Dodd and Schumer represent states with a large population working in financial services. I'm sure that they're pandering to the masses who vote more than the executives who fund their campaigns.
Without looking, I'd bet Texas Senators are opposed to spending for public transportation because of the oil industry employment in their state.
Prostitutes.
P.S. If you are wondering why there was funny action in the Russell 2000 today, maybe it's because the index is being reconstituted at market close tomorrow.
We believe you Mr. Kohn "For the moment, higher headline rates of inflation have shown only a few tentative signs of embedding themselves in core inflation or in longer-term inflation expectations."
Ross writes:
Schumer is dumber than a sack of hair.
Sure, but a sack of hair that knows how to get good press!
I despise Bush as much as the next guy, but people like Schumer and Dodd ought to give pause to anyone wishing for a one-party state. And today Obama was calling for more tax rebates... I believe he honestly said we need to make the rebates permanent. Anyone expecting the country to exit the land of make-believe after the electionj may want to think again. It's just a new and improved fantasy.
I said it before--if I had children, I'd think seriously about emigrating.
Schumer and his ilk are so powerful they probably have 'heroine fights' and hunt people like in The Most Dangerous Game...except without the heroine fights.
The U.S. Senate on Thursday approved $161.8 billion in new funds to continue fighting the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan for the next year, without timetables for withdrawing combat troops.
The Senate on Thursday approved legislation expanding benefits for the long-term unemployed who are struggling in an ailing economy, clearing the way for President George W. Bush to sign it into law.
Barclays warns of a financial storm as Federal Reserve's credibility crumbles
Last Updated: 12:30am BST 27/06/2008
US central bank accused of unleashing an inflation shock that will rock financial markets, reports Ambrose Evans-Pritchard
Barclays Capital has advised clients to batten down the hatches for a worldwide financial storm, warning that the US Federal Reserve has allowed the inflation genie out of the bottle and let its credibility fall "below zero".
"We're in a nasty environment," said Tim Bond, the bank's chief equity strategist. "There is an inflation shock underway. This is going to be very negative for financial assets. We are going into tortoise mood and are retreating into our shell. Investors will do well if they can preserve their wealth."
Barclays Capital said in its closely-watched Global Outlook that US headline inflation would hit 5.5pc by August and the Fed will have to raise interest rates six times by the end of next year to prevent a wage-spiral. If it hesitates, the bond markets will take matters into their own hands. "This is the first test for central banks in 30 years and they have fluffed it. They have zero credibility, and the Fed is negative if that's possible. It has lost all credibility," said Mr Bond.
"concerned that IndyMac's financial deterioration poses significant risks to both taxpayers"
Why Chucky? Oh because asshats like you created the FDIC? And the FRB's? Ah. Taxpayers wouldn't have that problem without that shit. Just idiots who had funds deposited there. Check.
"the regulatory community may not be prepared to take measures that would help prevent the collapse of IndyMac or minimize the damage should such a failure occur.""
Because you asshats let the "regulatory community" get pwned by the banks et. al., did nothing to correct it, and voted to allow capital requirements to fall into the toilet. Now that "community doesn't have the capital to absorb this (known to anyone with half a brain) event.
Nice job Chucky. You need to be part of the perp walk. Asshat!
The problem with emigrating with children is maps. The children don't have maps, so moving to a foreign country would be confusing and cruel. Instead of emigrating, though, you can always undergrate. Dig a really big hole and start a life inside earth's crust. This has many advantages including no sunburns, interesting new creatures, and, it is likely where all the Leprechans stash is hidden. Happy and rich, now that is a life.
Misean, My authority is none other than Ms. South Carolina Jr. I trust her over your "Google Maps" propaganda. Next thing you'll try to tell me is George Bush isn't the best president in the history of totally awesomely cool presidents. I smell something stinky and it isn't Ms. South Carolina, Jr., Mr. "Five Day Old Fish" Misean.
"...However, the Opec president said that he did not agree with predictions from Goldman Sachs, an investment bank, that the oil price could rise to $200 a barrel. He said that this was only likely if there was a major market crisis such as a halt in oil production in Iran. In that case, he added, prices could possibly surge to "200, 300, 400 dollars".
Bartman writes:
I would be shocked if there weren't a few big "Dominos Pizza Nights" in several locales by the FDIC over the weekend.
Bartman | 06.26.08 - 10:23 pm | #
Not bad considering the DJI fell 3% today. Lately, the N225 has consistently followed the US markets down the day after, even on Monday if the US markets have a bad Friday. I'm the farthest thing from a market sage, but the N225 behavior has been amazingly predictable over the past year.
Huh. The most agenda-setting newspaper in the USA doesn't even have today's financial meltdown as a top story. Couldn't possibly be that complacency thing I've been reiterating.
"Glad I maxed out my Heloc from them already and am sitting on the cash."
Careful, that cash is perishable and, like a loaf of bread, it is only good for a few more years. Although, I heard moldy bread can send you on a hell of a trip, so "good" is a matter of opinion.
"People just have to get off their fat asses. Obviously they can't be TOO pissed yet.
Representative republics can be turned upside down too..."
Goddamit I hope so. As a tech guy I wanted that in the 2000 bubble. Maybe this time.
The sillyness just messes with my mind. Dumborats elected to take Congang and NOTHING done. Everything Shrubboy wanted he got, in spades. Unbelievable. Maybe homelessness and hunger does the trick. We'll see.
What we have is fiat. It is a unit of exchange and a medium of account. It is not a store of value. So it is not money. But it is mandated. It is also counterfeited by the FRB's, as it costs them nothing to create more. That is wwhy it fails the money test. It is not a store of value.
1+1 can only =3 for just so long. The days of spending our way to prosperity while working bubble economy service jobs (retail & starbucks baristas), are officially over starting today. Tough tough road ahead.
Unlike last Friday's OPEX delta-hedge meltdown, tomorrow has economic data of not inconsiderable import. Personal spending/Personal income are likely to come in higher/lower than expected, respectively. This reflects the inflationary/deflationary environment of the moment. In response I'd expect equities to catch their breath by rising then falling then rising then falling and closing basically where it closed today.
barely writes:
1+1 can only =3 for just so long. The days of spending our way to prosperity while working bubble economy service jobs (retail & starbucks baristas), are officially over starting today. Tough tough road ahead.
barely | 06.26.08 - 11:19 pm | #
Starting today? I'll believe it when I see it. We had a measly 3% drop in the Dow & 'talk' of credit crunch - that's not a complete remake of society - not yet anyway.
The republic has been dead since they let women vote. Maybe before.
Nothing more than the road to serfdom and Spenglarian winter. I know it is popular to immigrate to some far off land but be careful. The Slavic north, Russia, has the only structure to be the 'next' civilization. One needs a new religion which allows for a new mathmatic.
The Mock and I know how hard the Ruskies are working on cold fusion. Love my tin hat palladium. It is a mania with them. Squirrly
ideas sometime come true.
Buy a hobby farm. I'm living proof that it can positive cash flow.
PPT Fact or Fiction?........YES:Has done something at least a few times and maybe a lot more times than we could imagine.................NO:Maybe something was done once or twice,but that"s it.Free running market....................Put Yes or No at start of your comment........Yes for me!
BTW, PPT was supersized by the Patriot Act. Once again, nobody here wants to acknowledge the Patriot Act as a financial defense weapon, but it is. And it manipulates the markets to an extraordinary level. And, we will be stuck with the reprecussions.
Ah early Hayek. True favorite of mine. Got me into Austrian economics I'm afraid. To the chagrin of the mathmetists who thought I would be their latest wunderkind.
Another problem for Mr. Dollar is that it will be several months before his actions take effect. Officials with the International Monetary Fund (IMF) have informed Bernanke about a plan that would have been unheard-of in the past: a general examination of the US financial system. The IMF's board of directors has ruled that a so-called Financial Sector Assessment Program (FSAP) is to be carried out in the United States. It is nothing less than an X-ray of the entire US financial system.
As part of the assessment, the Fed, the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), the major investment banks, mortgage banks and hedge funds will be asked to hand over confidential documents to the IMF team. They will be required to answer the questions they are asked during interviews. Their databases will be subjected to so-called stress tests -- worst-case scenarios designed to simulate the broader effects of failures of other major financial institutions or a continuing decline of the dollar.
@ Elvis,
Interesting idea about financial mandates as part of the terrorist act. Probably not a bad idea. Our financial system is so very fragile it would not suprise me.
Crude oil fell in New York, retreating from the record $140.39 a barrel reached yesterday, as the U.S. House of Representatives approved a bill aimed at curbing excessive energy-market speculation.
The bill, which passed 402-19, would require the Commodity Futures Trading Commission to consider using position limits, or constraints on the size of the stake each speculative investor can own, and raising margin requirements, the amount of money required to trade. The vote came after the record was set.
Buy a hobby farm. I'm living proof that it can positive cash flow.
They'll be cheaper than 'dirt' - forgive the pun - around here come the 'recession'. I'm already watching the RE rags... too pricey right now.
In the 80s when the snowmobile plants shut down you could buy 'hobby farms' for $100/acre in NW Minnesota. Even in S Minnesota/Iowa you could get them for $400/acre... really productive land too. Now in Iowa & S Minn that stuff goes for $4000 an acre or more for a large parcel... smallish acreages are outrageously priced.
If we see a real job-loss event like the 80s that will all change... then land will come down a lot... but not until.
Its funny Japan has been in a stink for 15+ years and they are net savers. Big time! I bet if we were net savers we'd have a 15+ year funk too... Save a few for the tech boom....
OK, I plead ignorance. How can the IMF compel US government insitutions to hand over confidential documents? Is it a clause in the founding documents? A priveledge accorded to members? Also, our government has a difficult enough time sneaking a peek into the books of US IBs. How is the IMF gonna get IB documents?
You are correct about raw land. Early but correct. You need the infrastructure to make it work. Outbuildings, areanas, stables, doublewides etc. Rentable goods plus a few acres for cash crops, gardens and hay meadows. Tractor Supply has built a good business off we dunderheads. Hey, but if you can afford it, it's fun. Put a paddle boat on the pond and bond with your grandkids.
Hiker90 total wild ass guess but maybe the IMF could prevent international business via strong arming other countries where the Gov cant stop US corps with out good reason...
hiker90 writes:
OK, I plead ignorance. How can the IMF compel US government insitutions to hand over confidential documents? Is it a clause in the founding documents? A priveledge accorded to members? Also, our government has a difficult enough time sneaking a peek into the books of US IBs. How is the IMF gonna get IB documents?
Jus' wondering.
hiker90 | 06.26.08 - 11:52 pm | #
The show up in black helicopters wearing blue helmets and just take whatever they want. Then go off to Area 51 to review... didn't you know that?
Seriously - I'd guess some of these IBs don't even know themselves. If the IMF can figure it all out they might ought to tell the IBs too.
Fed will have to raise interest rates six times by the end of next year to prevent a wage-spiral
I don't see it. What's supposed to cause this wage spiral? Just because gas is now $4.25/gallon doesn't mean you can just walk in and ask your boss for a raise and expect to get one. His costs are up and his margins are down - no room for a raise.
We got an email from our company CEO a few weeks back saying that there wouldn't be any raises for US employees this year - but there would be 6 to 8% raises for our Chinese and Indian employees.
You are correct about raw land. Early but correct. You need the infrastructure to make it work. Outbuildings, areanas, stables, doublewides etc. Rentable goods plus a few acres for cash crops, gardens and hay meadows. Tractor Supply has built a good business off we dunderheads. Hey, but if you can afford it, it's fun. Put a paddle boat on the pond and bond with your grandkids.
Ross | Homepage | 06.26.08 - 11:53 pm | #
I'd be a little more 'hard core' - I've lived in rural America most my life - I wouldn't need the infrastructure in place, I'd put it in & do it for shockingly little money, I know how to do that.
I'm mulling it over now - along with the wife. But it really means 'dropping out' and we are not yet there mentally. Closer every day though.
I spoke with a guy from MMC the other day who wanted my resume. MMC has a new shiny expensive contract with the FDIC to assist it with bank closing staffing. The only bank this guy mentioned to me was IndyMac. I was a little surprised that this was the bank he referenced in our conversation given how many out there are in terrible condition. Not to worry... G.H. Sheila Bair is on top of every little and big thing with her contracts and Congressional contacts. MMC Group ::: In the News
Previous thread Nova asked When the giants of the future show up ...
Nova, history teaches that us that very few times, positive leaders rise from these types of inflection points. Most of the time there is a drop in the population.
And btw: I'm only 5'4, so they might not all be giants
Hey Elvis,
You are just too funny, sometimes...
Glad to see you have not "left the building" and taken any of this stuff too seriously to not poke at it 'till it comes out humorous...
"The only bank this guy mentioned to me was IndyMac. I was a little surprised that this was the bank he referenced in our conversation given how many out there are in terrible condition. Not to worry... G.H. Sheila Bair is on top of every little and big thing with her contracts and Congressional contacts."
Sheila's playing her book then? Wouldn't suprise me.
All things considered, its a pretty nice way of life, if you don't mind eating goat (which you won't when you've been eating carrots for a few years). It also helps when your shorts are kicking ass.
Does anyone know if it possible to find and buy your own mortgage?
If you can afford to buy it, then you are not likely one of the riskier assets in their portfolio. Why would they want to sell any good ones that keep the toxic stuff masked?
Once again, nobody here wants to acknowledge the Patriot Act as a financial defense weapon, but it is. And it manipulates the markets to an extraordinary level.
"if you don't mind eating goat (which you won't when you've been eating carrots for a few years)"
My brother-in-law raised goats, the meat tasted very good but heck, was it greasy! There was about 1/4 inch thick grease on all the knives and utensils. Must mention here he has wound up with heart problems.
Don't go native just yet. My hobby farm is an investment as in 'Hobby'. You are much too wise to drop out.
We all must live in the times we are in. You seem pretty good at adjusting and adapting. I too cook and miser the markets. My dad was a great teacher. He learned from his mom. OK, I'm a hand me down skinflint but but I have fun gaming the 'system'. I know you do also.
Dryfly, since you're talking about hobby farms, I'll ask your advice. I've searched for a farm with at least 5 acres that's pretty remote, in case things get scary here in suburbia with my kids. On the net I've found a little 8 acre hobby farm in the Ozarks, mostly open, with mature fruit trees, henhouse, fenced and barbed pastures, small barn, small house with a fireplace, established perennial food garden, etc. Very remote. It's $80K, though. I look at the pictures sometimes just to reassure myself it's still for sale (over a year now).
Folks tell me that's way too high. I'm guessing you would agree? TIA.
Misean,
I know the old saying just joking. I hope like hell nobody is walking under tall buildings in NYC lately. I would hate to hear Jaime Diamond say as god is my witness I thought pigs could fly
Testifying to the House Energy and Commerce Committee, Michael Masters of Masters Capital Management said that the price of oil would quickly drop closer to its marginal cost of around $65 to $75 a barrel, about half the current $135.
Gads, Schumer and the lobbies are putting on a great show for the shorts, this is better than Hollywood scripting! Oil could be $1.99 if Congress would act...ROTFLMAO LOL hahahahahaaahahahawahaaawwwwehahaha
Someone with a camera ought to get over to an Indymac branch tomorrow with a camera in hand to get a shot of the Northern Rock-esque line wrapping around the block to yank money out.
Citigroup Inc\t$80,800
UBS Americas\t$74,250
Paul, Weiss et al\t$67,000
Kasowitz, Benson et al\t$64,250
Metropolitan Life\t$59,000
Goldman Sachs\t$58,040
Morgan Stanley\t$57,000
Guardsmark Inc\t$54,000
Lehman Brothers\t$53,750
Merrill Lynch\t$50,250
JPMorgan Chase & Co\t$47,800
2006:
Goldman Sachs\t$182,590
JP Morgan Chase & Co\t$129,800
Merrill Lynch\t$127,000
Bear Stearns\t$126,400
Citigroup Inc\t$111,550
Morgan Stanley\t$109,500
UBS Americas\t$103,000
Ernst & Young\t$101,800
Kasowitz, Benson et al\t$100,250
I guess he doesn't mind some of the larger banks swallowing up the smaller banks? Seeing as how its the larger banks that supported him... we need a teaparty...
It is. You can do way better than that. Dryfly might differ with me, but find an area you're interested in and subscribe to the local paper or, if you're in a hurry, contact a local real estate agent.
We may have the first Domino of the GDII--Domino's pizza et al-tipped off by Schumer's dealings, like the rumours of what the New York bank of the United States was, to today's IndyMac.
We may have the first Domino of the GDII--Domino's pizza et al-tipped off by Schumer's dealings, like the rumours of what the New York bank of the United States was, to today's IndyMac.
Really? Do you think anyone is paying close enough attention? I doubt it... maybe a handful of longer lines... but a true bank run and lines around the block?
(Sorry, I'm pretty young and naive but I don't think the average person understands the context, and people who pay attention already took their money out of the bank...)
The probability of an alternation in a sequence of random binary events is .5, yet people seem to expect an alternation rate of about .7.[3] In fact, in a short number of trials, variability and non-random-looking "streaks" are quite probable.
Daniel Kahneman and Amos Tversky explained this kind of misprediction as being caused by the representativeness heuristic.[4] Gilovich argues that a similar effect occurs for other types of random dispersions, including 2-dimensional data such as seeing clusters in the locations of impact of V-1 flying bombs on London during World War II or seeing streaks in stock market price fluctuations over time.[5]
retreating from the record $140.39 a barrel reached yesterday, as the U.S. House of Representatives approved a bill aimed at curbing excessive energy-market speculation
my spidey sense tells me this will drive the price to $200.
Gilovich argues that a similar effect occurs for other types of random dispersions, including 2-dimensional data such as seeing clusters in the locations of impact of V-1 flying bombs on London during World War II
If this were truly random, why are they clustered in London and not spread out all over Great Britain?
For example, during World War II London was struck by German V-1 flying bombs and V-2 rockets. The locations at which they landed seemed to cluster in poorer parts of the city, and there was a widespread belief that these areas were being specifically targeted. After the war, the locations where the flying bombs fell were subjected to statistical analysis. It showed that they had fallen uniformly at random. The apparent clustering that people had perceived was just a coincidence. (For a discussion of this example, and of the general propensity for people to believe things that they should not, see Gilovich 1 .)This reaction to the bombing of London is just one instance of a more general phenomenon of human thinking: a sense of coincidence that, all too often it seems, leads us to false conclusions.
Perhaps most striking is the human ability to draw rich inductive inferences from very sparse data, where the conclusions seem so underdeter-mined from the evidence available that even our imperfect level of success is remarkable. Many ofthe deepest questions in cognitive science take this form.
One of these experiments was based on the bombing of London, asking people to judge how big a coincidence it would be for a particular configuration of rocket locations to arise by chance.
We compared these judgements with the log-likelihood ratio produced by comparing a hypothesis in which some of the bombs fell around a common target (a mixture of a uniform and a Gaussian distribution, integrating over all model parameters) with the hypothesis of a uniform distribution (see Figure 2). Our results indicate that, in fact, people are extremely good at evaluating the evidence that an event provides for the existence of an unexpected causal forcejudgements of the strength of coincidences correlate extremely well with the appropriate likelihood ratios. This suggests that the errors we makein reasoning about coincidences are not a consequence of seeing evidence where none exists (i.e. miscalculating the likelihood ratio), but rather are due to a failure to recognise just how much evidence is needed to accept an outlandish conclusion (i.e. miscalculating the prior odds)
The people of London were not at fault in recognising that the rockets exhibited some evidence of clustering, but this evidence was certainly not sufficient to justify the conclusion that poorer parts of the city were being targeted (or even to reject the null hypothesis in the statistical tests performed after the war). Predicting the future, inferring causal relationships and identifying coincidences are just three examples of how Bayesian statistics can shed light on human cognition.
Statistics and the Bayesian mind
Tom Griffiths and Joshua Tenenbaum
Will the stock mkt go up every year? Do you see a pattern?
Why Smart People Make Big Money Mistakes
and How to Correct Them
Authors:\t \tGary Belsky & Thomas Gilovich
Consider an experiment conducted several years ago by Drazen Prelec and Duncan Simester, marketing professors at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Cambridge, Massachusetts. The pair organized a real-life, sealed-bid auction for tickets to a Boston Celtics game (this was during the Larry Bird, Kevin McHale, Robert Parrish era, so the tickets were especially valuable). Half the participants in the auction were informed that whoever won the bidding would have to pay for the tickets in cash (although they had one day to come up with the funds). The other half were told that the winning bidder would have to pay by credit card. Prelec and Simester then averaged the bids of those who thought they would have to pay by cash and those who thought they would have to pay by credit card. Incredibly, the average credit card bid was roughly twice as large as the average cash bid. Simply because they were dealing with plastic with money that was devalued in some way the students became spendthrifts. Put another way, credit cards turn us into big spenders in more ways than one. We become poorer because we're more likely to spend, and more likely to spend poorly.
Will the stock mkt go up every year? Do you see a pattern?
No, Yes. I see that as the population increases there is more money printed as a necessary measure to keep the flow of goods moving. Long term the market will move up, it's unlikely to remain at any level permanently and there's much more room above this level than down to zero. I don't think I'll ever see a negative number for the stock market. But my personal definition of long term is greater than ten years. As far as discernible patterns short term, hah!
Why Smart People Make Big Money Mistakes
Again flawed (although I agree with the conclusion) They needed to have at least one other category of bidders, those with a line of credit other than a credit card. I've been through times in my life where I couldn't come up with the cash (even given a week) to buy a Celtics ticket. Although I probably would have bid with the idea of scalping the ticket, since I hate the Celtics, especially that era.
the U.S. House of Representatives approved a bill aimed at curbing excessive energy-market speculation"
There is no safe store of value. If there were, the government would have to make its holding illegal, as was done in the case of gold. If everyone decided, for example, to convert all his bank deposits to silver or copper or any other good, and thereafter declined to accept checks as payment for goods, bank deposits would lose their purchasing power and government-created bank credit would be worthless as a claim on goods. The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves.
This is the shabby secret of the welfare statists' tirades against gold. Deficit spending is simply a scheme for the confiscation of wealth. Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights. If one grasps this, one has no difficulty in understanding the statists' antagonism toward the gold standard.
GOLD AND ECONOMIC FREEDOM
by Alan Greenspan
This article originally appeared in a newsletter: The Objectivist published in 1966 and was reprinted in Ayn Rand's Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal
You may make some fantastic gains but that don't mean you gonna keep them at least in the US.
Is anyone else getting fed up with Krugman's insistence that speculation cannot be what's driving up oil? His reasons given for the increase strike me as bearing an eerie resemblance to "they're not making any more land, you know."
Perhaps it's the Mom & Pop gas stations across the country who can't compete with the big chains on volume or price, so they set their price at $.10 or $.15 more than the big chains. And sit and wait. With their big tanks full of gas underground. Waiting for the price to go up. Are they the elusive ones who are hoarding?
Sorry for the OT, Krugman's comments section sucks, so I'm spouting off here.
GMAFB. Mom & Pop gas store's profit comes entirely from the mini grocery concessionary items. Posting "GO AWAY" prices compared to the chains would kill their business dead.
You need to get your head around the fact that production has peaked, but is still insufficient to meet demand at the cheap-ass prices we had become used to ($20-$60).
A $100 barrel of oil can be cracked into 20 gallons of gasoline, at ~$5/each. The economic utility of $5 gas is such that we will not see significant demand destruction -- though it's getting close.
(The $7/gal that $140 oil implies does seem to me to cross the line towards actual demand destruction, however.)
I want to point out that sue and suecris are separate posters.
Troy, in your area don't the smaller stations charge more? They certainly do here, as I said, usually 10 to 15 cents more. You're correct that their income comes from the convenience store aspect, which usually flourishes, though few buy gas there.
U.S. stock futures edged off their lowest level on Friday as a subdued reading in May's core personal consumption expenditures, an inflation gauge closely watched by the Federal Reserve, tempered nervousness about record oil prices and the health of banks.
suecris writes:
Dryfly, since you're talking about hobby farms, I'll ask your advice. I've searched for a farm with at least 5 acres that's pretty remote, in case things get scary here in suburbia with my kids. On the net I've found a little 8 acre hobby farm in the Ozarks, mostly open, with mature fruit trees, henhouse, fenced and barbed pastures, small barn, small house with a fireplace, established perennial food garden, etc. Very remote. It's $80K, though. I look at the pictures sometimes just to reassure myself it's still for sale (over a year now).
Folks tell me that's way too high. I'm guessing you would agree? TIA.
suecris | 06.27.08 - 12:33 am | #
Sorry - missed it - went to bed.
$80K? Depends. 5 acres is real small - I mean postage stamp small if you really want it to 'carry you'. Land in the Ozarks isn't the best either - not like Iowa or Illinois. I doubt it produces a lot other than the fruit (fruit requires chemicals up the wazoo unless you plan to turn it into jam/jelly/cider).
Does land have buildings & such? Good water? Permeable for septic? Wood to cut for heat - 5 acres won't produce enough wood to sustain long term UNLESS that's all you grow.
There are a lot of things I'd have to know before I would venture an opinion.
$80K might be okay - might be way too much, hard to say.
If I was buying land in N Minnesota & it wasn't on a lake - I wouldn't pay more than $20k for similar UNLESS the buildings made it worth more. Personally I'd want at least 100 acres.
I expect I could find a lot of property up there that was bigger, better, and less than $80K.
My guess is the Ozarks are no different IF far enough from Brantson or hard to get to from WalMart HQ, KC or St L. Spend more time & look hard before committing. Due diligence - YMMV.
Floor Statement Sen. Charles E. Schumer S 900 Conference Report
Thank you, Mr. President. And I first want to thank Chairman Gramm and Senator Sarbanes, Chairman Leach, Representative LaFalce, and all of my colleagues who worked so long and hard on this legislation. Particular thanks to Senators Dodd and Edwards, who worked with us in the late-night hours to come up with a compromise that eventually helped get this bill passed. Mr. President, this is a historic moment. We've been working towards it for 18 years.
It's taken 18 years for Congress to pass this bill. When I first came to Congress, the issue was a narrow one -- revenue bonds. Could banks underwrite revenue bonds? And with technological change, with globalization, the issue has expanded far beyond revenue bonds to an issue where the future of America's dominance as the financial center of the world is at stake.
This bill is vital for the future of our country. If we didn't pass this bill, we could find London or Frankfurt or years down the road Shanghai becoming the financial capital of the world. That has grave implications for all of America, where financial services are one of the areas where jobs are growing the most quickly, where our technology is way ahead of everyone else, where our capital dominates the world. And it would be a shame if because Congress has been unable to act that all those advantages were frittered away as they well could be in a global world by our failure to realize the problems that our existing antiquated laws cause us.
So there are many reasons for this bill, but first and foremost is to ensure that U.S. financial firms remain competitive. Like their international competitors now, U.S. firms will be able to offer financial services to complement their business models. Had we not done this, three years from now with new technology, we could find major U.S. companies leaving the United States and locating in other countries that would have laws that would allow them to do these things.
I don't know what the marketplace will yield. Will people want to buy all their financial services from one company? Will it be on-line or with individuals? We don't know. We do know this,l that to close off one avenue of competition is the death knell for the future of a country in that area. In this case, financial services. So it was essential that we pass this bill.
So the first issue is jobs, plain and simple. Hundreds of thousands, yes millions of high-paying jobs. And I need not tell the Senate how important this bill has been to the financial capital of the world, New York.
Second, it's important to consumers. What the years have shown is that the more competition, the better. And this bill will allow more competition by allowing many more firms to compete over similar product lines. When a bank decides to go into the securities industry or a securities firm decides to sell insurance, they're looking for a competitive edge. And they may well find it. They may not. But the ability to have more competition, which this bill creates, is vital to consumers. This is a pro-consumer bill. And it's proconsumer for the same reason that our system has predominated over all the others -- competition.
So jobs is an important reason for this bill. Consumer interest and competition is an important reason for this bill.
A third is that we have to keep up with changing markets. When Glass-Steagall was passed, commercial banks dominated the financial landscape. They had 57% of all financial assets. Today, they have less than 25%. And to look at the world through that antiquated spyglass and say we must keep commercial banks from other areas because they may dominate, is to look at a world that's 50 years old.
In fact, many would argue that commercial banks are among the weakest competitors when you put them against not only securities firms and electronic firms but against mutual funds and everything else. And so we had to move this bill, thirdly, to keep up with changing markets.
And finally, we had to do it because otherwise the regulators were going topsy-turvy. And we all know it makes bad policy to have individual regulatory decisions make policy. That has been what's happened. Because of the necessities of technology and globalization, because of the changes in financial markets, individual companies were going to the regulators and asking for special permission to do A, B, C and the regulators were granting it.
Now we have an overall fabric. We have a law that will treat all companies equally, that will allow businesses, either new or existing, to plan for the future, and will create a level playing field. So there are many reasons to pass this bill.
Now my goal -- Mr. Chairman -- and I stated this at the outset -- was to modernize financial services but not take one step backward on C.R.A. we have done that. The C.R.A. provisions of the bill do not move things forward but they do not take a single step backward. And, in fact, as I have argued to the groups in my state, they will benefit from this legislation. Because their leverage in the C.R.A. process has always been when there are new mergers or new products that a bank decides to add. This is going to increase 10, 20 times. And every time the groups that are interested in C.R.A., one of the most successful banking laws we passed, will have that leverage. So instead of two or three times a year having the opportunity to make the case, they will probably have it two or three times a month. I would argue that C.R.A. groups are going to be so busy with all the new mergers and all the new services that they may not have time to keep up.
We accomplished a great deal. And I want to thank the Senator from Maryland as well as the Administration for making sure we did not take a single step backward on C.R.A.
Sunshine provisions are in the bill. Very hard to argue against them. If I'm for sunshine for business and for political people, including myself, how can you not be for sunshine even for groups that you support and believe in? I have no problem with the concept of sunshine. So we succeeded in C.R.A.
We also succeeded in terms of helping the consumer, in terms of protections. On A.T.M. fees, for instance, I am proud that banks will be required to disclose any and all charges for using an A.T.M. before a customer makes a decision to withdraw funds. I fought for years for this provision. First in the House, with Representative Roukema, and now in the Senate. And it is in the bill.
In addition, there are privacy protections in the bill. Does the bill go as far as I would like on privacy? No. But privacy is a large and complicated issue. We don't know what the balance ought to be between the ability of businesses to share information and the right of the consumer to protect his or her information. In the Senate, we did not have a single hearing on privacy. And to restructure all of privacy with huge numbers of unknown consequences on this bill made no sense. My goal again was, can we move forward? And we have. Not as far as I would like or many would like, but certainly not enough to sink a bill that has so many necessities behind it.
And, finally, Mr. Chairman, safety and soundness. The one thing that has dominated my thinking in this area is that we not repeat an S&L crisis, we not allow insured deposits to be used for risky activities. I am proud to say that the compromise between Treasury and Federal Reserve and the structure of the bill here makes sure that when insured dollars are used for anything that might be slightly risky, that the capital requirements and fire walls will make virtually certain that we will not repeat the kind of S&L crisis that we have had in the past.
And so, Mr. President, in conclusion, this is a historic day. It's a historic day for my state of New York, which I am proud to say is the financial capital of the world, and with this bill has a much greater likelihood of remaining. It is a historic day for modernizing one of the most important industries in American where we are technologically and entrepreneurially way ahead of the rest of the world and this will help us maintain our lead. And it is an historic day for those who have argued that we need to keep C.R.A. strong and keep consumer protections in the bill.
From Glass-Steagall to Gramm-Leach, from the Great Depression to the Golden Age, from isolationists to internationalists, from underdogs to champions, this bill, in my opinion, Mr. President, is an American success story for our economy, for our financial institutions, for our communities and consumers and for my state of New York. And I was proud to have played a role with so many others in ensuring its passage.
Thank you.
about chuck | senate floor | press room | services | en español | kids' page | local government | contact | home
For more on Indy Mac and the recent sale of "performing loans" here is a link that gives a snapshot of what really happened with the sale.http://blog.metro-real-estate.com/?p=637.
The post will give you a snapshot of some revealing info. More to come this weekend.
My theory is that Schumer is short IMB.
The IndyMac CEO must have missed the last Schumer fund-raiser.
Scary stuff today wouldn't want to be long into this weekend.
I'd agree with the first two comments but I still think it's a damn gutsy call on Schumer's part. The man speaks the truth...
Schumer is dumber than a sack of hair. IMB is less than an item on Mickey D's dollar menu and he has 'concerns'?
Never in the history of these United States has the quality of it's leadership been so low. Current candidates included.
F DIC is going to have a busy weekend. The shotgun weddings are only now beginning. I don't care where you bank, keep it under 100k.
Easy. Indy Mac didn't contribute heavily to his campaign. He's teaching other banks and financial services companies a lesson.
List of Indy Mac Employees Donating To Schumer
List Of Other Donors
Or maybe I'm being too cynical and Chuckie is just trying to get on tv again...
Dodd and Schumer represent states with a large population working in financial services. I'm sure that they're pandering to the masses who vote more than the executives who fund their campaigns.
Without looking, I'd bet Texas Senators are opposed to spending for public transportation because of the oil industry employment in their state.
Prostitutes.
Well, if there wasn't going to be a run on Indymac tomorrow, there sure is going to be now!
Nice work, Sen. Schumer. Makes tomorrow's stick save that much tougher.
P.S. If you are wondering why there was funny action in the Russell 2000 today, maybe it's because the index is being reconstituted at market close tomorrow.
We believe you Mr. Kohn "For the moment, higher headline rates of inflation have shown only a few tentative signs of embedding themselves in core inflation or in longer-term inflation expectations."
FRB: Speech--Kohn, Global Economic Integration and Decoupling--June 26, 2008
Ross writes:
Schumer is dumber than a sack of hair.
Sure, but a sack of hair that knows how to get good press!
I despise Bush as much as the next guy, but people like Schumer and Dodd ought to give pause to anyone wishing for a one-party state. And today Obama was calling for more tax rebates... I believe he honestly said we need to make the rebates permanent. Anyone expecting the country to exit the land of make-believe after the electionj may want to think again. It's just a new and improved fantasy.
I said it before--if I had children, I'd think seriously about emigrating.
Making a bid on a Indy property in FC
a rather low bid!!!
Re: russell 2K rebalance:
Say sayonara to WCI, TMA, SCA and BKUNA, among others.
I said it before--if I had children, I'd think seriously about emigrating.
Not that long ago I came to the realization that it wasn't the politicians that were stupid; rather it was the people electing them over & over.
I don't have children and am definitely copacetic about emigrating (again).
Schumer and his ilk are so powerful they probably have 'heroine fights' and hunt people like in The Most Dangerous Game...except without the heroine fights.
I would be shocked if there weren't a few big "Dominos Pizza Nights" in several locales by the FDIC over the weekend.
The U.S. Senate on Thursday approved $161.8 billion in new funds to continue fighting the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan for the next year, without timetables for withdrawing combat troops.
UPDATE 1-U.S. Congress passes new Iraq war funds
| Reuters
The Senate on Thursday approved legislation expanding benefits for the long-term unemployed who are struggling in an ailing economy, clearing the way for President George W. Bush to sign it into law.
Congress sends Bush expanded jobless benefits
| Reuters
Short Bucky!
The question is "Can the sh&% hit the fan before the elections?" I think a little bit, but it will be muted. Come November, hide the pets.
OT - My concern is about Heather Locklear's stability, but that is a topic for another blog.
Not that long ago I came to the realization that it wasn't the politicians that were stupid; rather it was the people electing them over & over.
amen. Did you know that while Congress has an approval rating in the low teens, most people are satisfied with their Congress-critter (~60%).
They just can't seem to make the connection
I said it before--if I had children, I'd think seriously about emigrating.
You're lucky to be in MA, Bob (we lived there for 10 years). It's a little like emigrating!
This should make people feel good:
Barclays warns of a financial storm as Federal Reserve's credibility crumbles
Last Updated: 12:30am BST 27/06/2008
US central bank accused of unleashing an inflation shock that will rock financial markets, reports Ambrose Evans-Pritchard
Barclays Capital has advised clients to batten down the hatches for a worldwide financial storm, warning that the US Federal Reserve has allowed the inflation genie out of the bottle and let its credibility fall "below zero".
"We're in a nasty environment," said Tim Bond, the bank's chief equity strategist. "There is an inflation shock underway. This is going to be very negative for financial assets. We are going into tortoise mood and are retreating into our shell. Investors will do well if they can preserve their wealth."
Barclays Capital said in its closely-watched Global Outlook that US headline inflation would hit 5.5pc by August and the Fed will have to raise interest rates six times by the end of next year to prevent a wage-spiral. If it hesitates, the bond markets will take matters into their own hands. "This is the first test for central banks in 30 years and they have fluffed it. They have zero credibility, and the Fed is negative if that's possible. It has lost all credibility," said Mr Bond.
When the poop hit the fan, FDIC will be able to pay 10 cents on the dollar to insured accounts...... and they will be the lucky ones.
How is a 9.5 trillion dollar deficit going to be delt with in a deflationary economy.
Run on the bank to follow, probably tommorow..
Chucky's a tool of the elite.
"concerned that IndyMac's financial deterioration poses significant risks to both taxpayers"
Why Chucky? Oh because asshats like you created the FDIC? And the FRB's? Ah. Taxpayers wouldn't have that problem without that shit. Just idiots who had funds deposited there. Check.
"the regulatory community may not be prepared to take measures that would help prevent the collapse of IndyMac or minimize the damage should such a failure occur.""
Because you asshats let the "regulatory community" get pwned by the banks et. al., did nothing to correct it, and voted to allow capital requirements to fall into the toilet. Now that "community doesn't have the capital to absorb this (known to anyone with half a brain) event.
Nice job Chucky. You need to be part of the perp walk. Asshat!
Cheers,
The problem with emigrating with children is maps. The children don't have maps, so moving to a foreign country would be confusing and cruel. Instead of emigrating, though, you can always undergrate. Dig a really big hole and start a life inside earth's crust. This has many advantages including no sunburns, interesting new creatures, and, it is likely where all the Leprechans stash is hidden. Happy and rich, now that is a life.
Elvis,
"The problem with emigrating with children is maps. The children don't have maps"
Ermm...dude I know you died on the toilet in 1978 or 9 but today we have this:
Google Maps
Oh yeah...and the kids know about it.
Cheers,
watch the wires, Iran attack fears spreading...
Misean, My authority is none other than Ms. South Carolina Jr. I trust her over your "Google Maps" propaganda. Next thing you'll try to tell me is George Bush isn't the best president in the history of totally awesomely cool presidents. I smell something stinky and it isn't Ms. South Carolina, Jr., Mr. "Five Day Old Fish" Misean.
"watch the wires, Iran attack fears spreading..."
Petrol prices to rise after head of OPEC warns of sharp fuel hike - Telegraph
"...However, the Opec president said that he did not agree with predictions from Goldman Sachs, an investment bank, that the oil price could rise to $200 a barrel. He said that this was only likely if there was a major market crisis such as a halt in oil production in Iran. In that case, he added, prices could possibly surge to "200, 300, 400 dollars".
If Iran stops producing oil, Irun to work.
NKKEI225 down by 2% and only 181 visitors?
cant be bad unless 600 are here.
Elvis,
"My authority is none other than Ms. South Carolina Jr."
Some dumb bimbo. OK. I work with rather intelligent 20 somethings so perhaps there's a diff.
"Mr. "Five Day Old Fish" Misean."
Kinda uncalled for as I was being humorous. Note the toilet joke in the original post.
Cheers,
Asia's deep in the red:
Asian Markets
More Shanghai cliff diving: -3.6%
Bob In MA wrote: I said it before--if I had children, I'd think seriously about emigrating.
Just got my fingerprints done for an FBI check so I can get a Chilean card. Time to get into the life boats.
Houston, we have a problem.
get long something other than what is not money.
Not that long ago I came to the realization that it wasn't the politicians that were stupid; rather it was the people electing them over & over.
In 'Quality Assurance' that would be called the 'root cause'. Unfortunately in a 'democracy' you can't reject the voters no matter how flawed.
Being "Shanghaid" is taking on a whole new meaning...
where's the obfuscation? where's the "hot money going"...
get ready for disjointed moves.
get long something other than what is not money.
that would be booze.
Bartman writes:
I would be shocked if there weren't a few big "Dominos Pizza Nights" in several locales by the FDIC over the weekend.
Bartman | 06.26.08 - 10:23 pm | #
Do they get the FDIC discount?
Misean,
Man, I know you are joking. That is why my response was lathered in sarcasm. We're good man. Sorry to call you smelly fish.
Im long Island Tea.
pfft....throw it in the bay. taxes people....tax and deficit spending. Interest rates dont matter.
dollar going lower is plan A.
Plan B, be long dollars.
dryfly,
"Unfortunately in a 'democracy' you can't reject the voters no matter how flawed."
What democracy. This is a representational republic. Also, that representation is vetted by our rulers. You get tweedledee or tweedledum. some choice.
"In 'Quality Assurance' that would be called the 'root cause'."
'Tis, but the rulers control it. Not much to be done at this end.
Cheers,
Elvis,
"Sorry to call you smelly fish."
It's all good. I just HATE stinky fish.
Cheers,
Assurance is not insurance.
Assurance is a surcharge of bullshit, pay me for the privi's.
Rent my equipment, pay Assurance....
How is a 9.5 trillion dollar deficit going to be delt with in a deflationary economy.
RGMiron | 06.26.08 - 10:37 pm | #
Schumer knows.
Hint: they don't call it 'fiat' for nothng.
NKKEI225 down by 2% and only 181 visitors?
Not bad considering the DJI fell 3% today. Lately, the N225 has consistently followed the US markets down the day after, even on Monday if the US markets have a bad Friday. I'm the farthest thing from a market sage, but the N225 behavior has been amazingly predictable over the past year.
Huh. The most agenda-setting newspaper in the USA doesn't even have today's financial meltdown as a top story. Couldn't possibly be that complacency thing I've been reiterating.
At this moment it's 3rd down under "More News":
As Climate Meeting Starts, a Revival of Skepticism - NY Times
I'd call this a two-buck upChuck, but that would be overstating matters by about $1.20, wouldn't it?
IT would have mattered when it was still a going concern.
Too little too late. Glad I maxed out my Heloc from them already and am sitting on the cash.
Total Putz
Ciao
MS
Berylmarkham,
"get long something other than what is not money.
that would be booze."
And food. And ammo. And knives.
I believe I was long booze earlier this week. I might have to restock however, after I do inventory.
Cheers,
"Glad I maxed out my Heloc from them already and am sitting on the cash."
Careful, that cash is perishable and, like a loaf of bread, it is only good for a few more years. Although, I heard moldy bread can send you on a hell of a trip, so "good" is a matter of opinion.
misean writes:
"'Tis, but the rulers control it. Not much to be done at this end."
this end: not the ruler to be done.
personal liberty and freedom at the end of the powerlessness.
the end of self.
when you get to the end of yourself, you find that what you seek.
And look at this wonder of a story: Retirees Find the Time May Be Right to Buy - NY Times
More like Retirees Stare into Abyss that is their Retirement Funding.
'Tis, but the rulers control it. Not much to be done at this end.
If the ballot box isn't sufficient there is the street Misean. People just have to get off their fat asses. Obviously they can't be TOO pissed yet.
Representative republics can be turned upside down too...
Barclays warns of a financial storm as Federal Reserve's credibility crumbles
what the fuck is money?
dryfly,
"People just have to get off their fat asses. Obviously they can't be TOO pissed yet.
Representative republics can be turned upside down too..."
Goddamit I hope so. As a tech guy I wanted that in the 2000 bubble. Maybe this time.
The sillyness just messes with my mind. Dumborats elected to take Congang and NOTHING done. Everything Shrubboy wanted he got, in spades. Unbelievable. Maybe homelessness and hunger does the trick. We'll see.
Cheers,
Traders must be this tall to go on this ride.
Some market caps for tonight:
Regions Financial 8.0 BIL
Bed Bath & Beyond 7.7 BIL
Autozone 7.3 BIL
GM 7.3 BIL
Gamestop 7.1 BIL
vozworth
"what the f..k is money"
Well Wikipedia has a good definition:
"The main uses of money are as a medium of exchange, a unit of account, and a store of value."
Money - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
What we have is fiat. It is a unit of exchange and a medium of account. It is not a store of value. So it is not money. But it is mandated. It is also counterfeited by the FRB's, as it costs them nothing to create more. That is wwhy it fails the money test. It is not a store of value.
Cheers,
Goddamit I hope so. As a tech guy I wanted that in the 2000 bubble. Maybe this time.
Be careful what you wish for - they won't demand less gov't. They'll want 'effective' gov't. I don't think you'll like that.
1+1 can only =3 for just so long. The days of spending our way to prosperity while working bubble economy service jobs (retail & starbucks baristas), are officially over starting today. Tough tough road ahead.
Unlike last Friday's OPEX delta-hedge meltdown, tomorrow has economic data of not inconsiderable import. Personal spending/Personal income are likely to come in higher/lower than expected, respectively. This reflects the inflationary/deflationary environment of the moment. In response I'd expect equities to catch their breath by rising then falling then rising then falling and closing basically where it closed today.
dryfly,
"They'll want 'effective' gov't. I don't think you'll like that."
Nope, won't. Hoping it'll be so damned bankrupt that they will have to recognize reality.
Yeah, I'm a dreamer...but as I've said, this shite has to stop some where.
Cheers,
GameStop and GM in the same sentence is just wrong. But what would GM be if it emerged from Bankruptcy?
Anonymouse,
"I'd expect equities to catch their breath by rising then falling then rising then falling and closing basically where it closed today."
You mean GASPING for breath I suspect.
Cheers,
Tough tough road ahead.
barely
Speaking of roads, do you realize how expensive it is to build and maintain roads at $1400/bbl? Invest in shocks and horses.
$140/bbl.
Japan released its National CPI Ex Food, Energy (YoY) May: -0.1%. Coming soon to a country you're in.
Obviously they can't be TOO pissed yet.
Maybe after this stimulus check is spent. Then again, talk of another one. Maybe after that...
barely writes:
1+1 can only =3 for just so long. The days of spending our way to prosperity while working bubble economy service jobs (retail & starbucks baristas), are officially over starting today. Tough tough road ahead.
barely | 06.26.08 - 11:19 pm | #
Starting today? I'll believe it when I see it. We had a measly 3% drop in the Dow & 'talk' of credit crunch - that's not a complete remake of society - not yet anyway.
But hold that thought - tomorrow's another day.
Misean, Dryfly,
Love youse guys. Platonically
The republic has been dead since they let women vote. Maybe before.
Nothing more than the road to serfdom and Spenglarian winter. I know it is popular to immigrate to some far off land but be careful. The Slavic north, Russia, has the only structure to be the 'next' civilization. One needs a new religion which allows for a new mathmatic.
The Mock and I know how hard the Ruskies are working on cold fusion. Love my tin hat palladium. It is a mania with them. Squirrly
ideas sometime come true.
Buy a hobby farm. I'm living proof that it can positive cash flow.
Stiner Bock kicks in. Ta ta
PPT Fact or Fiction?........YES:Has done something at least a few times and maybe a lot more times than we could imagine.................NO:Maybe something was done once or twice,but that"s it.Free running market....................Put Yes or No at start of your comment........Yes for me!
NZX down 2.36% testing 2005 levels, wheeeeeeee.....
BTW, PPT was supersized by the Patriot Act. Once again, nobody here wants to acknowledge the Patriot Act as a financial defense weapon, but it is. And it manipulates the markets to an extraordinary level. And, we will be stuck with the reprecussions.
I'd rather be stuck with pins and told to roll down a hill. Well maybe not...
Ross,
"Nothing more than the road to serfdom"
Ah early Hayek. True favorite of mine. Got me into Austrian economics I'm afraid. To the chagrin of the mathmetists who thought I would be their latest wunderkind.
Oh yeah, that's another story...
Cheers,
dryfly- "They'll want 'effective' gov't. I don't think you'll like that."
I've been trying to tell you guys: maybe it's time to go long on Feldstiefeln and Blutfahnen.
The Shrinking Influence of the US Federal Reserve
The IMF's board of directors has ruled that a so-called Financial Sector Assessment Program (FSAP) is to be carried out in the United States.
Embarrassing Investigation
Another problem for Mr. Dollar is that it will be several months before his actions take effect. Officials with the International Monetary Fund (IMF) have informed Bernanke about a plan that would have been unheard-of in the past: a general examination of the US financial system. The IMF's board of directors has ruled that a so-called Financial Sector Assessment Program (FSAP) is to be carried out in the United States. It is nothing less than an X-ray of the entire US financial system.
As part of the assessment, the Fed, the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), the major investment banks, mortgage banks and hedge funds will be asked to hand over confidential documents to the IMF team. They will be required to answer the questions they are asked during interviews. Their databases will be subjected to so-called stress tests -- worst-case scenarios designed to simulate the broader effects of failures of other major financial institutions or a continuing decline of the dollar.
@ Elvis,
Interesting idea about financial mandates as part of the terrorist act. Probably not a bad idea. Our financial system is so very fragile it would not suprise me.
I see commodities seizure wars on the horizon.
misean defines the globalFX:
"What we have is fiat:
a broad base of sovereign bonds as a claim to service or goods. this is the system.
Crude oil fell in New York, retreating from the record $140.39 a barrel reached yesterday, as the U.S. House of Representatives approved a bill aimed at curbing excessive energy-market speculation.
The bill, which passed 402-19, would require the Commodity Futures Trading Commission to consider using position limits, or constraints on the size of the stake each speculative investor can own, and raising margin requirements, the amount of money required to trade. The vote came after the record was set.
Oil Falls From Record as U.S. House Passes Speculation Measure - Bloomberg.com
When the music stops, in terms of liquidity, things will be complicated.
You can speculate all you want in the barbaric relic though.
Don't worry, the CEO of IndyMac will forgo his honeymoon money to pay those who are making a run on the bank.
wont be a run on the bank in America.
its a fund of funds run run. That is why the hedge funds are blowing up broke. thats the perp walk crowd.
Buy a hobby farm. I'm living proof that it can positive cash flow.
They'll be cheaper than 'dirt' - forgive the pun - around here come the 'recession'. I'm already watching the RE rags... too pricey right now.
In the 80s when the snowmobile plants shut down you could buy 'hobby farms' for $100/acre in NW Minnesota. Even in S Minnesota/Iowa you could get them for $400/acre... really productive land too. Now in Iowa & S Minn that stuff goes for $4000 an acre or more for a large parcel... smallish acreages are outrageously priced.
If we see a real job-loss event like the 80s that will all change... then land will come down a lot... but not until.
Anyone want to be the markets open up tomorrow.... hahahahaha....
Holy Asia Batman.... Did I miss something?
BB writes:
internatio...,562291,00.html
The Shrinking Influence of the US Federal Reserve
SPIEGEL ONLINE - Nachrichten
Embarrassing Investigation...
BB | 06.26.08 - 11:35 pm | #
So do they ring a bell when a 'reserve currency' ceases to be a reserve currency? If not how will we know or has it already happened?
Its funny Japan has been in a stink for 15+ years and they are net savers. Big time! I bet if we were net savers we'd have a 15+ year funk too... Save a few for the tech boom....
OK, I plead ignorance. How can the IMF compel US government insitutions to hand over confidential documents? Is it a clause in the founding documents? A priveledge accorded to members? Also, our government has a difficult enough time sneaking a peek into the books of US IBs. How is the IMF gonna get IB documents?
Jus' wondering.
@ Dryfly,
You are correct about raw land. Early but correct. You need the infrastructure to make it work. Outbuildings, areanas, stables, doublewides etc. Rentable goods plus a few acres for cash crops, gardens and hay meadows. Tractor Supply has built a good business off we dunderheads. Hey, but if you can afford it, it's fun. Put a paddle boat on the pond and bond with your grandkids.
Hiker90 total wild ass guess but maybe the IMF could prevent international business via strong arming other countries where the Gov cant stop US corps with out good reason...
hiker90 writes:
OK, I plead ignorance. How can the IMF compel US government insitutions to hand over confidential documents? Is it a clause in the founding documents? A priveledge accorded to members? Also, our government has a difficult enough time sneaking a peek into the books of US IBs. How is the IMF gonna get IB documents?
Jus' wondering.
hiker90 | 06.26.08 - 11:52 pm | #
The show up in black helicopters wearing blue helmets and just take whatever they want. Then go off to Area 51 to review... didn't you know that?
Seriously - I'd guess some of these IBs don't even know themselves. If the IMF can figure it all out they might ought to tell the IBs too.
chuck schumer should go fuck sheep.
he has so much blood on his hands i'm surprised he can still take the bribes without them slipping into the bloody pile at his feet.
sorry about that but i was at a town hall with him in 2002 where everyone told him to vote against the war. Several hundred people. He didn't listen.
Fed will have to raise interest rates six times by the end of next year to prevent a wage-spiral
I don't see it. What's supposed to cause this wage spiral? Just because gas is now $4.25/gallon doesn't mean you can just walk in and ask your boss for a raise and expect to get one. His costs are up and his margins are down - no room for a raise.
We got an email from our company CEO a few weeks back saying that there wouldn't be any raises for US employees this year - but there would be 6 to 8% raises for our Chinese and Indian employees.
You are correct about raw land. Early but correct. You need the infrastructure to make it work. Outbuildings, areanas, stables, doublewides etc. Rentable goods plus a few acres for cash crops, gardens and hay meadows. Tractor Supply has built a good business off we dunderheads. Hey, but if you can afford it, it's fun. Put a paddle boat on the pond and bond with your grandkids.
Ross | Homepage | 06.26.08 - 11:53 pm | #
I'd be a little more 'hard core' - I've lived in rural America most my life - I wouldn't need the infrastructure in place, I'd put it in & do it for shockingly little money, I know how to do that.
I'm mulling it over now - along with the wife. But it really means 'dropping out' and we are not yet there mentally. Closer every day though.
I spoke with a guy from MMC the other day who wanted my resume. MMC has a new shiny expensive contract with the FDIC to assist it with bank closing staffing. The only bank this guy mentioned to me was IndyMac. I was a little surprised that this was the bank he referenced in our conversation given how many out there are in terrible condition. Not to worry... G.H. Sheila Bair is on top of every little and big thing with her contracts and Congressional contacts.
MMC Group ::: In the News
Previous thread Nova asked
When the giants of the future show up ...
Nova, history teaches that us that very few times, positive leaders rise from these types of inflection points. Most of the time there is a drop in the population.
And btw: I'm only 5'4, so they might not all be giants
What Ross said.
Hey Elvis,
You are just too funny, sometimes...
Glad to see you have not "left the building" and taken any of this stuff too seriously to not poke at it 'till it comes out humorous...
Does anyone know if it possible to find and buy your own mortgage?
FFDIC,
"The only bank this guy mentioned to me was IndyMac. I was a little surprised that this was the bank he referenced in our conversation given how many out there are in terrible condition. Not to worry... G.H. Sheila Bair is on top of every little and big thing with her contracts and Congressional contacts."
Sheila's playing her book then? Wouldn't suprise me.
Cheers,
We can predict what Schumer will say next: "If IndyMac is allowed to fail, it will be like a dagger to the heart of the American financial system."
I grew up with parents who "dropped out".
All things considered, its a pretty nice way of life, if you don't mind eating goat (which you won't when you've been eating carrots for a few years). It also helps when your shorts are kicking ass.
More carrots and SRS please!
dude,
"You are just too funny, sometimes..."
Elvis needs to start working with Leno, or at least Colbert. Some of his shite is golden...
Just sayin'
-ducks-
Cheers,
Does anyone know if it possible to find and buy your own mortgage?
If you can afford to buy it, then you are not likely one of the riskier assets in their portfolio. Why would they want to sell any good ones that keep the toxic stuff masked?
Elvis wrote:
Once again, nobody here wants to acknowledge the Patriot Act as a financial defense weapon, but it is. And it manipulates the markets to an extraordinary level.
Please elaborate.
Might as well BK now that the torpedo has hit.
Would be interesting following the web of phone calls out of his office to friends of staff, etc.
"if you don't mind eating goat (which you won't when you've been eating carrots for a few years)"
My brother-in-law raised goats, the meat tasted very good but heck, was it greasy! There was about 1/4 inch thick grease on all the knives and utensils. Must mention here he has wound up with heart problems.
Kis,
True thasts what I told the doc I work with it was his idea to find his own motgage. Personally I rent!!!!!!
BTW, if you repurchase your own debt obligations at a reduced price, you have to pay capital gains on the "income."
So do they ring a bell when a 'reserve currency' ceases to be a reserve currency? If not how will we know or has it already happened?
The indicator is when we start assembling iPods for export to China.
"The indicator is when we start assembling iPods for export to China."
And when your most prized possessions are a rice bowl and bicycle.
. Must mention here he has wound up with heart problems.
See above about eating carrots.
Goat isn't greasy, Hog is.
Well, guess Schumer's fixed whatever was wrong with Dodd's bill. Expect this greased pig to fly soon.
(Affordable houses? In a pig's eye.)
No frog speak,
They are trying to keep houses high but 300 billion ain't gonna cut it. It will end closer to 3 trillion.
No Frog,
"Well, guess Schumer's fixed whatever was wrong with Dodd's bill. Expect this greased pig to fly soon.
(Affordable houses? In a pig's eye.)"
Can't be fixed...Although I do expect many pigs to be thrown of NY skyscrapers to show they can fly...fro the moment at lest.
Cheers,
Misean,
Dead cats can jump to
IHT
Deleveraging, now only in early stages, will transform the banking industry
Deleveraging, now only in early stages, will transform the banking industry - The New York Times
@ Dryfly,
Don't go native just yet. My hobby farm is an investment as in 'Hobby'. You are much too wise to drop out.
We all must live in the times we are in. You seem pretty good at adjusting and adapting. I too cook and miser the markets. My dad was a great teacher. He learned from his mom. OK, I'm a hand me down skinflint but but I have fun gaming the 'system'. I know you do also.
Bueno suerto. U dacha.
Dryfly, since you're talking about hobby farms, I'll ask your advice. I've searched for a farm with at least 5 acres that's pretty remote, in case things get scary here in suburbia with my kids. On the net I've found a little 8 acre hobby farm in the Ozarks, mostly open, with mature fruit trees, henhouse, fenced and barbed pastures, small barn, small house with a fireplace, established perennial food garden, etc. Very remote. It's $80K, though. I look at the pictures sometimes just to reassure myself it's still for sale (over a year now).
Folks tell me that's way too high. I'm guessing you would agree? TIA.
Why is it around midnight lately the subject turns to goats?
Local home for sale includes wife
(and maybe a goat)
Local home for sale includes wife |West Palm Beach News, South Florida Breaking News, Forecast, Video from WPTV
sequoia512,
"Dead cats can jump to"
I always thought they bounced. And not well. I'm willing to be proven wrong.
Cheers,
Misean,
I know the old saying just joking. I hope like hell nobody is walking under tall buildings in NYC lately. I would hate to hear Jaime Diamond say as god is my witness I thought pigs could fly
Anonymous writes:
But what would GM be if it emerged from Bankruptcy?
Trek?
@ suecris,
Offer less but don't dispare. Things won't get that bad. The Ozarks are beautiful but it's kind of rocky. Not much for day to day existing.
Rent the John Wayne movie 'Shepherd of The Hills'. Very realistic about the area and mindsets.
Thanks, Ross. I'm not ready to bolt yet, just want to have an idea in mind of places I could buy in a hurry if I wanted to.
I'll add the movie to my Netflix queue - sometimes an old John Wayne movie on a weekend is just right.
sequoia512,
"I would hate to hear Jaime Diamond say as god is my witness I thought pigs could fly."
I kinda would. Just my sickness I suppose.
Cheers,
hastas and good night all.
Cheers,
Worries About Banks Send Shares Tumbling
Worries About Banks Send Shares Tumbling - NY Times
Is Chuck in the hole on a long speculation or setting up a short position here?
Testifying to the House Energy and Commerce Committee, Michael Masters of Masters Capital Management said that the price of oil would quickly drop closer to its marginal cost of around $65 to $75 a barrel, about half the current $135.
Gads, Schumer and the lobbies are putting on a great show for the shorts, this is better than Hollywood scripting! Oil could be $1.99 if Congress would act...ROTFLMAO LOL hahahahahaaahahahawahaaawwwwehahaha
He's setting up his long position to go into our short holes...
Tipping point occurs when police, secret service, and military understand how dangerous all of our politicians are.
Re: 167 Visitors Online
ROTFLMAO..LOL!
Too tired to comment tonite, we are closed.
Someone with a camera ought to get over to an Indymac branch tomorrow with a camera in hand to get a shot of the Northern Rock-esque line wrapping around the block to yank money out.
Schumer's 2008 donations so far:
Citigroup Inc\t$80,800
UBS Americas\t$74,250
Paul, Weiss et al\t$67,000
Kasowitz, Benson et al\t$64,250
Metropolitan Life\t$59,000
Goldman Sachs\t$58,040
Morgan Stanley\t$57,000
Guardsmark Inc\t$54,000
Lehman Brothers\t$53,750
Merrill Lynch\t$50,250
JPMorgan Chase & Co\t$47,800
2006:
Goldman Sachs\t$182,590
JP Morgan Chase & Co\t$129,800
Merrill Lynch\t$127,000
Bear Stearns\t$126,400
Citigroup Inc\t$111,550
Morgan Stanley\t$109,500
UBS Americas\t$103,000
Ernst & Young\t$101,800
Kasowitz, Benson et al\t$100,250
I guess he doesn't mind some of the larger banks swallowing up the smaller banks? Seeing as how its the larger banks that supported him... we need a teaparty...
suecris- "Folks tell me that's way too high."
It is. You can do way better than that. Dryfly might differ with me, but find an area you're interested in and subscribe to the local paper or, if you're in a hurry, contact a local real estate agent.
Is what Schumer did LEGAL?
We may have the first Domino of the GDII--Domino's pizza et al-tipped off by Schumer's dealings, like the rumours of what the New York bank of the United States was, to today's IndyMac.
It's going to be a long, long night.
We may have the first Domino of the GDII--Domino's pizza et al-tipped off by Schumer's dealings, like the rumours of what the New York bank of the United States was, to today's IndyMac.
Really? Do you think anyone is paying close enough attention? I doubt it... maybe a handful of longer lines... but a true bank run and lines around the block?
(Sorry, I'm pretty young and naive but I don't think the average person understands the context, and people who pay attention already took their money out of the bank...)
So...this is "it," right?
Yes it is, whatever "it" is.
YLSP- "...people who pay attention already took their money out of the bank..."
People who pay attention? Sorry, I've never met any.
Naw, this isn't "it". I ordered a cheese and pineapple, and this is clearly not it.
"Yes, Dmitri; it's nice to be fine.
But Dmitri ........ "
"I ordered a cheese and pineapple, and this is clearly not it."
Well, I'm glad you're clear on "it," because most people aren't.
Thats a relief.
I know it's coming, but I wasn't sure if this was it or not.
Waiting is brutal.
Daniel, it's clear now that someone, currently smoking cannabis, didn't get your cheese and pineapple. He's still waiting.
Clustering illusion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The probability of an alternation in a sequence of random binary events is .5, yet people seem to expect an alternation rate of about .7.[3] In fact, in a short number of trials, variability and non-random-looking "streaks" are quite probable.
Daniel Kahneman and Amos Tversky explained this kind of misprediction as being caused by the representativeness heuristic.[4] Gilovich argues that a similar effect occurs for other types of random dispersions, including 2-dimensional data such as seeing clusters in the locations of impact of V-1 flying bombs on London during World War II or seeing streaks in stock market price fluctuations over time.[5]
retreating from the record $140.39 a barrel reached yesterday, as the U.S. House of Representatives approved a bill aimed at curbing excessive energy-market speculation
my spidey sense tells me this will drive the price to $200.
Mr Market does not like to be trifled with
Here are the San Fernando Valley Home sales for those of you living up this way.
Gilovich argues that a similar effect occurs for other types of random dispersions, including 2-dimensional data such as seeing clusters in the locations of impact of V-1 flying bombs on London during World War II
If this were truly random, why are they clustered in London and not spread out all over Great Britain?
Currently Smoking Cannabis, Don't get excited!!!!!
Wait for it!!!!!!!
NOW............. NO WAIT!!
Dude I watched kudlow tonight to cheer up on the internet, and normally he makes me happy. But tonight he made me want to shoot myself.
For example, during World War II London was struck by German V-1 flying bombs and V-2 rockets. The locations at which they landed seemed to cluster in poorer parts of the city, and there was a widespread belief that these areas were being specifically targeted. After the war, the locations where the flying bombs fell were subjected to statistical analysis. It showed that they had fallen uniformly at random. The apparent clustering that people had perceived was just a coincidence. (For a discussion of this example, and of the general propensity for people to believe things that they should not, see Gilovich 1 .)This reaction to the bombing of London is just one instance of a more general phenomenon of human thinking: a sense of coincidence that, all too often it seems, leads us to false conclusions.
Perhaps most striking is the human ability to draw rich inductive inferences from very sparse data, where the conclusions seem so underdeter-mined from the evidence available that even our imperfect level of success is remarkable. Many ofthe deepest questions in cognitive science take this form.
One of these experiments was based on the bombing of London, asking people to judge how big a coincidence it would be for a particular configuration of rocket locations to arise by chance.
We compared these judgements with the log-likelihood ratio produced by comparing a hypothesis in which some of the bombs fell around a common target (a mixture of a uniform and a Gaussian distribution, integrating over all model parameters) with the hypothesis of a uniform distribution (see Figure 2). Our results indicate that, in fact, people are extremely good at evaluating the evidence that an event provides for the existence of an unexpected causal forcejudgements of the strength of coincidences correlate extremely well with the appropriate likelihood ratios. This suggests that the errors we makein reasoning about coincidences are not a consequence of seeing evidence where none exists (i.e. miscalculating the likelihood ratio), but rather are due to a failure to recognise just how much evidence is needed to accept an outlandish conclusion (i.e. miscalculating the prior odds)
The people of London were not at fault in recognising that the rockets exhibited some evidence of clustering, but this evidence was certainly not sufficient to justify the conclusion that poorer parts of the city were being targeted (or even to reject the null hypothesis in the statistical tests performed after the war). Predicting the future, inferring causal relationships and identifying coincidences are just three examples of how Bayesian statistics can shed light on human cognition.
Statistics and the Bayesian mind
Tom Griffiths and Joshua Tenenbaum
Will the stock mkt go up every year? Do you see a pattern?
This is good:
Why Smart People Make Big Money Mistakes - Belsky, Gilovich - Review @ Moneyspot.org
Why Smart People Make Big Money Mistakes
and How to Correct Them
Authors:\t \tGary Belsky & Thomas Gilovich
Consider an experiment conducted several years ago by Drazen Prelec and Duncan Simester, marketing professors at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Cambridge, Massachusetts. The pair organized a real-life, sealed-bid auction for tickets to a Boston Celtics game (this was during the Larry Bird, Kevin McHale, Robert Parrish era, so the tickets were especially valuable). Half the participants in the auction were informed that whoever won the bidding would have to pay for the tickets in cash (although they had one day to come up with the funds). The other half were told that the winning bidder would have to pay by credit card. Prelec and Simester then averaged the bids of those who thought they would have to pay by cash and those who thought they would have to pay by credit card. Incredibly, the average credit card bid was roughly twice as large as the average cash bid. Simply because they were dealing with plastic with money that was devalued in some way the students became spendthrifts. Put another way, credit cards turn us into big spenders in more ways than one. We become poorer because we're more likely to spend, and more likely to spend poorly.
Will the stock mkt go up every year? Do you see a pattern?
No, Yes. I see that as the population increases there is more money printed as a necessary measure to keep the flow of goods moving. Long term the market will move up, it's unlikely to remain at any level permanently and there's much more room above this level than down to zero. I don't think I'll ever see a negative number for the stock market. But my personal definition of long term is greater than ten years. As far as discernible patterns short term, hah!
Why Smart People Make Big Money Mistakes
Again flawed (although I agree with the conclusion) They needed to have at least one other category of bidders, those with a line of credit other than a credit card. I've been through times in my life where I couldn't come up with the cash (even given a week) to buy a Celtics ticket. Although I probably would have bid with the idea of scalping the ticket, since I hate the Celtics, especially that era.
go long on schmucks, bullshit, corruption and dishonesty. never ending supply there..
the U.S. House of Representatives approved a bill aimed at curbing excessive energy-market speculation
Let's set up our new US government with an agency that analyzes legislation for any unintended consequences. We sure do need one.
Hmm... in the meantime crude is trading at 141.
At this rate look for more carnage today.
Fed May Ease Rules on Private Equity Bank Stakes: WSJ
Fed May Loosen Rules on Private Equity Bank Stakes: WSJ - CNBC
BB: At this rate look for more carnage today.
And look for chilly con carnage next winter.
the U.S. House of Representatives approved a bill aimed at curbing excessive energy-market speculation"
There is no safe store of value. If there were, the government would have to make its holding illegal, as was done in the case of gold. If everyone decided, for example, to convert all his bank deposits to silver or copper or any other good, and thereafter declined to accept checks as payment for goods, bank deposits would lose their purchasing power and government-created bank credit would be worthless as a claim on goods. The financial policy of the welfare state requires that there be no way for the owners of wealth to protect themselves.
This is the shabby secret of the welfare statists' tirades against gold. Deficit spending is simply a scheme for the confiscation of wealth. Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights. If one grasps this, one has no difficulty in understanding the statists' antagonism toward the gold standard.
GOLD AND ECONOMIC FREEDOM
by Alan Greenspan
This article originally appeared in a newsletter: The Objectivist published in 1966 and was reprinted in Ayn Rand's Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal
You may make some fantastic gains but that don't mean you gonna keep them at least in the US.
Is anyone else getting fed up with Krugman's insistence that speculation cannot be what's driving up oil? His reasons given for the increase strike me as bearing an eerie resemblance to "they're not making any more land, you know."
Perhaps it's the Mom & Pop gas stations across the country who can't compete with the big chains on volume or price, so they set their price at $.10 or $.15 more than the big chains. And sit and wait. With their big tanks full of gas underground. Waiting for the price to go up. Are they the elusive ones who are hoarding?
Sorry for the OT, Krugman's comments section sucks, so I'm spouting off here.
suecris,
I expect to hear his rationale repeated everywhere and, yes, it is already tiresome if not disingenuous.
There is what seems to me a more forthright essay which I linked yesterday so, with apologies to those who've seen this previously:
Thomas Palley: "Beating the Oil Barons" (And the Misunderstood Role of Inventories) « naked capitalism
18 visitors at 7 AM--maybe today won't be as bad as I feared. I recall on B-S day there were hundreds through the wee hours...
Andrew Foland writes:
maybe today won't be as bad as I feared.
Not sure what your fear level is but i don't expect a positive close today.
And sit and wait
GMAFB. Mom & Pop gas store's profit comes entirely from the mini grocery concessionary items. Posting "GO AWAY" prices compared to the chains would kill their business dead.
You need to get your head around the fact that production has peaked, but is still insufficient to meet demand at the cheap-ass prices we had become used to ($20-$60).
A $100 barrel of oil can be cracked into 20 gallons of gasoline, at ~$5/each. The economic utility of $5 gas is such that we will not see significant demand destruction -- though it's getting close.
(The $7/gal that $140 oil implies does seem to me to cross the line towards actual demand destruction, however.)
Except that $100 barrel of oil is also cracked in other oil products, propane, heating oil, asphalt etc so your assessment is apples to apples.
I want to point out that sue and suecris are separate posters.
Troy, in your area don't the smaller stations charge more? They certainly do here, as I said, usually 10 to 15 cents more. You're correct that their income comes from the convenience store aspect, which usually flourishes, though few buy gas there.
U.S. stock futures edged off their lowest level on Friday as a subdued reading in May's core personal consumption expenditures, an inflation gauge closely watched by the Federal Reserve, tempered nervousness about record oil prices and the health of banks.
US STOCKS-Futures off lows on muted inflation measure
| Reuters
Oh Yeah, that just gave me a big old woddy.
I was expecting more news on IndyMac. Is there a bank run or not. Maybe no one was paying attention yesterday.
In any case, I seriously doubt they will be letting anyone withdraw from the a few hundred bucks today before going into FDIC receivership.
They will plead needing forms and other paperwork to hold off people who want to withdraw.
Cheers,
stuck
oups, typo galore:
"In any case, I seriously doubt they will be letting anyone withdraw more than a few hundred bucks today before going into FDIC receivership."
!!!NO FEAR YET!!!
Foland bear in mind there is no new post up.
There are also two Sue-s - but I like the other Sue's comments so far, am happy with that conflation!
IndyMac is up today. The market thinks Schumer is an idiot which he is. He should never be a Senator. They should have an IQ test.
suecris writes:
Dryfly, since you're talking about hobby farms, I'll ask your advice. I've searched for a farm with at least 5 acres that's pretty remote, in case things get scary here in suburbia with my kids. On the net I've found a little 8 acre hobby farm in the Ozarks, mostly open, with mature fruit trees, henhouse, fenced and barbed pastures, small barn, small house with a fireplace, established perennial food garden, etc. Very remote. It's $80K, though. I look at the pictures sometimes just to reassure myself it's still for sale (over a year now).
Folks tell me that's way too high. I'm guessing you would agree? TIA.
suecris | 06.27.08 - 12:33 am | #
Sorry - missed it - went to bed.
$80K? Depends. 5 acres is real small - I mean postage stamp small if you really want it to 'carry you'. Land in the Ozarks isn't the best either - not like Iowa or Illinois. I doubt it produces a lot other than the fruit (fruit requires chemicals up the wazoo unless you plan to turn it into jam/jelly/cider).
Does land have buildings & such? Good water? Permeable for septic? Wood to cut for heat - 5 acres won't produce enough wood to sustain long term UNLESS that's all you grow.
There are a lot of things I'd have to know before I would venture an opinion.
$80K might be okay - might be way too much, hard to say.
If I was buying land in N Minnesota & it wasn't on a lake - I wouldn't pay more than $20k for similar UNLESS the buildings made it worth more. Personally I'd want at least 100 acres.
I expect I could find a lot of property up there that was bigger, better, and less than $80K.
My guess is the Ozarks are no different IF far enough from Brantson or hard to get to from WalMart HQ, KC or St L. Spend more time & look hard before committing. Due diligence - YMMV.
Press Release
Floor Statement Sen. Charles E. Schumer S 900 Conference Report
Thank you, Mr. President. And I first want to thank Chairman Gramm and Senator Sarbanes, Chairman Leach, Representative LaFalce, and all of my colleagues who worked so long and hard on this legislation. Particular thanks to Senators Dodd and Edwards, who worked with us in the late-night hours to come up with a compromise that eventually helped get this bill passed. Mr. President, this is a historic moment. We've been working towards it for 18 years.
It's taken 18 years for Congress to pass this bill. When I first came to Congress, the issue was a narrow one -- revenue bonds. Could banks underwrite revenue bonds? And with technological change, with globalization, the issue has expanded far beyond revenue bonds to an issue where the future of America's dominance as the financial center of the world is at stake.
This bill is vital for the future of our country. If we didn't pass this bill, we could find London or Frankfurt or years down the road Shanghai becoming the financial capital of the world. That has grave implications for all of America, where financial services are one of the areas where jobs are growing the most quickly, where our technology is way ahead of everyone else, where our capital dominates the world. And it would be a shame if because Congress has been unable to act that all those advantages were frittered away as they well could be in a global world by our failure to realize the problems that our existing antiquated laws cause us.
So there are many reasons for this bill, but first and foremost is to ensure that U.S. financial firms remain competitive. Like their international competitors now, U.S. firms will be able to offer financial services to complement their business models. Had we not done this, three years from now with new technology, we could find major U.S. companies leaving the United States and locating in other countries that would have laws that would allow them to do these things.
I don't know what the marketplace will yield. Will people want to buy all their financial services from one company? Will it be on-line or with individuals? We don't know. We do know this,l that to close off one avenue of competition is the death knell for the future of a country in that area. In this case, financial services. So it was essential that we pass this bill.
So the first issue is jobs, plain and simple. Hundreds of thousands, yes millions of high-paying jobs. And I need not tell the Senate how important this bill has been to the financial capital of the world, New York.
Second, it's important to consumers. What the years have shown is that the more competition, the better. And this bill will allow more competition by allowing many more firms to compete over similar product lines. When a bank decides to go into the securities industry or a securities firm decides to sell insurance, they're looking for a competitive edge. And they may well find it. They may not. But the ability to have more competition, which this bill creates, is vital to consumers. This is a pro-consumer bill. And it's proconsumer for the same reason that our system has predominated over all the others -- competition.
So jobs is an important reason for this bill. Consumer interest and competition is an important reason for this bill.
A third is that we have to keep up with changing markets. When Glass-Steagall was passed, commercial banks dominated the financial landscape. They had 57% of all financial assets. Today, they have less than 25%. And to look at the world through that antiquated spyglass and say we must keep commercial banks from other areas because they may dominate, is to look at a world that's 50 years old.
In fact, many would argue that commercial banks are among the weakest competitors when you put them against not only securities firms and electronic firms but against mutual funds and everything else. And so we had to move this bill, thirdly, to keep up with changing markets.
And finally, we had to do it because otherwise the regulators were going topsy-turvy. And we all know it makes bad policy to have individual regulatory decisions make policy. That has been what's happened. Because of the necessities of technology and globalization, because of the changes in financial markets, individual companies were going to the regulators and asking for special permission to do A, B, C and the regulators were granting it.
Now we have an overall fabric. We have a law that will treat all companies equally, that will allow businesses, either new or existing, to plan for the future, and will create a level playing field. So there are many reasons to pass this bill.
Now my goal -- Mr. Chairman -- and I stated this at the outset -- was to modernize financial services but not take one step backward on C.R.A. we have done that. The C.R.A. provisions of the bill do not move things forward but they do not take a single step backward. And, in fact, as I have argued to the groups in my state, they will benefit from this legislation. Because their leverage in the C.R.A. process has always been when there are new mergers or new products that a bank decides to add. This is going to increase 10, 20 times. And every time the groups that are interested in C.R.A., one of the most successful banking laws we passed, will have that leverage. So instead of two or three times a year having the opportunity to make the case, they will probably have it two or three times a month. I would argue that C.R.A. groups are going to be so busy with all the new mergers and all the new services that they may not have time to keep up.
We accomplished a great deal. And I want to thank the Senator from Maryland as well as the Administration for making sure we did not take a single step backward on C.R.A.
Sunshine provisions are in the bill. Very hard to argue against them. If I'm for sunshine for business and for political people, including myself, how can you not be for sunshine even for groups that you support and believe in? I have no problem with the concept of sunshine. So we succeeded in C.R.A.
We also succeeded in terms of helping the consumer, in terms of protections. On A.T.M. fees, for instance, I am proud that banks will be required to disclose any and all charges for using an A.T.M. before a customer makes a decision to withdraw funds. I fought for years for this provision. First in the House, with Representative Roukema, and now in the Senate. And it is in the bill.
In addition, there are privacy protections in the bill. Does the bill go as far as I would like on privacy? No. But privacy is a large and complicated issue. We don't know what the balance ought to be between the ability of businesses to share information and the right of the consumer to protect his or her information. In the Senate, we did not have a single hearing on privacy. And to restructure all of privacy with huge numbers of unknown consequences on this bill made no sense. My goal again was, can we move forward? And we have. Not as far as I would like or many would like, but certainly not enough to sink a bill that has so many necessities behind it.
And, finally, Mr. Chairman, safety and soundness. The one thing that has dominated my thinking in this area is that we not repeat an S&L crisis, we not allow insured deposits to be used for risky activities. I am proud to say that the compromise between Treasury and Federal Reserve and the structure of the bill here makes sure that when insured dollars are used for anything that might be slightly risky, that the capital requirements and fire walls will make virtually certain that we will not repeat the kind of S&L crisis that we have had in the past.
And so, Mr. President, in conclusion, this is a historic day. It's a historic day for my state of New York, which I am proud to say is the financial capital of the world, and with this bill has a much greater likelihood of remaining. It is a historic day for modernizing one of the most important industries in American where we are technologically and entrepreneurially way ahead of the rest of the world and this will help us maintain our lead. And it is an historic day for those who have argued that we need to keep C.R.A. strong and keep consumer protections in the bill.
From Glass-Steagall to Gramm-Leach, from the Great Depression to the Golden Age, from isolationists to internationalists, from underdogs to champions, this bill, in my opinion, Mr. President, is an American success story for our economy, for our financial institutions, for our communities and consumers and for my state of New York. And I was proud to have played a role with so many others in ensuring its passage.
Thank you.
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For more on Indy Mac and the recent sale of "performing loans" here is a link that gives a snapshot of what really happened with the sale.http://blog.metro-real-estate.com/?p=637.
The post will give you a snapshot of some revealing info. More to come this weekend.