The temporary suspension of foreclosures is designed to allow affected borrowers facing foreclosure to retain their homes while Fannie Mae works with mortgage servicers to implement the streamlined modification program scheduled to launch December 15.
... so that we can resume kicking people out to the curb during the week of Dec 25.
Notice the timing? It's also more or less a kick in the nuts to the next administration -- having 2 months of backlogged evictions acted on in the first week
Not much point in kicking people out if the houses will just remain empty and decay. And there is always a small chance of getting a reduced stream of payments.
Already 50%+ of sales in bubble markets are foreclosures, yet foreclosure inventory just keeps rising.
This temporary measure is a good thing to get some families through the holidays without further disruption.
Will delaying foreclosure proceedings for this small number of properties impact the RE market? So many sales are now foreclosures that it seems like delaying the appearance of a small number of properties on the market is worth the cost of delaying foreclosures over the holidays.
I see nothing bad about this, as long as it is temporary.
If they are just gonna suspend foreclosures can I just get a loan for no money down and have payments start when they decide to start making their other clients pay for their mortgages?
Seriously. Just put me in a home, and I promise I will start making payments in a few months.
I think I bet energycon last year that there would be a foreclosure freeze.....followed by the national guard going door-to-door 'suggesting' that people should honor thier mortgages.
"I think I bet energycon last year that there would be a foreclosure freeze.....followed by the national guard going door-to-door 'suggesting' that people should honor thier mortgages."
If that's the case, sign me up for the guard. I have a very persuasive tone with deadbeats who think my tax dollars should subsidize their greed.
If other lenders and mortgage service providers follow suit we may at least have some breathing room to salvage something before the economy capsizes and drowns even the first class passengers. But the rest of the bunch is not in receivership under the US government....not yet at least....
Man what a huge mess. The horror that unregulated new finance hath brought.
"temporary suspension of foreclosures is designed to allow affected borrowers facing foreclosure to retain their homes"
Paraphrased: temporary suspension of foreclosures designed to keep angry mobs facing homelessness to stay at home. This initative will prevent open hunting season of scared shitless politicians. They should throw in free cable as an incentive for the out-of-credit-out-of-cash rabble.
Finally some postive ACTION (rather than words and plans) to help struggling homeowners. As I discussed, this action is much overdue. Save the homeowner, save the nation.
I really hope they'll let us renters stay too. It's getting pretty cold outside here in Denver, though downtown is awfully quiet and peaceful otherwise.
I can't recall who it was last week who was betting on a big upside to the market this week. Does anyone recall who that well known poster was? Anyone?
Someone must have messed in their panties about now. Wooops.
What about all the people who are struggling to pay their mortgages - and are still up-to-date? Many are making decisions about not buying their children new clothes or not paying the auto-loan or credit cards - in order to keep up their mortgages.
The new message: Don't bother paying your mortgage - no sweat.
This will kill any green shoots of private mortgage-lending like DDT on a lawn.
Andy writes:
Finally some positive ACTION (rather than words and plans) to help struggling homeowners. As I discussed, this action is much overdue. Save the homeowner, save the nation.
Nope. It is save the assets, save the nation's ass. As long as people make their mortgage payment, your underlying asset is safe and you, the lender/investor, could potentially ride out the loss in value. No pay the mortgage, asset gets marked truly to market at foreclosure and those holding the investment side of the note become bag holders.
So the real question is: what is the delta on those making or not making their payments so Freddie, Fannie, etc can be made whole in the end, despite the depreciating asset. Old school finance could have dealt with the situation. Slice and dice model makes this a Gordian Knot with everyone groping around for the bold stroke.
"Turn him to any cause of policy,
The Gordian Knot of it he will unloose,
Familiar as his garter" (Shakespeare, Henry V, Act 1 Scene 1. 45-47)
Help them retain their homes? If they are in the foreclosure process, the house isn't theirs any more.
I sure hope that my rent can be suspended between Thanksgiving & New Years. It would certainly increase my spending money, and the property management company can ask for TARP funding to make up the difference.
Andy writes:
"Finally some postive ACTION (rather than words and plans) to help struggling homeowners. As I discussed, this action is much overdue. Save the homeowner, save the nation."
Save the homeowner??? If they are responsible, they don't need to be saved. If they aren't, then FUCK THEM. Some jerkoff takes out a loan that he doesn't repay and we're supposed to pick up the tab? Idiot.
s_puttnick said: I see nothing bad about this, as long as it is temporary.
Haven't you realized that all of the liquidity facilities and bailouts and new windows installed by The Fed are "temporary"? Obviously you have nothing to fear, as any day now these "temporary" measures will be rolled back and we can get back to free market dealings. /chortle
bruiser:
presumably your landlord will not have to make his mortgage payments on the property, so he should be willing to suspend rent payments for you as well...
Unless you're like me and live in a place the landlord owns outright. Not sure what I'm gonna do about that.
I am glad they distinguish between occupied and vacant homes. If they finish foreclosures of vacant homes faster and occupied homes slower, that doesn't sound like such a bad thing. It probably leads to less weather damage, vandalism, and theft.
I still don't understand why it's so rare to have a bank rent out foreclosed homes. It would help their cashflow.
Andy, for celebrating the "save the homeowner" initiative. Which means that some couple with a $200k salary that overextended themselves on a $1 million house at the market peak, no longer able to afford, will get a massive bailout with our tax dollars.
Moribund malls have not gone unnoticed amongst industry analysts and Web sites like Deadmalls.com that feature photos of hundreds of now-abandoned sites. But what were once just worrying signs appear to have finally flat-lined. Last year was the first in half a century that a new indoor mall didn't open somewhere in the countrya precipitous decline since the mid-1990s when they rose at a rate of 140 a year, according to Georgia Tech professor Ellen Dunham-Jones, coauthor of the forthcoming book "Retrofitting Suburbia," which focuses on the decline of malls and other commercial strips. Today, nearly a fifth of the country's largest 2,000 regional malls are failing, she says, and according to the International Council of Shopping Centers, and a record 150,000 retail outlets, including such mall mainstays as the Gap and Foot Locker, will close this year
wow, if that many malls already have negative carry then just imagine what would happen if they all get closed. The weak will drag down the strong stores. Retail employment is huge
Inquiring minds wanta know who will be paying for Com Ed, Peoples Gas, water bill, real estate taxes and city services while staying in their homes? Just like the good ole' days of chopping up the furniture, fences, and neighbors trees to keep the house warm.
Another mucked-up Wylie Coyote and Roadrunner episode.
Upthread, you made the crucial switch from "can't" kick out of house to "won't" make you pay taxes.
This is another moral hazard issue, just like Lehman was.
Let's just hope the results of the decision about foreclosures--whether to suspend moral hazard indefinitely--aren't similarly lackluster as were those of Lehman.
The government will always retain the power to move you around, unless it loses its monopoly on legal violence. Whether and how it enforces that power is the question.
But don't let me stop you from paying your taxes, your child support, your utilities bills, your whatever. 'Cause until everyone thinks that way, there's no way this country gets any better...
"rps writes:
Inquiring minds wanta know who will be paying for Com Ed, Peoples Gas, water bill, real estate taxes and city services while staying in their homes?"
We never had the opportunity to punish the irresponsible. The election cycle made sure of it. If we're all going down, I want the irresponsible to go down first in hopes that their carcasses will cushion my fall.
Kevin, blaming the homeowner is like blaming the workers at GM.
The problem is a systematic failure of fiduciary duty from the real estate agents, to the appraisers, brokers, underwriters, and rating agencies.
The selling of mortgage debt in slices and dices that were then leveraged against and all sold like a commodity. This created incentives to cut corners in the transactional basis for creating the mortgage debt as a short term profit vehicle with no skin in the game rather than long term investments held by formerly local banks.
So your anger needs to be directed to the Big Picture my friend. And it ain't pretty and it as complex as the new finance that made the problem possible in the first place.
How many homeowners do you know whom want to go into foreclosure or bankruptcy and have their lives utterly ruined. The social consequences on our economy is very real. Homeownership = Middle Class Stability. No middle class stability, no stable economy. This is serious.
I still don't understand why it's so rare to have a bank rent out foreclosed homes. It would help their cashflow.
some investor guy | 11.20.08 - 5:22 pm
The reason is that banks are banks, and not in the property management business. If a rental property is foreclosed upon, the tenants can stay. However, an owner-occupied single family residence, if foreclosed, becomes/stays vacant. If the bank rents it out, the bank is going into the rental biz. Not allowed.
Plus, banks want to get the ORE off of the balance sheet as fast as possible. Renters would complicate matters.
fallonPDX, I have lots of friends that simply want to stop paying and are looking for some incentive. This could be it. I know people that bought at 4, 5, 10 times their salary. They all bragged that they were going to get rich off of real estate. They bought out of stupidity and greed. They deserve NOTHING.
"I just spoke with an options trader about this historic move. He said that there structured product trades buried in trading books all over the world which are melting. There is a massive short in the 30 year sector (in Treasury paper and in the swap market) which resulted from sales of cheap volatility. Some of these positions have been on the books of various entities for years and it is only recently that the chickens have come home to roost. Each time the spread turns more negative, that movement forces some one to receive in swaps to hedge there position. There are short the long end trades in every permutation and combination along the curve. The receiving creates a self fulfilling prophecy which compels someone else to receive. He had no opinion on when this would end."
OT-from today's San Jose Mercury: a quarterly survey of 509 Bay area CEO's found that business confidence plunged to a record low (32), and for every company planning to hire 3 companies plan to have layoffs, and that 50% of the CEOs believe that the recession will last another 5 quarters and 41% think it could last longer.
OT-My game plan: Move out of unaffordable 3 bedroom townhouse into more affordable 2 bedroom apartment. Take equity from town house and invest it into the market. Give me six months to implement.
"It's all fun, games and self righteous chest pounding until you are the one that loses your job, your savings, your assets and your retirement.
Friedman Marx"
At that point, you might just consider making the end sooner than later.
No middle class stability, no stable economy...
fallonPDX
Greed is wiping-out the geese that lay the golden eggs, aka taxes. No one paying federal income taxes, payroll taxes, state taxes, city taxes.....Goodbye city services, school programs closed, libraries, firemen, policemen cuts......been there in the 70's.
the aspens will already be turning. They turn in clusters, because their roots are interconnected.
fallonPDX, these aren't just friends, but people I met everywhere. Folks making decent salaries, refi-ing their McMansions to buy six-figure BMW's. Guess what? They can now use our tax dollars to finance their greedy and lavish lifestyles. There is no "poor homeowner" in this situation. I'm a "poor renter", who is going to bail me out when my landlord raises the rent??
At what point is it more cost effective to hold cash than even to buy the shortest term US Treasuries? What about the 30 yr?
mykillk | Homepage | 11.20.08 - 5:38 pm |
~~~~~~~~~~
my opinion is bonds are going down like frazier, just like the last GD, only with a shorter time horizon. the dollar will join the bonds.
There is something really, really weird happening on the long end of the curve. I have a hard time believing that the exotics that have gotten so much press lately are responsible for movements of this magnitude. Either way, it appears to be a structural issue with the bond market and not risk averse investors moving out the yield curve.
At what point is it more cost effective to hold cash than even to buy the shortest term US Treasuries? What about the 30 yr?
--mykillk
When short term yields approach 0%, i.e. now. 30 year is at 3.X%. The U.S. cannot afford to pay of its debts without printing money, especially given the current direction of economic activity. If they don't print, they default on debt and the default risk should be reflected in the price. At 3.X%, it's not.
At that point, you might just consider making the end sooner than later.
Elvis | 11.20.08 - 5:38 pm | #
Righteous.
I am cheering for you to lose all your money now.
Trust me, I have no love for the right or left wingers. They're all thieves. I just can't wait to see what mamma barracka does come January to show how much he cares for the downtrodden. It's only just begun. The Federal Teats are only gonna get more sore as everyone suckles for mamma's milk.
For those of you out there who faithfully keep paying your mortgages on time, tell us how it feels to have a neighbor sitting back with his beer and chips at xmas time as the Feds work on his behalf to shave off 200 grand from his mortgage and stick you with the taxes to support his engorged belly-o-beer? Just think about it. He's gonna be paying so much less to live in your neighborhood while you pick up the tab for him over the next 30 years.
Is it bad of me to be happy about falling real estate prices, like seeing them fall an additional 15-30% in my area of a large midwestern city. Is there a downside for me as a renter (hopefully a buyer in the next 6-18 months) with falling home prices? I'm excited about plummeting real estate!!!
Kevin where do you live that folks can still get that kind of cash out re-fi? There are hardly any places left in the US with that kind of equity available nor vigorous residential RE market.
Morocco Bama I agree. Unfortunately this mess is very complex. We could of course just let everything default across the board and permanently end the middle class.
The Aspen's quote is via Scooter Libby letter to Judith Miller...hehehehe. Different context, but nonetheless its' all about what it was called in my day;"Fraud."
"Trust me, I have no love for the right or left wingers. They're all thieves. I just can't wait to see what mamma barracka does come January to show how much he cares for the downtrodden. It's only just begun. The Federal Teats are only gonna get more sore as everyone suckles for mamma's milk."
Good luck. Well if the day comes that you lose your job, your money and all your security. Then you will be begging for government assistance.
I am almost willing to bet this will happen.
So, what are your thoughts on the rumour that there is going to be a major rush on physical come December.
--Comrade Scared Shitless
IMO, the physical rush has happened at this price level. Spot, I think, does not reflect the physical value, and that is dubious. I have been watching GLD vs. S&P the last few days. Gold is holding up better than stocks. I am looking to see if gold starts rallying with the flight to quality in bonds, or, for long bonds to sell off with stocks and for gold to rally. No trend has emerged, so I'm still watching.
From Across the Curve: Part Two
November 20th, 2008 6:06 pm | by John Jansen |
There have been stunning and dramatic moves in the market since wrote my earlier piece.
...
The breakeven spread on 10 year TIPS is about zero. The market is predicting no inflation for 10 years.
Ouch. There goes the home appreciation down the tubes. No 'V' bottom for this baby.
We are in danger of being overwhelmed with irredeemable paper, mere paper, representing not gold nor silver; no sir, representing nothing but broken promises, bad faith, bankrupt corporations, cheated creditors and a ruined people.
Daniel Webster, speech in the Senate, 1833
Shouldn;t there be a rule that the owner had to have put at least ten pewrcent up (with no downpayment assistance) before any consideration of help. otherwise lets just call it welfare not compassion
Oh, could anyone give me an approximation to the amount of money we're talking about being traded daily when the 3-month T-Bill yield is so close to zero?
This temporary measure is a good thing to get some families through the holidays without further disruption.
They have enough work in the inbox to last them through February, so they essentially weren't going to get to any new ones until January anyway. It's just spin to make the GSE's look like they care.
NO, we are not. That is how we got here in the first place. Think!!
I should have said "punish irresponsible homedebtors". There is now way foreclosures will or can be more or less limited to people who took out option ARMS, I/O, no-doc, etc. loans on overpriced homes. Lots and lots of responsible people are about to get caught in the downdraft, too.
As for punishing politicians, bankers, appraisers, mortgage brokers, etc. - have at it.
Fannie South Sea + Freddie Tulip! You can't get any better than that. I told Tanta some years back that these 2 idiotic companies would take down the whole damn country.
EVERYTHING IN OUR FORECLOSURE INBOX IS GETTING MOVED TO OUR MODIFICATION INBOX. 99% OF WHAT GOES INTO OUR MODIFICATION INBOX WILL EVENTUALLY GO BACK INTO OUR FORECLOSURE INBOX STARTING ON JANUARY 9, 2009. CREATING MORE LAYERS OF RED TAPE TO GET BACK TO THE SAME SPOT YOU STARTED AT ANYWAY IS THE "G" IN "GSE"
dk writes:
Peter Schiff just ** SCHOOLED the traders on Fast Money. Bless that man, and thank you to CNBC for giving him airtime!
Sorry, I did not catch him on CNBC. Pray tell us what he schooled them about? The old lesson about getting out of U.S dollar and therefore invest with his firm or some new lesson?
lawyerliz said: What happens when vacant towers with no insurance get hit by hurricanes?
Have you ever visited Asbury Park, NJ? No hurricanes, but you get the same effect. Lots of rusting beachfront structures, the bones of redevelopment projects that never quite finished before the next crash.
Andy writes:
Finally some postive ACTION (rather than words and plans) to help struggling homeowners. As I discussed, this action is much overdue. Save the homeowner, save the nation.
Andy | Homepage | 11.20.08 - 5:09 pm | #
Yeah, Andy. Right. Just screw the folks that happen to have saved and hold the notes. F. Y.
I see nothing bad about this, as long as it is temporary.
See, that's a funny, cause as soon as Obama is in office we'll see the government suspending them for the next four years. That's like saying there's nothing bad about terminal cancer, as long as it's temporary.
We could of course just let everything default across the board and permanently end the middle class.
Maybe that's the whole point, and maybe we don't have a say. No more middle class. Of course, what is the middle class? I truly don't know the answer to that question.
I remember when Bush said during his campaign in 1999-2000 that he wasn't an interventionist and didn't believe in Nation Building. Obama talks about believing in the Middle Class. Maybe Obama's gonna put the nail in the coffin for the middle class in direct opposition to the platform he ran on just as sure as Dubya intervened and engaged in Nation Building (meaning Nation Destroyong).
Dying is an alternative to living. And if you don't like living because you are so miserable, dying might not be a bad alternative. People "down on their luck" have options. It's up to them which option they pick.
"Dying is an alternative to living. And if you don't like living because you are so miserable, dying might not be a bad alternative. People "down on their luck" have options. It's up to them which option they pick."
True.
But think of the children man! Think of the children!
One question, why should the bond holders be made whole when the stockholders, employees and the govt take the hit either in incurring stock losses, tax receipts or bail out costs.
Hey, check yourself. Your self-righteousness runneth over. Why don't you find some maxed-out credit junkie and write a check to cover his debt.
It will make you feel warm and fuzzy all over.
No new home loans. Double digit interest rates for the few with assets worth making loans to. Inventories skyrocket as only those with cash can buy. Home prices crash NATIONWIDE. Begin GD II.
Well, at least if home prices keep dropping, they will reach a level where people will be able to pay cash for a house and not have to deal with the messed up lending situation.
I didn't say that they still can, just that they did. I have met so many well-off folks over the years that would certainly qualify for whatever kind of homeowner bailout is cooked up. It is appalling that anybody thinks our tax dollars should bail out a home owner.
Step one: borrow a shitload of money. Step two: stop paying back the money. Step three: have the gov't pay back your money. Anybody that thinks we should bail them out needs to die.
"Alfred, what would be done for the renters, and individuals otherwise responsible with credit?"
They will be punished first via job losses and paying for bailouts, and then via hyperinflation as the entire "sucker goes down" - did you expect anything else?
Nice ploy.
Damn wish I'd bought a house in 2005 and never paid for it.
Idiots.
Yes it's true, CR has new thread about it
Does this mean we're going to rally tomorrow? Time to load up on SRS?
Nothing surprises me anymore. To steal from Pink Floyd I'm almost comfortably numb. Except I'm not comfortable about any of it.
You can stay in your house - for now.
Merry Christmas
Can I stop paying my rent too? PPS is the landlord. I'm sure they can get TARP money.
The temporary suspension of foreclosures is designed to allow affected borrowers facing foreclosure to retain their homes while Fannie Mae works with mortgage servicers to implement the streamlined modification program scheduled to launch December 15.
... so that we can resume kicking people out to the curb during the week of Dec 25.
problem solved.
now just close the market and the DJIA wont go any lower.
whoops, didn't read TFA. No foreclosures until Jan 9.
Merry Christmas
BED finally released today:
(Q1 08) 300k jobs lost; CES initially said 160k losses, 247k after revisions; B/D subtracted 100k jobs to make it close.
So either the Q4 2007 was a complete outlier with +400k jobs or those temp jobs didn't go away.
Confusing.
Notice the timing? It's also more or less a kick in the nuts to the next administration -- having 2 months of backlogged evictions acted on in the first week
Not much point in kicking people out if the houses will just remain empty and decay. And there is always a small chance of getting a reduced stream of payments.
Already 50%+ of sales in bubble markets are foreclosures, yet foreclosure inventory just keeps rising.
This temporary measure is a good thing to get some families through the holidays without further disruption.
Will delaying foreclosure proceedings for this small number of properties impact the RE market? So many sales are now foreclosures that it seems like delaying the appearance of a small number of properties on the market is worth the cost of delaying foreclosures over the holidays.
I see nothing bad about this, as long as it is temporary.
"EvilHenryPaulson writes:
Notice the timing? It's also more or less a kick in the nuts to the next administration"
Yes. Make the other guy deal with it...
Prosecute marijuana growing and forgive marijuana cultivation. Smart move big guys.
So the foreclosures will just be dumped en masse once the cease is lifted. Cool, nothing like competing foreclosures to drive the market further down.
This nation is fucked
"I see nothing bad about this, as long as it is temporary.
s_puttnick"
If they can't kick me out of my house, maybe they cannot make me pay child support either.
But what will this do to housing sales!?!?!?!!?
/end snark!
If they won't kick me out of my house, maybe they won't care if I don't pay my taxes or if I stab that man playing with his daughter over there.
Extend unemplyment benefits.
Suspend foreclosures.
When will food and gas be free?
Hasn't the S&P 500 come down by -54.14% from it's high?
The average struggling homemoaner must be wondering why he or she is making mortgage payments on time.
God,
are you on THIS thread? God?
CR where do you get the news from if there is no link? I'm pretty low tech. Is there a news feed or something?
TIA
If they are just gonna suspend foreclosures can I just get a loan for no money down and have payments start when they decide to start making their other clients pay for their mortgages?
Seriously. Just put me in a home, and I promise I will start making payments in a few months.
USDJPY at 93.60 -- unbelievable!!
I think I bet energycon last year that there would be a foreclosure freeze.....followed by the national guard going door-to-door 'suggesting' that people should honor thier mortgages.
God ran out to pull his mortgage check out of the mail box. He'll be back shortly
Why can't the government just sign over the deeds to these homes to the people living in them and eliminate the mortgages?
That would solve all of this foreclosure nonsense and then those people would have money each month to spend and get the economy going again.
Comrade Anonymous | 11.20.08 - 5:04 pm
LOL!!!
No, but I am here..
// dc1000 writes:
God,
are you on THIS thread? God?
dc1000 | 11.20.08 - 5:02 pm | # //
....
"I think I bet energycon last year that there would be a foreclosure freeze.....followed by the national guard going door-to-door 'suggesting' that people should honor thier mortgages."
If that's the case, sign me up for the guard. I have a very persuasive tone with deadbeats who think my tax dollars should subsidize their greed.
Fed balance sheet down slightly. (on-air CNBC)
Hey Alfred,
Now your thinking like a politician. Careful what you wish for 'cause I bet we're getting very close to this idea on the extreme left.
If other lenders and mortgage service providers follow suit we may at least have some breathing room to salvage something before the economy capsizes and drowns even the first class passengers. But the rest of the bunch is not in receivership under the US government....not yet at least....
Man what a huge mess. The horror that unregulated new finance hath brought.
The horror. The horror. Kill them. Kill them all.
"temporary suspension of foreclosures is designed to allow affected borrowers facing foreclosure to retain their homes"
Paraphrased: temporary suspension of foreclosures designed to keep angry mobs facing homelessness to stay at home. This initative will prevent open hunting season of scared shitless politicians. They should throw in free cable as an incentive for the out-of-credit-out-of-cash rabble.
Alfred, what would be done for the renters, and individuals otherwise responsible with credit?
Finally some postive ACTION (rather than words and plans) to help struggling homeowners. As I discussed, this action is much overdue. Save the homeowner, save the nation.
I really hope they'll let us renters stay too. It's getting pretty cold outside here in Denver, though downtown is awfully quiet and peaceful otherwise.
Morocco Bama send them a thank-you note.
I can't recall who it was last week who was betting on a big upside to the market this week. Does anyone recall who that well known poster was? Anyone?
Someone must have messed in their panties about now. Wooops.
Disaster!
What about all the people who are struggling to pay their mortgages - and are still up-to-date? Many are making decisions about not buying their children new clothes or not paying the auto-loan or credit cards - in order to keep up their mortgages.
The new message: Don't bother paying your mortgage - no sweat.
This will kill any green shoots of private mortgage-lending like DDT on a lawn.
Please don't do anything to impede the fall of home prices...I want to be able to afford one (just one) someday. I don't think that's asking too much.
There goes the sales numbers for december
Andy, I'm not into helping some dipsticks with a household income of $120k stay in a house on which they owe $600k.
dc1000,
yes, I am here my son. I am everywhere.
Well, if you haven't stopped paying your mortgage, you will now!!
Ahhh... lemme think about that one
We have an imposter on this board. I am the real big G. I had a compound in Waco and everything.
The housing market is turning into a car dealer...buy a house now, no payments until January 2009!!
Andy writes:
Finally some positive ACTION (rather than words and plans) to help struggling homeowners. As I discussed, this action is much overdue. Save the homeowner, save the nation.
Nope. It is save the assets, save the nation's ass. As long as people make their mortgage payment, your underlying asset is safe and you, the lender/investor, could potentially ride out the loss in value. No pay the mortgage, asset gets marked truly to market at foreclosure and those holding the investment side of the note become bag holders.
So the real question is: what is the delta on those making or not making their payments so Freddie, Fannie, etc can be made whole in the end, despite the depreciating asset. Old school finance could have dealt with the situation. Slice and dice model makes this a Gordian Knot with everyone groping around for the bold stroke.
"Turn him to any cause of policy,
The Gordian Knot of it he will unloose,
Familiar as his garter" (Shakespeare, Henry V, Act 1 Scene 1. 45-47)
that's one way to boost retail spending during the holidays ....
Now that Freddie Mac has suspended all foreclosures, can people who were already kicked out of their home move back in if the house is still empty?
CredtorNation wrote:
can't recall who it was last week who was betting on a big upside to the market this week. Does anyone recall who that well known poster was? Anyone?
I recall the name Persecuted Comrade
Anonymouse.
Cheers,
Килгор Траут
Help them retain their homes? If they are in the foreclosure process, the house isn't theirs any more.
I sure hope that my rent can be suspended between Thanksgiving & New Years. It would certainly increase my spending money, and the property management company can ask for TARP funding to make up the difference.
Andy writes:
"Finally some postive ACTION (rather than words and plans) to help struggling homeowners. As I discussed, this action is much overdue. Save the homeowner, save the nation."
Save the homeowner??? If they are responsible, they don't need to be saved. If they aren't, then FUCK THEM. Some jerkoff takes out a loan that he doesn't repay and we're supposed to pick up the tab? Idiot.
"Careful what you wish for 'cause I bet we're getting very close to this idea on the extreme left.
CreditorNation "
All of this jacksh@t is being done by the extreme right, at the moment. Every freaking one of them should be hung from the lampposts. Neocon traitors.
Some jerkoff takes out a loan that he doesn't repay and we're supposed to pick up the tab? Idiot. --kevin
Who's the idiot?
s_puttnick said: I see nothing bad about this, as long as it is temporary.
Haven't you realized that all of the liquidity facilities and bailouts and new windows installed by The Fed are "temporary"? Obviously you have nothing to fear, as any day now these "temporary" measures will be rolled back and we can get back to free market dealings. /chortle
Merry Christmas! Skip a few more mortgage payments!
bruiser:
presumably your landlord will not have to make his mortgage payments on the property, so he should be willing to suspend rent payments for you as well...
Unless you're like me and live in a place the landlord owns outright. Not sure what I'm gonna do about that.
"Some jerkoff takes out a loan that he doesn't repay and we're supposed to pick up the tab? Idiot."
This is the republican party in action. This is how they are going to rebuild themselves...deadbeats and evangelicals united against the responsible.
Who's the idiot?
Anonymous | 11.20.08 - 5:20 pm
Yes, I think the banks should go down as well.
Let's not start the Left, Right Fox Trot, please. There's plenty of blame to go around, regardless of the so-called side of the aisle.
Totally agree 'Bama.
I am glad they distinguish between occupied and vacant homes. If they finish foreclosures of vacant homes faster and occupied homes slower, that doesn't sound like such a bad thing. It probably leads to less weather damage, vandalism, and theft.
I still don't understand why it's so rare to have a bank rent out foreclosed homes. It would help their cashflow.
"Who's the idiot?"
Andy, for celebrating the "save the homeowner" initiative. Which means that some couple with a $200k salary that overextended themselves on a $1 million house at the market peak, no longer able to afford, will get a massive bailout with our tax dollars.
Folks, we are way, way, way beyond "punish the irresponible".
"Save the homeowner, save the nation."
Save the deadbeats, trash America.
Retail: Is the American Shopping Mall Dead? | Newsweek Environment | Newsweek.com
wow, if that many malls already have negative carry then just imagine what would happen if they all get closed. The weak will drag down the strong stores. Retail employment is huge
Inquiring minds wanta know who will be paying for Com Ed, Peoples Gas, water bill, real estate taxes and city services while staying in their homes? Just like the good ole' days of chopping up the furniture, fences, and neighbors trees to keep the house warm.
Another mucked-up Wylie Coyote and Roadrunner episode.
This is insane . I
Folks, we are way, way, way beyond "punish the irresponible".
It's called trickle up Accountability and Responsibility.
back to your graph previous post:
No two markets are the same. My missus and me were agreeing that the chart looks much like 1929, after today it looks worse.
I am expecting a grim day tomorrow. Of course I could be wrong.
Elvis,
Upthread, you made the crucial switch from "can't" kick out of house to "won't" make you pay taxes.
This is another moral hazard issue, just like Lehman was.
Let's just hope the results of the decision about foreclosures--whether to suspend moral hazard indefinitely--aren't similarly lackluster as were those of Lehman.
The government will always retain the power to move you around, unless it loses its monopoly on legal violence. Whether and how it enforces that power is the question.
But don't let me stop you from paying your taxes, your child support, your utilities bills, your whatever. 'Cause until everyone thinks that way, there's no way this country gets any better...
We're all bankruptcy judges now.
Someone sent me this today - a bizarre article. (Sorry if it has already been posted.)
FHA Backed Loans: The New Subprime
FHA-Backed Loans: The New Subprime - BusinessWeek
The bond market today - what is there even to say?
"rps writes:
Inquiring minds wanta know who will be paying for Com Ed, Peoples Gas, water bill, real estate taxes and city services while staying in their homes?"
Tiger Woods?
We never had the opportunity to punish the irresponsible. The election cycle made sure of it. If we're all going down, I want the irresponsible to go down first in hopes that their carcasses will cushion my fall.
I'm Tiger Woods.
Folks, we are way, way, way beyond "punish the irresponible".
PeakVT
No. We reward (irresponsible) fraud with TARPS, Treasury giveaways, and bailouts . Socialism for the top 1%. "It sucks to be you" for the rest of us.
Kevin, blaming the homeowner is like blaming the workers at GM.
The problem is a systematic failure of fiduciary duty from the real estate agents, to the appraisers, brokers, underwriters, and rating agencies.
The selling of mortgage debt in slices and dices that were then leveraged against and all sold like a commodity. This created incentives to cut corners in the transactional basis for creating the mortgage debt as a short term profit vehicle with no skin in the game rather than long term investments held by formerly local banks.
So your anger needs to be directed to the Big Picture my friend. And it ain't pretty and it as complex as the new finance that made the problem possible in the first place.
How many homeowners do you know whom want to go into foreclosure or bankruptcy and have their lives utterly ruined. The social consequences on our economy is very real. Homeownership = Middle Class Stability. No middle class stability, no stable economy. This is serious.
dc1000
please stop crying out my name every time you have a gambling, uh hum i mean investment problem
remember, i help those who help themselves
now go forth and invest, i mean sin, no more
I still don't understand why it's so rare to have a bank rent out foreclosed homes. It would help their cashflow.
some investor guy | 11.20.08 - 5:22 pm
The reason is that banks are banks, and not in the property management business. If a rental property is foreclosed upon, the tenants can stay. However, an owner-occupied single family residence, if foreclosed, becomes/stays vacant. If the bank rents it out, the bank is going into the rental biz. Not allowed.
Plus, banks want to get the ORE off of the balance sheet as fast as possible. Renters would complicate matters.
"Upthread, you made the crucial switch from "can't" kick out of house to "won't" make you pay taxes.
This is another moral hazard issue, just like Lehman was."
I was just tired of using " cannot" or "can't." Kind of like I get tired of eating gov't cheese sometimes.
I always thought banks were blood suckers.
If a rental property is foreclosed upon, the tenants can stay.
No.
you were always right
Kind of like I get tired of eating gov't cheese sometimes.
That's nacho cheese. It's mine.
Elvis,
LOL!
Wouldn't have expected you to be at the Federal teat.
Time for trickle up economics.
There is nothing like rebuilding from the bottom up.
FDR/English socialism is coming fast.
This collapse ensures that the free market has once again been manipulated to criminal levels, and the rubes are mad as heck.
There is no functioning republican party as of this moment in time, there is only an Elks club waiting for the last fools to dies and be sold.
Real Estate is dead for at least a decade- get the message!!!
Good, now go and find something people need like cheap reliable energy.
This is the 70's show writ large or 1931.
Someday this war's gonna end...
fallonPDX, I have lots of friends that simply want to stop paying and are looking for some incentive. This could be it. I know people that bought at 4, 5, 10 times their salary. They all bragged that they were going to get rich off of real estate. They bought out of stupidity and greed. They deserve NOTHING.
I like the faux govt cheese, made with motor oil. Yum.
They deserve nothing, but they will get much more than nothing in the end.
Morocco Bama, I'm nacho Daddy, although myself and several hundred other men thought so until the paternity test came back.
for bond folks especially, looks like a bond disaster is much closer...
from Across the Curve-
Across the Curve » Blog Archive » Part Two
"I just spoke with an options trader about this historic move. He said that there structured product trades buried in trading books all over the world which are melting. There is a massive short in the 30 year sector (in Treasury paper and in the swap market) which resulted from sales of cheap volatility. Some of these positions have been on the books of various entities for years and it is only recently that the chickens have come home to roost. Each time the spread turns more negative, that movement forces some one to receive in swaps to hedge there position. There are short the long end trades in every permutation and combination along the curve. The receiving creates a self fulfilling prophecy which compels someone else to receive. He had no opinion on when this would end."
There is no way the government can backstop that much bad debt. End game folks.
Rotel dip, anyone?
serf AG - stop. You'll scare the children for Pete's sake!
Real Estate is dead for at least a decade- get the message!!!
Real Estate, Stocks, Bonds, are all dead for a decade.
Elvis, I was born of a jackal.
Kevin, those loans should have never been made. And you need some better friends. They sound like grifters.
"Wouldn't have expected you to be at the Federal teat.
s_puttnick"
And you would have been right.
A decade? Is Terri Schiavo dead for a decade?
Well, we weren't planning to buy before Jan 9th anyway. Guess there will be even more inventory in the spring.
Just keep delaying that day of reckoning as long as you can. It's worked so well thus far.
in the end we are all dead
I still think we should set taxes to our credit score.
serf AG - stop. You'll scare the children for Pete's sake!
Geoff | 11.20.08 - 5:33 pm | #
~~~~~~~~
hee hee, next time i'll hold a flashlight under my chin when i post.
OT-from today's San Jose Mercury: a quarterly survey of 509 Bay area CEO's found that business confidence plunged to a record low (32), and for every company planning to hire 3 companies plan to have layoffs, and that 50% of the CEOs believe that the recession will last another 5 quarters and 41% think it could last longer.
Fallon, there needs to be a method to separate the whaet from the grifters. Until then, it's awarding graft at the top and the bottom.
in the end we are all dead
--mock turtle
Speak for yourself. OT, gold hung in there today.
Between retail collapse, real estate collapse, forestry collapse and tourism collapse- The Fate of BC is sealed.
Ontario and Quebec- have the additional problem of shrinking US owned manufacturing..
It is gonna be a fun Winter (Jan-March 09) in Canada
It's all fun, games and self righteous chest pounding until you are the one that loses your job, your savings, your assets and your retirement.
Out til 2010,
Credit scores are going to be overhauled after this is all over.
The 1990s Edition Trivial Pursuit board game has as one of the playing pieces a share of .com stock.
I'm guessing the 2000s version will have a credit report.
There not going to mean as much when the emphasis on credit is diminished.
Peter Schiff just f'ing SCHOOLED the traders on Fast Money. Bless that man, and thank you to CNBC for giving him airtime!
OT-My game plan: Move out of unaffordable 3 bedroom townhouse into more affordable 2 bedroom apartment. Take equity from town house and invest it into the market. Give me six months to implement.
At what point is it more cost effective to hold cash than even to buy the shortest term US Treasuries? What about the 30 yr?
"If they won't kick me out of my house, maybe they won't care if I don't pay my taxes or if I stab that man playing with his daughter over there."
Oh, but you don't belong to the protected class - i.e. greedy, irresponsible fools willing to blatantly lie on a mortgage application.
This country is done. It may take a while, but it's as clear as the bubble was back in 2003.
"It's all fun, games and self righteous chest pounding until you are the one that loses your job, your savings, your assets and your retirement.
Friedman Marx"
At that point, you might just consider making the end sooner than later.
No middle class stability, no stable economy...
fallonPDX
Greed is wiping-out the geese that lay the golden eggs, aka taxes. No one paying federal income taxes, payroll taxes, state taxes, city taxes.....Goodbye city services, school programs closed, libraries, firemen, policemen cuts......been there in the 70's.
the aspens will already be turning. They turn in clusters, because their roots are interconnected.
Fannie Mae press release:
Media: News Releases > Fannie Mae To Suspend Foreclosures Until January 2009
Cam
dk writes:
fallonPDX, these aren't just friends, but people I met everywhere. Folks making decent salaries, refi-ing their McMansions to buy six-figure BMW's. Guess what? They can now use our tax dollars to finance their greedy and lavish lifestyles. There is no "poor homeowner" in this situation. I'm a "poor renter", who is going to bail me out when my landlord raises the rent??
Damn, sorry to go back to the market, in Oakland today.
Ouch.
And I'm not sure I want to know what happened in the Bond Market.
But horray! Their still playing kick the friggin' can down the road.
Gotta give it to Shrubboy, when he finds something that epically fails...he keeps on a failing.
Nostrovia
rps,
Beautiful quote about aspens! I think some aspen forests are technically the largest living organisms on earth.
Anyway, regarding city services, I'm in city planning. The next ? years are going to be sparse.
serf Alan Greenspend | Homepage | 11.20.08 - 5:36 pm
Yet another eye I need.
Speak for yourself. OT, gold hung in there today.
Anonymous | 11.20.08 - 5:36 pm
So, what are your thoughts on the rumour that there is going to be a major rush on physical come December.
The reason is that banks are banks,
No they're not: they're insurance companies, credit card companies, mortgage companies, etc. anything to get under the TARP.
dk writes:
That guy is a dirt bag too.
Dear Misean,
Can you please forward my messages on to God?
thanks,
DC1000
Bond Girl --
The bond market today - what is there even to say?
I don't know, but I would still like to hear you say it.
Any theories?
"FHA Backed Loans: The New Subprime"
Conjure says, "BWAHAHAHA!"
"Let's all go buy some FHA paper."
I always thought banks were blood suckers.
Morocco Bama
Those are vampires. Banks are those giant holes in the ground into which you throw...
I doubt they understood a word he was saying. Did they call him Dr. Doom, or insult him, like they normally do at CrapNBC?
The mall across the street is noticeably busy today again.
One last Christmas?
At what point is it more cost effective to hold cash than even to buy the shortest term US Treasuries? What about the 30 yr?
mykillk | Homepage | 11.20.08 - 5:38 pm |
~~~~~~~~~~
my opinion is bonds are going down like frazier, just like the last GD, only with a shorter time horizon. the dollar will join the bonds.
glod will go up.
longer term i'm still working on forecasting.
I could do that..
// dc1000 writes:
Dear Misean,
Can you please forward my messages on to God?
thanks,
DC1000
dc1000 | 11.20.08 - 5:41 pm | # //
........
CSS -- Actually, I heard Dec. COMEX deliveries are on 11/28...next Friday
There is something really, really weird happening on the long end of the curve. I have a hard time believing that the exotics that have gotten so much press lately are responsible for movements of this magnitude. Either way, it appears to be a structural issue with the bond market and not risk averse investors moving out the yield curve.
And TIPS - for the love of God.
At what point is it more cost effective to hold cash than even to buy the shortest term US Treasuries? What about the 30 yr?
--mykillk
When short term yields approach 0%, i.e. now. 30 year is at 3.X%. The U.S. cannot afford to pay of its debts without printing money, especially given the current direction of economic activity. If they don't print, they default on debt and the default risk should be reflected in the price. At 3.X%, it's not.
At that point, you might just consider making the end sooner than later.
Elvis | 11.20.08 - 5:38 pm | #
Righteous.
I am cheering for you to lose all your money now.
If the S&P goes below 500 what will they call?
S&P 000?
Hey Fried man,
Trust me, I have no love for the right or left wingers. They're all thieves. I just can't wait to see what mamma barracka does come January to show how much he cares for the downtrodden. It's only just begun. The Federal Teats are only gonna get more sore as everyone suckles for mamma's milk.
For those of you out there who faithfully keep paying your mortgages on time, tell us how it feels to have a neighbor sitting back with his beer and chips at xmas time as the Feds work on his behalf to shave off 200 grand from his mortgage and stick you with the taxes to support his engorged belly-o-beer? Just think about it. He's gonna be paying so much less to live in your neighborhood while you pick up the tab for him over the next 30 years.
s_puttnick writes:
rps,
Beautiful quote about aspens!
Fuck you Scooter!
CSS,
there has been a rush on gold and silver since July, and it is only getting worse.
The prices paid on the Comex no longer reflect anything like reality.
The run on physical means a run on the dollar will be starting up once the size of the federal deficit becomes apparent next year.
My bet is for $2 trillion in red ink for FY2010.
Someday this war's gonna end...
Is it bad of me to be happy about falling real estate prices, like seeing them fall an additional 15-30% in my area of a large midwestern city. Is there a downside for me as a renter (hopefully a buyer in the next 6-18 months) with falling home prices? I'm excited about plummeting real estate!!!
Kevin where do you live that folks can still get that kind of cash out re-fi? There are hardly any places left in the US with that kind of equity available nor vigorous residential RE market.
Morocco Bama I agree. Unfortunately this mess is very complex. We could of course just let everything default across the board and permanently end the middle class.
mykillk writes:
CSS -- Actually, I heard Dec. COMEX deliveries are on 11/28...next Friday
Nov 28 is the first day to give notice, and first day to take delivery for Dec futures
Dec 29 is the last day to deliver
dc1000,
I could speak to Glod for you. Not sure what to ask though. This thread has like 300 posts a minute. Had to skim through.
Nostrovia,
s_puttnick,
The Aspen's quote is via Scooter Libby letter to Judith Miller...hehehehe. Different context, but nonetheless its' all about what it was called in my day;"Fraud."
Well, now I understand the boxing reference. I prefer the ancient Egyptian architect and Illuminatus! references.
Really. There aren't enuf resources to do all the foreclosures at once. May as well do the vacant ones first. Less deterioration.
What happens when vacant towers with no insurance get hit by hurricanes?
congrats to all the deflationists. You were right (so far). Even Jas, as hard as it is for me to admit. Treasuries killed me today.
EHP: Thanks for the info...gotta write this dow
A FRIENDLY HEADS-UP: Since Failie May and Fraudie Max are suspending foreclosures until Jan 2009:
Fannie and Freddie Suspend Foreclosures into January 2009 « Your Mortgage or Your Life…
SO STOP TRASHING YOUR HOUSE AND PEEING IN THE CORNERS (until after Christmas)!
FED buys long end down in Quantitative easing move through the derivatives at glodman...
shhh....secrets not out yet.
Stop. Stop for just a moment, please. Be quiet. Think.
The MSM on CNBC (et al BTW) is now talking about another depression, a 'doomsday scenario', ad nauseum.
Roubini, Schiff, et al are being listened to without ridicule.
Time to sit tight. Let it come in. Wait for it. We're not close yet. It's just now getting good.
CreditorNation writes:
Hey Fried man,
"Trust me, I have no love for the right or left wingers. They're all thieves. I just can't wait to see what mamma barracka does come January to show how much he cares for the downtrodden. It's only just begun. The Federal Teats are only gonna get more sore as everyone suckles for mamma's milk."
Good luck. Well if the day comes that you lose your job, your money and all your security. Then you will be begging for government assistance.
I am almost willing to bet this will happen.
Glib self righteousness only goes so far.
"He's gonna be paying so much less to live in your neighborhood while you pick up the tab for him over the next 30 years."
Unfortunately we have been paying for people like this for decades... The real change is that now these free riders will live next door.
So, what are your thoughts on the rumour that there is going to be a major rush on physical come December.
--Comrade Scared Shitless
IMO, the physical rush has happened at this price level. Spot, I think, does not reflect the physical value, and that is dubious. I have been watching GLD vs. S&P the last few days. Gold is holding up better than stocks. I am looking to see if gold starts rallying with the flight to quality in bonds, or, for long bonds to sell off with stocks and for gold to rally. No trend has emerged, so I'm still watching.
Folks, we are way, way, way beyond "punish the irresponible".
PeakVT | 11.20.08 - 5:23 pm | #
NO, we are not. That is how we got here in the first place. Think!!
Anonymous wrote:
in the end we are all dead
--mock turtle
Speak for yourself.
Anonymous
Anonymous, have you been making deals with Satan?
ps Misean, yes I know about dc1000 already, you don't have to tell me
Also VERY important to gold/silver/etc delivery
In 2006 the LME had a fail to deliver in nickel contracts.
LME Imposes Backwardation Limit for Nickel
They retroactively rewrote the contracts to be settled only in cash, and gave a 10% premium to spot price
I guess owning a seat at an exchange has its perks in the form of protection
"I am cheering for you to lose all your money now.
Friedman Marx"
Thank you. You are sweet. And I ask these questions: Why is dying always a bad alternative? Because you say it is?
slow down writes:
FED buys long end down in Quantitative easing move through the derivatives at glodman...
Treasury, not Fed
From Across the Curve: Part Two
November 20th, 2008 6:06 pm | by John Jansen |
There have been stunning and dramatic moves in the market since wrote my earlier piece.
...
The breakeven spread on 10 year TIPS is about zero. The market is predicting no inflation for 10 years.
Ouch. There goes the home appreciation down the tubes. No 'V' bottom for this baby.
CSS,
Yes heard Glod rumor. Can not find good confirmation. But it is making me a bit nervous.
Nostrovia,
God has left the building
They retroactively rewrote the contracts to be settled only in cash, and gave a 10% premium to spot price
I guess owning a seat at an exchange has its perks in the form of protection
EvilHenryPaulson | 11.20.08 - 5:48 pm
And that was nothing compared to the chaos to come in silver and to less extent in gold.
Good post on that video of every major world leader from the G-20 summit snubbing Bush, and why they did.
Emptywheel » Page not found
This asshole can't vacate the office fast enough.
Misean,
the majority of my prayers were made here:
HaloScan.com - Comments
worth a scan, use CTRL-F to find me...
maybe God can do that too?
CTRL-F that is?
Treasury, not Fed
Anonymous | 11.20.08 - 5:48 pm
same same, different name.
Elvis writes:
"Thank you. You are sweet. And I ask these questions: Why is dying always a bad alternative? Because you say it is?"
Good luck!
and LOL @ Misean.
when asked, can you talk to God for me, he says, yeah, but what did you want to say?
nice one.
love it.
i'm loving every minute of it, jerry!
I think it's fair to say that we will see the unwinding of Greenspan's "irrational exuberance" which would put us below DOW 4500, at least
We are in danger of being overwhelmed with irredeemable paper, mere paper, representing not gold nor silver; no sir, representing nothing but broken promises, bad faith, bankrupt corporations, cheated creditors and a ruined people.
Daniel Webster, speech in the Senate, 1833
Wash, rinse, repeat.....
ll,
"What happens when vacant towers with no insurance get hit by hurricanes?"
Um, ever see Mad Max or Escape from New York.
Nostrovia,
Bond Girl --
And TIPS - for the love of God.
Nobody much interested in being Protected from Inflation?
"Um, ever see Mad Max or Escape from New York."
Those may have been documentaries.
Actually, I am the building.
Shouldn;t there be a rule that the owner had to have put at least ten pewrcent up (with no downpayment assistance) before any consideration of help. otherwise lets just call it welfare not compassion
"Why is dying always a bad alternative? Because you say it is?"
Good luck!
Friedman Marx"
No answer for me, huh?
Oh, could anyone give me an approximation to the amount of money we're talking about being traded daily when the 3-month T-Bill yield is so close to zero?
Yep. It was a rhetorical question.
Actually, the county will eventually take them back for failure to pay taxes, and turn them into welfare hotels.
Or, a sort of Mad Max Disneyworld!!
How's that for making lemonade out of lemons!
Long time lurker, and this is the reason why. Lots of people smarter than me and I learn something magnificent every day. Please keep it up everyone
EvilHenryPaulson writes:
Also VERY important to gold/silver/etc delivery
In 2006 the LME had a fail to deliver in nickel contracts.
LME Imposes Backwardation Limit for Nickel
They retroactively rewrote the contracts to be settled only in cash, and gave a 10% premium to spot price
I guess owning a seat at an exchange has its perks in the form of protection
slow down writes:
FED buys long end down in Quantitative easing move through the derivatives at glodman...
Which is illegal to do secretly. But as Shrub's role model Nixon said, "if the President does it, it's not a crime"
This temporary measure is a good thing to get some families through the holidays without further disruption.
They have enough work in the inbox to last them through February, so they essentially weren't going to get to any new ones until January anyway. It's just spin to make the GSE's look like they care.
"Why is dying always a bad alternative? Because you say it is?"
Good luck!
Friedman Marx"
No answer for me, huh?
Dying isn't an alternative. We all die.
How we live is a different story.
Good Luck!
NO, we are not. That is how we got here in the first place. Think!!
I should have said "punish irresponsible homedebtors". There is now way foreclosures will or can be more or less limited to people who took out option ARMS, I/O, no-doc, etc. loans on overpriced homes. Lots and lots of responsible people are about to get caught in the downdraft, too.
As for punishing politicians, bankers, appraisers, mortgage brokers, etc. - have at it.
Why don't they make them pay a nominal amount? Even $250.00 per month would make me feel better, or even less, but just something!
Geez.
Fannie South Sea + Freddie Tulip! You can't get any better than that. I told Tanta some years back that these 2 idiotic companies would take down the whole damn country.
EVERYTHING IN OUR FORECLOSURE INBOX IS GETTING MOVED TO OUR MODIFICATION INBOX. 99% OF WHAT GOES INTO OUR MODIFICATION INBOX WILL EVENTUALLY GO BACK INTO OUR FORECLOSURE INBOX STARTING ON JANUARY 9, 2009. CREATING MORE LAYERS OF RED TAPE TO GET BACK TO THE SAME SPOT YOU STARTED AT ANYWAY IS THE "G" IN "GSE"
dk writes:
Peter Schiff just ** SCHOOLED the traders on Fast Money. Bless that man, and thank you to CNBC for giving him airtime!
Sorry, I did not catch him on CNBC. Pray tell us what he schooled them about? The old lesson about getting out of U.S dollar and therefore invest with his firm or some new lesson?
lawyerliz said: What happens when vacant towers with no insurance get hit by hurricanes?
Have you ever visited Asbury Park, NJ? No hurricanes, but you get the same effect. Lots of rusting beachfront structures, the bones of redevelopment projects that never quite finished before the next crash.
I think we may be seeing the unwinding of Reagonomics. Back to early 80s levels on all assets.
Andy writes:
Finally some postive ACTION (rather than words and plans) to help struggling homeowners. As I discussed, this action is much overdue. Save the homeowner, save the nation.
Andy | Homepage | 11.20.08 - 5:09 pm | #
Yeah, Andy. Right. Just screw the folks that happen to have saved and hold the notes. F. Y.
I see nothing bad about this, as long as it is temporary.
See, that's a funny, cause as soon as Obama is in office we'll see the government suspending them for the next four years. That's like saying there's nothing bad about terminal cancer, as long as it's temporary.
We could of course just let everything default across the board and permanently end the middle class.
Maybe that's the whole point, and maybe we don't have a say. No more middle class. Of course, what is the middle class? I truly don't know the answer to that question.
I remember when Bush said during his campaign in 1999-2000 that he wasn't an interventionist and didn't believe in Nation Building. Obama talks about believing in the Middle Class. Maybe Obama's gonna put the nail in the coffin for the middle class in direct opposition to the platform he ran on just as sure as Dubya intervened and engaged in Nation Building (meaning Nation Destroyong).
"Dying isn't an alternative. We all die.
How we live is a different story."
Dying is an alternative to living. And if you don't like living because you are so miserable, dying might not be a bad alternative. People "down on their luck" have options. It's up to them which option they pick.
Elvis(Unrated) writes:
"Dying is an alternative to living. And if you don't like living because you are so miserable, dying might not be a bad alternative. People "down on their luck" have options. It's up to them which option they pick."
True.
But think of the children man! Think of the children!
What a great benefit for people who overpaid, over-reached or lied! Courtesy of all the rest of us.
You're welcome.
One question, why should the bond holders be made whole when the stockholders, employees and the govt take the hit either in incurring stock losses, tax receipts or bail out costs.
I say, its time to take out the bond holders!!!
Please leave Elvis alone. He is all that is left of the America we once loved.
"Glib self righteousness only goes so far."
Hey, check yourself. Your self-righteousness runneth over. Why don't you find some maxed-out credit junkie and write a check to cover his debt.
It will make you feel warm and fuzzy all over.
What this really means:
No new home loans. Double digit interest rates for the few with assets worth making loans to. Inventories skyrocket as only those with cash can buy. Home prices crash NATIONWIDE. Begin GD II.
Well, at least if home prices keep dropping, they will reach a level where people will be able to pay cash for a house and not have to deal with the messed up lending situation.
fallonPDX,
I didn't say that they still can, just that they did. I have met so many well-off folks over the years that would certainly qualify for whatever kind of homeowner bailout is cooked up. It is appalling that anybody thinks our tax dollars should bail out a home owner.
Step one: borrow a shitload of money. Step two: stop paying back the money. Step three: have the gov't pay back your money. Anybody that thinks we should bail them out needs to die.
"Alfred, what would be done for the renters, and individuals otherwise responsible with credit?"
They will be punished first via job losses and paying for bailouts, and then via hyperinflation as the entire "sucker goes down" - did you expect anything else?
Some more on this all too generous offer!
Thank you Sir, may I have another?
Fannie and Freddie Suspend Foreclosures into January 2009 « Your Mortgage or Your Life…
Oh - sorry to all of you who will evicted the day before Turkeyday!