europe" has not gone all the way adopting the "because I can" attitude, being "hamstrung" by all those pesky relics of old social conventions of propriety and upholding appearances. I guess that's related to why those dudes called it "Old" Europe - meant as an insult, but doubling as a compliment.
There is enough shit and favors dealing going on, but public perceptions are still considered important and are paid heed. Perhaps it's as simple as there being more "accountability" in politics, by it not being a one/two party system (though it increasingly seems to drift there).
speaking of taxes the Geithner confirmation hearings are likely not going to take place until after the cold and snowy inauguration -
take it! booooyaaaaaaa
"I should"
That is much better than "we should". You are off the list "god damn Russians". For now...
Preparations, in Langes case, include a storeroom in his
basement in New Jersey stacked high with enough food, water, diapers,
and other necessities to last his family six months;
because diapers are so high on the list of MUST haves.
Aaaaaaaaaaaabbott, if they have the money to make the loan, then why do they need to borrow money to make the loan?
Like I said, normally a repo is used when you have the cash today, will have it in in a few days, but because of the timing of your payments and receivables you won't have it tomorrow. The repo is a kind of bridge loan. You have to have the security for the repo, but a security isn't cash and you'd have to pay a commission to sell it and then re-buy in a few days, plus take on some market risk. The repo converts a non-cash asset into cash for a short period to cover the short-term cash shortfall.
Zitterbewegung! Eistein said so.
No it is not "Zitterbewegung", it is outright masturbation of quarks. God damn particles !
The thought police!
I wish someone would revive the film of someone I knew in Moscow, Yvgeni Tsymbal. He made a film called Zashitnik Sedov [Defender Sedov], about an attorney who couldn't take it any more, and decided to defend some engineers who were about to be executed on false charges during the Great Purge.
The censor passed the film because he thought it was a sports film [zashitnik can also mean a defensive player in football].
He also made a film in which Stalin's murder, by surgical operation, of Frunze was portrayed.
I remember when Tsymbal came back from a meeting at the Film Union, where what he described as an audience of "bald heads" put him up on the stage and hurled accusations at him. When he returned home his face was pale.
"They're going to kill me", he muttered.
But then, the SU fell instead.
All those who have risked their lives for freedom may comment.
So Pavel: You Admit as a Russian that YOU FUCKED IT UP AS SOCIETY? That as Finnish I really would like to hear...
Defender Sedov won the young director's award at the London Film Festival, 1989. It is extraordinarily powerful, with a shocking denouement.
Yeah, thought so too. Getting a straight answer from a Russian is like interviewing a tortoise.
=Russian Uncertainty Principle! Even worse than Heisenberg
?
supafly73 writes:
...History is full of anomalies...
Sure looks like that way when a Finn thanks an american (ocupation-) soldier (rent_to_own, occupying Germany still after 60+ years after the end of the war) "for all the Stukas against Russian invasion back in summer 1944"!
And no, Operation Barbarossa was not about getting even with those Russians, they haven't done annything bad to the Nazies, it was a war against the ideological arch-enemy of the Nazies : Socialism (massively influenced by Jews).
And last, but not least: no need at all to get personal with Pavel !
So, supafly73, you might first learn something about history and the participants you correspond with here, before you lodge another truly hilarious post.
(btw., I am German)
Nortel filed because it is burning about $1bn in cash a year. It will go through its cash pile pretty quickly at this rate. So instead of having to pay out the nose for DIP financing, it's declaring BK while it still has cash to finance its ops.
supafly73,
My husband used to do a lot of consulting for finish companies in the early 90's and late 80's. After the collapse of the soviet union he traveled by volvo with his finish partners across finland to St. Petersburg. The city of ST. Pete was looking to barter some property for work on their waste water treatment plant. It was winter and it was cold. They brought to trade for services a white fish for their interperter (They later ate it in his apartment)and a black and white TV for their stay at the Astoria.
My husband meet with the Vice Mayer of ST. Pete. He described as none other than a gangster and he saw "evil" in his eyes. This man was non other than Valdimer Putin. The future Czar of Russia.
MLM writes:
...I can't remember, is $6 billion a lot, or just a nothingburger...
Well, it seems to be half an aircraft carrier or 20% of the Bear Stearns "investment by the american taxpayers".
I would say it's "collateral damage" thanks to our AAA-lying (former) allies.
"So, supafly73, you might first learn something about history and the participants you correspond with here, before you lodge another truly hilarious post. (btw., I am German)"
Yes, and I somehow remember my grandfather stories about fighting both Russians and you Germans back in Lapland (while your troops (which were very BTW helpful against Russian troops) were retreating at the end of the war).
There were actually three wars for Finland, two against Russia and then one dirty war against YOU Germans back in Lapland in 1944-1945.
It really was a different war for Finland than for you Germans but I have to admit, both were happily going against Russia.
"rent_to_own, occupying Germany still after 60+ years after the end of the war"
Well, that is an interesting perspective, considering that I work for a German company, married to a German I met in Canada, and have never been in the military.
And that my children are both German and American citizens. Who were born and raised here, having spent less than a half year total of their lives in the U.S.
But whatever. However, the American and French left this region a while ago - the Americans 15 years ago, the French more than 5 years ago. The Canadians also left more than a decade ago, too.
But the region does have a lot of Aussiedler - on the Strassenbahn between Karlsruhe, Baden-Baden, and Achern, Russian is quite common. Certainly more common than English or French. But then, the Russian speakers are not occupiers either, they are Germans, at least according to their passports.
While the Germans living in the Alsace are neither French nor occupiers.
Very multi-culti, it seems, at least in this part of southern Germany.
re : supafly73
I am not firm in Finland/Russian history, but if Russia really should have unprovokedly attacked Finland, I certainly can understand your anger against Russia.
But this is still not a reason to attack Pavel!
(Who btw. still owes me an answer to a question a few weeks ago, eh Pavel?)
rent_to_own: Well, maybe I am such a asshole because I lived years ago in Munich, about 200 meters from the THAT hitler's place
Many Strasse...
But beer was super-excellent but as protestant I still feel liked burning the damn place!
Next time I have to move to Germany, it is either Köln or Berlin. Clearly marihuana burning straight protestant groupsexy people
No more that catholic southern BS!
re : rent_to_own
Oh,oh...,Ich bitte vielmals um Entschuldigung!
Well, I gathered hat you are American, and since most of Americans in Germany are indeed soldiers, and since there was once the talk about the "Käfertal" (where there are american Barracks), I (erroneously) made the uncritical inference that you are an american soldier. Sorry for that, and btw. wellcome in Germany!
Well, and since you are not military, you are certainly not an "occupier" either, nor are those Russians you mean. But the military ones were.
Sorry for that again!
Pavel Chichikov writes:
...He also made a film in which Stalin's murder,...
Maybe he should also have made a film about Stalin's murders?
I guess that was a bit more than just thought police?
Going to the confessional is good.
Lehman skipped some of their opportunities and look what happened to them.