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Old news.
Wait, that can't be right; those are AAA.
Double Nemoed!
I guess now that the Troubled Asset Relief Program is officially not going to buy any Troubled Assets, they have become more Troubled.
How can capital allocation function in the private sector at all when Treasury is poised to throw around hundreds of billions of dollars, nobody knows how they intend to throw it around, and the story (such as it is) changes every week?
Semi-serious question.
Bartender, a round of radioactive beer on tap for my friends.
Well who got screwed on this little manuever?
Nemo writes:
I guess now that the Troubled Asset Relief Program is officially not going to buy any Troubled Assets, they have become more Troubled.
That will show them! The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
My guess is GGP
Yawn! Where's the volume in the equity market decline? Volume confirms price. 'Nuf said.
Well, on the previous thread I saw a comment that wanted the government to do something without raising welfare!
Welfare? That has been dead for quite a long time.
Now it will come back with a big boost to the economy.
I know someone who is on disability (really disabled) trying to live on $500 a month. Thank Heaven he is married, as his medical costs are $600 a month!!!
WTF? Welfare? What welfare?
Too much conservative talk radio moronic thought.
Wanna stimulate the economy? Give the man $1,500 a month- enough to decently survive.
Geez, it is sooo easy to see the gaping holes in our social safety net- drop through and take a look.
As for ABX- when are they going to admit this stuff will have zero residual value unless bailed out by the government.
Someday this war's gonna end...
Mouse:
Turn down the volume. I can't hear you.
Ah, this post takes me back the old days when we just talked about a crash happening.
..... got the munchies. A bowl of synthethic CDO's to go with that radioactive half-life beer
Yawn! Where's the volume in the equity market decline? Volume confirms price. 'Nuf said.
I can almost believe this. But it's so old school.
You know, from back before the government would just arbitrarily ban shorting. Or arbitrarily make AMEX a bank.
Does charting still work when all the assumptions are either different, or completely missing?
Wow! Thanks for pointing this out.
After seeing this, I'm putting my shorts back on.
After seeing this, I'm putting my shorts back on.
Was the last post that exciting for you?
"All of the CMBX indices are setting new record lows again."
Joy of joy's.
This is going to help.
We need to shoot the short sellers.
BTW, Shakespears quip about killing the lawyers was about those people actually protecting citizens from gov't. Back when the law was a shield. Now it is a sword in the gov'ts hand.
Times they do change.
Nostrovia,
PeakVT writes:
'After seeing this, I'm putting my shorts back on.'
Was the last post that exciting for you?
With all the weird details that Broward keeps volunteering, it might have worked for someone. :
PS. You all misunderstand the noun being modified. It is not a relief program for troubled assets. It is an asset relief program that is troubled. There. Problem solved!
Nemo said, "How can capital allocation function in the private sector at all when Treasury is poised to throw around hundreds of billions of dollars, nobody knows how they intend to throw it around, and the story (such as it is) changes every week?"
A. Very inefficiently.
As an investor, personally I've decided to sit things out. I got tired of the rule changes in the middle of the game and decided that the market was rigged aganist us little folk.
I hope the big players don't come to the same conclusion.
PeakVT, well done.
PeakVT writes:
Ah, this post takes me back the old days when we just talked about a crash happening.
Yes, back when this was obscure.
I didn't realize these really had much downside left!
Got Popcorn?
Neil
China cut taxes on 28 percent of exports yesterday, adding to $586 billion of spending pledged by the government to sustain growth as a global recession looms. The economy may expand 5.8 percent this quarter, the weakest pace in at least 15 years, according to Credit Suisse AG.
China Industrial-Output Growth Is Slowest in 7 Years (Update3) - Bloomberg.com
PeakVT (and all),
Can we trust the China numbers?
Of course you can trust the numbers out of China.
PeakVT,
"China cut taxes on 28 percent of exports yesterday, adding to $586 billion of spending pledged by the government to sustain growth as a global recession looms. The economy may expand 5.8 percent this quarter, the weakest pace in at least 15 years, according to Credit Suisse AG."
Oh this will drop.
China's been selling malamine crap to children. This is worse than to pet owners in USA.
What else is there to say?
Nostrovia,
s_puttnick - I wouldn't trust the specific number, but the fact that it is so bad is very meaningful. JMHO.
CR,
Is this your way of saying that when the usual end of quarter squeeze happens and we have more markdowns that Libor will shoot up again?
If so, nicely done.
I remain convinced there is no bottom until we get clarity in financials. I'll take certainty too (overt nationalization)
LowerMiddleClass writes:
Double Nemoed!
LOL! He had time to think of something clever that required two posts and pull it off. That monkey must be back on the clock....
...............
I think that this might be a christmas we all remember.... Maybe tell people about years from now..... maybe?
That could just be the nostalgia of the cliff diving posts.... (and an IPA or two)
No this is not old news. This is devastating news.
Will they start pricing CMBX in dollars rather than spread?
Look out below ... the credit system is about to freeze back up.
@Nemo
"Wait, that can't be right; those are AAA."
You slay me. Who are you channeling? Paulson? Fuld?
I remain convinced there is no bottom until we get clarity in financials. I'll take certainty too (overt nationalization)
Noble
With the current BS that Hanky Panky is pulling (not letting the tax payers know who's taken what) we're not getting any closer.
Has anyone seen a list of whos taken what produced by insiders? Seems that there should be enough discontent that people might be able to spill their guts....
Then again.....
Yes. When you see cliff-diving like that, it means anybody who has written naked puts is gonna have to put their shorts back on...or else they're gonna get reamed with loads of stock put to them by the longs.
Geeze CR, you're a machine.
CR:
This may be a lame request, but it would be better if the links in your posts opened in a new window. That way we can keep our CR page up.
Just a thought.
@Noble
"I'll take certainty too."
Markets tend to like that. I do not see that happening until I-Day at the earliest when the O-Man should be safely able to communicate whatever big plan he can come up with between now and then.
He looks to be a fairly smart guy, I hope he can come up with something better than MOTS.
How he handles Plelosi's begging for the Big 3 will be telling.
Hello....USG is no longer taking out the garbage. So, not surprising. Question is who is buying?
Well, I am now taking a bit. Off setting Ts with 10% weighting of, lets call it for whatt it is, junk.
The drag of this is having an effect (or is affect?) on munis, too. Got a 5year (actually 16 months left) muni and the yield, if seen to maturity is 14.65%. I dont see a big city defaulting on bonds in the next 16 months..but who knows.
Making money in bear markets is easier. Follow the fear. The TSX had an awful day. But some nice sweet spots - been acquiring CEW for a few weeks now and slowly been adding to XIU which I got out of in May 07 . As for the US, HIO is very nice place for fixed but slow pay. Cdn dollar is way to cheap so I dont mind the exposure and I really dont believe the medium term US dollar is at all strong.
All said however, still in 70% cash.
Really need to figure out a way to short longer USTs. Dont have this down yet...any thoughts.
Also looking for entry into emerging markets via a fund and am now looking any thoughts.
All said - US 9% unemployment by year end and GDP is -3.4 in Q4.
Any dividends connected to this shit will obviously be evaporated like squirrel juice on a hot summer day!
"This may be a lame request, but it would be better if the links in your posts opened in a new window. That way we can keep our CR page up.
Just a thought."
Right click on link. Works for haloscan too. So you don't have annoying little window to post in.
Nostrovia,
squirrel juice? ROFL
"@CSC
This may be a lame request, but it would be better if the links in your posts opened in a new window."
Right click... Open in new window/tab. Unless you are using a Mac.
With the current BS that Hanky Panky is pulling (not letting the tax payers know who's taken what) we're not getting any closer.
nades
The lack of leadership is just astounding. They are content to let the market do their work for them. They should declare a bank holiday, go into these banks and figure out who is solvent and who isnt. Nationalize the insolvents and move on. But Bush has explicitly ordered - No Nationalization on his watch. And so, we suffer. The animal spirits of businesses and consumers when the watch the market has been totally devastated. Its a pity really but it will give long term investors some amazing bargains sometime next year when the new leadership does bring about clarity. Assuming ofcourse some of these financials last that long. That is severely in doubt.
Comrade Misean is Dope writes:
"This may be a lame request, but it would be better if the links in your posts opened in a new window. That way we can keep our CR page up.
Just a thought."
Highly agree!
"squirrel juice?"
Gahhh!
OK that's a bit beyond the pale.
Nostrovia,
Right-click is the right way.
Just say no to mono-mouse.
I don't understand cliff diving unless I visually see it on the post. Also, I don't understand nudity unless I visually see it on the post. Please add both freeely and frewuently.
Right click... Open in new window/tab. Unless you are using a Mac.
Blackhalo
I'm a huge macolyte
Just found out all the new mouses that come with the imacs actually have a right and a left click in them. granted it only looks like one button. You have to go to the settings and tell it to change the right click to right click.
Granted this is prolly obvious to anyone who has owned a mac for a while (?) but i'm a recent convert!
Blackhalo: I hope one of the first things on President Obama's charter is to tackle insolvencies in the banking system.
That infection has become gangrenous.
"The lack of leadership is just astounding."
Who put these clowns and sycophants in charge? I see better ideas on any given story on this blog than these financial rocket scientists come up with.
Tell me the one again where buying up .02% of the outstanding CDS paper is going to fix everything....
I like colorful graphs.
Noble writes:
The lack of leadership is just astounding.
Agreed. Nothing has exacerbated this situation like the inconstancy shown by the people involved. Self-dealing, vacillation, obvious lack of a plan, deliberately provoking a panic for political ends, nothing that can erode trust has been omitted.
To think back to the heady days when Wim Duisenberg running his mouth was a scandal, oh those were the days.
I think they have had plans. But they all were bad, misinformed plans that never worked. We need a leader with good plans that have a actual chance of succeeding.
Im on the mutherfukka.
.....NOW Asian stock markets are down 5-7%......except Shanghai is up 5% ..... Yuen replacces $$$ rather quickly......
"Blackhalo: I hope one of the first things on President Obama's charter is to tackle insolvencies in the banking system.
That infection has become gangrenous."
I do not know if that is doable in a single term. 12 years of Voodoo Economics, followed by 8 years of VE Lite, followed by 8 more of VE Extra Strength.
I am of the mind that it is time to cull the heard and save the living.
We need a leader with good plans that have a actual chance of succeeding.
Elvis |
I have found your leader, and his name is Bob.
YouTube - No More Bailouts!!!
Gawk, spit, spit:
Constituents for CMBX-NA-BB 3
BEAR STEARNS COMMERCIAL MORTGAGE SECURITIES TRUST 2007-PWR15
CITIGROUP COMMERCIAL MORTGAGE TRUST 2006-C5
J.P. Morgan Chase Commercial Mortgage Securities Trust 2006-LDP9
Ack, puft, spit.... so many tasting shitballs
Elvis,
"I think they have had plans. But they all were bad, misinformed plans that never worked. We need a leader with good plans that have a actual chance of succeeding."
Nah! It works better having the Joker running around saying:
"Do I look like a man with a plan"
IMHO.
Nostrovia,
Im on the mutherfukka.
central_wolf_planner
LOL!!!!
....
Noble writes:
Blackhalo: I hope one of the first things on President Obama's charter is to tackle insolvencies in the banking system.
Amen, and I agree with Pavel that he needs to have a real talk with the American people about just what kind of situation we're in.
I'm not planning on seeing it, but bank nationalization and a frank admission that we are in a very perilous situation are two good steps.
Formulating a policy structure that imposes a severe austerity package would be a third good one, IMO. Hoover whatever, this country needs its balance sheet repaired, even at the cost of genuine hardship. The hardship is coming anyway, we might as well rebuild the public purse deliberately rather than suffer policy paralysis from operational collapse.
CR is a machine. No seriously.
We are supposed to believe a retired person can run a blog and hike in the mountains all the time and hone in on every important economic issue of the day? Seriously?! Skynet sent you back in time to mock us!
And nemo, that was hilarious and insightful.
Hawk, spit, spit, gack, ahhh.. spit:
10-K 1 ccmt06c5_10k.htm CITIGROUP COMMERCIAL MORTGAGE TRUST 2006-C5 FORM 10-K
Citigroup Commercial Mortgage Trust 2006-C5 Form 10-K
\t
Description
4(i)
The series 2006-C5 pooling and servicing agreement dated as of November 1, 2006 among Citigroup Commercial Mortgage Securities Inc., as depositor (the “Depositor”), Wachovia Bank, National Association, as master servicer no. 1 (the "Master Servicer No. 1"), Midland Loan Services, Inc., as master servicer no. 2 (the "Master Servicer No. 2"), LNR Partners, Inc., as special servicer (the “Special Servicer”), Wells Fargo Bank, National Association, as trustee (the “Trustee”), and LaSalle Bank National Association, as certificate administrator (the “Certificate Administrator”) (the "Pooling and Servicing Agreement") (Previously filed as part of the Registrant's Current Report on Form 8-K on December 6, 2006)*
"I have found your leader, and his name is Bob."
Awesome. That is a keeper. Torrent?
db,
I'm glad I'm not related to Bob, because holidays would really wear me out having to sit around and listen to that guy talk a million miles an hour and loudly. Actually, I'd spike his drinks with downers right away and that might solve the problem. Then, when he is passed out, I'd urinate on him.
"Then, when he is passed out, I'd urinate on him."
But only in a nice, loving, family sort of way.
Yawn! Where's the volume in the equity market decline? Volume confirms price.
How can you have volume when nobody in their right mind wants to buy, and those who own stock refuse to sell at such low prices?
Not snarky. Isn't this just like what is happening in RE?
Then, when he is passed out, I'd urinate on him.
Elvis
That sounds like more of a Jim Morrison move than an Elvis move.
Hormigas y Cucarachas
ya no puede caminar...
Now here yah friggn go, yer sitting at home watching a porno show and yah think you have it ok, cause yah bet the farm in a mutual fund, and dang, yah find out, the dudes running that show have all sorts a shit they been doing that yah had no idea was going down -- now that's a pickle:
Re: Lincoln Variable Insurance Products Trust
LVIP T. Rowe Price Structured Mid-Cap Growth Fund
http://yahoo.brand.edgar-online.com/EFX_dll/EDGARpro.dll?FetchFilingHTML1?ID=5969015&SessionID=TbTMWH0cSYxwU77
March 31, 2008
Commercial Mortgage-Backed Securities – 2.60%
CITIGROUP COMMERCIAL MORTGAGE TRUST 2006-C5
How did we get here?
lol nice find Kona
Obama having an honest discussion with the American people would be like your local librarian reading Gravity's Rainbow at story hour.
el final a pie o muerte.
Ack, puft, spit.... so many tasting shitballs
Kona
LOL!
el toro es guapo.
@nades 10:28:
Re single-mouse Macs--
Either cntrl-click or Apple/CMD-click should give you a "right-click" if on a single mouse.
Check out OmniWeb as a browser. Tabbed browsing in particular a huge plus (tabs are mini-windows in a drawer on the side of your window). Been using OW since '93, when the NeXT was still a viable system.
No worries. Our financial institutions and all counterparties are well capitalized.
mooooo
¡Me quiero jugo de ardilla!
Hoover whatever, this country needs its balance sheet repaired, even at the cost of genuine hardship.
We really want to ease into the deficit-reduction mode. Doing it abruptly will create a lot more of that hardship thing.
And fixing the balance sheet (at the federal level, at least) isn't completely insurmountable. The tax increases passed in the 1993 budget deal were moderate, and were instrumental in putting the budget in balance by 2000. They were also compatible with growth, despite what Republicans said when the changes were being debated.
shnaps. thats the funniest shit all noche !!
do I need to do credits?
cuz I reads it all daze long.....
Margin Call of Cthulu --
PS. You all misunderstand the noun being modified. It is not a relief program for troubled assets. It is an asset relief program that is troubled. There. Problem solved!
Damn, that's pretty good.
For the last time.
The capitalist economy is too complicated for anyone to understand. Be it Paulson, Krugman, Roubini, von Mises, Bush, Ron Paul, Obama, Summers, Friedman, Marx, you name it.
6 Billion consumers. 30 Billion daily transactions. Money is the medium of exchange. Unintended consequences of government action and central planning.
Don't blame HP and BB, they simply do not know what they are doing. And neither do their critics.
The only thing we can do is to sit quietly and watch and short the market to oblivion.
There Goes My Life
YouTube -
Kenny Chesney just won CMA on teevee...
Obama having an honest discussion with the American people would be like your local librarian reading Gravity's Rainbow at story hour.
LOL. But V is a better read.
Barley:
was looking at Powershares Ultrashort on the 20 year Treasury (TBT). They also have an intermediate term - 7 to 10 years - Ultrashort (PST).
Both are only about 5 months old and are down from the September peaks.
Like you, I'm trying to get a handle on things.
How to work this? Out of EEV/TWM with a profit and now own F shares.
But with yields this low on the treasuries, don't honestly know much lower the funds can go so I think that they're pushing bottom. But buy equal amounts of each or skew towards the longer term since greater volatility (like that's possible with these ultras) and sensitivity to any actions?
Nemo you say: "Should long-term Treasury rates decide to rise before the economy turns around, however, I have a guess."
Your thoughts...
Hmmm. Communism and Capitalism are BOTH destined to fail as they are BOTH managed markets. Problem is, living in a truly free market is interesting to say the least.
s_puttnick writes:
Obama having an honest discussion with the American people would be like your local librarian reading Gravity's Rainbow at story hour.
Well, it's one of those things.
This is a Republic, and that requires Citizens with a capital C.
People rise to your expectations.
I think barring a serious realignment of people's perceptions, of what they "must" or "should" be involved in and reality, it will be easy to manage the American state moving forward. That is because about seven in ten people will be dead. The remainder will smarten up considerably.
You might as well try to change the paradigm. The alternative is a near-immediate date with historic events.
I'm going TBT. Interest rates are about to explode with China selling some themselves and competing with the (lack of money) to buy the amount that the US plans to sell. To infinity and beyond...
"Don't blame HP and BB, they simply do not know what they are doing."
When I get the feeling the bloggers make more sense that the guys with the keys to the treasury, I get uneasy. Greenspan should have been the tip-off. That guy said less in more words than is sensible. I guess I should be relieved that he found the flaw. Everything must be better now.
When it is obvious the bloggers are making mores sense, I get angry.
PeakVT writes:
We really want to ease into the deficit-reduction mode. Doing it abruptly will create a lot more of that hardship thing.
No, I mean quite honestly I think it would be better to have people starving to death than a bad national balance sheet.
It's really quite important and if we don't stop deliberately, I don't think we'll mend our ways before we lose policy steerage on the Good Ship America. Under those conditions, a little bit of starvation or a few doomed Republican uprisings to crush will be like a pleasant Sunday picnic.
The governance of failing empires is a harsh and unrewarding task.
Yikes. Bloomberg's always cheery Chris V. looks like a ghost. Eerie lighting and bad makeup enhance the creepiness.
"Under those conditions, a little bit of starvation or a few doomed Republican uprisings to crush will be like a pleasant Sunday picnic."
You know what they say, "As long as it is not me starving, I'm in.."
BR- no!!!
There is no chance if you try to stop the crash by fiscal austerity.
The time for that was back in 2005- now it is waaay too late.
Now we only have total frickin Keynesian stimulation to save our butts.
Stop with the small government meme. We just had 8 years of everything but pork and the war being slashed down. Now you have to watch the real welfare state start up again.
The screams from the libertarian fringe will be drown out by the suffering of the ordinary folks.
Get used to it, as this is the dirty thirties on steroids- everything will be much faster than it took then.
Someday this war's gonna end...
Barley--if you are talking about going long on an emerging market fund, I have heard VWO recommended on this board. You might want to check again though before you go with it.
This is the link where they were talking about it:
HaloScan.com - Comments
I am thinking about this myself.
Damn. Actually thought I was original in flying TBT. If everyone has the same thought how I'm gonna hedge?
IMF with holds backing for Iceland's loan.
Wonder why?
IMF withholds backing for Iceland loan deal: report
| Reuters
IMF with holds backing for Iceland's loan.
Wonder why?
bjork?
Barley --
Well, since you asked...
In that case, I think the Fed hits "print" and starts buying long-duration Treasuries, either voluntarily, on in response to Congressional pressure. (The Fed's independence was granted by the stroke of a pen and can be revoked just as easily.)
Then we really do get 1930s Germany or 2000s Zimbabwe.
Our government's ability to borrow at insanely low rates of interest is all we have left; pray they do not squander it.
Well, I suppose we also have our military. Hey, maybe we do get a 30s re-run. U.S. = Germany, China = U.S., etc. Hm.
Bottom! MJ gives up the ranch that Thriller built.
Yahoo! 404 - Page Not Found
Citizen AllenM writes:
There is no chance if you try to stop the crash by fiscal austerity.
[...]
Now we only have total frickin Keynesian stimulation to save our butts.
"Stop" the crash? Not gonna happen.
Your balance sheet is already ruined. You'll just destroy your ability to raise funds trying to answer it with profligate spending.
Stop with the small government meme. We just had 8 years of everything but pork and the war being slashed down. Now you have to watch the real welfare state start up again.
I hope I don't sound judgmental if I I think you have both humanitarian and sectarian feelings that are not compatible with the extreme severity of this crisis.
Watching CNBC just now - they're talking about financial collapse, depression, meltdown - you pick the euphemism. The flashy graphics and hard beat bumpers seem strangely incongruous. It's like singing happy birthday at a funeral.
Wonder why?
zoom | 11.12.08 - 11:17 pm | #
Let Iceland disintegrate, get a bit chaos stirred. Use this to push for fast track for global regulatory bodies controlled by the same folks that got us here, like TARP fear-mongering, but bigger.
"ZOMG, you have to sign on to this or you'll end up like Iceland!"
The IMF, World Bank et al, ain't there to help, they exist to impose.
GDII: Charles Bovary's Revenge
Buffy, FancyTrap
Re: The capitalist economy is too complicated for anyone to understand.
I may need to respectfully disagree, because I was doing some research on population growth the other day and where I live the annual growth rate was about 1.4% per year, but during the housing bubble, homes were being built as if the growth rate was going to be 20% higher, thus, this is not complicated, it's a pyramid scheme and people were retarded to buy into it!
"I'm going TBT. Interest rates are about to explode"
I'm there to the tune of 1/4 of my acct. The only thing that scares me is it's so obvious I must be missing something.
Revenge of the Economy II.
"I'm there to the tune of 1/4 of my acct. The only thing that scares me is it's so obvious I must be missing something.
bearly"
Fortunately, obvious has been a good play for somebody with a time horizon over 2 weeks. Stick with it. You won't be sorry.
happy birthday at a funeral? Why so glum?
Elvis writes:
You know what they say, "As long as it is not me starving, I'm in.."
We should probably have a lottery, without too much worry about if we are preserving the young, old, skilled, unskilled, etc. Keep it as generic as possible, we're not going to lose too much irreplaceable human capital out of 350,000,000.
First rank for food, second rank for food, etc. If you want to give it away, that's your business. Divide the country into about ten cohorts. Make sure the first in line for food are also the first in line for military service, then see if we can make it be a pointless, silly bit of disaster prep.
Now wait just a dang second, the yield curve looks pretty fucking weird here and pleas excuse my fucking French -- but are we going super inverted crash or what?
Composite Bond Rates: Bonds Center - Yahoo! Finance
WTF is the curve doing off the chart here; I need to look at this closer...
I'm in, at worst it will be a self-fulfilling prophecy like the voodoo charts.
I just hope our troubles remain confined to the financial world and the economy. How does this go if combined with the pandemic influenza the DHS, CDC and WHO are all creepily and diligently preparing for?
Flu.gov
It can always get worse.
I am an uneducated peasant. I speak no foreign languages. Those paper shreds were crude folk drawings, not my MBA.
@Anonymous writes:
"Bottom! MJ gives up the ranch that Thriller built."
Hah! the only bottom that ranch has any significance for is a 6yo.
Byzantine_Ruins | Homepage | 11.12.08 - 11:35 pm | #
BR, are you sure you're not a SciFi writer . . . or perhaps a wannabe SciFi writer?
Because you're off to a good start tonight.
The entire yield curve has an odd configuration and has for awhile, I think. The 2year/5year spread is 118 basis points. The 5year/10 year spread is 130 basis points. The 10year/30 year spread is just 52 basis points.
My contention is that 10year/30 years is much too flat relative to the rest of the curve. One veteran salesman argues that the frightful decline in stocks has motivated that spread. He suggests that pension funds and insurance companies with annuity liabilities primarily hedge with equities.
Those assets have melted and, according to this salesman, many of those same insurance companies and pension funds have crowded into the long end of the Treasury market. They will have a golden opportunity to stock the shelves tomorrow when the Treasury auctions new bonds.
[hat tip]
Still digging ... looks very weird!!!
Asia taking a dump tonight. Check out the -888 on the Hang Seng. Not too lucky:
Major World Indices - Yahoo! Finance
Nikkei -550:
Nikkei.com - Market Live
ByzR-
I can't tell you how much some of the libertarian survivalist guff spewed here by semiautistic children galls me.
You want to stimulate this economy, you have to reverse a ton of misguided stupid policies. I live in one of the worst states for the social safety net, and the need is immense.
On the other hand I hear constant memes of the huge welfare state that are nothing but blatant lies.
Angry- it is starting to go beyond mere anger. And yet I hear tons of what are quite simply unworkable things to do.
Someday this war's gonna end...
WTF is the curve doing off the chart here; I need to look at this closer...
Indeed! That looks like a plotting error to me, but please, report back!
LOL Blackhalo! How long until Dubai gives the gloved one the boot!
On the other hand I hear constant memes of the huge welfare state that are nothing but blatant lies.
Well, not when it comes to corporate welfare.
AllenM, you've seen it before. The pot calls the kettle black hoping you'll forget the pot is really a pot.
I'm there to the tune of 1/4 of my acct. The only thing that scares me is it's so obvious I must be missing something.
Shorting Treasuries is like taking a fixed rate loan with no option for prepayment. Does it make sense going into a deflationary recession to be taking on debt?
Kona,
Are there any actual data points between the 10 and 30 yr? If not, the portion of the blue curve off the chart is meaningless right? Looks like someone did a bad polynomial fit to the data points. I know little about bonds and treasuries so I could be completely wrong.
Look at the twenty- it is running 4.5 percent. That is over the 30 year.
We have an artificially manipulated market with all too many people piling into long bonds.
Some of them are now getting sold off- the 20 is starting to become a target of shorting.
Someday this war's gonna end...
Citizen AllenM,
I agree with you about the extreme nature of many of the recent postings here and I respect your view.
As you say, Someday this war's gonna end...
Until then, carry on please. The extremists need to read what you write but it is getting difficult for me to read this garbage and I may have to quit. I don't have a clue as to how to rebut this stuff. Hope you and Pavel stick around.
Shorting Treasuries is like taking a fixed rate loan with no option for prepayment. Does it make sense going into a deflationary recession to be taking on debt?
Kicker
? ETFs generally mean that your investment is liquid. If you think the US gov't will continue to borrow at low rates when liquidity has dried up, maybe you know more than me. Definitely open for comment.
zoom and homedad, I read last night that the IMF was withholding the loan at the behest of the British and Dutch. Both countries' citizens got 'boned' in failure of the Icelandic banks, and the Brits and Dutch are using the IMF loan as leverage to get some money back for their citizens.
British bankers are nothing but wankers.
No one is going to starve in the US for lack of money or resources - not here not now. Some starve now but there are extenuating circumstances (they starve while mountains of food rot bins all across flyover).
Same with energy - look at the waste wood just lying everywhere - don't see that in Haiti. Don't even see many trees in Haiti.
If you think 'starving' is even remotely possible NOW - take a drive across the US Midwest. I say start at Indianapolis and drive west on I 74 to the Quad Cities then west across I 80 to the middle of Nebraska - then soak in the thought that that terrain stretches some 500 miles both north & south of that path (some places a lot more if you include Canada).
Coasts will only starve when we stop growing enough excess food for them and that is a major crisis cycle or two away yet [a century at least].
Austerity here & now mean 'basic cable', 'subsidized housing' and maybe one 15 year old used car for the whole family vs a couple huge LuxUVs & Mini-McMansion all on credit.
But if we don't fix the balance sheet & subsequently reallocate resources fairly soon so as to maintain our long term 'productive capacity' vs the 'bread & circuses' we are getting... then eventually we'll get to that starving thing. Eventually.
Wow, I know the Asian markets typically just react to the U.S.
But, tonight, they are overreacting (a bit).
Hope that we break down tomorrow.
I look forward to getting out of these shorts and into gold and UNWPX.
Sheesh guys - it's just mindless curve fitting. Their algorithm is trying to extrapolate up past the 10, then deals with the 30 year not fitting the 'pattern'.
There's no data behind it. Numerology chasers ...
Uncle Sam's Credit Line Running Out?
Uncle Sam's Credit Line Running Out? - Barrons.com
Trillions are no hyperbole. The Treasury is set to borrow $550 billion in the current quarter alone and $368 billion in the first quarter of 2009. "Near-term pressures on Treasury finances are much more intense than we had thought," Goldman Sachs economists commented when the government announced its borrowing projections last week.
It may finally be catching up with Uncle Sam. That's what the yield curve may be whispering. But some economists are too deaf, or dumb, to get it.
The steepening of the Treasury yield curve has been accompanied by an increase in the cost of insuring against default by the U.S. Treasury. It may come as a shock, but there are credit-default swaps on the U.S. government and they have become more expensive -- in tandem with an increase in the spread between two- and 10-year notes.
Both the yield spread and the cost of insuring debt moved up sharply together starting in September. Cutting through the technical jargon, the yield curve and the credit-default swaps market both indicate the markets are exacting a greater cost to lend to Uncle Sam. And it's not because of anticipated recovery, which would reduce, not increase, the cost of insuring Treasury debt against default. All of which suggests America's credit line has its limits.
I dunno, dryfly. From what I've read, there was a lot of malnutrition in the G.D.
Now, we have whole sections of cities that are in terrible shape, and have little ability to fend for themselves; compare New Orleans with Mississippi during Katrina.
Me, I think we are going to have lots of starvation, unfortunately.
?? Therefore, focusing on longer-term TIPS may be a more cost effective approach for the Treasury, Ramanthan said. But he added that no decisions have been made. The Treasury will sell 10-year and 20-year TIPS in January and has scheduled a 5-year TIPS issue for April.
"Me, I think we are going to have lots of starvation, unfortunately."
I doubt starvation as long as McDonalds is in business, but I think malnutrition may be an epidemic.
"Austerity here & now mean 'basic cable', 'subsidized housing' and maybe one 15 year old used car for the whole family vs a couple huge LuxUVs & Mini-McMansion all on credit.
But if we don't fix the balance sheet & subsequently reallocate resources fairly soon so as to maintain our long term 'productive capacity' vs the 'bread & circuses' we are getting... then eventually we'll get to that starving thing. Eventually."
dryfly, right on. However, I think the time frame from conditions you describe in paragraph 1 transitioning over to paragraph 2 will be relatively short for a variety of reasons. Did you have any time frame in mind for 'eventually' if or when the productive capacity thing doesn't pan out?
Genuinely curious about your opinion, or if you have one in this regard.
Mes amis,
It is getting pretty bad. Read this.
computer/tech industry hit hard. layoffs are already announced. The worse is to come. stock are also hit hard.
details below:
MarketWarnings: INTC stock intel earnings will be below expectations
dryfly writes: Austerity here & now mean 'basic cable', 'subsidized housing' and maybe one 15 year old used car for the whole family vs a couple huge LuxUVs & Mini-McMansion all on credit.
...
yep. The problem is promises to pay that can not be kept.
I hope you are right, Elvis, that it is merely malnutrition.
Anyone?
@Comrade-Dope jg (jg)
"Me, I think we are going to have lots of starvation, unfortunately."
Yeah but probably not in the U.S. N. Korea, Hati, and sub-Saharan Africa are probably not going to be too happy though. The Mexicans were annoyed with the recent run up in corn and might get a little rowdy.
The Chinese are able to afford to eat well, and U.S. Farmers will be only too happy to sell it to them at a higher rate than the Aid agencies can afford.
I'm in agreement with Byzantine_Ruins regarding the public works programs.
First and foremost we need a huge program for farming/food somehow. This might include research and investment on clean water sources, converting all our excess global warming sea-water into usable water. Additionally figuring out how to harvest meat in a way that is safe and humane to the nutters who want humane meat (apparently everyone in California).
We need to go back to farming. It doesn't matter if we can think of the craziest weapons designs or high speed trains or what not, but if towns are running out of food... that's important.
My other question is; where are people going to go with their nice monorails? Is the plan to build trains to nowhere? This thinking doesn't match the thought of a "greater depression".
Maybe if we all knew how to farm, we could purchase homes, and land and live for ourselves without anyone coming in and telling us what to do.
Personally I think not bailing out the big 3 is foolish as well, but hard to tell how much money to spend on them. Do you guys think that all those Japanese companies will really keep their plants in America? Do you think the cost of those cars won't go up if we get rid of our domestic production?
Comrade-Dope jg (jg) writes:
I dunno, dryfly. From what I've read, there was a lot of malnutrition in the G.D.
Now, we have whole sections of cities that are in terrible shape, and have little ability to fend for themselves; compare New Orleans with Mississippi during Katrina.
Me, I think we are going to have lots of starvation, unfortunately.
Comrade-Dope jg (jg) | 11.12.08 - 11:57 pm | #
I'm telling ya jg - ain't gonna happen.
First of all they can can grow vitamins by the beaucoup in factories for god sake - stuff's as hard to make as soylent. I used to work in the biz. Even malnutrition won't be a big problem once Big Brother decides it isn't going to be a problem.
Everyone is fighting the last war - it will be different this time. Food in NAFTA Zone will not be a problem - even with tight energy supplies. We'll have other problems - like learning to be happy with one color of iphone.
Rest of world - not necessarily the case.
Criminals don't recognize borders. SW will be unrecognizable when the oil income runs out in Mexico.
Drug Cartels Flex Muscle In Southwest - CBS News
Also, I want to repeat... Wal-Mart rally-day tommorrow! So all this fear mongroling and depression talk can wait until the weekend... and yes my money is in WalMart (begrudgingly).
Schwab's public page says: deflation:
Arc of a Diver: Inflation Succumbs to Deflation
Arc of a Diver: Inflation Succumbs to Deflation
by Liz Ann Sonders, Senior Vice President, Chief Investment Strategist, Charles Schwab & Co., Inc.
November 3, 2008
Page Not Found
"We need to go back to farming."
That is easy to say, but who wants to do it? Farming isn't easy and is a serious form of gambling.
@pierre
No surprises with tech layoffs. I have been working under that shadow for some time now.
H1B's should be shitting bricks. No love for them here but plenty for the folks back home in the lower cost of living land.
More from Schwab:
Deflation is the real threat
It's the first time since the Great Depression that the two biggest components of household net worth—stocks and real estate—are falling simultaneously. Deflation in these assets, as well as others, can become self-perpetuating as consumers hold off on consumption in the hopes of better prices in the future, keeping downward pressure on demand.
The cycle can become vicious, as it was in the 1930s in the United States and in the 1990s in Japan. On the other hand, mild deflation is less damaging to the economy and the stock market. We believe the aggressive stance of the Fed today should keep us in the mild deflation camp.
Borrowers particularly take it on the chin during deflationary cycles, and today's an exaggerated example. I have often highlighted the impact of deflation in housing on borrowing metrics with the "real mortgage rates" illustration, seen below.
Real mortgage rates pressuring borrowers
Chart: Real mortgage rates pressuring borrowers
Represents 30-year fixed mortgage rate minus year-over-year % change in median sales price. Orange-shaded areas represent recession periods. As of September 30, 2008. Source: FactSet.
In general, deflation is onerous for borrowers because as asset prices fall, it raises the "real" cost of credit—the opposite of what monetary policy needs to do to combat falling demand. Using mortgages as an example, and as illustrated above, when you are subtracting a negative number (real estate price declines) from a positive number (30-year fixed mortgage rate), you get an elevated "real" reading.
Simply put: A home buyer will currently pay a 6.5% 30-year fixed rate to buy an asset that's depreciating at a double-digit rate, putting his actual "cost" of borrowing significantly higher. It begs the questions: Who wants to borrow money to buy a rapidly depreciating asset? Who wants to lend money to someone to buy a rapidly depreciating asset?
Okay, d- and B-, you've convinced me.
Yep, zoom, I look forward to my wife coming to her senses, saying, 'Yep, La Jolla is not safe, let's move to Idaho (for a few years).
Great read - pic is good too:
The End Of Wall Streets Boom - News Markets - Portfolio.com
I love deviled eggs
What is UNWPX?
rich, UNWPX is U.S. Global Investors World Precious Metals Fund. Run out of San Antonio by Frank Holmes, did better than Vanguard Precious Metals and Mining Fund (VGPMX) in the good old days of gold and gold mining funds in '05-'06.
I had 100% of my money in them, and they doubled my money over the two year period (with reinvested dividends).
Deviled Eggs,
It is way too late to read that whole article. Next time link to a Family Circus cartoon or something.
I started reading "Confessions of an Economic Hitman" a couple of days ago. For those of you who haven't heard about it the basic story is a guy recruited in the late sixties by a Haliburton like engineering conglomerate (via the NSC/ Peace Corps)whose primary function was to produce overly optimistic economic growth projections in order to facilitate multibillion dollar loans from the World Bank,IMF, etc. The proceeds from these loans would be then be used for massive infrastructure projects designed, built, maintained and upgraded by US based firms such as Bechtel, Haliburton, etc. Since the projections were knowingly false to begin with the projects never generated the economic growth necessary to repay the loans.
This of course gave the lenders and the Government which backed them enormous leverage when negotiating with the debtors.
Its a good read and offers many opportunities for comparisons to current events which now may have been turned back upon us.
I'm with Elvis; that's a tough read at this hour.
Yep, zoom, I look forward to my wife coming to her senses, saying, 'Yep, La Jolla is not safe, let's move to Idaho (for a few years).'
Comrade-Dope jg (jg) | 11.13.08 - 12:12 am | #
Idaho is a nice choice - I had friends who built a VERY nice cabin & lived there for a couple decades until they were too old. We aren't talking austerity either - but remote & off the grid. I visited them there and didn't want to leave (not my option however).
Deviled eggs,
Michael lewis is one of my favorite writers. What I took away from that article was the idiocy of IBs and enough people understood the risk early on but continued feeding the CDO machine for the profits.
Wall Street drove redlined until the engine seized.
Almost all hunger in the world today is not for lack of food but food denied for political/genocidal purposes. No matter how things go, decades of agricultural technology will not evaporate. The US has been paying farmers for decades NOT to produce crops as markets can be easily flooded driving prices below production costs.
There are two types of manpower planning: planning for production and planning for full employment. Market economies use the former and planned economies use both. Many may return to being farmers in the US, but it will not be out of necessity for producing food but for producing jobs however pointless.
rich,
Since you are here, please answer this question I asked earlier. Why invest in mining stocks when mining companies are big price hedgers rather than investing in the hard assets/commodities on the futures market?
Makes sense, S-P-.
Yep, we'll see, d-, how this shakes out, socially.
OT but did anyone see this article?
Nordstrom Bank May Not Give You Full Access To Your Available Credit For Up To 21 Days After A Payment Is Credited To Your Account
CreditMattersBlog.com: Nordstrom Bank May Not Give You Full Access To Your Available Credit For Up To 21 Days After A Payment Is Credited To Your Account
"Idaho is a nice choice - I had friends who built a VERY nice cabin & lived there for a couple decades until they were too old."
It is a great place, too, if you are a white supremist (sp?). Fortunately, I'm not, but I still like Idaho, because there is a big dark spot on the light map there.
Elvis, from what I read at JSMineset and other 'gold bug' sites, the miners are unwinding their hedges.
Once they unwind, given their huge fixed costs, any movement up in the price of gold -- as long as such is greater than the increase in variable costs -- means nice amplification of their bottom line --> stock price.
UNWPX was up 31% in '05 and 52% in '06. Gold was only up 18% and 24% in those same two years.
UNWPX: Performance for US GLOBAL INVESTORS FUNDS WORLD - Yahoo! Finance
dryfly writes:
Austerity here & now mean 'basic cable', 'subsidized housing' and maybe one 15 year old used car for the whole family vs a couple huge LuxUVs & Mini-McMansion all on credit.
Whatever it means, we need it and we need it yesterday. If it's as pleasant as all that, then so be it. If not, it would not stop me. I think a sudden transition will be horrendously traumatic, if only psychically, but it's really better than failing down.
But if we don't fix the balance sheet & subsequently reallocate resources fairly soon so as to maintain our long term 'productive capacity' vs the 'bread & circuses' we are getting... then eventually we'll get to that starving thing. Eventually.
I think it's the change over time that's the killer, man. Starvation is typically not due to lack of food, it's due to lack of wherewithal to purchase food, or to food being unavailable due to political or military situation.
It's not raw biomass per bipedal monkey that's the issue, IMO.
This country will not be a pleasant place if the FedGov faces funding problems. Maybe I'm wrong, I thought it would be McCain / Palin too. Not betting on it, tho.
Yep, we'll see, d-, how this shakes out, socially.
Comrade-Dope jg (jg) | 11.13.08 - 12:19 am | #
'Socially' is the problem. How do you tell someone a small condo is 'okay' for them after they've lived for years in a mini-McM? They are going to want to blame somebody.
And we aren't even talking 'three hots and a cot' yet.
But starving? Isn't going to happen en mass THIS cycle - not in NAFTA Zone anyway.
Hey Elvis, I live in Idaho and you're right! We even have our own "CRE hole in the ground" right in the center of town (it's been there for nine years and counting). And like my children say, I do community service when I'm ordered by the court....
"UNWPX was up 31% in '05 and 52% in '06. Gold was only up 18% and 24% in those same two years."
But is that a lagging indicator? When prices fall do they go back to hedging?
"Basic cable"? Guess you folks don't talk to your kids. In case they didn't tell you, you can download anything worth watching for free off the Internet...
For those on the West Coast it means "The Latest Dope TV Show" can be downloaded 2 hours before it even airs in your market.
Another threat to the economy and companies like MSFT are open source projects. Whereas 10 years ago you had to pay $200 for an operating system on your computer; nowaday's people give them away for free, with source code!
"'Socially' is the problem. How do you tell someone a small condo is 'okay' for them after they've lived for years in a mini-McM? They are going to want to blame somebody."
They will thank you, because there is less to clean. Really.
Good question, Elvis; I do not know.
I presume that they are not dummies, and read and know about gold's monetary potential of $3,000-5,000 per ounce. Especially given all the stupidity here in the U.S. with TARP and junk.
Me, 75-80% of my money will be in gold bullion and 10-15% will be in UNPWX (remainder in checking for operating expenses). I can afford to bet a bit, which is what UNWPX will be for me. Big risk with UNWPX and other gold miners is nationalization of mines, as in Venezuela last week.
It'll all continue until it no longer can, and then it won't.
Good night all.
The night is still young and I am still virile.
American society has been planned for obsolescence. We became a throw away society when we no longer could carry the debt/consumer role for the world. How the world reacts to devaluation of the dollar or what I believe is inevitable default of our debt is my big worry.
China has literally destroyed their environment to become the manufacturing hub. They traded livability for worthless paper. They will have to externalize their social unrest for their government to survive. Let's pray we aren't the external threat. I think we will be.
I agree we can feed ourselves and protect ourselves but can we reform into a society that respects the egalitarian values imbued in the Constitution? Watching capitalism collapse gives me hope we'll learn our lesson regarding banks and fiat currency. Work hard and you eat is preferable to do little and amass material wealth that feels the empty void family and community once held.
I am not naive and expect significant turmoil but when a way of life becomes so unbalanced and unsustainable then it is time for it to change. The truth is change only comes from utter failure. We have utterly failed. Time to try again.
Mmmmmmm: Chocolate Squirrel
Chocolate Squirrel.
zoom,
What's funny is that it seems we are the winners, because everyone traded us their manufacturing products for worthless paper. Now that the paper is worthless the only ones really built up is us...
I'm pretty sure we've already got enough clothes, cars, housing, and guns to pass down for the next generation.
At the same time if we desire to be mindless consumerists of the world, well we will be unhappy.
WHEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Another exciting day at the dog track.
" The truth is change only comes from utter failure. We have utterly failed. Time to try again.
zoom"
Be careful with the words "utter failure." My expensive car and second home have got me laid numerous times.
"At the same time if we desire to be mindless consumerists of the world, well we will be unhappy."
I was thinking about this a while back, and it occurred to me that it's not even that people desire to be mindless consumers, but that most literally do not know how to be anything else.
The indoctrination laid down over many generations is strong indeed.
Elvis writes:
The night is still young and I am still virile.
There's always Broward Horne. =)
This country will not be a pleasant place if the FedGov faces funding problems. Maybe I'm wrong, I thought it would be McCain / Palin too. Not betting on it, tho.
Byzantine_Ruins | Homepage | 11.13.08 - 12:23 am | #
Only when we stop making stuff - then the 'funding' gets tricky.
Again - we don't eat the paper (fiat) we eat what the fiat buys & trades for - if inside our 'economic borders' we still produce enough to satisfy our selves AND trade for stuff we really need that others make/grow - then the 'balance sheet' looking 'out to the rest of the world' isn't as big of a problem. We then go 'paygo'... but at least we generate the 'pay' to make it 'go'.
But the trouble with aprolonged & growing F/Ued balance sheet is that it drives bad decisions & distortions that tend to destroy that productive capacity - we've seen it w/ housing and 'services' - most of which produce little we can 'trade for'.
And the real problem w/ the austerity we are likely to see THIS CYCLE is though not severe it is likely to generate a 'Veblen Effect' - loss of status from a falling 'standard of living' - most of which is conspicuous consumption anyway (for personal status building) and by no means even remotely necessary.
But that doesn't mean people won't have a cow about it anyway - and social fabric could unravel.
Q1 and Q2 2006 vintage (almost 3yr seasoned loans) Fixed Rate Conduit CMBS (as shown on bloomberg)
60D+___REO___Frcl
0.25%_0.03%_0.09%
Elvis,
Virile eh? Too bad you weren't here last night... perhaps you could've been the 36th Chinaman "ran over" by one of our lurking trolls...
Careful what you wish for...
Be careful with the words "utter failure." My expensive car and second home have got me laid numerous times.
Elvis | 11.13.08 - 12:39 am | #
My good looks and charm did the same. Ok, a dinner and a movie helped.
Acquisition of material goods to ensure dissemination of your genes is history itself.
Subcommander Doom writes:
It'll all continue until it no longer can, and then it won't.
Subcommander Doom | 11.13.08 - 12:30 am | #
That also applies to the fuel cycles inside the sun...
less of a veblen effect than an evita effect, as we go back through the time machine and instead of having the working classes adopt the comforts and assumptions of the upper-middles, the opposite takes place.
perhaps karma for our bullying ways with latin america all of these decades...
My standard of living is in a van down by the river. When I fall to a mobile home in Tornado Alley, I'll be angry, but I'll have to unlease my wrath upon the Little People of Oz.
Anyone know how to find extended hours volume for something like SRS?
E-trade customer service didn't.
Nikkei shoots for 7699
Now at about 8200
Elvis writes:
My standard of living is in a van down by the river. When I fall to a mobile home in Tornado Alley, I'll be angry, but I'll have to unlease my wrath upon the Little People of Oz.
Elvis | 11.13.08 - 12:45 am | #
Whew - for a second there I thought you were going to unleash your virility on them. That would have given me nightmares...
Good night Elvis.
"My good looks and charm did the same. Ok, a dinner and a movie helped."
Yes, but I also have an expensive car and a vacation home, and, taken together, that almost cannot be beat. I get my choice of any frustrated, hot MILF who is angry at their husband. Sorry if it is your wife.
Dryfly-
Must be a flyfisherman---
Just returned from a steelhead trip-
Three on the fly.
Now back to that dog track.
This will be a trend that will happen faster than a chocolate squirrel melting in a microwave:
KKR Financial Holdings is trying to get its finances in order and to do so the investment firm is suspending its dividend and arranging $400.0 million in new loans to preserve capital.
Investors weren't willing to hang around and see how well that works. KKR Financial shares plummeted 39.3%, or $1.29, to $1.99, Tuesday. Its stock has tumbled 85.8% since the beginning of the year.
"Anyone know how to find extended hours volume for something like SRS?"
just track VNQ and assume a double-negative, if that trades much AH. or do a double negative on the big components, if they do such.
seems like a pretty thin ticker for off hours in any case.
Karma bgates?
Let us plead this is not the case. The crimes against humanity that have taken place to support my standard of living beggars my imagination.
Watched the 60 minute clip about the sending of our used electronics back to China tonight. My favorite part was the 30 yo middle American who owned the company offering free recycling. His interview and subsequent statements when he's caught breaking the law embody the moral failure of making a living at all costs.
Don't know who said it but it is my favorite hypocrisy:
"The American way of life is non negotiable."
Following The Trail Of Toxic E-Waste - 60 Minutes - CBS News
"KKR Financial Holdings" Shocking as finding out that bacon was bad for you.
"The American way of life is non negotiable."
I only negotiate with terrorists.
Dryfly-
Must be a flyfisherman---
Just returned from a steelhead trip-
Yup - mostly browns & brookies out here. Not much steelhead action (a few in the Great Lakes - haven't chased them since Reagan's first term). Lots of browns & brookies though - almost all wild natural reproducing populations too. Whodathunkit in the Midwest.
Elvis,
Much love to you. Peace.
Ok, here is my list of downgrades tonight. I have 731 stocks here and decided to be nice and not include smaller companies, i.e, I had over 2000, but these all have mkt cap over $500 million
Stock Screener Results - Yahoo! Finance
4 million New Yorkers ride the subway every day. Another million on buses. Smog is down considerably since the 70's, and the Hudson is almost swimmable.
Dude,
Only 731? Maybe you could also read War and Peace in the background.
"My other question is; where are people going to go with their nice monorails?"
Damn italics
I swam on the Hudson once. But, it was Kate Hudson, and she was nice.
"Karma bgates? "
My father had this observation in central america ten years ago - the high garden walls with glass pieces stuck in the top, the obvious and entrenched social divisions, the economy based on tourism, agriculture, and money laundering, the politics revolving around a military culture which couldn't operate a peashooter and a serious investment in ignorance by the religious interests...
in large part a creation to serve our interests, and perhaps our own destiny
oneworldcurrency yogi writes:
"My other question is; where are people going to go with their nice monorails?"
Disneyland?
"in large part a creation to serve our interests, and perhaps our own destiny
bgates"
I thought I was only Luke. Are we all Lukes?
"Are we all Lukes?"
you seem a little more like a Han, El
Nothing better than finding out that you wanted to get it on with your princess sister, Leia. Awkward.
7 million srs shares were traded during the day, closing at 172. AH shows 179.
Citizen AllenM writes:
I can't tell you how much some of the libertarian survivalist guff spewed here by semiautistic children galls me.
Oh I hear 'em. Not exactly an enemy of the social safety net.
You want to stimulate this economy, you have to reverse a ton of misguided stupid policies.
My primary concern is the manmade disaster of bankruptcy. Once the insolvency is handled lots of things will be doable. It's just that the insolvency happens to be the largest such event in human history.
On the other hand I hear constant memes of the huge welfare state that are nothing but blatant lies.
Proxies for racism or social-economic anxiety, I'd reckon.
Angry- it is starting to go beyond mere anger. And yet I hear tons of what are quite simply unworkable things to do.
My concern is that money is as real as water, earth and the sun. A manmade disaster of the money running out will look like the sun or the water went away. If it could be ignored or done away with, the world would run very differently. Keeping the money flowing is job 1. Of people die from it, well, that's the rulership of a continent-scale state in hard times.
If the market goes down another 800 points this week then what?
"7 million srs shares were traded during the day, closing at 172. AH shows 179."
which probably tracks appropriately with URE and VNQ. who is trading REITs at midnight NYC time anyways?
It was yslp's Q. I'll learn this evil haloscan someday.
If the market goes down another 800 points this week then what?
RationalJeff
An 800 point loss?
Elvis writes:
An 800 point loss?
Beat me to it. =)
We are 800 closer to the bottom...
We are the city that never sleeps. Why would srs volume correlate to those other things I've never heard of?
Thanks.
As an example, GE has a mkt cap of $177 billion with a share price of $16.00. Overvalued by at least 4% today and analysts look for EPS to fall next year by 10% -- call it 15% overvalued -- gimmie the next fucker...
GOOG?
800 points off the spx or ndx would be interesting
gimmie the next fucker...
Kona
Hugh Hefner
"Why would srs volume correlate to those other things I've never heard of?"
not necessarily volume (though quite possibly), but price should.
unless i'm mistaken, SRS is a double-negative on VNQ, URE is the double-positive.
TBT is the next SRS.
zoom,
thanks for the link...I figured the Mexican drug war would creep across the border but didn't know when. This is the real war.
"In June, three Mexican nationals were arrested by Phoenix police after a violent home invasion and murder at a drug "safe house." They were dressed head-to-toe just like the local S.W.A.T. team - and just as heavily armed."
Unlike Osama bin Laden, the drug cartels are too smart to openly challenge the US govt. They infiltrate and suborn double agents within law enforcement.
Elvis,
How did you get to kate hudson before Lance Armstrong..
you must have jumped off the bike into the escort car....
With respect to farming, so many factors play into success or failure. I live in eastern NC, great, fertile farmland. My family has several small farms now.(Land is leased to larger farming operation) We have a tractor and do garden farming on about 5 acres.
We have fruit trees that produce, and pecans. It takes years to get production from fruit trees and a real understanding of horticulture. It's hard work to till and plant and tend and harvest a large garden. Then there's the weather, and pests, and don't get me started on a steady supply of water. No, the x-boxers won't be johnny appleseed overnight.
And they ain't got the patience to wait.
if the fbi hooks up with the bloods and crips you can kiss the mexican cartel messing with americans goodbye....
DJ US Real Estate Index, double inverted.
i've held RRPIX for a while and flirted with shorting treasuries for 6 years now. still waiting for that ship to come in. TLT has a fairly liquid options trade, though the puts always strike me as a bit rich.
"cd writes:
Elvis,
How did you get to kate hudson before Lance Armstrong.."
Who said it was before?
This New Yorker must get some sleep finally. Don't start the tea be tea party without me.
VNQ is the MSCI equivalent. but the same bag of trash, SPG, PLD, GGP, all of those glittering jewels of my portfolio...
"bgates writes:
i've held RRPIX for a while and flirted with shorting treasuries for 6 years now. still waiting for that ship to come in."
The end of bubbles are always hard to call, but, when you call the collapse correctly, you are justly rewarded.
Lance Armstrong may be an American icon, but, apparently, he isn't a female icon in bed.
"you are justly rewarded."
well, I shorted FRE back in '02 because I saw this coming, and have spent significant money trying to short treasuries since that time...
timing is everything.
OK it's late, I'm very worried, and I've been drinking, but this just seems to make sense right now ... from Advice From a Spiritual Friend (Tibetan Buddhist)
"If a person has a good heart, a sincere mind, and gives some help to others without expecting any results, then maybe they create some pure Dharma -- and that's very rare; otherwise not. Usually people live the life only with a worldly mind, particularly attachment, clinging to this life. They use the whole human life, the precious human body and all their education just to create additional causes to go to the lower realms.
This is what is happening in every day life. For the entire life people act like a moth attracted to the flame, completely hallucinated, completely deceived, not knowing the flame will burn, that it is completely other than what it appears. Even though they get burned, while they still have the power to fly they will continue to go towards the flame."
You are correct. Timing is everything. Welcome to everything.
Send lawyers, guns, and money, I agree. You have been drinking.
Send lawyers, guns, and money--
Dig it. You should drink more often
404 Error, No such article | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle
3,800 UTMB [Galveston] employees to be laid off
Most of the lost jobs will reportedly come from the hospital
(Texas is now being impacted on a daily basis and it is getting worse.)
i try to still tip 20% or more for good service even in weeks where 10% of my net worth has been vaporized. hopefully that puts me north of dust mites on the reincarnation list.
I tip big, but I expect at least a good hand job in return.
"The Royal Navy has repelled a pirate attack on a Danish cargo ship off the coast of Yemen, shooting dead two men believed to be Somali pirates.
The Ministry of Defence (MoD) confirmed the incident took place on Tuesday, when HMS Cumberland crew members tried to board a traditional wooden dhow. "
Finally, somebody shows some backbone regarding this piracy.
Those who mindlessly repeat "You can't time the market..." are
dopes.
@Elvis & HH
True that, from "Drinking Wine Poems"
Chinese (pardon the length)
"Sympathetic friends who know my tastes
Bring wine jug when they come to visit.
Sitting on the ground beneath the pine tree
A few cups of wine make us drunk
Venerable elders gabbing all at once
And pouring from the bottle out of turn.
Aware no more that our own 'I' exists (note)
How are we to value other things?
So rapt we are not sure of where we are-
In wine there is a taste of profundity.
Finally, somebody shows some backbone regarding this piracy.
Kung Fu Panda
Usually in jail, they only show tailbone.
guns and money-nice....
I've seen a lot of moths lately....
An investor is a speculator waiting for his perspective to become popular, whether worthy or not.
"And pouring from the bottle out of turn."
My rule has always been, and will always be, when empty, fill up. It is not about turns, it is about thirst.
Ok, some weird stuff going on, including CMBX actually NOT posting gains/losses due to bank holiday. I don't doubt the movements and positions, but not in a stalled market.
WTF?
Me suspicious.
Big naughty. Don get da Counterpointer suspicious.
CC
Elvis,
I passed Kate to Chris Robinson when we co-wrote she talks to angels lyrics..i was looking more torwards halle berry for some reason at that time..
you must be kind of young..but your elvis...
Lance does ok w/1 testicle.
Elvis, how was the unemployed real estate agent tongiht?
Flexible and willing.
ew post, folks
"i was looking more torwards halle berry for some reason at that time.."
How old was Halle Berry in 1991? Sick SOB.
interesting that the dow and nik are surfing the same waves..so close but so far..
Elvis,
halle was 25
halle was 25
cd
Maybe in human years, but she was 12 in Galapagos Tortoise years.
This is what is happening in every day life. For the entire life people act like a moth attracted to the flame, completely hallucinated, completely deceived, not knowing the flame will burn, that it is completely other than what it appears. Even though they get burned, while they still have the power to fly they will continue to go towards the flame."
Send lawyers, guns, and money | 11.13.08 - 1:18 am | #
No one has shown us a better way. Probably always been true. Those that are enlightened sought it. The rest get caught up in the herd.
Good thought and imagery. Thanks.
Warren, you bastard, are you out there you punk ... huh, huh? Your sugar water is overvalued punk, whaddyah think of that yah bum, huh, huh?
Coke now @ $43.25
Real value =
EPS of $2.57/.03665 (10 yr TR yield) = $27.28
Eat it baby!
Put it perspective, a sic pack of coke is worth more than a share of Ford -- that aint real baby!
"Put it perspective, a sic pack of coke is worth more than a share of Ford -- that aint real baby!
Kona"
Unless there are too many shares of Ford.
zoom | 11.13.08 - 12:43 am | # Acquisition of material goods to ensure dissemination of your genes is history itself.
Is that copyright.
I'll be using it copyright or not.
If you short a bond ETF, do you have to make the interest payments to the person from whom you borrowed the shares?
Doesn't 2.57/.03665 = $70.12
re: zoom
Jesus showed us a different way...
Just saying... knowing many here are drunk, it's late, or whatever. I just can't allow you to say "no one showed us a better way".
We need to go back to farming.
If it's such a great idea, what's stopping you?
A few weeks spent mucking cow stalls and pulling weeds cured me for life.
What's a republic?