LA Times: Retailers cutting back on holiday hiring
Submitted by
CalculatedRisk on Tue, 10/14/2008 - 12:31pm (178 comments)
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First. Thanks for playing.
Is that kind of employment a U3 or U6 number?
Merry Christmas!
I believe,
Both...
ouch
self fulfilling prophecy coming along?
Where is my stimuls check?
I want a pink pony and of course one unlimited line of credit.......
Oh wait, that is the choice that put us in this mess.....
Wash, rinse, repeat...
Looks like they let Carly out of the basement or wherever it was they stuffed her. Appeared on Bloomberg a few minutes ago touting McCains home mortgage buyout plan as the best solution to the housing market. Then suggested that McCain may propose a "flat tax" program as an alternative since he thinks that would be a good idea. Ya know. Don't tax capiral, tax income". Keep Joe/Jane heartland in the ass.
All is not well;
I doubt some foul play....Rosencrantz and Guilderstern are dead.
All is not well;
I doubt some foul play....Rosencrantz and Guilderstern are dead.
Heads.
Where's Tanta when we so desperately need an obscure Shakespeare referent? Aye, there's the rub.
I've been working a part time job for a retailer this past year just a few days a month. When I explained I'd have greater availability for Christmas, the manager said good, now I don't have to hire anybody for the holidays.
Ho ho humbug. Christmas sucks anyways. It's just a great day to drink a whole bottle of vodka.
Ho ho humbug. Christmas sucks anyways.
Not this year. Less materialism = better xmas for me.
I'm getting to like this recession thing.
I hear that Ponies R Us will be hiring though, to meet the increased demand.
With less buyers, I think I will get very special care at Victoria's Secret this year.
"Then suggested that McCain may propose a "flat tax" program as an alternative since he thinks that would be a good idea."
Ahhhhhh.....Yes....the good ol' repub standby. Let's give those upper 1% folks a flat tax, and do the same for the lower 1% as well. Seems quite fair to me.
Australians just got their ponies. 10 billion stimulus announced yesterday, including upping the first time homebuyers rebate from 7K to 21K for new homes and 14K for existing. 2,100 for pensioner couples for Xmas and 1000 for each kid. Even better the government has gotten on TV and practically begged people NOT to save it but to SPEND IT NOW.
I called all this last July:
This month marks the start of the Christmas season. The Christmas shipping season from Asia to the US West Coast ports and beyond that is. Last year was the worst Christmas since 2002. What? You missed that buried on page D-12 last February? All you remember was the CNBC cheerleaders pushing the preliminary store estimates the Monday after Black Friday? Exactly.
So. What can you use to predict this Christmas? Not the yoy retail reports. You can be sure they'll use last year's abysmal numbers for comparison. One suggestion is the 'Baltic Dry Index.' The BDI is an index of dry shipping rates. Kind of a heterodyned long metric. When prices for shipping explode (doubling since Feb) It wipes out margins and businesses just plain old don't ship at a loss. China will essentially burning their pesodollars before they are worth less or no longer accepted in trade for shipping fuel. I suggest watching the tonnage at West Coast ports.
No soup for you.
Elvis writes:
With less buyers, I think I will get very special care at Victoria's Secret this year.
They might be so happy to see customers, you could get more than that.
"Less materialism = better xmas for me."
Amen to that.
Cancel cable TV: $0
No videogames: $0
Intelligent children with attention spans: Priceless!
ew FED Press Release
please submit all thoughtful comments to the nearest memory hole.
Treasury Requests Public Input on Establishment of
Guaranty Program for Troubled Assets
Washington The Department of the Treasury released a request for public input today on an insurance program for troubled assets which is required by the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008 (EESA). The purpose of this program is to restore liquidity and stability to the financial system, while minimizing any potential long term negative impact on taxpayers.
Under the EESA the Secretary is charged with establishing a program that will guarantee principal of, and interest on, troubled assets originated or issued prior to March 14, 2008. The program may take any form and may vary by asset class, but it must be voluntary and self-funding. The Secretary has the authority to set premiums to reflect the credit risk characteristics of the insured assets so as to ensure that taxpayers are fully protected.
Treasury invites comment on how the program should be structured to minimize adverse selection, including how premiums should be calculated, what events should trigger insurance payout, what form that payout should take, and which institutions and assets should be eligible. The Department also asks for public comment on technical considerations, including what legal, accounting, or regulatory issues would arise and what administrative challenges the program will create.
Comments are due by Friday, October 28 and may be submitted at Regulations.gov
HP-1212: Treasury Requests Public Input on Establishment of Guaranty Program for Troubled Assets
HAMLET
O, I die, Horatio;
The potent poison quite o'er-crows my spirit:
I cannot live to hear the news from England;
But I do prophesy the election lights
On Fortinbras: he has my dying voice;
So tell him, with the occurrents, more and less,
Which have solicited. The rest is silence.
Dies
HORATIO
Now cracks a noble heart. Good night sweet prince:
And flights of angels sing thee to thy rest!
Cancel cable TV: $0
No videogames: $0
Intelligent children with attention spans: Priceless!
Wisdom Seeker
I have a large DVD library. No commercials, content control, cheap entertainment. Other than usurious prices Disney charges this has proven an incredible investment.
Even Disney has cut their prices on regular DVDs from 19.99 always to 16.99, from what I've seen.
By the twiching in my thumb, something wicked this way comes.
@Alan Greenspend: "Under the EESA the Secretary is charged with establishing a program that will guarantee principal of, and interest on, troubled assets originated or issued prior to March 14, 2008. The program may take any form and may vary by asset class, but it must be voluntary and self-funding."
Damn, I thought this was some kind of satire!
Reread that: guarantee principal of, and interest on, troubled assets.
Can I haz some o' dem ponies for my troubled ass(ets)?
When are the Chistmalus checks going to be mailed?
Bah, humbug.
When are the Chistmalus checks going to be mailed? should read
ChRistmalus
Thanks.
Among signs that the economic pain is being to bite, more than 52 percent of China's toy makers for export have been forced to close down this year as a result of higher labor costs and overheads, a stronger currency, and the elimination of export tax rebates.
Expired
Jesus was born in July anyway
"more than 52 percent of China's toy makers for export have been forced to close down this year"
Oh, oh. Big trouble in little China.
andy in nz writes:
Among signs that the economic pain is being to bite, more than 52 percent of China's toy makers for export have been forced to close down this year
Sorry kids. No lead paint and melamine for you this year
@Rob Dawg and Fraud Guy:
Try the local public library... Most of the Disneys are free there. Granted, you don't always get to pick a specific one, but there's always something good.
20 books/week plus a weekend movie for the 2 kids and ourselves... and we'll retire a lot sooner to boot.
Consumption of just about anything other than food is overrated.
And in Act V isn't the stage littered with dead bodies?
wait, there's another, all hail bank of mellon, the new trillion plus overlords of all serfs and plutocrats.
Treasury Hires Custodian Under the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act
Washington- The U.S. Treasury Department today announced that Bank of New York Mellon will serve as its custodian for the implementation of the Troubled Asset Relief Program authorized under the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act. Treasury hired the New York City-based firm Monday and work began immediately to help the Department with custodial, accounting, auction management and other infrastructure services needed to administer the complex portfolio of troubled assets the Department will purchase.
Treasury hired the Bank of New York Mellon to provide the accounting of record for the portfolio, hold all cash and assets in the portfolio, provide for pricing and asset valuation services and assist with other related services. The financial agent will also track unique asset attributes as required by the Act, such as linkages to executive compensation limits and to warrants received from selling institutions. In addition, the financial agent will support the acquisition of securitized assets by serving as auction manager and conducting reverse auctions for the trouble assets. Bank of New York Mellon will provide all related infrastructure needs.
Treasury hired Bank of New York Mellon using its Financial Agent selection authorities. Treasury publicly announced its solicitation on Monday, October 6. The Department received 70 submissions, of which 10 met the eligibility requirements and minimum qualifications. The contract will last three years.
The Bank of New York Mellon Corporation is a global financial services company focused on helping clients manage and service their financial assets, operating in 34 countries and serving more than 100 markets. The company is a leading provider of financial services for institutions, corporations and high net-worth individuals, providing superior asset management and wealth management, asset servicing, issuer services, clearing services and treasury services through a worldwide client-focused team. It has more than $23 trillion in assets under custody and administration, more than $1.1 trillion in assets under management and services $12 trillion in outstanding debt. Additional information is available at BNY Mellon
hp-1211: Treasury Hires Custodian Under the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act
from previous thread: "Alternative Energy" is the Great White Hope of the well-connected industrialists like GE, Buffett, Cerebus, GM, etc. If there is ANY WAY to puff up that bubble it will happen. That said, I saw a GE windmill on I-610 in Houston a few weeks ago, and it looked like a substantial piece of industrial bling "Made in USA". May not be a bad thing.
Retail provides about 15mn jobs, or 10% of the total workforce.
If the seasonal pullbacks grow into layoffs, and store closures, then it can have a mini-positive feedback loop given that Auto-makers + suppliers, Boeing + suppliers, Screen Actors Guild (and everyone working around movies/tv are either laying off, on strike, or about to go on strike
The government should have tied recapitilzation to mortgage principal reductions, and reduce the handout to irresponsible borrowers by collecting 80-90% of the appreciation upon sale, and must not leave house for 3-5 yrs to both calm the market and discourage short-term tenants who wouldn't be turning over much asset appreciation.
A financial system that is encumbered is bad, a nation of consumers (btw, consumers are ~70%? of GDP) that are encumbered with job uncertainty, inflation uncertainty, car/home/medical/furniture/credit card/cd of the week loan payments is even worse.
You can only solve the problem with a broad approach, and you can't do that without stepping on toes ... but let's face it, if the self-interest game is allowed to play out everyone loses. Might as well set the floor on losses and provide potential upside benefit
... just wanted to say I'm still fascinated by AIG, can't wait to find out about their balance sheet. They borrowed $122bn? in a month, just wow. No signs of slowing down either so long as CDS contracts are being triggered. Any of the auto-makers entering BK to get some restructuring could force the gov't to cut ties to a sinking ship
With less buyers, I think I will get very special care at Victoria's Secret this year.
Elvis | 10.14.08 - 5:13 pm
Good, last year you looked sooooo frumpy under the tree.
The greatest unintended consequence of this crisis could be the awakening of the American people. Hard times always make me focus, either it was my fault and I fix it or it was someone elses and I fix that.
The blame assessment phase of this debacle will begin full swing after the election. My fear is they will manage to transfer the blame back onto us. Your neighbor is at fault for overspending and buying too much house. Take it out on him instead of the government and banks.
Good time to be driving an economy car and renting.
consumer recessions are so boring
they take forever and they don't declare themselves with a sea of red numbers falling violently
i demand more global financial systemic failures - much more interesting
does this mean ower prices
cuz i haz cash and a mean materialstic streak
Good, last year you looked sooooo frumpy under the tree.
nova
You must have me confused with 1970s Vegas Elvis.
The good news is that there will be that many more people to volunteer as bellringers for the Salvation Army's Red Kettle campaign.
Now if they each could simply keep their own buckets, there would be tremendous gains in efficiency.
oh, and by the way:
nova 1
Elvis 0
@picking Bank of NY Mellon for Tarp:
Treasury goes long BK!
The Bank of New York Mellon Corporation: Ticker = BK"
Hey, what have yo done with Iceland, you bast..., err, I mean, shortsellers!
Bloomberg.com:
Personal Finance
"The U.S. Treasury Department today announced that Bank of New York Mellon will serve as its custodian for the implementation of the Troubled Asset Relief Program authorized under the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act."
Whats the mark-up on that gig - 300 bp? I can't even calculate that on $700Billion after a shot of grappa - thats what the asshats charge me for transactions in Europe on my VISA/MC.
othing will be solved until we can start telling the truth. The bailouts at their core are the same as the Latin debt crisis in the 80's and Japan in the 90's. Neither one of those ended until everybody came clean and acknowledged that a lot of the loans weren't going to be repaid.
Latest estimate for bad loans is about 3trillion so far write off have been about 600billion. When we acknowledge the remaining 2.3 trillion and write it off then we will see a recovery. Looks the government will be owning the banks for about 15 years.
My credit rating is probably higher than some of these banks and I know I'm more solvent, why can't I get some of this cheap ass cash! I want a pony too.
Hey, Bank of NY/Mellon DOES this. When I moved my escrow account there and out of soon to be defunct (I guess) regional BankUnited, they assured me there was no problem, very little of their profits came from doing banking, and they mostly did custodial stuff around the world.
Better it not be done perhaps (forsooth?), but t'were it done, it is better than Goldman S.
Any comments re: Cramer's latest that financial guarantees of bank debt nullify need for CDS in the names. Sounds like he's basically arguing that the survivors are now established.
I presume short's will now start targeting non-guaranteed financials and non-financials. Sector rotation?
Be glad you don't have a mortgage in Iceland:
"People who have high mortgages are suffering the hardest blows at the moment. If they have loans in ISK they are indexed and grow with the inflation and if they have loans in foreign currencies they grow even faster because of the depreciation of the ISK."
http://www.icelandreview.com/icelandreview/daily_news/?cat_id=16539&ew_0_a_id=313625
"Good time to be driving an economy car and renting."
You can't beat a bottom-of-the-line KIA for pure economics...
Comrade Scared Shitless wrote: let's give those upper 1% folks a flat tax, and do the same for the lower 1% as well. Seems quite fair to me.
Uh, comrade, I don't mean to tax your pink matter but the bottom 1% or even the bottom 40% for that matter don't pay any federal income tax in effect. Lets do it the liberal demoKratic way...screw them with sin taxes...cigarettes, beer, lottery tickets...etc. Yes, demokrats bleed for the masses.
This season (American Thanksgiving - Christmas) is absolutely critical to retailers. The average store at a mall breaks even or loses money even up until the winter holiday sales. They might take in 80% of the year's revenue in 2-3 months.
These are vague anecdotes I'm recalling, there must be some retailer that describes how much of their profits come from Nov-Dec.
Further note, if you want something on a shelf in Nov it has to be ordered by now. There have been delays in shipping as speculators unwound their ship contracts and at the same time fumbling letters of credit for export/import. So there's a chance that even good retailers, but without top of the line global logistics, have the merchandise delayed
Sales should be good. Abercrombie and Fitch ended the summer bragging about how it would never hold a sale because that devalued the brand, they might be rethinking that now after their terrible earnings report/outlook vs their peers like Aeropostale
There was a bad consumer confidence story a couple of weeks ago so it's already baked in the Dow. Bull rally as far as one can see!
@Anonymous: "the bottom 1% or even the bottom 40% for that matter don't pay any federal income tax in effect."
No, but there's the pesky 15% FICA tax, the medicare tax, the state sales tax, their property tax...
Cut the bullshit about the poor not paying taxes.
Anyone know more about Bank of NY Mellon?
I just know that in the past they've been useful to drug money launderers, and continue to be custodians for overseas holders of large amounts of Treasuries (incl. unofficial reserves)
Is this more of a sign to foreign investors? Are they trying to encourage the middle-east states to invest? Will the US advisor to the Iraqi gov't blind them with CDO tranching magic?
Paulson: The consumers better start consuming if they know what's good for them.
Bush: Did we get the Democrats to pass that stimulus checks before Christmas?
Bernanke: I can warm up the black helicopters and drop over all the malls.
Pelosi: What special interest did I forget to add in this stimulus package? Oh yeah the consumer, how do we make sure they spend this money at Wal Mart and CostCo.
Obama: You guys better give me a foreign war to distract the consumers or we are all screwed.
McCain: Can I be the Defense Secretary? Back in my day they called it the War Secretary, can we change my title?
Banks: You guys owe me 2 trillion more before I give you a dime.
The consumer: Huh?
Well if there isn't going to be enough help I'm not buying anything except ammo & wine
jo6pac
The race to the bottom continues.
Anonymous wrote:
Sorry kids. No lead paint and melamine (1,3,5-Triazine-2,4,6-triamine) for you this year.
What dad! No Melamine this year? All the other kids got melamine...what will they say at school. I'll just die..fur sure...fur..sure.
Things that are truer than God:
PRESIDENT Obama
RETEST THE LOWS
DEEP recessio
"The average store at a mall breaks even or loses money even up until the winter holiday sales. They might take in 80% of the year's revenue in 2-3 months."
Heard a retail consultant on the radio who said the USA has about 60 Billion sf of retail space, can use only about 20 Billion, so do the numbers on profitability. The RE bubble spawned ZILLIONS of franchise storefronts and strip malls, not to mention the big stuff. Look out below...
It astounds me how few understand US retail square footage:
http://jameshowardkunstler.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2007/06/25/mags_diary21_retail_graph_2.jpg
Malls are/were a temporary aberration of the true American Milieu.
Just type 'mv * /dev/null'.
Nostrovia,
US retail square footage
Americans need wider aisles...
@Rob Dawg
What else were they supposed to build with all of that free money? Infrastructure? Affordable housing? Schools?
Come on now, we buy therefore we are.
Gone Fishin' writes:
@Rob Dawg
What else were they supposed to build with all of that free money? Infrastructure? Affordable housing? Schools?
Good point. Right now "free money" is backfilling "dead money." Until that clears up (fills up?) there is no investment.
I'd like to dedicate this song to Paulson and Bernanke:
Last Train to Clarksville 3 - Monkees
YouTube -
Things that are truer than God:
PRESIDENT Obama
RETEST THE LOWS
DEEP recession
godhatesfangs | 10.14.08 - 5:39 pm | #
Not hard to be truer than god, especially the one you apparently prey to.
Not hard to be truer than god, especially the one you apparently prey to.
You probably meant "pray", but prey often works too.
Things that are truer than God:
PRESIDENT Obama
RETEST THE LOWS
DEEP recession
I'm certain you wanted to add:
and with
PRESIDENT McCain
RETEST THE LOWS
DEEP recession
LONG WARS
I think the preference is quite obvious, don't you think?
PRESIDENT Obama
ACORN Tree
RETEST THE LOWS
DEEP recessio
You probably meant "pray", but prey often works too.
JP | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 5:58 pm | #
With a moniker like that, is there a difference?
Not sure if this was posted already but Bill Moyers interviewed George Soros regarding the meltdown:
Bill Moyers Journal . Watch & Listen | PBS
Watching it now...
Switched over to US Bank after reading about how many good decisions they made in staying out of the sub prime/derivatives market.
Why aren't they being included in the "Healthy banks getting money category?".
Are they in a good position going forward or have they been targeted for assimilation? Anyone?
Amazing, Bush Administration will likely preside over an eight year job contraction. Time for more corporate tax breaks. Or maybe we should allow the UBER wealthy to offset ordinary income taxes with recent capital losses. That should placate the angry masses.
I've had US bank for about fifteen years. I'm paranoid about changing to any other bank after the problems I've had with BofA, etc.
AIG's toes,
ACORN Tree
The sound of howling desperation ...
Best car-sticker of the year:
[expensive black euro sedan]
Sticker: "I am NOT a Republican".
ya, portland's not very GOP friendly. (86% for Kerry 2004)
I wouldn't want to be a mid-scale retailer this holiday season (think Macy's). People are really pulling in their spending horns. Restaurants will suffer bigtime too - except 'family priced' places that are not chains.
BofA is one of the harshest banks for small clients and employees to deal with.
The sound of howling desperation ...
RE | Homepage | 10.14.08 - 6:06 pm | #
"WE are the ones, WE have been waiting for"
-BHO
Gone Fishin'
It looks like neither well behaved banks, nor well behaved citizens (renters and low LTV borrowers) will benefit.
One thing giving me hope is the possibility that this $trillion dollar crash delay was conceived to give the over 55 crowd fair warning before the bottom drops out. DJI -30% off all time high is not a great time to get out, but the well behaved have margin for error.
On the one hand we don't get the cookies. On the other hand, we're not fat guys with stomache aches.
Thank goodness old people vote. Shame about the choices they have.
Denninger rant, includes a picture of a pair of forlon bankers leaving the meeting at the treasury
America Has Died - To Thunderous Applause - The Market Ticker
Barry O'bama has always seemed like the Tiger Woods of politics. I would've preferred Ron Paul but what are you gonna do.
Do you have a Plan B for your life?
We are building a community. A solution for peak oil, the unfolding financial and economic crisis, climate change and the pursuit of authentic happiness.
Our web site:
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P:S: please forward this message to your family and friends
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Sarah's Smash Shack - relieve tension by smashing dishes.
Now if only somebody would start up "Punch-A-Politican" and "Beat-A-Broker"
When the retail jobs are gone, what does that leave?
Why, the democratizing biz, soldier.
Man Dirk was on the radio again.
Nostrovia,
This Soros interview is very candid, he slams Paulson pretty hard.
The over 55 crowd has the triple whammy hitting them.
Loss of house value.
Loss of 401k value.
Death of SS and medicaid.
Let's add the disintegrating employment market. They do have seniority and higher wage scales/benefits. They are also realizing they will need to work till they die.
I took part in the street corner protests against the bailout package. I was the only person out of 50 people under 40 with both my kids. They get the consequences but will they take to the streets in large numbers to protest. I hope so.
Builder Bob writes:
This Soros interview is very candid, he slams Paulson pretty hard.
A Moyer interview with Soros slamming Reps. Stop the presses! The sun rises in the east!
Relocate,
Good luck with that utopian thing. There's doubtless plenty of empty housing to squat in if things don't work out like you all expect.
I've figured it out (borrowing from Dirk van Dijk's post in the last thread). We used to raise interest rates to stop inflation, even if it meant a recession. Now we lower interest rates to stop a recession, even if it means hyperinflation!
Compare - Reagan Era: "Volker who broke the back of inflation, although that effort was a very big part of the reason for the 81-82 recession." (DvD)
versus - Bush Era: Greenspan and Bernanke, who broke the back of the recessions, although that effort was a very big part of the reason for the 2009-2012 hyperinflation... ??
NPR interviewed some guys last week who were money brokers between banks. I don't know exactly what they were called. Anyway there was absolutely no business.
NPR asked again today: was the bailout working? credit unfreezing? banks loaning to each other.
Nope. Absolutely no business, and nobody else they knew has any either.
Only 1 day of course, but still. . .
lawyerliz - can you keep us posted on how that progresses? It jives with the story in the FT that so far, interbank lending aint unfreezin.
All I know is what I read here, and hear on NPR. Will be happy to post if I hear.
Gone Fishin' writes:
Let's add the disintegrating employment market. They [over 55ers] are also realizing they will need to work till they die.
I think this is going to be a huge story. Here's hoping somebody writes it and follows it, and it makes the mainstream. The perceived betrayal of such a large, mainly educated, played-by-the-rules class of people is tremendous force out there. Talk about 'tickling the dragon's tail" !!
The banks are waiting for cold hard cash before they release any funds.
They have absolutely no reason not to loan with full guarantees of interbank lending. The banks will not blink first and they can wait until the governments buy up the bad assets.
Also the possibility they know something we don't?
I'd like to dedicate this song to Paulson and Bernanke:
YouTube - Sex Pistols-Im Not Your Stepping Stone
Mellon is really trying to get over the money laundering thing. When I opened my escrow account, the branch manager actually came over and visted my office, I guess to see if I had a real business. 'Course, it's just across the street, but still. I felt like I was proposing marriage to them, not just opening an account.
Gone fishin
The 55+ crowd working til they die is just the final insult to those of us in our mid to late 40s who have been rooting and grubbing for boomer scraps our whole lives. They need to retire.
Jerks.
"BofA is one of the harshest banks for small clients and employees to deal with."
Oh, baby. There probably isn't any other bank that mistreats the retail customer like BofA does. Even US Bank is better, and they are pretty bad.
I deal with Union, Citi, Wamu, and US Bank, and I have almost moved the accounts out of US bank more than once when they refused to cash a good check.
People over 55 vote in greater numbers than any other age group. Why do you think the AARP has so much clout?
I think Conjure would argue there's no interbank lending because the high quality prescription grade shit is 1/2 off at the Fed.
Next question is when non-financials get access.
Oh, baby. There probably isn't any other bank that mistreats the retail customer like BofA does. Even US Bank is better, and they are pretty bad.
And just try to get your earned bonus if you're an employee
Wait a goldurnminnit. This 62 1//2 year old resents being called a jerk.
So if we work til we drop we're bad, cause we didn't get out of the way for the next generation, and if we retire we are bad because we are sucking valuable resources and not contributing.
Bah.
Tanta is almost certainly a boomer, is she a jerk automatically.
Wells Fargo was so bad in my town BoA is like a breath of fresh air.
Seriously, I had a Wells Fargo customer service rep actually berate me on the phone for over a screw up that was THEIR fault. That lady chewed my ass big time. I closed every single account at Wells Fargo immediately, with no explanation, and I have hung up on them when they followed up with phone calls for customer surveys.
In 35 years of banking, I've never been treated so poorly, not by a long shot. Wish they would fail.
Wachovia, now, they just stole from. Glad they went bust, such as it were.
Yes!
Jerks!
Bah!
Bitter bitter bitter.
@chill bear
Talked to my grandmother over the weekend, she's 72 and working 40 hours a week.
We talked about the economy and I asked her if she was retiring soon. Her reply was she couldn't afford too. This is a woman living in a double wide mobile home driving a 15 year old car and a perfect credit score. Makes $40,000 a year. She told me she was tired of having to get up every morning. Broke my heart.
Where is her money going you ask? Chronic health problems, expensive medication and a less than adequate health plan. She's living the dream...
Gone fishin:
It stinks. It just stinks all the way around.
I have decided that "little people" are "Austrian" economists, because they don't have the luxury of being any other type.
I note Chillbear didn't answer my comments and merely called all us boomers jerks.
hey, I want to be called something exotically insulting. Surely your scatological vocabulary is larger than that?
Libor finally falling:
Accrued Interest: Fading fast
One should consider what I have said about trading against the government.
Now that GS is essentially powered up fully with money, this is the wrong time to be going against the new policy.
Everybody refuses to accept the imposed change in trend. I guess the new masters will have to make the seal learn how to bark on command.
Somday this war's gonna end...
Chill Bear, believe me the 55+ crowd would dearly love to retire but that's beginning to look like a fantasy.
Would you retire if you couldn't support yourself on your savings??? Well neither will anybody else, be they 35, 45, 55, or 75.
There is only the flimsiest of safety nets in this country and to depend on it for your survival as opposed to continue working at some lame-ass, underpaid job (if you're lucky enough to find one) is just not a good choice.
Get over yourself and start realizing what the real problem is.
ew thread in the weave...
"Talked to my grandmother over the weekend, she's 72 and working 40 hours a week.
We talked about the economy and I asked her if she was retiring soon. Her reply was she couldn't afford too. This is a woman living in a double wide mobile home driving a 15 year old car and a perfect credit score. Makes $40,000 a year. She told me she was tired of having to get up every morning. Broke my heart.
Where is her money going you ask? Chronic health problems, expensive medication and a less than adequate health plan. She's living the dream..."
Sure, and let's blame belief in God, in whom some of you don't believe, or God in case you do believe in Him, or the boomers, or any other scapegoat you can think of.
If only the world were ruled by atheists, you may think, because atheists are not encumbered with primitive ideas, like God-given human dignity and a transcendent source of self-giving love and morality.
I've seen the results of that secular faith in two different societies. It would take a hundred years to find and exhume all the bodies.
Liz, Dufus:
I'm 47, technically a boomer myself...
The essence of boomerism... not getting over oneself?
Exotically insulting... hrm... "Your family, descended from fire starting shoe salesmen, and none of whom resemble each other, should have the fortune of actually living through such interesting times."
Howz that?
One parting shot, my retirement plan:
I'm saving half my take home and putting 10% net in Au coin.
How did Soviet Union employ older people? Babushkas sweeping the street in -40 weather?
Compare - Reagan Era: "Volker who broke the back of inflation, although that effort was a very big part of the reason for the 81-82 recession." (DvD)
versus - Bush Era: Greenspan and Bernanke, who broke the back of the recessions, although that effort was a very big part of the reason for the 2009-2012 hyperinflation... ??
Wisdom Seeker | 10.14.08 - 6:21 pm | #
I think you may have it right there WS, although most likely the 2010-14 hyperinflation. Longer to arrive and harder to break.
lawyerliz - can you keep us posted on how that progresses? It jives with the story in the FT that so far, interbank lending aint unfreezin.
Proletariat Geoff | 10.14.08 - 6:24 pm | #
Also consistant with a TED spread of over 4.0%
Babushka Adoption Foundation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Babushka Adoption Foundation is a charitable non-governmental organization based in Bishkek, the capital city of Kyrgyzstan. It was founded in 1999 by Markus Muller; the director, based in Bishkek, is Xenia Kirsanova.
The main goal of the foundation is to provide support of elderly who do not have any family members that can provide support for them in Kyrgyzstan. The term "babushka" is Russian for "grandmother" or "old lady."
The objective of Babushka Adoption is not to replace Kyrgyz social institutions, but to work hand in hand with them to help Kyrgyz pensioners in difficult times.
A sponsor can adopt an elderly person for ten U.S. dollars a month; this amount will provide clothing, food, medical care and other important necessities.
Pavel,
I prefer atheists over religious fanatics any day.
"How did Soviet Union employ older people? Babushkas sweeping the street in -40 weather?"
There was real poverty among low wage earners, and yes, elderly women held these jobs.
AIG:
We will need to do this here in USA soon.
Sucks. We'll be having to pay huge taxes as well.
Where are the panzers at the moment?
No currency has ever survived hyperinflation. Nor has the next currency they print to replace the original.
Pavel, Missed the link between my grandmothers story and religion. Dumb it down for me, please.
The wealthy elite don't have a religion? Worshiping money is a religion. Very lucrative as well.
ammo beans rice in that order
Booze bullets bullion and beans
"I prefer atheists over religious fanatics any day."
I look at individual people as they are. All are precious, no matter what they do or don't believe.
potable water, bullets, rice, beans and lotsa tobasco
Lawyerliz writes:
All I know is what I read here, and hear on NPR. Will be happy to post if I hear."
NPR "PLANET MONEY"
Planet Money Blog : NPR
"Then suggested that McCain may propose a "flat tax" program as an alternative since he thinks that would be a good idea."
Poor McCain, he has no real plan, so he just keeps throwing things out, hoping something will stick.
Where are the panzers at the moment?
Chill Bear | 10.14.08 - 6:51 pm | #
UK has not accepted the Deltmark, so Delt forces are digging through the barricades placed by British forces in the chunnel, will be launching an EMP raid tonight over London,
and are working on a secret Naval weapon. The Deltfuhrer plans a speech sometime this week.
France is now a permanent part of Greater Deltland.
"Pavel, Missed the link between my grandmothers story and religion. Dumb it down for me, please."
Sorry, Fishin'. I was reacting to some other comments, and your grandmother's story set the reaction off.
My own grandmother started field work when she was six, and she worked until she was old.
Thanks Pavel. Not sure where this all ends. Trajedy?
I look at individual people as they are. All are precious, no matter what they do or don't believe.
I agree with that but that also presupposes that they leave ideology and belief to the individual and let them develop their own systems.
The desire to spread a particular of religion has caused some of the worst suffering in history.
The desire to spread a particular of religion has caused some of the worst suffering in history.
RE
... and I wonder why people seem so "scared" of atheists, it is not like they killed so many people during the "Great Atheist Wars" in the past
"... and I wonder why people seem so "scared" of atheists, it is not like they killed so many people during the "Great Atheist Wars" in the past"
WWII. 60 million minimum.
"Tanta is almost certainly a boomer, is she a jerk automatically.
Lawyerliz"
I'm 56 Liz, a boomer babe too. Ya know women live alot longer than men so we'll keep our management positions and professional positions well after those 40-something boys are toes up;)
WWII. 60 million minimum.
Pavel Chichikov
I would not say that WWII had much to do with religion (really)
WWII. 60 million minimum.
Give me a break! Hitler was anything BUT an atheist. He mentioned many times that he believed in god.
Just spreading BS.
The desire to spread state-sponsered religion has caused some of the worst suffering in history.
I fixed your post for you.
In Islam, it seems polygamy drives conversion of infidel women, and the killing, enslavement or conversion of infidel men.
Give me a break! Hitler was anything BUT an atheist. He mentioned many times that he believed in Providence.
I fixed another one of your posts for you.
I fixed your post for you
I'll fix it to my liking but thanks...
The desire to spread organized religion has caused some of the worst suffering in history.
Give me a break! Hitler was anything BUT an atheist. He mentioned many times that he believed in god.
"Hitler expressed admiration for the Muslim military tradition. According to one confidant, Hitler stated in private, "The Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness..."[273]"
Adolf Hitler - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Joseph Goebbels notes in a diary entry in 1939: "The Führer is deeply religious, but deeply anti-Christian. He regards Christianity as a symptom of decay." Albert Speer reports a similar statement: You see, its been our misfortune to have the wrong religion. Why didnt we have the religion of the Japanese, who regard sacrifice for the Fatherland as the highest good?
Adolf Hitler's religious beliefs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Hitler expressed admiration for the Muslim military tradition. According to one confidant, Hitler stated in private, "The Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness..."
Heck, just read Shirer. Hitler planned to replace the Bible with Mein Kampf and the cross with the swastika in all German churches. Ask Bonhoeffer how much of a "Christian" Hitler was.
Hitler was not a friend of communists, mostly atheists
"Just type 'mv * /dev/null'. "
Misean-
root@federalreserve.gov:/# mv * /dev/null
mv: target `/dev/null' is not a directory
We are powerless against the system!
The desire to spread organized religion has caused some of the worst suffering in history.
I don't understand how "organized" religion can cause suffering unless it has the power of the state behind it. The state maintains a monopoly on force within a given geographic region. Can you explain how religion has caused such great suffering without the power of the state behind it?
Crusades? Nope.
Inquisition? Nope.
These are the two that usually pop to mind when people make the claim you are trying to make. The founding fathers understood this which is why they mandated a separation of church from state.
"[Hitler] viewed traditional Christianity as a corruption of the original ideas of Jesus, whom Hitler regarded as an Aryan opponent of the Jews."
Hitler appeared to take any idea and find how it could fit into his scheme. There is also "German paganism". See: "The Occult Roots of Nazism: Secret Aryan Cults and Their Influence on Nazi Ideology : The Ariosophists of Austria and Germany, 1890-1935."
Clearly, he cast about for anything and everything that would gravitate and compel human beings in his direction, while fashioning himself as a Messiah for his cause.
The founding fathers understood this which is why they mandated a separation of church from state.
They tried to separate the economy from the state too but we're abandoning that.
I would not say that WWII had much to do with religion (really)
WWII was just the completion of WWI which had a heck of a lot to do with religion.
Clearly, he cast about for anything and everything that would gravitate and compel human beings in his direction, while fashioning himself as a Messiah for his cause"
My view too. I don't call fascism a religion.
"I would not say that WWII had much to do with religion (really)"
I meant something like that.
As for Hitler, he probably believed in Hitler, period.
When Nazi functionaries tried to substitute Hitler's picture for the crucifix in school rooms, Bavarians said:
'Lieber Wilhelm von Gottes Gnaden, als den Depp von Berchtesgaden. ...
"WWII was just the completion of WWI which had a heck of a lot to do with religion."
It had a heck of a lot to do with the struggle for markets.
"[Hitler] viewed traditional Christianity as a corruption of the original ideas of Jesus, whom Hitler regarded as an Aryan opponent of the Jews."
IMO that's a lot of kvatsch. Hitler didn't give a **** *** about Jesus, except maybe as a competitor.
"Hitler planned to replace the Bible with Mein Kampf and the cross with the swastika in all German churches. Ask Bonhoeffer how much of a "Christian" Hitler was."
Hitler planned to crush the churches after 'victory', though while the war was on he couldn't afford to alienate believers.
"Clearly, he cast about for anything and everything that would gravitate and compel human beings in his direction, while fashioning himself as a Messiah for his cause." AIG's toes | 7:24 pm
Poor McCain, he has no real plan, so he just keeps throwing things out, hoping something will stick.
Whereismyretirement | 6:54 pm
Hmmmmm. An emerging meme with a 30 minute periodicity ???
"Joseph Goebbels notes in a diary entry in 1939: "The Führer is deeply religious,"
For God's sake, Goebbels was a professional liar, who also happened to be a deluded fantasist.
I apologize for going off the deep end here. It sets me off, though, when people say things like: "The economy is gong to hell, and oh yeah, what about the Inquisition?"
"The 55+ crowd working til they die is just the final insult to those of us in our mid to late 40s who have been rooting and grubbing for boomer scraps our whole lives. They need to retire."
If you've been "rooting and grubbing for scraps" for several decades, then you should thank every boomer you meet. You've been well trained to survive the next decade.
Fried,
Just think how a 52 year old feels being stuck between y'all and your stupid generational generalizations.
Damn you CR! I never finished Hamlet. Now you spoiled the ending.
Fried, no offense intended.
I don't mind if the Boomers keep working but can they fucking shut up about the Beatles already? Thank you.
Last quote on the subject of Hitler and God:
From Mein Kampf (p 70.):
"Die ewige Natur rächt unerbittlich die Übertretung ihrer Gebote. So glaube ich heute im Sinne des allmächtigen Schöpfers zu handeln: Indem ich mich des Juden erwehre, kämpfe ich für das Werk des Herrn"
Cannot get much clearer than that.
Forget Hitler.
Joseph Stalin - more than 40 million dead
Mao Zedong - more than 80 million dead
Both bonafide atheists.
Mortgage meltdown to hit credit card users - The Red Tape Chronicles - msnbc.com
Ahhh, the hits keep coming.
Forget Hitler.
No, don't forget Hitler. If you can translate the piece from mein Kampf I posted above then you see that he justified his actions based ON religion!
We're all Hamlets now.
I would never sublet to a ham!
Oh my god.
This thread has become All Hitler, All the Time. It's like the bloody History Channel!
Hitler is dead. Mel Brooks spoofed him to a quadruple death. Hogan's Heroes squeezed in there a bit, too. Yes, he (Hitler) killed a bunch of my relatives. Yes, the history of the NAZI regime and WWII and the Holocaust needs to be taught in the schools.
But WTF does any of this have to do with the TED spread or the financial crisis or the state of the political economy?
I push the boundaries of the threads sometimes myself. I don't think there should be thread police. But, with all due respect, sheesh, enough with the Hitler stuff already.
Just think how a 52 year old feels being stuck between y'all and your stupid generational generalizations.
Rat Fink
Who's y'all? The guy's in his late 40s and sees himself as having spent his life "rooting and grubbing". If that's his resume, he should be comfortable in a depression.
Do you have a Plan B for your life?
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