That monument to Jackson's ego was a firing offense in and of itself. Feel, feel for the poor HUD employees who had to look at that while going to work every day.
So I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that Tanta is not a big fan of Mr. Jackson.
I thought I hid it so well under my even-tempered persona.
Mr. Jackson was the big cheerleader for zero-down FHA loans, and a huge defender of the "DAP" dealie (let the builders make the down payment!).
I'm guessing that Mr. Frank wasn't going to let loose with the next FHA appropriation until Mr. Jackson decided to spend more time with the wife and kiddies.
"There are...people out there who are so financially distressed that simply getting a 'Yes' is the most important thing for them, and the faster you can get to 'Yes', the more quickly you've given them the major aspect of the product that they want"
Another exemplar of the Bush doctrine: fill the ranks with loyalists, who in return for obeisance may rape the treasury. When will this administration pay for its malfeasances?
crispy&cole writes:
When one party stays in power for too long this is what happens.
crispy&cole | Homepage | 03.31.08 - 12:07 pm | #
Looking at the polls I've seen - unless something huge changes - that party will have the WH for at least four more... replacing Jackson with likes of Phil Gramm.
Not trying to incite political firestorm - just looking at the polls.
Think Progress is the outfit which accused McCain of plagiarism last week, and had to issue an embarrassing retraction.
You mean "had the guts to issue an embarrassing retraction"?
As opposed to continuing to harp on a no-there-there story until enough people were convinced that it's true?
Your post is the most classic example of "ad hominem" I think I've ever seen. And in the context of a Bush appointee who has never yet admitted to having made a single mistake, it's like Total Irony Overload.
Yep, there's trouble alright. Trouble that starts with T and rhymes with P that stands for Philly.
It's the way business is done here. A couple of years ago the ex-mayor's brother got into some sort of real pantyknot for trying to finagle a no-bid contract for the airport. But it's all so mundane, it hardly merits a stir.
Sort of a mini-Bush administration - get into office, help out all your friends and family.
Your post is the most classic example of "ad hominem" I think I've ever seen. And in the context of a Bush appointee who has never yet admitted to having made a single mistake, it's like Total Irony Overload.
Tanta | 03.31.08 - 12:29 pm | #
I think THINK PROGRESS should embarrassingly apologize for posting that picture... NOW that would be progress. Either that or provide coupons for 'brain bleach'...
It does not matter who wins anyway, the political system is corrupt and the losers will be the citizens who are not part of the crony capitalists system we currently have.
It's a question of choosing one's sources of information. If they show signs of being unreliable, a practical course is to be skeptical of what that publication reports. The Los Angeles Times had to issue an embarrassing retraction last week, too, over a story concerning rappers and the rap industry.
Not trying to incite political firestorm - just looking at the polls.
Polls are meaningless at this stage. (Especially national polls, since our Presidential election is not national.)
The only "poll" worth watching is Intrade. And right now, the punters are giving the Republicans a 40% chance of keeping the White House. Think they are wrong? Then by all means, take their money! You can have a 150% return in 8 months if you are right.
Me, I think 40% is way too high. And yeah, I have money on it.
I am often called liberal, but I also have done some work in the government housing area and can tell you one thing: if HUD disappeared today, it would probably do more to HELP HUD's mission than hurt it.
CORRECTION: As a blog that strives to maintain credibility and transparency, we would like to explain our mistake. When we were alerted to the tip that Adm. Ziemer gave a similar speech in 1996, we searched LexisNexis and McCains campaign site for whether the senator used the disputed phrases before that time. We did not find anything. After we published the post, the McCain campaign contacted us and pointed to a speech given by the senator in 1995, which appears on McCains Senate site. As soon as we were alerted to the error, we rushed to publish a correction. Once again, we regret the error, and we apologize for it.
You mean like this? I'm sure littlegreenfootballs, redstate and the like are littered with these. After all, that's what responsibility is all about, innit?
It's a question of choosing one's sources of information.
Yes. And you we don't know from any other recent drive-by commenter who seems to show up only to toss off one-liners. We therefore suspect your motives.
Especially when you can't issue a correction for having played the ad-hominem card.
I for one have some skepticism about anything ElCliffo reports.
crispy&cole said: "It does not matter who wins anyway, the political system is corrupt and the losers will be the citizens who are not part of the crony capitalists system we currently have."
Completely agree, except for the part about citizens being helpless and hopeless to improve their lives despite the crony capitalists.
Conservatives using political office to loot and damage government they dislike in the first place seemed to start with Reagan. Is anyone else old enough to remember James Watt who founded an anti-environmental legal training foundation and was appointed Secretary of the Interior by Reagan?
Exceprt from Wikipedia:
"Watt's tenure as Secretary of the Interior was marked by controversy, stemming primarily from his alleged hostility to environmentalism and his support of the development and use of federal lands by foresting, ranching, and other commercial interests.
For over two decades, Watt held the record for protecting the fewest species under the Endangered Species Act in United States history. The record was broken by Dirk Kempthorne, a George W. Bush appointee who, as of August 27, 2007, had not listed a single species in the 15 months since his confirmation."
An acquaintance works at HUD and this is YEARS overdue. FEMA and HUD, have both been traditionaly used to provide sinecures for the most imcompetent political hacks that the incomming party has to find jobs for.
This is why I try not to write about politics. It attracts the mud-slinging partisans in minutes.
If you want to defend Jackson's contributions to housing, mortgage lending, and the safety of the financial sector, why go ahead. We'd all like to know if the man did anything besides sit for photos.
But if you're here only to list out every other person who has ever been incompetent or corrupt, please go away. The readers of this blog are not really interested in "HE DID IT TOO!" as an intellectual pursuit.
Interesting Tesco was planning on opening their upscale quick food marts in U.S. Not anymore.
Tesco puts U.S. expansion plans on hold
Tesco will take a planned three-month break in the opening schedule for its U.S. Fresh & Easy stores to evaluate operations. It still plans to open 200 U.S. stores by early 2009. Bloomberg
I sat next to Watt (across the aisle) on a flight from Tampa to DC in the '80s. I wanted to kick his ass (but I didn't want to go to jail). At that time, I viewed him as the most dangerous man in America.
This uber-wingnut actually said that we didn't need to conserve resources, because Jesus was coming back soon, and he'd take care of everything.
The way I see it, the American people are going to make the wrong decision come November. Partly because all choices are fairly bad; but it's their fault for not realizing this.
They're not in a position yet to understand what's going on. Much of that is their fault. But give them four more years of increasing pain, and they'll start paying attention.
Me, I think 40% is way too high. And yeah, I have money on it.
Nemo | Homepage | 03.31.08 - 12:38 pm | #
Nemo - I agree the election isn't national - the last few rounds I've only watched two states: Ohio & Wisconsin. I see no way the Dems can win without both (Florida is the third I will watch after OH & WI but I believe Dems can win w/o FL IF they win both WI & OH & a few others like IA, PA, NM - all possible).
I see no way either Hillary or Obama carry Wisconsin OR Ohio. They will carry the metros but get killed in out-state. They can't get there via electoral college majority unless those two go blue.
"Not trying to incite political firestorm - just looking at the polls.
dryfly"
Oh, but you are. If you think the Dems are through, you forgot how many people want us out of Iraq. Whoever the Dem nominee is come Sept, the only issue we will hear will be IRAQ, IRAQ, IRAQ.
That is why the 2006 elections went the Dems way. The ONLY reason. That reason is stronger than ever with Mc100years.
The Dems can't lose this election, even if Fox polls show McCrock leading today.
It's not the economy, stupid, it's IRAQ, IRAQ, IRAQ.
This uber-wingnut actually said that we didn't need to conserve resources, because Jesus was coming back soon, and he'd take care of everything. I guess the doctrine of "creation stewardship," is lost on these guys.
Well, it's good to be skeptical. But of course we don't have to wonder about the motives of Think Progress, because they announce them explicitly on their website. On their home page, they clearly say What We're Fighting For, and What We're Fighting Against.
Funny thing is I couldn't care less who wins. I'm 40, pale white, male, balding (somewhat). I've voted my heart the past 2 elections only to see the country reject those choices.
Fine. The damage has been done as far as I'm concerned, and as a person who didn't take out a suicide loan this decade I find the present Republicans /slightly/ on the right side of the issue, relative to my interests.
Isn`t this the same baby (bovine)-face Alphonso Jackson you were so higly talking about, a while back?
I take it "you" in that sentence means "me."
In which case a lot of your comments are now explicable. You do not have enough of a grip on idiomatic written English to be able to decipher tone or irony.
Tanta said: "But if you're here only to list out every other person who has ever been incompetent or corrupt, please go away. The readers of this blog are not really interested in "HE DID IT TOO!" as an intellectual pursuit."
But please, does this have to turn into a "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy vs. The Liberal Media" thing. My Glod, those debates are so annoyingly pointless.
Oh, but you are. If you think the Dems are through, you forgot how many people want us out of Iraq. Whoever the Dem nominee is come Sept, the only issue we will hear will be IRAQ, IRAQ, IRAQ.
I was saying two years ago that the economy would have Iraq so far back in the paper it will be in with the coupons & obits. Everyone laughed at me then - not anymore.
And it isn't that Iraq went away - Sadr showed that this last weekend - its that the economy loomed larger. That SHOULD have helped the Dems but they've placed almost all their bet on an anti-Iraq reaction.
The election will be won/lost in Ohio between I 80 and the Ohio River (south of Cleveland & Toledo). Unless the Dems change focus - that won't be favorable for them.
Sorry, a little OT, but I just read the whole revamping of US financial system...
Since DHS worked out so well, let's take all those "specialized" regulators and stick them in one agency...there can't possibly be differences is expertise, I mean it's just money...
Oh, and rechauffe the usual "too much regulation" but repackage this microwave dinner as "revamping" our regulatory system...
Remember folks, it's all that regulatory streamlining that those foreigners are doing that has led to capital flight...so let's just smooth these inefficiencies and we'll all be competitive again...vomit, swallow...repeat.
dryfly said: "...And it isn't that Iraq went away - Sadr showed that this last weekend - it's that the economy loomed larger. That SHOULD have helped the Dems but they've placed almost all their bet on an anti-Iraq reaction.
The election will be won/lost in Ohio between I 80 and the Ohio River (south of Cleveland & Toledo). Unless the Dems change focus - that won't be favorable for them."
I'm finding it tough to escape your logic on this subject, although the implications are a little disheartening.
The Bush selectees as office holders are so incompetent, as a lot!!
Here's another kinder, gentler fraudster, with his steel fist in his probably religiously blessed glove... screw them, and when Obama takes over, arrest and prosecute them all.
By RACHEL L. SWARNS
Published: March 31, 2008
WASHINGTON Housing secretary Alphonso R. Jackson resigned on Monday, saying that he needed to devote more time to his family. The announcement came as federal authorities were investigating whether he had given lucrative housing contracts in the Virgin Islands and New Orleans to friends.
bovine-face is not really ad hominem, as it doesn't lead to "ugly, therefore must be wrong".
Ad hominem is usually a slightly related attack. For example, to say that X is card carrying member of the Favorite American Association (NRA, ACLU), and that should therefore disqualify any arguments from that person is ad hominem.
Ad hominem attacks are crafty, not stupid flames. Stupid flames get ignored by even morons, while well-crafted ad hominem attacks infect even normally thoughtful people. That is why they are so dangerous.
One popular ad hominem lately is that any politician who has accepted campaign contributions from any financial employees must be corrupt.
It doesn't logically follow. Especially in light of the high capital demand of campaigns and the present system. You will never have a candidate who hasn't, which leads to the false conclusion that they are all corrupt.
But please, does this have to turn into a "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy vs. The Liberal Media" thing. My Glod, those debates are so annoyingly pointless.
Cheers,
Misean
Not long ago homeowners (on different forums) were calling me a "doom & gloom lib" because I was arguing things weren't as bright as the seemed and housing was going to tank, taking the economy with it.
Now I'm a right-winger because I want to see people suffer a bit before they get their bailouts so on balance the burden of poor decisions weighs on those who made them.
You can't win... or lose.
I guess it all depends on what color your glasses are tinted and which forum you happen to be posting on.
So, calling someone a 'bovine face' would be an ad hominem. Got it.
It certainly might have been a species of ad hominem, if that is in fact what I had said and was arguing that the bovine face proved that the words coming out of the mouth were false.
However, "bovine" appears to be a bit of misremembering. In the interests of whatever it is we're trying to accomplish, here is the full text of what I think is the comment of mine in question:
Lowlight: Alphonso Jackson, whose soporific discourse leads the viewer's mind to abandon the struggle to pick content out of the bromides and focus instead on that oddly expressionless, smooth, unwrinkled, ageless baby face of his. What, you wonder, would it take to make this man look a little troubled? Armageddon?
I was certainly struck by his bland demeanor. I implied that it seemed a bit inappropriate in context. This reveals a preference of mine for people who openly acknowledge that we've got a real mess on our hands. Plus an inkling in my head that Jackson is just a smooth-talking con man. Now, I did not make that latter argument. I would have done so if requested to. But I will only say here that I think the facial expression, demeanor, and spoken style of a person matters if "con man" is on the table as a possibility. Plus, anyone who is capable of creating a Shrine in the lobby of his own larger-than-life images is vulnerable to a certain chuckling over his stage "presence."
It's Tanta material. Really. Like it's intrinsically good to just cram everything under one umbrella ignoring the reality that some things, financials in this case, can really have different structures that must be understood and regulated by different departments of specialist...not saying one way or the other, but that's the implicit MBA logic...we'll we could just synergize everything...Ben, get the synergy ray, set to Conflation! bzzzz...
you need only look at the democratic race to see that.
Hillary way ahead, and then Obama, and then Hillary again, etc.
currently the Dems are bashing each other, while McCain has nothing to do. so his polling #'s look better.
but once the dems choose their candidate, then the attacks will sling towards McCain.
not saying he will/will not win, just saying.
And I have family in rural northeast MN/northwest WI.
in every single past election they talked about "values" and assigned those to the 'pubs. My sister's pastor told them that it was a sin to vote for Al Gore last time.
This time is different. The religious rural northern WI/MN folk are talking about it being a sin to attack other countries, and the greed associated with the bubble (they're getting hit hard up there) and so on...
a lot of religious people don't find McCain very religious either... so he may not win them over.
in the past people from Ohio could be expected to vote against their economic interest if there were a moral cause that were more important... I'm not so sure this time.
yeah but Al Gore is fat and Bill Clinton lied about oral sex and tried to kill Bin Laden to distract from the impeachment hearings (which of course were FAR more important), so the Democrats are just as bad.
The election will be about the economy, and how it got that way, namely:
The War
Katrina
No-bid contracts
Crony capitalism
Tax breaks for the wealthy
Incompetence
Illegal immigration
Outsourcing
Deficit spending
Marcus Aurelius | 03.31.08 - 1:08 pm | #
Dems don't have united policy planks for those issues either - that's the problem.
Dems will try to paint McCain as 'Same as Bush'... McCain will fight it. It is a strategy that will work for Dems in strongly blue areas... won't work at all (or be even counter-productive) in strongly red areas (Bush still has favorables >30 overall & >50 in some states)... and in between - who knows?
Its the in between where the battle is won/lost. I do NOT believe it will be enough to try to paint 'McCain = Bush' to carry most of these areas... Including downstate Ohio, Wisconsin, Missouri, Iowa... some of those places Dems have to win.
Yes, of course, partisanship does not necessarily make a claim false. I'm simply suggesting people be skeptical of partisan publications--and you can't get more blatant than posting a manifesto on your home page, as Think Progress has done. I would be much more persuaded by links to a newspaper like the Washington Post (which I consider completely reliable) or The New York Times, which I enjoy.
Skepticism about Think Progress doesn't necessarily mean they're wrong, either. But it's not an ad hominem attack to say so. A true ad hominem attack, which I am not making, but which some people unfortunately do make, would be pointing out that the eminent Paul Krugman of The New York Times, who's got a Ph.D. in economics from MIT, once served as an consultant to Enron, in 1999.
The election will be won/lost in Ohio between I 80 and the Ohio River (south of Cleveland & Toledo). Unless the Dems change focus - that won't be favorable for them. JMHO.
I'd like to say I disagree but I can't. The Dems are making one of their classic political blunders and it's going to cost them the WH. The east-cost liberal elite (and remember I'm one) of the party has banded together with the anti-Hillary crowd (of which Dean is one...he's still in pay-back mode) to back someone that can't appeal to the right demographics in the general election. Especially without the Hillary supporters who are going to vote for McCain in greater numbers than you think. I'm in MA, about as Dem as you can get, and I know not one person that is behind Hillary that plans to vote for Obama. Not one, and I have a pretty broad circle there, including some dem movers and shakers.
Obama is a darling of the exact kind of people that don't connect with the middle voter...an NPR-crowd type of person with a Harvard education. His speeches sound like a marketing blurb for a Web 2.0 product on a website where you're left wondering what the product actually does. Mr and Mrs worker bee aren't going to feel a connection there.
Joseph Stiglitz new book the $3 Trillion War is out new now. Do you want to explain to him that the real issue is the subprime economy? Good luck.
Kind of ties it all together, I think. The Dems need to concentrate on one topic which covers all others. IRAQ spending reduction will translate to more money to spend fixing the local problems, including possible mortgage solutions.
Sorry to keep this going, but you guys are wrong about that. IRAQ is the major issue, and politicians know this.
In fact, I think the Dems intentionally played out the pastor race card early to get it out of the Repubs Oct poker hand. They knew the Repubs were going to pull that out late to cause a stir, now it's out and they can go forward reminding everyone how the IRAQ war is the reason behind our deficits and the reason the American economy will continue to suffer.
Mc100years doesn't stand a chance when that message is replayed 500 times each week.
Just saying that I expect some surprises.
Yearning to learn | 03.31.08 - 1:16 pm | #
Me too. But before I pick an 'upset surprise' I want to see if the 'up setter' has game... so far I see no 'game' on any of those topics MA listed. Until that changes just not being Bush won't be enough in those 'purple' precincts.
--
I watched The Age Of American Unreason by Susan Jacoby last night on BOOK TV (I posted the alert on the blog).
As I said last night, Looks like many on this blog can use it.
Well, Ms Jacoby fully confirmed by conclusion that Americans are born-and-bred dopes because they are fed on junk thoughts. Junk food, junk thoughts, junk economy, junk political system, etc., are consistent with my own observations.
America IS a nation of born-and-bred dopes led by Crooks among the private sector and evildoers as top public officials. The housing bubble and its aftermath fully confirms these.
Conservatives using political office to loot and damage government they dislike in the first place seemed to start with Reagan. Is anyone else old enough to remember James Watt who founded an anti-environmental legal training foundation and was appointed Secretary of the Interior by Reagan?
I sure remember James Watt. The (politically) brilliant part of appointing this douchebag to run Interior, was that he was a lightning rod who attracted media attention with his frequent outrageous quotes, which distracted the media from what was really going on. The media can only keep so many stories in the air at one time, if you give them something to keep themselves busy you can quietly get away with all kinds of mischief.
You know what they say about Republicans: they claim government can't get anything right, then they get elected and prove it.
I understand that sometimes environmental regulations go too far; what depresses me about the GOP is that when they get in charge, they don't just seek to adjust environmental regulations to be more 'reasonable'; instead they seek to destroy the environment and environmental regulations.
Mirror
Picture of George III Bush
White Dawg named Suffer
Family? BS. Have the family stand up; they've just been identified in the public media and are entitled to get a little of the spotlight. Wanna see the cream of this Administration? No better than the Bush daughters or the Barbara Bush son. The religious right get their heroes; no sex, except in the public toilets and in the arms of gay prostitutes; and the public, who bought that crap, hook line & sinker, reap their rewards. Tragically, so do we all. Pass me the disinfectant; I'm sick from the spew.
I would be much more persuaded by links to a newspaper like the Washington Post (which I consider completely reliable)
Now I'm picking bits of my lunch off the keyboard again.
We would all be much more entertained if you clicked the link to the Think Progress post I provided, and then went through and clicked all the links TP provides within this post to all the articles, some of which are, um, from the WaPo, that back up its claims.
I posted this piece because it's a convenient summary of all the stories in one place.
I agree, El Cliffo, that you come across as a real partisan and should therefore be treated with a high degree of skepticism.
But please, does this have to turn into a "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy vs. The Liberal Media" thing. My Glod, those debates are so annoyingly pointless.
Didn't you hear? The VRWC aka Scaife now thinks Hillary is quite impressive.
First, upside down mortgages. Then, upside down politics. Whatever next?
They don't have to equate McCain with Bush. They simply have to equate the Republican party and failure at every level.
Everyone knows the entire legislature is a Democratic rout this time around. That's where the politics is local and the Republican failure will feel the retribution. The huge mistake of the Democrats, and you can see this already, is to over-reach on this incompetence, and start proposing huge programs and bail-outs over the economy. It plays really well in Boston, but in Ohio bailing out people that bought 500k homes is not going to work. So you're going to have people with second thoughts of putting in a Democratic president with an overwhelmingly Democratic congress.
McCain's war cred just cements the base and reaches into middle-America's values. But this election is not going to be won on the war issues, and if it were, McCain is a slam-dunk because of that segment.
They knew the Repubs were going to pull that out late to cause a stir, now it's out and they can go forward reminding everyone how the IRAQ war is the reason behind our deficits and the reason the American economy will continue to suffer.
And that brings the automotive component plant back to Zanesville how?
That's the question the folks in downstate want answered... it isn't even getting addressed.
JJ, I recommend you change your epithet here, unless you really do mean that Americans in general have a lower IQ potential at birth.
I do agree with you to some extent that various subcultures inculcate stupidity into their members (I'm thinking of the urban gangsta subculture and its the mirror image Christian Fundamentalists).
We are not a "nation" of dopes, however, and to over-generalize like you do just makes you look like . . . a autodogmatic, ranting dope with nothing interesting to say.
Hjalmar Schacht formed the limited liability company Metallurgische Forschungsgesellschaft, m.b.H., or "MEFO" for short. The company's "mefo bills" served as bills of exchange, convertible into Reichsmark upon demand. MEFO had no actual existence or operations and was solely a balance sheet entity. The bills were mainly issued as payment to armaments manufacturers.
"Especially without the Hillary supporters who are going to vote for McCain in greater numbers than you think."
No way. Hillary's supporters are the most die-hard liberal Dems there are. They couldn't vote Republican if they tried. It's all talk. Obama has crossover, but even the moderate Repubs who like him will be unlikely to support McCain if it's Hillary.
That tough Hillary-Obama supporter talk is just talk. It's interesting that so many here are buying into it all.
Do you people really think those Dem supporters are going to cross party lines? After these last 8 years? What a crock!
and more from ipodius "Mr and Mrs worker bee aren't going to feel a connection there."
Sure, they'd rather support Johnny boy and his 'no help' for the foreclosure ridden Ohio communities.
WTF??
It doesn't take a 2 hour speech to explain the inconsistencies, it takes 2 sentences. The Dems have to work VERY hard to lose this election. Possible? Yes. But very, very improbable.
"And that brings the automotive component plant back to Zanesville how?
That's the question the folks in downstate want answered... it isn't even getting addressed."
I disagree. Hillary has talked about redoing NAFTA and CAFTA.
it has CNBC in cold shakes. Larry Kudlow has a seizure every time he plays that tape.
I'm not saying that redoing NAFTA will bring the jobs back. but a lot of people in the industrial belt believe that it will.
--
"When one party stays in power for too long this is what happens."
Sorry, Crispy, it had nothing to do with any party. Pox on both their houses. It is a ploy for blind faithful of one party to blame the other and vice versa. The two-party system is a scam (blame the other!).
The whole American system is corrupt to the bone. The population has been corrupted. The cancer of financial immorality (deception and manipulation as the way to get ahead in the race for money and sex) has been spreading and one day the system will die, i.e., collapse. The only question is when. My forecast is before 2030.
His speeches sound like a marketing blurb for a Web 2.0 product on a website where you're left wondering what the product actually does. Mr and Mrs worker bee aren't going to feel a connection there.
If Joe America doesn't like Obama, they are more than welcome to vote for McCain. No skin off my nose, either way.
Including downstate Ohio, Wisconsin, Missouri, Iowa... some of those places Dems have to win.
FWIW I was back in Iowa the past two weeks and unless things start to tank hard and fast, the economy will probably not be as huge a concern. The farmers are doing pretty well (OK, well for farmers), and there didn't seem to be much slowdown in the state spending.
Of course this is the same state that managed to elect Steve King (and Gopher too).
ipodius "The Dems are making one of their classic political blunders and it's going to cost them the WH"
Agreed. More than 1/2 of Hillary supporters will switch teams in the ballot box if Obama represents the party. This election could easily be a Dukakis 2.0. If Obama is the golden child it'll be McCain's election to lose.
I don't consider ad hominem attacks to be as unreasonable as others seem to. Obviously, if we're talking about the debating equivalent of the Marquess of Queensbury rules, ad hominem attacks are not allowed. Also, many of the people who use them do so because they're unable or unwilling to effectively debate the issue on its merits.
However, from a Bayesian point of view, if a given person's ideas have been 90% crap, then prima facie there's a 90% likelihood that the last thing to have come out of his mouth was crap. The argument against ad hominem attacks thus boils down to "Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn sometimes."
Note that I'm talking about arguments concerning the provenance of ideas and the intellectual history of their authors. Mere name-calling ("Bovine face!") really cheapens a debate.
Heck, most of us are here because of an ad hominem judgement; Tanta and CR are believed more likely than the average blogosphere wanker to produce insightful and enlightening posts.
McCain's war cred just cements the base and reaches into middle-America's values. But this election is not going to be won on the war issues, and if it were, McCain is a slam-dunk because of that segment.
ipodius | 03.31.08 - 1:28 pm | #
Ipod - I've always suggested people do 'cultural exchanges'... you know leave their home in say suburban Orange County CA or SF or Greenwich Conn and go somewhere exotic to learn about new and different cultures... someplace like Ross County OH or Scott County Missouri. If they did - these elections & electoral college outcomes wouldn't be such a surprise.
Ralph, I don't think the general exhortation to "consider the source" is "ad hominem."
In fact, El Cliffo didn't start out with the claim that it was a "partisan" source.
He started out with the claim that a different post on that website involved a big mistake and had to be retracted and apologized for. We were invited to conclude that therefore this post is likely to be false. That's what makes it "ad hominem."
As far as people who think "ad hominem" is just "insults," I can't help you. It is a kind of logical fallacy, not a mere offense against good taste. You might dislike the latter, as well, but the term "ad hominem" isn't what you want there.
America's first President George Washington, did not belong to a political party. This made him America's only independent (not affiliated with a party) president. Most of America's founding fathers were opposed to political parties, and wanted none of them in the U.S.
America's first political party was the Federalist Party founded by Alexander Hamilton in 1792. The Federalists favored a strong central government ruled by a wealthy educated elite, a national bank, strong military, treaty with Britain, and fewer rights for states and most citizens. Federalists controlled the government until 1801. George Washington supported many Federalist policies. America's second President John Adams was a member of the Federalist Party.
America's second political party was the Democratic-Republican Party, founded by Thomas Jefferson and James Madison in 1792 in order to oppose the policies of the Federalists. The emergence of the Democratic-Republican Party marked the beginning of the U.S. two-party system. Jefferson was reluctant to create a party because he was opposed to political parties in general because of their power struggles for control of the government, but he felt that founding an opposition party was the best way to protect the rights of citizens from the consolidation of power in the federal government that the Federalists favored. The Democratic-Republican Party opposed the treaty with Britain, defended the Constitution, denounced the national bank, and promoted citizen's and states' rights. It became the dominant political party in the United States from 1800 until the 1820s, when it split into competing factions, one of which became the modern-day Democratic Party.
Therefore, the two party system in the U.S. occurred to prevent one party from gaining too much power, by creating a second party with opposite policies.
Ross County? Good God,You want to get the visitors shot as interlopers??? I grew up in a very rural area of Ohio. I still have friends all over the state. Dumping some poor bastard from the OC or NYC in somewhere like Maynard,OH (Look it up) just isn't fair...Yes,as a good ol country boy I lived in the OC and have traveled the world...
I doubt Hillary supporters will vote McCain. We'll see. In any event, we still have debates between the nominees. McCain vs. either Dem will be a disaster for McCain.
"Agreed. More than 1/2 of Hillary supporters will switch teams in the ballot box if Obama represents the party. barely"
That's such BS. Hillary's supporters are the most pie-eyed liberal Dems that there are. She is more left wing than a Michael Moore party list.
Her supporters are playing games. I'll bet that not one single Hillary supporter would switch to vote Repulican. Not one. The only lesbian voting Republican is that Cheney daughter. That is a game of chicken, and you are buying it.
Are you in reality anymore? Do you know that Bill only won in 1992 because of the independent vote going to Perot. No H. Ross, no Clinton. It wasn't the Clinton cross-over appeal.
you know leave their home in say suburban Orange County CA or SF or Greenwich Conn and go somewhere exotic to learn about new and different cultures... someplace like Ross County OH or Scott County Missouri.
Honestly. I sit in amazement at what the Democrats are now doing. They have learned nothing from the Dukakas/Kerry humiliations and are running down the same road again. And they could do that if they didn't have Hillary as the other contender, who DOES appeal to this very segment.
Well, the best thing about this is that the liberal wing of the party will end up as destroyed as the nut-job wing of the Republicans over this. And perhaps that will help the party as a whole.
a lot of H supporters will be better off economicially with a repbulican president. but they are idealists and usually go with democrats. However there is a strong resentment among those H supporters that entire left wing is working against H. This will make it much easier for those supporters to cross the line or not vote. I simply don't see THE UNITER can unite them.
BTW, there is still a chance that H will compete as an independent if Mr. Bloomberg provides financial support. It is a very very long shot.
you can say to heck with all this political stuff..cause we here at CR are all about real property and economics.
but don't fool yourself...it's all about politics.
it' pretty up front that liberals "like" government and want to make it work for the average person (yes they do have their wealthy patrons too or would never get in power) and they have their thieves
neo-cons hate government, want to aggravate any inherent dis-functionalities in government, shrink it to the size it can be strangled in a bathtub and raid it's resources, land, money, etc for the benefit of private contractors and friends.
their are good conservatives out there...i have voted for more than a few...
the current crop in power are neo-cons and as corrupt as any i've seen in over 50 years.
if our economic system is to survive we need a reasonably regulated market system. excesses to the left or right, will destroy us.
I've never thought of the possibility that a Hillary supporter would vote for McCain.
I'll have to start talking to people. this idea had never occurred to me before.
(I've never heard anybody say that before).
I don't follow politics much, is this a consensus or something? was a poll done?
I honestly cannot believe that a Hillary supporter will vote for McCain.
the reverse argument:
did anybody honestly believe Rush Limbaugh or Ann Coulter as example when Ann said she'd vote for Hillary if McCain won the nomination?
no way. it played well when there were other 'pubs around... but not anymore.
freebirdinblue writes:
"...a lot of H supporters will be better off economicially with a repbulican president..."
Did you just wake up from an 8 year coma, or something?
The Republicans know nothing about economics. They know only corruption, cronyism, and graft. "better off economicially with a repbulican president..." You crack me up!
Troy-McCain-It won't be skin falling off your nose, it will be much worse and more of a chance that maybe you not alive to feel it anyways.
McCain will go into Iran and start the third world war..Warmongers do this...
As a republican I would never vote for him. We need someone to bring us together over these next 4 years or look out. I'll vote for youth, as they have a outlook to the future, old crooked men could care less about it, they would rather have kill youth by wielding power..
Obama is how my daughter would vote, so I'll vote for her here..
BTW, there is still a chance that H will compete as an independent if Mr. Bloomberg provides financial support. It is a very very long shot.
Isn't that funny. I heard rumblings about this at a lunch last week...H enlisting Bloomberg on an Independent ticket. That would be the end of Obama for sure. There is a lot of bad blood in the party that is playing out. Which is dumb, as they should be concentrating on trying to cement the power-base for a long Democratic rule. As usual, they are not picking the best solution (an H/O ticket that would ensure 16 years in the WH barring any catastrophe) but are pandering to the very liberal wing.
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
What is this "two party system" everyone keeps imagining?
Now come on, did anybody claim these parties were materially different?
Maybe they're just two different parties of beady-eyed politicians pretending to have different beliefs since there's not enough room in the political system for everybody at the same time.
there are a lot of Hillary Supporters (the so-called "liberal elite" or "limoliberals") who are affluent but who feel a social responsibility or at least believe in govt intervention
that govt intervention will hurt them personally in many cases, but they "believe" in it.
by voting for Hill, they are voting for higher taxation on themselves
thus, they would be (short term) better off under W or McCain where they get more tax breaks.
longer term is harder to fathom. (degradation of our infrastructure, environmental problems, etc etc etc)
Agreed. More than 1/2 of Hillary supporters will switch teams in the ballot box if Obama represents the party. This election could easily be a Dukakis 2.0. If Obama is the golden child it'll be McCain's election to lose.
Barley,
It's this sort of logic that always twists up the democratic primaries.. I remember when John Kerry was "the best choice" because he was a decorated veteran. That fact didn't seem to matter.
Either people are ready for "it" or they aren't. People weren't ready in 2004.. maybe they are ready today.
But, it will have little to do with whether or not Hillary Clinton or Barak Obama is running.
Surely, this is just for giggles, no? The fed organize a nationalization instead of a Japan-style "drawn-out response, where ailing banks were propped up in a half-public limbo for years." But that kind of moral hazard inducing paralysis is what the Fed does best.
Marcus, if you read what I write, you can figure out that I don't just know H supporters but people able to discuss strategy. You can take what I say as you will.
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
Ipodius,
I doubt it.. right now, people may be all fired up. But, as humans, we tend to get over things a lot faster than we imagine.
Clinton supporters may pout for 4 - 6 weeks if she loses the nomination.. but they'll recover. (Unless they're some serious racist types.. I guess. hehe.. is that ad hominem? it's a conditional statement..)
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
ipodius | 03.31.08 - 1:53 pm | #
This is the first time in my life I can't remember my parents not helping the democratic party. No fund raisers,phone calls,no checks cut...This from people who have been dem all their lives. For sure this will not be a dull election...
"I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done."
Keep on saying it. You will never admit that you were wrong, of course. Plus, you have no proof.
And those of us who actively know Hillary supporters, know very well they would never vote Republican. Maybe they won't vote for Obama. Too bad, I don't believe that either. They are definitely voters against Republicans. I know that from experience, too. They won't vote McCain. That's pure bullshit.
Brings up a question: if I'm an investor, do I believe that the ROI in the US financial system is high, medium, low, or negative given Nationalization of banking? That's the question. Forget about nationalization good/bad, can the US do it and make my returns higher? Would I want to invest in that type of economy? O.k. so I invest in other emerging command economies with good results, but do I want an interventionist Fed gov? Forget moral hazard, we jumped that shark...I know, a cold, nasty lense to look through...
Where did this guy come from? And is/was he another "window dressing black" for the present administration? What explains choosing him in the first place?
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
ipodius | 03.31.08 - 1:53 pm | #
i disagree. in all my years of active participation in politics, including holding low level elective office and working on campaigns, mostly democrat, one nonpartisan, and one republican...i have never seen so much antipathy towards he republican party as i have witnessed the past two years.
Clinton and Obama supporters will not cross the aisle in significant numbers to vote for McCain, unless something DRASTIC, UGLY and NEW is trotted out before our eyes.
EURO inflation at 3.5%...go long on the Euro. Dollar will go down more...this is getting very serious since Fed counted on coordinating international central banks...not happening.
Lowlight: Alphonso Jackson, whose soporific discourse leads the viewer's mind to abandon the struggle to pick content out of the bromides and focus instead on that oddly expressionless, smooth, unwrinkled, ageless baby face of his. What, you wonder, would it take to make this man look a little troubled? Armageddon?
Given that description, it is a sign of the utter lack of justice in the world, that the pictures of Jackson in the lobby were not simultaneously aging, becoming dissipated and evil-looking as the years of his tenure progressed.
Any Democrat is going to revise the tax code significantly. With the rich paying lots more. Even McCain might be forced into something of the sort. The extremely pro-rich tax policy of the Bush administration will simply have to change in any case.
I see no way either Hillary or Obama carry Wisconsin OR Ohio.
But what if Al Gore is the nominee?
Your analysis is sound, but I think you may be underestimating the importance of Florida.
Not that it matters much. The Democratic nominee, whoever she is, will simply run against Bush, not McCain. And I think it will work. I believe we are about to witness a sea change that will kick the Republicans out of power for at least 20 years; i.e., until the Democrats become just as lazy and corrupt as they were when they held all the cards.
As a non-fruitcake libertarian, there is simply no existing party for me to support. (Although I cannot understand why I do not dislike Obama... But I don't. Must be the Volcker endorsement.)
Now THAT explains everything. Did you register Dem to vote for Hillary in the primary, too?
LOL...I love the way everyone reads a statement without thinking about it. I'm from a very old NE Republican family. I've been one since before the wingnuts took over the party. And I vote for whomever is best, not by party.
Actually Hillary and Bill before her were classically Republican in their politics. It's just the Republicans went wacko, forcing me to mostly vote for Democrats. And I have to admit I would vote for H in the general election in a heartbeat. Not a prayer I'd vote for O. We've had 8 years of empty talk and "uniting".
And Marcus, you can tell yourself that all you want. If it makes you feel better. It won't alter the facts, however.
Given that description, it is a sign of the utter lack of justice in the world, that the pictures of Jackson in the lobby were not simultaneously aging, becoming dissipated and evil-looking as the years of his tenure progressed.
I was originally inclined toward the "Stepford Secretary" theory, but "The Picture of Dorian HUD" has potential. Perhaps that's one of the pictures that is not in the lobby.
Something that ought to happen doesn't mean it will. We could lower taxes, borrow more, provide fewer services and zimbabwe the dollar. We ought not too, doesn't mean either party won't do it...it could even be bi-partisan since it would inflate away our foreign debt.
Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson announces the biggest overhaul of financial regulations since the Great Depression in Monday during a speech at the Treasury Department.
"Isn't that funny. I heard rumblings about this at a lunch last week...H enlisting Bloomberg on an Independent ticket. That would be the end of Obama for sure."
ipodius,
It isn't about Obama. It's about the Iraq war. It should continue. Too many powerful people are making billions out of it. Thus McCain must win. Hillary will serve as a decoy like Ralph Nader did.
Imagine some of you make 12 billion/month. What would you do to keep that war alive ?
Reading opinions of people who think Hillary supporters are the "liberal elite," is most edifying, in that it reveals the world will never run out of new ways to completely waste my time.
That said, I don't see how it's unfair to point out that Jackson represented a personnel policy, not a personnel mistake.
Spitzer was a personnel mistake. His foibles were not the reason he was hired (by New York voters), who in fact wanted an arm-twisting, name-taking anti-corruption crusader, rather than a hypocritical john.
Jackson was exactly what the Bush administration wanted, part of a policy demonstrated by every other one of their hires.
Baruza,
I doubt the international business editor of the UK's highest selling quality newspaper is likely to publish something like this for giggles. Just my opinion.
Add to this Mishkin's commentary on zero bound and that Fed SWAT teams are not just a proposal but are already in operation, you're faced with an interesting possible view to the near future.
The irony is that higher inflation should be BEARISH for a currency.
ac,
yes, I invest where the monetary policy will trend to raise interest rates verses investing where monetary policy attempts to devalue my investment...long on Euro for me...beats the dollar until the dollar hits the bottom, and it hasn't hit the bottom.
Nobles, oh I'm in agreement as I hope the end of my last post made clear. I just can't see the Fed acting to buck the bankers in such a drastic manner, something that would require the support of an at least semi-independent legislature. Very hard to imagine that kind of thing happening in America.
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
ipodius | 03.31.08 - 1:53 pm | #
The reverse is equally true - I do NOT see the black base turning out for Hillary after a scorched earth primary vanquishing of Obama - and at this point that is what it will take - scorched earth.
Listen to Cobra's parents speaking - those are the fold they have to bring back in... I don't see it happening.
McCain won't win in a electoral college landslide due to the almost stone like red-blue divide... but he won't be challenged much UNLESS he does something stooopid.
The sad truth,'' he writes,is that subprime is just the first big boulder in an avalanche of asset writedowns that will rattle on through much of 2008.''
Expect the landslide to cascade through high-yield bonds, commercial mortgages, leveraged loans, credit cards and -- the big unknown -- credit-default swaps, Morris says. The notional value for those swaps, which are meant to insure bondholders against default, covered about $45 trillion in portfolios as of mid-2007, up from some $1 trillion in 2001, he writes.
Morris sketches a scenario in which hedge fund counterparty defaults would ripple through default swap markets, triggering writedowns of insured portfolios, demands for collateral, and a rush to grab cash from defaulting guarantors. The credit system would suffer an utter thrombosis,'' he says, making the subprime crisislook like a walk in the park.''
As bankers and regulators try to prop up the ``Yertle the Turtle-like unstable tower of debt,'' Morris points to two previous episodes of lost market confidence.
While there are no recorded incidents of them goose stepping or giving the "Heil Hitler" salute, the short answer to the question is yes. Both Bush's grandfather's palled around with sympathizers to the Nazi cause, with George Herbert Walker the worse of the two and grandfather Prescott Bush even worse as he dealt with Nazi Germany before and during WWII.
The Bushes don't like to talk about their past, and much of the early information comes from George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography by Webster G. Tarpley and Anton Chaitkin. While the book's origins are suspect and the authors tend to go off on wild LaRouchian rants, the basic research has held up to scrutiny since business dealings and government actions are a matter of public record. Note: I don't have Cecil Adam's resources, staff or salary, and all sources are from the web.
George Herbert Walker married off his daughter to Prescott Bush. It was a good arrangement for both: Prescott married into money and financial connections; the Walkers rose in society and power. A standard trade-off. George Herbert Walker isn't listed as a member of the Skull and Bones Society at Yale, but future son-in-law Prescott is, and the son and grandson named after him are, as are the Bush's who were his grandson and great-grandson. Aside: The Skull and Bones Society itself has been the subject of much speculation especially about the Bushes, and the real story is as interesting, but an entirely different column.
In 1919, Missouri deal-maker Bert Walker became the president and CEO of the W.A. Harriman and co. bank, which became one of the largest companies in the world. In 1922, the Harriman company set up a branch in Berlin under the residency of George H. Walker. In 1924, the Harriman company spun off the Union Banking Corporation [Wikipedia entry on Union Banking Corporation], also run by Bert. The UBC was established to send American capital to Germany to finance the reorganization of its industry under the Nazis. Their leading German partner was the notorious Nazi industrialist Fritz Thyssen, who wrote a book admitting much of this called "I Paid Hitler." [quoted here] An article called Nazis In The Attic states boldly, "Walker was one of Hitler's most powerful financial supporters in the United States." and gives other details.
Samuel Prescott Bush, father to Prescott, was an Ohio manufacturer and close advisor to President Herbert Hoover. During WWI, Samuel was director of the facilities division of the US War Industries Board under Bernard Baruch. In 1920, Harriman and Bert Walker gain control of the German Hamburg-Amerika Line, said to be the world's largest private shipping line which had been confiscated by the US after the war [part of long blog posting here]. Still, while many of his business deals are with shady people who were more involved with the Nazis, Samuel himself wasn't a major player.
Prescott Bush was a major player. In addition to having ties with most of his father-in-laws friends (notably the Harrimans) and companies (notably the Union Banking Corporation), Bert hired Prescott to supervise the new Thyssen/Flish Consolidated Silesian Steel Corporation and the Upper Silesian Coal and Steel Company. John Loftus, a former Justice Department prosecutor whose latest series of lectures is on The Truth About Terrorism, has published a number of books about the Nazis and WWII. The page on Loftus' site linked above is from a Clamor magazine article by Toby Rogers entitled Heir to the Holocaust and also says, "Prescott Bush became managing director of UBC and handled the day-to-day operations of the new German economic plan. Bush's shares in UBC peaked with Hitler's new German order. But while production rose, cronyism did as well." and "According to classified documents from Dutch intelligence and US government archives, President George W. Bush's grandfather, Prescott Bush made considerable profits off Auschwitz slave labor." Rogers says this information came from "A Dutch intelligence agent in 1941," before we were at war with Germany. While the companies were seized by the Germans during the war, claims Cecil, Rogers points out that Prescott was eventually paid $1.5 million for his interest in UBC after Thyssen died and the companies assets were unfrozen.
Dealing with Nazi Germany, and even financing Hitler, may have been ethically and morally repugnant, even at the time, but they weren't illegal until Hitler declared war on the US. Six days after Pearl Harbor, FDR signed the Trading With the Enemies Act. By then, most (though not all) of the companies that had been doing business with Hitler's war machine had stopped. But not Prescott Bush and the Union Banking Corporation. Writes Rogers, "Prescott Bush continued with business as usual, aiding the Nazi invasion of Europe and supplying resources for weaponry that would eventually be turned on American soldiers in combat against Germany." }
Oil reversed earlier losses to trade back above $106 as a further fall in the dollar overshadowed an easing of tensions in the key Iraqi oil port of Basra.
Dollar weakness has encouraged investors to buy into crude, as funds look to hedge against a tumbling currency, inflation concerns and widespread financial weakness. The dollar has slipped to a low of $1.5895 against the euro this afternoon.
McCain won't win in a electoral college landslide due to the almost stone like red-blue divide... but he won't be challenged much UNLESS he does something stooopid.
The interesting thing to note is that, in the states with the most electoral votes and the ones with the closest red/blue numbers, H won. But I'm in total agreement with you dryfly. And as the current occupant demonstrated a win is a win, no matter how close. I just don't understand the Dems strategy at all with O. The more things look unstable, the more people will run to the guy that looks like (grand)Dad.
Instead of a weak and vacillating Government, a single, purposeful, energetic personality is ruling today.
Hjalmar Schacht
The German future lies in the hands of our Fuehrer.
Hjalmar Schacht
After the many rumours that we had heard about Hitler and the published criticisms we had read about him, we were pleasantly impressed. His appearance was neither pretentious nor affected.
Hjalmar Schacht
And I think the American people look to the leaders to lead. They look to the leaders to take on the big problems. And the president deserves a lot of credit for doing that.
John W. Snow
We continue to have a strong dollar policy; we continue to support the strong dollar policy. It's been our policy and will continue to be our policy.
John W. Snow
Well, I make a practice of not commenting on the role of the relative exchange value of our currency.
John W. Snow
The rich in general did far better under Clinton than they have under W. even though W. did everything he could to favor them. Under Clinton, though, the rest of the country also did far better, so on a relative basis, the rich did not do as well under Clinton. Why did the rich do well under Clinton? The S&P grew at a CAGR of 16% under Clinton, and 0% under Bush. The performance of the stock portfolio is more important to your wealth if you have lots of wealth than a few points on your marginal tax rate.
I was referring to Broker's 'bovine' comment, not your description of Jackson from the earlier thread.
I'm no fan of A-Jax. On the contrary - he has demonstrated himself to be petty, vain, and of marginal intellectual capacity on many occasions. But with so many substantive criticisms available, it seems beneath any of us to resort to nothing more than name-calling.
I was hoping to punk him so much better than that. But if he's just another bald, retired golfer now - there's no sport in that.
The most recent national polls show Obama beats McCain. McCain isn't unelectable, but between his support for the Iraq War and a economic plan that consists solely of cutting corporate taxes (literally!) he has a huge hill to climb whatever the election is fought over. When people start looking at what a McCain administration would do his numbers will drop substantially. Also, if Obama is the nominee don't underestimate the power of the unprecedented political machine he's constructed. He's going to have something like a million volunteers backed by half a billion dollars. There has never been anything like that in American politics. He won the 1992 Senate election for Carol Mosely Braun with a voter registration drive, and he had nothing like the resources he'll have this year.
The News of the World reported that Mosley, 67, paid five prostitutes 2,500 pounds in cash and then engaged in an orgy that lasted almost five hours.
Spitzer and Paulson have not commented about this situation which involved Nazi role- playing which many believe to be linked to the Shanghai stock market and new labor laws in China.
The Electoral College is all uphill for the Dems. With O as the nominee McCain could actually take California. Game over. Not that it maters, being merely competitive in CA drains far too many resources for O to win elsewhere. While H can safely ignore CA as hers except for writing checks she gives up near all the swing states in exchange. The Dems should just be grateful that the popular former Governor of Florida is saddled with an unfortunate last name and thus beyond Rep VP consideration. Lieberman's endorsement tells you how middle america will turn regardless.
This year will really come down to voter turn-out vs cross-over votes. Conservative turn-out will be low for McCain. H turnout will be low for O supporters and vice versa. The question then becomes how many of these dis-affected supporter will cross over or just hold their nose and vote party lines and say the h--k with it.
I don't think anyone can tell today how that mix will play out. There might be some idea in Sept/Oct but there won't be many rabid/passionate supporters on either side who can make the difference.
Remember when something like this would have been a major scandal with whole weeks of news coverage devoted to it?
Yeah.... good times.
When one party stays in power for too long this is what happens.
So I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that Tanta is not a big fan of Mr. Jackson.
Hey look, it's "First things First" in action.
Get rid of the people who screwed things up?
Sounds like a great first step to me.
That monument to Jackson's ego was a firing offense in and of itself. Feel, feel for the poor HUD employees who had to look at that while going to work every day.
There isn't enough rope for the Bush administration.
So I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that Tanta is not a big fan of Mr. Jackson.
I thought I hid it so well under my even-tempered persona.
Mr. Jackson was the big cheerleader for zero-down FHA loans, and a huge defender of the "DAP" dealie (let the builders make the down payment!).
I'm guessing that Mr. Frank wasn't going to let loose with the next FHA appropriation until Mr. Jackson decided to spend more time with the wife and kiddies.
Feel, feel for the poor HUD employees who had to look at that while going to work every day.
I'd bet my next paycheck that they had to hire a janitor dedicated to wiping the spit off it every evening.
Also, Jackson was recently in China urging them to buy MBS et al.
That's what happens when a country embraces FACISM.
Feel, feel for the poor HUD employees who had to look at that while going to work every day.
hopefully the HUD workerbees will take those photos out to the parking lot today, light them on fire, and have a weenie roast to improve morale.
Believe me... It's best for all of us here if we don't know how much that shrine cost.
But bacon, wouldn't lighting the photos on fire already be a weenie roast?
A quote you won't see on ThinkRegression
"There are...people out there who are so financially distressed that simply getting a 'Yes' is the most important thing for them, and the faster you can get to 'Yes', the more quickly you've given them the major aspect of the product that they want"
Another exemplar of the Bush doctrine: fill the ranks with loyalists, who in return for obeisance may rape the treasury. When will this administration pay for its malfeasances?
Corruption, cronyism, incompetence. Those will be the watchwords for the last eight years. This is just another example.
crispy&cole writes:
When one party stays in power for too long this is what happens.
crispy&cole | Homepage | 03.31.08 - 12:07 pm | #
Looking at the polls I've seen - unless something huge changes - that party will have the WH for at least four more... replacing Jackson with likes of Phil Gramm.
Not trying to incite political firestorm - just looking at the polls.
Think Progress is the outfit which accused McCain of plagiarism last week, and had to issue an embarrassing retraction.
Think Progress » EXCLUSIVE: McCain’s Foreign Affairs Speech Plagiarizes 1996 Address By Adm. Timothy Ziemer (UPDATED)
p.s. I hope the photos can find a new home in the George Bush Presidential Library and Museum.
You are doing a heck of a job Alpohonso!
Think Progress is the outfit which accused McCain of plagiarism last week, and had to issue an embarrassing retraction.
You mean "had the guts to issue an embarrassing retraction"?
As opposed to continuing to harp on a no-there-there story until enough people were convinced that it's true?
Your post is the most classic example of "ad hominem" I think I've ever seen. And in the context of a Bush appointee who has never yet admitted to having made a single mistake, it's like Total Irony Overload.
This has been a long time coming. Too long.
Yep, there's trouble alright. Trouble that starts with T and rhymes with P that stands for Philly.
It's the way business is done here. A couple of years ago the ex-mayor's brother got into some sort of real pantyknot for trying to finagle a no-bid contract for the airport. But it's all so mundane, it hardly merits a stir.
Sort of a mini-Bush administration - get into office, help out all your friends and family.
Your post is the most classic example of "ad hominem" I think I've ever seen. And in the context of a Bush appointee who has never yet admitted to having made a single mistake, it's like Total Irony Overload.
Tanta | 03.31.08 - 12:29 pm | #
I think THINK PROGRESS should embarrassingly apologize for posting that picture... NOW that would be progress. Either that or provide coupons for 'brain bleach'...
"Not trying to incite political firestorm - just looking at the polls."
C'mon dryfly...polls in March don't matter. Tell me what the polls are saying when we get to September!
Fanta:
RE: El Cliffo | 03.31.08 - 12:22 pm
Thank You.
dryfly-
It does not matter who wins anyway, the political system is corrupt and the losers will be the citizens who are not part of the crony capitalists system we currently have.
crispy&cole writes:
When one party stays in power for too long this is what happens.
crispy&cole | Homepage | 03.31.08 - 12:07 pm
If you check your history, I think you'll see that this stuff happens every time a particular party is in power.
Nixon should have never been pardoned.
Time to build the gibbets.
It's a question of choosing one's sources of information. If they show signs of being unreliable, a practical course is to be skeptical of what that publication reports. The Los Angeles Times had to issue an embarrassing retraction last week, too, over a story concerning rappers and the rap industry.
EL CLIFFO-
Has the Bush Admin issued an apology for going to war for WMD and never finding any? There are 4,000 families who pay for that lie!
Flashback, Bill Clinton's HUD chief Henry Cisneros pleads guilty: Washingtonpost.com: The Cisneros Probe: Key Stories
Heckuva job, Alphonso.
dryfly --
Not trying to incite political firestorm - just looking at the polls.
Polls are meaningless at this stage. (Especially national polls, since our Presidential election is not national.)
The only "poll" worth watching is Intrade. And right now, the punters are giving the Republicans a 40% chance of keeping the White House. Think they are wrong? Then by all means, take their money! You can have a 150% return in 8 months if you are right.
Me, I think 40% is way too high. And yeah, I have money on it.
I am often called liberal, but I also have done some work in the government housing area and can tell you one thing: if HUD disappeared today, it would probably do more to HELP HUD's mission than hurt it.
I'd much rather go to a source of information that has the integrity to issue retractions than one that does not.
So, you don't read The New Republic or watch CBS News, right?
CORRECTION: As a blog that strives to maintain credibility and transparency, we would like to explain our mistake. When we were alerted to the tip that Adm. Ziemer gave a similar speech in 1996, we searched LexisNexis and McCains campaign site for whether the senator used the disputed phrases before that time. We did not find anything. After we published the post, the McCain campaign contacted us and pointed to a speech given by the senator in 1995, which appears on McCains Senate site. As soon as we were alerted to the error, we rushed to publish a correction. Once again, we regret the error, and we apologize for it.
You mean like this? I'm sure littlegreenfootballs, redstate and the like are littered with these. After all, that's what responsibility is all about, innit?
It's a question of choosing one's sources of information.
Yes. And you we don't know from any other recent drive-by commenter who seems to show up only to toss off one-liners. We therefore suspect your motives.
Especially when you can't issue a correction for having played the ad-hominem card.
I for one have some skepticism about anything ElCliffo reports.
El Cliffo writes:
So, you don't read The New Republic or watch CBS News, right?
El Cliffo | 03.31.08 - 12:40 pm
I stay away from the MSM - far too neocon for my tastes.
crispy&cole said: "It does not matter who wins anyway, the political system is corrupt and the losers will be the citizens who are not part of the crony capitalists system we currently have."
Completely agree, except for the part about citizens being helpless and hopeless to improve their lives despite the crony capitalists.
Sebastia
Conservatives using political office to loot and damage government they dislike in the first place seemed to start with Reagan. Is anyone else old enough to remember James Watt who founded an anti-environmental legal training foundation and was appointed Secretary of the Interior by Reagan?
Exceprt from Wikipedia:
"Watt's tenure as Secretary of the Interior was marked by controversy, stemming primarily from his alleged hostility to environmentalism and his support of the development and use of federal lands by foresting, ranching, and other commercial interests.
For over two decades, Watt held the record for protecting the fewest species under the Endangered Species Act in United States history. The record was broken by Dirk Kempthorne, a George W. Bush appointee who, as of August 27, 2007, had not listed a single species in the 15 months since his confirmation."
James G. Watt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jackson is the rule not the exception.
JIm
More time with the family.
Do they really think ANYONE believes this crap?
An acquaintance works at HUD and this is YEARS overdue. FEMA and HUD, have both been traditionaly used to provide sinecures for the most imcompetent political hacks that the incomming party has to find jobs for.
This is why I try not to write about politics. It attracts the mud-slinging partisans in minutes.
If you want to defend Jackson's contributions to housing, mortgage lending, and the safety of the financial sector, why go ahead. We'd all like to know if the man did anything besides sit for photos.
But if you're here only to list out every other person who has ever been incompetent or corrupt, please go away. The readers of this blog are not really interested in "HE DID IT TOO!" as an intellectual pursuit.
Interesting Tesco was planning on opening their upscale quick food marts in U.S. Not anymore.
Tesco puts U.S. expansion plans on hold
Tesco will take a planned three-month break in the opening schedule for its U.S. Fresh & Easy stores to evaluate operations. It still plans to open 200 U.S. stores by early 2009. Bloomberg
I sat next to Watt (across the aisle) on a flight from Tampa to DC in the '80s. I wanted to kick his ass (but I didn't want to go to jail). At that time, I viewed him as the most dangerous man in America.
This uber-wingnut actually said that we didn't need to conserve resources, because Jesus was coming back soon, and he'd take care of everything.
The way I see it, the American people are going to make the wrong decision come November. Partly because all choices are fairly bad; but it's their fault for not realizing this.
They're not in a position yet to understand what's going on. Much of that is their fault. But give them four more years of increasing pain, and they'll start paying attention.
2008 is just a checkpoint. 2012 is the Big One.
I take it all back.
Me, I think 40% is way too high. And yeah, I have money on it.
Nemo | Homepage | 03.31.08 - 12:38 pm | #
Nemo - I agree the election isn't national - the last few rounds I've only watched two states: Ohio & Wisconsin. I see no way the Dems can win without both (Florida is the third I will watch after OH & WI but I believe Dems can win w/o FL IF they win both WI & OH & a few others like IA, PA, NM - all possible).
I see no way either Hillary or Obama carry Wisconsin OR Ohio. They will carry the metros but get killed in out-state. They can't get there via electoral college majority unless those two go blue.
Its McCain's to lose.
"Not trying to incite political firestorm - just looking at the polls.
dryfly"
Oh, but you are. If you think the Dems are through, you forgot how many people want us out of Iraq. Whoever the Dem nominee is come Sept, the only issue we will hear will be IRAQ, IRAQ, IRAQ.
That is why the 2006 elections went the Dems way. The ONLY reason. That reason is stronger than ever with Mc100years.
The Dems can't lose this election, even if Fox polls show McCrock leading today.
It's not the economy, stupid, it's IRAQ, IRAQ, IRAQ.
This uber-wingnut actually said that we didn't need to conserve resources, because Jesus was coming back soon, and he'd take care of everything. I guess the doctrine of "creation stewardship," is lost on these guys.
I for one am happy to see that Bush's cronyism and nepotism is equal opportunity.
Maybe this will mollify Kanye West after the katrina debacle.
Somebody's selling an awful lot of gold. Wonder what's keeping the market up?
Well, it's good to be skeptical. But of course we don't have to wonder about the motives of Think Progress, because they announce them explicitly on their website. On their home page, they clearly say What We're Fighting For, and What We're Fighting Against.
Think Progress » Home Page
That sounds pretty partisan to me. You don't see stuff like that on the front page, or home page, of The New York Times.
That sounds pretty partisan to me. You don't see stuff like that on the front page, or home page, of The New York Times.
El Cliffo | 03.31.08 - 12:54 pm
hey cliffo:
You can be partisan without being a goddamned liar. One is a political agenda, the other is a character flaw.
Isn`t this the same baby (bovine)-face Alphonso Jackson you were so higly talking about, a while back?
MA,
Oil took a step down from $106 to $102 - though we are risking the steel toed bunny slippers 'o death here ya know!
That sounds pretty partisan to me.
BUT IT DOES NOT MAKE THE CONTENT OF THIS POST FALSE.
Do me a big favor, will you? Look up "ad hominem" to find out why it's a logical fallacy?
Here, let me make it easy for you:
Ad hominem - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This is why I try not to write about politics. It attracts the mud-slinging partisans in minutes.
We're already here, we just normally do it with thinly-veiled economic and financial rhetoric.
Funny thing is I couldn't care less who wins. I'm 40, pale white, male, balding (somewhat). I've voted my heart the past 2 elections only to see the country reject those choices.
Fine. The damage has been done as far as I'm concerned, and as a person who didn't take out a suicide loan this decade I find the present Republicans /slightly/ on the right side of the issue, relative to my interests.
Isn`t this the same baby (bovine)-face Alphonso Jackson you were so higly talking about, a while back?
I take it "you" in that sentence means "me."
In which case a lot of your comments are now explicable. You do not have enough of a grip on idiomatic written English to be able to decipher tone or irony.
That sounds pretty partisan to me. You don't see stuff like that on the front page, or home page, of The New York Times.
El Cliffo,
I expect that there will be a full article on Alphonso in the NYT very soon. It will probably cover all the points mentioned by Think Progress..
..though, maybe not..
Catherine Austin Fitts "HUD is a sewer"
Tanta said: "But if you're here only to list out every other person who has ever been incompetent or corrupt, please go away. The readers of this blog are not really interested in "HE DID IT TOO!" as an intellectual pursuit."
Or even "HE DID IT!", but that's just me.
Sebastia
ac,
Good one.
But please, does this have to turn into a "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy vs. The Liberal Media" thing. My Glod, those debates are so annoyingly pointless.
Cheers,
Re: You do not have enough of a grip on idiomatic written English to be able to decipher tone or irony.
Oh, but you are. If you think the Dems are through, you forgot how many people want us out of Iraq. Whoever the Dem nominee is come Sept, the only issue we will hear will be IRAQ, IRAQ, IRAQ.
I was saying two years ago that the economy would have Iraq so far back in the paper it will be in with the coupons & obits. Everyone laughed at me then - not anymore.
And it isn't that Iraq went away - Sadr showed that this last weekend - its that the economy loomed larger. That SHOULD have helped the Dems but they've placed almost all their bet on an anti-Iraq reaction.
The election will be won/lost in Ohio between I 80 and the Ohio River (south of Cleveland & Toledo). Unless the Dems change focus - that won't be favorable for them.
JMHO.
So, calling someone a 'bovine face' would be an ad hominem. Got it.
Shnaps writes:
So, calling someone a 'bovine face' would be an ad hominem. Got it.
Shnaps | Homepage | 03.31.08 - 1:02 pm
Unless you were referring to a cow. Then it'd be an ad bovinem attack, and true.
Now who's gonna look out for the "borriors" ??
Sorry, a little OT, but I just read the whole revamping of US financial system...
Since DHS worked out so well, let's take all those "specialized" regulators and stick them in one agency...there can't possibly be differences is expertise, I mean it's just money...
Oh, and rechauffe the usual "too much regulation" but repackage this microwave dinner as "revamping" our regulatory system...
Remember folks, it's all that regulatory streamlining that those foreigners are doing that has led to capital flight...so let's just smooth these inefficiencies and we'll all be competitive again...vomit, swallow...repeat.
link to Proposal:
Treasury department's financial systemoverhaul proposal - Mar. 29, 2008
dryfly said: "...And it isn't that Iraq went away - Sadr showed that this last weekend - it's that the economy loomed larger. That SHOULD have helped the Dems but they've placed almost all their bet on an anti-Iraq reaction.
The election will be won/lost in Ohio between I 80 and the Ohio River (south of Cleveland & Toledo). Unless the Dems change focus - that won't be favorable for them."
I'm finding it tough to escape your logic on this subject, although the implications are a little disheartening.
S.
Will the election be about the war, or the economy?
The election will be about the economy, and how it got that way, namely:
The War
Katrina
No-bid contracts
Crony capitalism
Tax breaks for the wealthy
Incompetence
Illegal immigration
Outsourcing
Deficit spending
Re: "repackage this microwave dinner "
Is this like rearranging deck chairs on the unsinkable Titanic, i.e, moving the peas from the right to the left and then reducing the portion size?
Did you even know there was a Secty of Housing??
The Bush selectees as office holders are so incompetent, as a lot!!
Here's another kinder, gentler fraudster, with his steel fist in his probably religiously blessed glove... screw them, and when Obama takes over, arrest and prosecute them all.
By RACHEL L. SWARNS
Published: March 31, 2008
WASHINGTON Housing secretary Alphonso R. Jackson resigned on Monday, saying that he needed to devote more time to his family. The announcement came as federal authorities were investigating whether he had given lucrative housing contracts in the Virgin Islands and New Orleans to friends.
Re:
"perhaps prostitutes to his Washington parties."
Is this a reference to Paulson and Bush?
bovine-face is not really ad hominem, as it doesn't lead to "ugly, therefore must be wrong".
Ad hominem is usually a slightly related attack. For example, to say that X is card carrying member of the Favorite American Association (NRA, ACLU), and that should therefore disqualify any arguments from that person is ad hominem.
Ad hominem attacks are crafty, not stupid flames. Stupid flames get ignored by even morons, while well-crafted ad hominem attacks infect even normally thoughtful people. That is why they are so dangerous.
One popular ad hominem lately is that any politician who has accepted campaign contributions from any financial employees must be corrupt.
It doesn't logically follow. Especially in light of the high capital demand of campaigns and the present system. You will never have a candidate who hasn't, which leads to the false conclusion that they are all corrupt.
Bad logic.
That El CLiffo joker has come to the wrong place.
[And yes that joker descriptor was an ad hominen insult. Ah well.]
ac,
Good one.
But please, does this have to turn into a "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy vs. The Liberal Media" thing. My Glod, those debates are so annoyingly pointless.
Cheers,
Misean
Not long ago homeowners (on different forums) were calling me a "doom & gloom lib" because I was arguing things weren't as bright as the seemed and housing was going to tank, taking the economy with it.
Now I'm a right-winger because I want to see people suffer a bit before they get their bailouts so on balance the burden of poor decisions weighs on those who made them.
You can't win... or lose.
I guess it all depends on what color your glasses are tinted and which forum you happen to be posting on.
So, calling someone a 'bovine face' would be an ad hominem. Got it.
It certainly might have been a species of ad hominem, if that is in fact what I had said and was arguing that the bovine face proved that the words coming out of the mouth were false.
However, "bovine" appears to be a bit of misremembering. In the interests of whatever it is we're trying to accomplish, here is the full text of what I think is the comment of mine in question:
Lowlight: Alphonso Jackson, whose soporific discourse leads the viewer's mind to abandon the struggle to pick content out of the bromides and focus instead on that oddly expressionless, smooth, unwrinkled, ageless baby face of his. What, you wonder, would it take to make this man look a little troubled? Armageddon?
I was certainly struck by his bland demeanor. I implied that it seemed a bit inappropriate in context. This reveals a preference of mine for people who openly acknowledge that we've got a real mess on our hands. Plus an inkling in my head that Jackson is just a smooth-talking con man. Now, I did not make that latter argument. I would have done so if requested to. But I will only say here that I think the facial expression, demeanor, and spoken style of a person matters if "con man" is on the table as a possibility. Plus, anyone who is capable of creating a Shrine in the lobby of his own larger-than-life images is vulnerable to a certain chuckling over his stage "presence."
Calculated Risk: Project Lifeline
I am speechless.
anon...LOL.
It's Tanta material. Really. Like it's intrinsically good to just cram everything under one umbrella ignoring the reality that some things, financials in this case, can really have different structures that must be understood and regulated by different departments of specialist...not saying one way or the other, but that's the implicit MBA logic...we'll we could just synergize everything...Ben, get the synergy ray, set to Conflation! bzzzz...
...and now you have systemic financial soufflé.
dryfly:
polls can change in an instant
you need only look at the democratic race to see that.
Hillary way ahead, and then Obama, and then Hillary again, etc.
currently the Dems are bashing each other, while McCain has nothing to do. so his polling #'s look better.
but once the dems choose their candidate, then the attacks will sling towards McCain.
not saying he will/will not win, just saying.
And I have family in rural northeast MN/northwest WI.
in every single past election they talked about "values" and assigned those to the 'pubs. My sister's pastor told them that it was a sin to vote for Al Gore last time.
This time is different. The religious rural northern WI/MN folk are talking about it being a sin to attack other countries, and the greed associated with the bubble (they're getting hit hard up there) and so on...
a lot of religious people don't find McCain very religious either... so he may not win them over.
in the past people from Ohio could be expected to vote against their economic interest if there were a moral cause that were more important... I'm not so sure this time.
Just saying that I expect some surprises.
An ad hominem attack is an attack on the person, instead of the idea.
Politician 1: I think we need a flat tax.
Politician 2: Anyone who would wear a tie like yours has no business commenting on taxation.
yeah but Al Gore is fat and Bill Clinton lied about oral sex and tried to kill Bin Laden to distract from the impeachment hearings (which of course were FAR more important), so the Democrats are just as bad.
H e can be glad M. Spitzer doesn't fly to Washington for prosection jobs.
In another matter I went long silver.
O-Joe
"prosection jobs"
you mis-spelled prostitution.
The election will be about the economy, and how it got that way, namely:
The War
Katrina
No-bid contracts
Crony capitalism
Tax breaks for the wealthy
Incompetence
Illegal immigration
Outsourcing
Deficit spending
Marcus Aurelius | 03.31.08 - 1:08 pm | #
Dems don't have united policy planks for those issues either - that's the problem.
Dems will try to paint McCain as 'Same as Bush'... McCain will fight it. It is a strategy that will work for Dems in strongly blue areas... won't work at all (or be even counter-productive) in strongly red areas (Bush still has favorables >30 overall & >50 in some states)... and in between - who knows?
Its the in between where the battle is won/lost. I do NOT believe it will be enough to try to paint 'McCain = Bush' to carry most of these areas... Including downstate Ohio, Wisconsin, Missouri, Iowa... some of those places Dems have to win.
Again JMHO.
Yes, of course, partisanship does not necessarily make a claim false. I'm simply suggesting people be skeptical of partisan publications--and you can't get more blatant than posting a manifesto on your home page, as Think Progress has done. I would be much more persuaded by links to a newspaper like the Washington Post (which I consider completely reliable) or The New York Times, which I enjoy.
Skepticism about Think Progress doesn't necessarily mean they're wrong, either. But it's not an ad hominem attack to say so. A true ad hominem attack, which I am not making, but which some people unfortunately do make, would be pointing out that the eminent Paul Krugman of The New York Times, who's got a Ph.D. in economics from MIT, once served as an consultant to Enron, in 1999.
The election will be won/lost in Ohio between I 80 and the Ohio River (south of Cleveland & Toledo). Unless the Dems change focus - that won't be favorable for them. JMHO.
I'd like to say I disagree but I can't. The Dems are making one of their classic political blunders and it's going to cost them the WH. The east-cost liberal elite (and remember I'm one) of the party has banded together with the anti-Hillary crowd (of which Dean is one...he's still in pay-back mode) to back someone that can't appeal to the right demographics in the general election. Especially without the Hillary supporters who are going to vote for McCain in greater numbers than you think. I'm in MA, about as Dem as you can get, and I know not one person that is behind Hillary that plans to vote for Obama. Not one, and I have a pretty broad circle there, including some dem movers and shakers.
Obama is a darling of the exact kind of people that don't connect with the middle voter...an NPR-crowd type of person with a Harvard education. His speeches sound like a marketing blurb for a Web 2.0 product on a website where you're left wondering what the product actually does. Mr and Mrs worker bee aren't going to feel a connection there.
They don't have to equate McCain with Bush. They simply have to equate the Republican party and failure at every level.
Again, IRAQ is the economy.
Joseph Stiglitz new book the $3 Trillion War is out new now. Do you want to explain to him that the real issue is the subprime economy? Good luck.
Kind of ties it all together, I think. The Dems need to concentrate on one topic which covers all others. IRAQ spending reduction will translate to more money to spend fixing the local problems, including possible mortgage solutions.
Sorry to keep this going, but you guys are wrong about that. IRAQ is the major issue, and politicians know this.
In fact, I think the Dems intentionally played out the pastor race card early to get it out of the Repubs Oct poker hand. They knew the Repubs were going to pull that out late to cause a stir, now it's out and they can go forward reminding everyone how the IRAQ war is the reason behind our deficits and the reason the American economy will continue to suffer.
Mc100years doesn't stand a chance when that message is replayed 500 times each week.
Just saying that I expect some surprises.
Yearning to learn | 03.31.08 - 1:16 pm | #
Me too. But before I pick an 'upset surprise' I want to see if the 'up setter' has game... so far I see no 'game' on any of those topics MA listed. Until that changes just not being Bush won't be enough in those 'purple' precincts.
--
I watched The Age Of American Unreason by Susan Jacoby last night on BOOK TV (I posted the alert on the blog).
As I said last night, Looks like many on this blog can use it.
Well, Ms Jacoby fully confirmed by conclusion that Americans are born-and-bred dopes because they are fed on junk thoughts. Junk food, junk thoughts, junk economy, junk political system, etc., are consistent with my own observations.
America IS a nation of born-and-bred dopes led by Crooks among the private sector and evildoers as top public officials. The housing bubble and its aftermath fully confirms these.
Jas
http://cagle.com/working/080322/matson.jpg
Conservatives using political office to loot and damage government they dislike in the first place seemed to start with Reagan. Is anyone else old enough to remember James Watt who founded an anti-environmental legal training foundation and was appointed Secretary of the Interior by Reagan?
I sure remember James Watt. The (politically) brilliant part of appointing this douchebag to run Interior, was that he was a lightning rod who attracted media attention with his frequent outrageous quotes, which distracted the media from what was really going on. The media can only keep so many stories in the air at one time, if you give them something to keep themselves busy you can quietly get away with all kinds of mischief.
You know what they say about Republicans: they claim government can't get anything right, then they get elected and prove it.
I understand that sometimes environmental regulations go too far; what depresses me about the GOP is that when they get in charge, they don't just seek to adjust environmental regulations to be more 'reasonable'; instead they seek to destroy the environment and environmental regulations.
Alphonso Jackson family:
Mirror
Picture of George III Bush
White Dawg named Suffer
Family? BS. Have the family stand up; they've just been identified in the public media and are entitled to get a little of the spotlight. Wanna see the cream of this Administration? No better than the Bush daughters or the Barbara Bush son. The religious right get their heroes; no sex, except in the public toilets and in the arms of gay prostitutes; and the public, who bought that crap, hook line & sinker, reap their rewards. Tragically, so do we all. Pass me the disinfectant; I'm sick from the spew.
Lorax - THATS FUNNY!
danka there dry fly...
thought somewhat appropriate
I would be much more persuaded by links to a newspaper like the Washington Post (which I consider completely reliable)
Now I'm picking bits of my lunch off the keyboard again.
We would all be much more entertained if you clicked the link to the Think Progress post I provided, and then went through and clicked all the links TP provides within this post to all the articles, some of which are, um, from the WaPo, that back up its claims.
I posted this piece because it's a convenient summary of all the stories in one place.
I agree, El Cliffo, that you come across as a real partisan and should therefore be treated with a high degree of skepticism.
But please, does this have to turn into a "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy vs. The Liberal Media" thing. My Glod, those debates are so annoyingly pointless.
Didn't you hear? The VRWC aka Scaife now thinks Hillary is quite impressive.
First, upside down mortgages. Then, upside down politics. Whatever next?
Architect Of Vast Right Wing Conspiracy "Reassesses" Hillary
They don't have to equate McCain with Bush. They simply have to equate the Republican party and failure at every level.
Everyone knows the entire legislature is a Democratic rout this time around. That's where the politics is local and the Republican failure will feel the retribution. The huge mistake of the Democrats, and you can see this already, is to over-reach on this incompetence, and start proposing huge programs and bail-outs over the economy. It plays really well in Boston, but in Ohio bailing out people that bought 500k homes is not going to work. So you're going to have people with second thoughts of putting in a Democratic president with an overwhelmingly Democratic congress.
McCain's war cred just cements the base and reaches into middle-America's values. But this election is not going to be won on the war issues, and if it were, McCain is a slam-dunk because of that segment.
I agree Lorax, well done.
that said, I don't see Wells Fargo in the brackets.
they must be an ironclad investment then!!!!
They knew the Repubs were going to pull that out late to cause a stir, now it's out and they can go forward reminding everyone how the IRAQ war is the reason behind our deficits and the reason the American economy will continue to suffer.
And that brings the automotive component plant back to Zanesville how?
That's the question the folks in downstate want answered... it isn't even getting addressed.
America IS a nation of born-and-bred dopes
JJ, I recommend you change your epithet here, unless you really do mean that Americans in general have a lower IQ potential at birth.
I do agree with you to some extent that various subcultures inculcate stupidity into their members (I'm thinking of the urban gangsta subculture and its the mirror image Christian Fundamentalists).
We are not a "nation" of dopes, however, and to over-generalize like you do just makes you look like . . . a autodogmatic, ranting dope with nothing interesting to say.
Worth repeating, that SIFMA and wall street finance was born in the NAZI era.
SIFMA roots:
Mefo bills - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
An imaginary company
Hjalmar Schacht formed the limited liability company Metallurgische Forschungsgesellschaft, m.b.H., or "MEFO" for short. The company's "mefo bills" served as bills of exchange, convertible into Reichsmark upon demand. MEFO had no actual existence or operations and was solely a balance sheet entity. The bills were mainly issued as payment to armaments manufacturers.
"Especially without the Hillary supporters who are going to vote for McCain in greater numbers than you think."
No way. Hillary's supporters are the most die-hard liberal Dems there are. They couldn't vote Republican if they tried. It's all talk. Obama has crossover, but even the moderate Repubs who like him will be unlikely to support McCain if it's Hillary.
That tough Hillary-Obama supporter talk is just talk. It's interesting that so many here are buying into it all.
Do you people really think those Dem supporters are going to cross party lines? After these last 8 years? What a crock!
and more from ipodius "Mr and Mrs worker bee aren't going to feel a connection there."
Sure, they'd rather support Johnny boy and his 'no help' for the foreclosure ridden Ohio communities.
WTF??
It doesn't take a 2 hour speech to explain the inconsistencies, it takes 2 sentences. The Dems have to work VERY hard to lose this election. Possible? Yes. But very, very improbable.
"And that brings the automotive component plant back to Zanesville how?
That's the question the folks in downstate want answered... it isn't even getting addressed."
I disagree. Hillary has talked about redoing NAFTA and CAFTA.
it has CNBC in cold shakes. Larry Kudlow has a seizure every time he plays that tape.
I'm not saying that redoing NAFTA will bring the jobs back. but a lot of people in the industrial belt believe that it will.
--
"When one party stays in power for too long this is what happens."
Sorry, Crispy, it had nothing to do with any party. Pox on both their houses. It is a ploy for blind faithful of one party to blame the other and vice versa. The two-party system is a scam (blame the other!).
The whole American system is corrupt to the bone. The population has been corrupted. The cancer of financial immorality (deception and manipulation as the way to get ahead in the race for money and sex) has been spreading and one day the system will die, i.e., collapse. The only question is when. My forecast is before 2030.
Jas
His speeches sound like a marketing blurb for a Web 2.0 product on a website where you're left wondering what the product actually does. Mr and Mrs worker bee aren't going to feel a connection there.
If Joe America doesn't like Obama, they are more than welcome to vote for McCain. No skin off my nose, either way.
Including downstate Ohio, Wisconsin, Missouri, Iowa... some of those places Dems have to win.
FWIW I was back in Iowa the past two weeks and unless things start to tank hard and fast, the economy will probably not be as huge a concern. The farmers are doing pretty well (OK, well for farmers), and there didn't seem to be much slowdown in the state spending.
Of course this is the same state that managed to elect Steve King (and Gopher too).
ipodius "The Dems are making one of their classic political blunders and it's going to cost them the WH"
Agreed. More than 1/2 of Hillary supporters will switch teams in the ballot box if Obama represents the party. This election could easily be a Dukakis 2.0. If Obama is the golden child it'll be McCain's election to lose.
I don't consider ad hominem attacks to be as unreasonable as others seem to. Obviously, if we're talking about the debating equivalent of the Marquess of Queensbury rules, ad hominem attacks are not allowed. Also, many of the people who use them do so because they're unable or unwilling to effectively debate the issue on its merits.
However, from a Bayesian point of view, if a given person's ideas have been 90% crap, then prima facie there's a 90% likelihood that the last thing to have come out of his mouth was crap. The argument against ad hominem attacks thus boils down to "Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn sometimes."
Note that I'm talking about arguments concerning the provenance of ideas and the intellectual history of their authors. Mere name-calling ("Bovine face!") really cheapens a debate.
Heck, most of us are here because of an ad hominem judgement; Tanta and CR are believed more likely than the average blogosphere wanker to produce insightful and enlightening posts.
Just sayin'.
McCain's war cred just cements the base and reaches into middle-America's values. But this election is not going to be won on the war issues, and if it were, McCain is a slam-dunk because of that segment.
ipodius | 03.31.08 - 1:28 pm | #
Ipod - I've always suggested people do 'cultural exchanges'... you know leave their home in say suburban Orange County CA or SF or Greenwich Conn and go somewhere exotic to learn about new and different cultures... someplace like Ross County OH or Scott County Missouri. If they did - these elections & electoral college outcomes wouldn't be such a surprise.
Jas "The two-party system is a scam (blame the other!)."
I agree! The system is corrupt to the core.
Next time please post only stories from the Washington Times...which is owned By Reverend Moon (a Friend of the Bushes and the rest of the neCONs).
What is this "two party system" everyone keeps imagining?
Ralph, I don't think the general exhortation to "consider the source" is "ad hominem."
In fact, El Cliffo didn't start out with the claim that it was a "partisan" source.
He started out with the claim that a different post on that website involved a big mistake and had to be retracted and apologized for. We were invited to conclude that therefore this post is likely to be false. That's what makes it "ad hominem."
As far as people who think "ad hominem" is just "insults," I can't help you. It is a kind of logical fallacy, not a mere offense against good taste. You might dislike the latter, as well, but the term "ad hominem" isn't what you want there.
I posted this piece because it's a convenient summary of all the stories in one place.
Well, that's a valuable service. So, Think Progress in this way serves as a news aggregator, much like that famous partisan, Drudge.
I agree, El Cliffo, that you come across as a real partisan and should therefore be treated with a high degree of skepticism.
Yes, I'm a registered Democrat.
No way. Hillary's supporters are the most die-hard liberal Dems there are.
They may be, but they're still going to vote for McCain.
Whay went wrong?????
America's first President George Washington, did not belong to a political party. This made him America's only independent (not affiliated with a party) president. Most of America's founding fathers were opposed to political parties, and wanted none of them in the U.S.
America's first political party was the Federalist Party founded by Alexander Hamilton in 1792. The Federalists favored a strong central government ruled by a wealthy educated elite, a national bank, strong military, treaty with Britain, and fewer rights for states and most citizens. Federalists controlled the government until 1801. George Washington supported many Federalist policies. America's second President John Adams was a member of the Federalist Party.
America's second political party was the Democratic-Republican Party, founded by Thomas Jefferson and James Madison in 1792 in order to oppose the policies of the Federalists. The emergence of the Democratic-Republican Party marked the beginning of the U.S. two-party system. Jefferson was reluctant to create a party because he was opposed to political parties in general because of their power struggles for control of the government, but he felt that founding an opposition party was the best way to protect the rights of citizens from the consolidation of power in the federal government that the Federalists favored. The Democratic-Republican Party opposed the treaty with Britain, defended the Constitution, denounced the national bank, and promoted citizen's and states' rights. It became the dominant political party in the United States from 1800 until the 1820s, when it split into competing factions, one of which became the modern-day Democratic Party.
Therefore, the two party system in the U.S. occurred to prevent one party from gaining too much power, by creating a second party with opposite policies.
Usually, reading the comments here is worthwhile. Today - not so much.
"Ross County OH"
dryfly,
Ross County? Good God,You want to get the visitors shot as interlopers??? I grew up in a very rural area of Ohio. I still have friends all over the state. Dumping some poor bastard from the OC or NYC in somewhere like Maynard,OH (Look it up) just isn't fair...Yes,as a good ol country boy I lived in the OC and have traveled the world...
Chris
Yes, I'm a registered Democrat.
Oh, come now. What do you think I'm going to do next? Take it all back because you're a partisan on what you think is my side?
Grow up.
ipodius:
I doubt Hillary supporters will vote McCain. We'll see. In any event, we still have debates between the nominees. McCain vs. either Dem will be a disaster for McCain.
"Agreed. More than 1/2 of Hillary supporters will switch teams in the ballot box if Obama represents the party. barely"
That's such BS. Hillary's supporters are the most pie-eyed liberal Dems that there are. She is more left wing than a Michael Moore party list.
Her supporters are playing games. I'll bet that not one single Hillary supporter would switch to vote Repulican. Not one. The only lesbian voting Republican is that Cheney daughter. That is a game of chicken, and you are buying it.
Are you in reality anymore? Do you know that Bill only won in 1992 because of the independent vote going to Perot. No H. Ross, no Clinton. It wasn't the Clinton cross-over appeal.
Again, do you know where you are?
you know leave their home in say suburban Orange County CA or SF or Greenwich Conn and go somewhere exotic to learn about new and different cultures... someplace like Ross County OH or Scott County Missouri.
Honestly. I sit in amazement at what the Democrats are now doing. They have learned nothing from the Dukakas/Kerry humiliations and are running down the same road again. And they could do that if they didn't have Hillary as the other contender, who DOES appeal to this very segment.
Well, the best thing about this is that the liberal wing of the party will end up as destroyed as the nut-job wing of the Republicans over this. And perhaps that will help the party as a whole.
a lot of H supporters will be better off economicially with a repbulican president. but they are idealists and usually go with democrats. However there is a strong resentment among those H supporters that entire left wing is working against H. This will make it much easier for those supporters to cross the line or not vote. I simply don't see THE UNITER can unite them.
BTW, there is still a chance that H will compete as an independent if Mr. Bloomberg provides financial support. It is a very very long shot.
you can say to heck with all this political stuff..cause we here at CR are all about real property and economics.
but don't fool yourself...it's all about politics.
it' pretty up front that liberals "like" government and want to make it work for the average person (yes they do have their wealthy patrons too or would never get in power) and they have their thieves
neo-cons hate government, want to aggravate any inherent dis-functionalities in government, shrink it to the size it can be strangled in a bathtub and raid it's resources, land, money, etc for the benefit of private contractors and friends.
their are good conservatives out there...i have voted for more than a few...
the current crop in power are neo-cons and as corrupt as any i've seen in over 50 years.
if our economic system is to survive we need a reasonably regulated market system. excesses to the left or right, will destroy us.
Hmm...
I've never thought of the possibility that a Hillary supporter would vote for McCain.
I'll have to start talking to people. this idea had never occurred to me before.
(I've never heard anybody say that before).
I don't follow politics much, is this a consensus or something? was a poll done?
I honestly cannot believe that a Hillary supporter will vote for McCain.
the reverse argument:
did anybody honestly believe Rush Limbaugh or Ann Coulter as example when Ann said she'd vote for Hillary if McCain won the nomination?
no way. it played well when there were other 'pubs around... but not anymore.
Ross County? Good God,You want to get the visitors shot as interlopers???
LOL - Cobra, I do business there that's how I knew about it... and ya its 'different'. Same with parts of rural Illinois, Missouri, etc.
But until folks GROK these kinds of places they will be left scratching their heads when the results come in in Nov.
freebirdinblue writes:
"...a lot of H supporters will be better off economicially with a repbulican president..."
Did you just wake up from an 8 year coma, or something?
The Republicans know nothing about economics. They know only corruption, cronyism, and graft. "better off economicially with a repbulican president..." You crack me up!
Nationalization of US Banks?
Fed eyes Nordic-style nationalisation of US banks - Telegraph
Troy-McCain-It won't be skin falling off your nose, it will be much worse and more of a chance that maybe you not alive to feel it anyways.
McCain will go into Iran and start the third world war..Warmongers do this...
As a republican I would never vote for him. We need someone to bring us together over these next 4 years or look out. I'll vote for youth, as they have a outlook to the future, old crooked men could care less about it, they would rather have kill youth by wielding power..
Obama is how my daughter would vote, so I'll vote for her here..
BTW, there is still a chance that H will compete as an independent if Mr. Bloomberg provides financial support. It is a very very long shot.
Isn't that funny. I heard rumblings about this at a lunch last week...H enlisting Bloomberg on an Independent ticket. That would be the end of Obama for sure. There is a lot of bad blood in the party that is playing out. Which is dumb, as they should be concentrating on trying to cement the power-base for a long Democratic rule. As usual, they are not picking the best solution (an H/O ticket that would ensure 16 years in the WH barring any catastrophe) but are pandering to the very liberal wing.
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
What is this "two party system" everyone keeps imagining?
Now come on, did anybody claim these parties were materially different?
Maybe they're just two different parties of beady-eyed politicians pretending to have different beliefs since there's not enough room in the political system for everybody at the same time.
marcus:
I disagree with you.
there are a lot of Hillary Supporters (the so-called "liberal elite" or "limoliberals") who are affluent but who feel a social responsibility or at least believe in govt intervention
that govt intervention will hurt them personally in many cases, but they "believe" in it.
by voting for Hill, they are voting for higher taxation on themselves
thus, they would be (short term) better off under W or McCain where they get more tax breaks.
longer term is harder to fathom. (degradation of our infrastructure, environmental problems, etc etc etc)
ipodius:
You must know lots of Hillary supporters.
If you knew horses, you could tell us who will the next Kentucky Derby.
No, of course, I don't expect you to take it all back. This is your blog, after all.
"They may be, but they're still going to vote for McCain.
ipodius"
You're wrong. You must be a Hillary supporter.
Agreed. More than 1/2 of Hillary supporters will switch teams in the ballot box if Obama represents the party. This election could easily be a Dukakis 2.0. If Obama is the golden child it'll be McCain's election to lose.
Barley,
It's this sort of logic that always twists up the democratic primaries.. I remember when John Kerry was "the best choice" because he was a decorated veteran. That fact didn't seem to matter.
Either people are ready for "it" or they aren't. People weren't ready in 2004.. maybe they are ready today.
But, it will have little to do with whether or not Hillary Clinton or Barak Obama is running.
Noble writes:
Nationalization of US Banks?
Telegraph | Error 404 | Sorry, the page you have requested is not available cnfed131.xml
Noble | 03.31.08 - 1:53 pm | #
Surely, this is just for giggles, no? The fed organize a nationalization instead of a Japan-style "drawn-out response, where ailing banks were propped up in a half-public limbo for years." But that kind of moral hazard inducing paralysis is what the Fed does best.
You must know lots of Hillary supporters.
Marcus, if you read what I write, you can figure out that I don't just know H supporters but people able to discuss strategy. You can take what I say as you will.
You're wrong. You must be a Hillary supporter.
I'm actually a Republican. So go figure.
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
Ipodius,
I doubt it.. right now, people may be all fired up. But, as humans, we tend to get over things a lot faster than we imagine.
Clinton supporters may pout for 4 - 6 weeks if she loses the nomination.. but they'll recover. (Unless they're some serious racist types.. I guess. hehe.. is that ad hominem? it's a conditional statement..)
A good strategy is to know your enemy. Apparently the people you know who discuss strategy don't know jack.
FT Alphaville » Blog Archive » Gavekal’s four great ‘momentum trades’ — and what next
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
ipodius | 03.31.08 - 1:53 pm | #
This is the first time in my life I can't remember my parents not helping the democratic party. No fund raisers,phone calls,no checks cut...This from people who have been dem all their lives. For sure this will not be a dull election...
Chris
"I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done."
Keep on saying it. You will never admit that you were wrong, of course. Plus, you have no proof.
And those of us who actively know Hillary supporters, know very well they would never vote Republican. Maybe they won't vote for Obama. Too bad, I don't believe that either. They are definitely voters against Republicans. I know that from experience, too. They won't vote McCain. That's pure bullshit.
baruza,
Brings up a question: if I'm an investor, do I believe that the ROI in the US financial system is high, medium, low, or negative given Nationalization of banking? That's the question. Forget about nationalization good/bad, can the US do it and make my returns higher? Would I want to invest in that type of economy? O.k. so I invest in other emerging command economies with good results, but do I want an interventionist Fed gov? Forget moral hazard, we jumped that shark...I know, a cold, nasty lense to look through...
"I'm actually a Republican. So go figure.
ipodius "
Now THAT explains everything. Did you register Dem to vote for Hillary in the primary, too?
What a joke!
I'm actually a Republican. So go figure.
Big surprise.
Where did this guy come from? And is/was he another "window dressing black" for the present administration? What explains choosing him in the first place?
Ipodius wrote:
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
ipodius | 03.31.08 - 1:53 pm | #
i disagree. in all my years of active participation in politics, including holding low level elective office and working on campaigns, mostly democrat, one nonpartisan, and one republican...i have never seen so much antipathy towards he republican party as i have witnessed the past two years.
Clinton and Obama supporters will not cross the aisle in significant numbers to vote for McCain, unless something DRASTIC, UGLY and NEW is trotted out before our eyes.
Jim | 03.31.08 - 2:06 pm
Rumor on the street is that he once lived in a house, and had quite a bit of experience at it.
FT.com / Brussels / Economy - Eurozone inflation surges to 16-year high
EURO inflation at 3.5%...go long on the Euro. Dollar will go down more...this is getting very serious since Fed counted on coordinating international central banks...not happening.
Lowlight: Alphonso Jackson, whose soporific discourse leads the viewer's mind to abandon the struggle to pick content out of the bromides and focus instead on that oddly expressionless, smooth, unwrinkled, ageless baby face of his. What, you wonder, would it take to make this man look a little troubled? Armageddon?
Given that description, it is a sign of the utter lack of justice in the world, that the pictures of Jackson in the lobby were not simultaneously aging, becoming dissipated and evil-looking as the years of his tenure progressed.
Any Democrat is going to revise the tax code significantly. With the rich paying lots more. Even McCain might be forced into something of the sort. The extremely pro-rich tax policy of the Bush administration will simply have to change in any case.
dryfly --
I see no way either Hillary or Obama carry Wisconsin OR Ohio.
But what if Al Gore is the nominee?
Your analysis is sound, but I think you may be underestimating the importance of Florida.
Not that it matters much. The Democratic nominee, whoever she is, will simply run against Bush, not McCain. And I think it will work. I believe we are about to witness a sea change that will kick the Republicans out of power for at least 20 years; i.e., until the Democrats become just as lazy and corrupt as they were when they held all the cards.
As a non-fruitcake libertarian, there is simply no existing party for me to support. (Although I cannot understand why I do not dislike Obama... But I don't. Must be the Volcker endorsement.)
Now THAT explains everything. Did you register Dem to vote for Hillary in the primary, too?
LOL...I love the way everyone reads a statement without thinking about it. I'm from a very old NE Republican family. I've been one since before the wingnuts took over the party. And I vote for whomever is best, not by party.
Actually Hillary and Bill before her were classically Republican in their politics. It's just the Republicans went wacko, forcing me to mostly vote for Democrats. And I have to admit I would vote for H in the general election in a heartbeat. Not a prayer I'd vote for O. We've had 8 years of empty talk and "uniting".
And Marcus, you can tell yourself that all you want. If it makes you feel better. It won't alter the facts, however.
Given that description, it is a sign of the utter lack of justice in the world, that the pictures of Jackson in the lobby were not simultaneously aging, becoming dissipated and evil-looking as the years of his tenure progressed.
I was originally inclined toward the "Stepford Secretary" theory, but "The Picture of Dorian HUD" has potential. Perhaps that's one of the pictures that is not in the lobby.
Jim,
Something that ought to happen doesn't mean it will. We could lower taxes, borrow more, provide fewer services and zimbabwe the dollar. We ought not too, doesn't mean either party won't do it...it could even be bi-partisan since it would inflate away our foreign debt.
Democratic nominee, whoever she is, will simply run against Bush, not McCain
LOL!
uh oh...Paulson is speaking again..
Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson announces the biggest overhaul of financial regulations since the Great Depression in Monday during a speech at the Treasury Department.
girlbear,
There is a nice link on cnn to contents of the plan...it even has poor editing with random characters in the text...to symbolize speech impediment...
Ipodius: elite, east-coast Republican
Certainly explains the high opinion you have of yourself. Also explains why that opinion is so delusional. Thanks for clearing that up for us.
"Isn't that funny. I heard rumblings about this at a lunch last week...H enlisting Bloomberg on an Independent ticket. That would be the end of Obama for sure."
ipodius,
It isn't about Obama. It's about the Iraq war. It should continue. Too many powerful people are making billions out of it. Thus McCain must win. Hillary will serve as a decoy like Ralph Nader did.
Imagine some of you make 12 billion/month. What would you do to keep that war alive ?
Also explains why that opinion is so delusional. Thanks for clearing that up for us.
Yawn. I'm now officially tired of the troll-baiting. I'm listening to Paulson...and trying to keep from stabbing myself in the forehead with my pen.
Nemo
i believe you are correct.. hearing many politicians in my state party saying what you said...defeat mccain by running against bush
Ipodius, you clearly have one strong message: Obama-bad.
Hmm. Wonder why that is?
Hmm. Wonder why that makes me like him even more?
"I'm now officially tired of the troll-baiting. "
Apparently, you don't even know who the troll is.
Einstein Ridicules Women's Fight:
"Remarks Cackling Geese Once Saved Rome."
But Einstein was far less amused two days later when ...
Einstein: his life and universe - Google Books
Einstein: His Life and Universe
By Walter Isaacso
EURO inflation at 3.5%...go long on the Euro. Dollar will go down more...
The irony is that higher inflation should be BEARISH for a currency.
Of course hot money flips everything on its head and makes high inflation a good thing, until the very end... as Iceland is finding out the hard way.
Reading opinions of people who think Hillary supporters are the "liberal elite," is most edifying, in that it reveals the world will never run out of new ways to completely waste my time.
That said, I don't see how it's unfair to point out that Jackson represented a personnel policy, not a personnel mistake.
Spitzer was a personnel mistake. His foibles were not the reason he was hired (by New York voters), who in fact wanted an arm-twisting, name-taking anti-corruption crusader, rather than a hypocritical john.
Jackson was exactly what the Bush administration wanted, part of a policy demonstrated by every other one of their hires.
as Iceland is finding out the hard way.
What's up with that? Is the country actually a country or is it just a hedge fund posing as a country?
ipodius writes:
Democratic nominee, whoever she is, will simply run against Bush, not McCain
LOL!
I don't get the joke. There's no chance Condi will switch parties.
Baruza,
I doubt the international business editor of the UK's highest selling quality newspaper is likely to publish something like this for giggles. Just my opinion.
Add to this Mishkin's commentary on zero bound and that Fed SWAT teams are not just a proposal but are already in operation, you're faced with an interesting possible view to the near future.
And then there are some who are simply tired of dynastic politics.
Bush, Clinton, Bush, Clinton? I don't think so.
I'm for the younger face thingy; traitor to my gen gen generation.
Not to mention that she's a Republican in sheep's clothing.
ac wrote:
The irony is that higher inflation should be BEARISH for a currency.
ac,
yes, I invest where the monetary policy will trend to raise interest rates verses investing where monetary policy attempts to devalue my investment...long on Euro for me...beats the dollar until the dollar hits the bottom, and it hasn't hit the bottom.
Not to mention that she's a Republican in sheep's clothing.
Thanks for articulating succinctly all my points for why she's the better nominee that can will in the general election.
Nobles, oh I'm in agreement as I hope the end of my last post made clear. I just can't see the Fed acting to buck the bankers in such a drastic manner, something that would require the support of an at least semi-independent legislature. Very hard to imagine that kind of thing happening in America.
I'm stating this now: you are going to be surprised at how many H supporters won't vote for O when this is all said and done.
ipodius | 03.31.08 - 1:53 pm | #
The reverse is equally true - I do NOT see the black base turning out for Hillary after a scorched earth primary vanquishing of Obama - and at this point that is what it will take - scorched earth.
Listen to Cobra's parents speaking - those are the fold they have to bring back in... I don't see it happening.
McCain won't win in a electoral college landslide due to the almost stone like red-blue divide... but he won't be challenged much UNLESS he does something stooopid.
Brace for $1 Trillion Writedown of `Yertle the Turtle' Debt
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aHCnscodO1s0
The sad truth,'' he writes,is that subprime is just the first big boulder in an avalanche of asset writedowns that will rattle on through much of 2008.''
Expect the landslide to cascade through high-yield bonds, commercial mortgages, leveraged loans, credit cards and -- the big unknown -- credit-default swaps, Morris says. The notional value for those swaps, which are meant to insure bondholders against default, covered about $45 trillion in portfolios as of mid-2007, up from some $1 trillion in 2001, he writes.
`Utter Thrombosis'
Morris sketches a scenario in which hedge fund counterparty defaults would ripple through default swap markets, triggering writedowns of insured portfolios, demands for collateral, and a rush to grab cash from defaulting guarantors. The credit system would suffer an utter thrombosis,'' he says, making the subprime crisislook like a walk in the park.''
As bankers and regulators try to prop up the ``Yertle the Turtle-like unstable tower of debt,'' Morris points to two previous episodes of lost market confidence.
--Worth repeating, that SIFMA and wall street finance was born in the NAZI era.
SIFMA roots:--
As were the Bush's rise to wealth and power in America. The more things stay the same ... ...the more they never really change.
Fixing the Straight Dope: Were Bush's Great-Grandfather and Grandfather Nazis?
{By David E Romm
with apologies to Cecil Adams
[links checked and updated 10/07]
While there are no recorded incidents of them goose stepping or giving the "Heil Hitler" salute, the short answer to the question is yes. Both Bush's grandfather's palled around with sympathizers to the Nazi cause, with George Herbert Walker the worse of the two and grandfather Prescott Bush even worse as he dealt with Nazi Germany before and during WWII.
The Bushes don't like to talk about their past, and much of the early information comes from George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography by Webster G. Tarpley and Anton Chaitkin. While the book's origins are suspect and the authors tend to go off on wild LaRouchian rants, the basic research has held up to scrutiny since business dealings and government actions are a matter of public record. Note: I don't have Cecil Adam's resources, staff or salary, and all sources are from the web.
George Herbert Walker married off his daughter to Prescott Bush. It was a good arrangement for both: Prescott married into money and financial connections; the Walkers rose in society and power. A standard trade-off. George Herbert Walker isn't listed as a member of the Skull and Bones Society at Yale, but future son-in-law Prescott is, and the son and grandson named after him are, as are the Bush's who were his grandson and great-grandson. Aside: The Skull and Bones Society itself has been the subject of much speculation especially about the Bushes, and the real story is as interesting, but an entirely different column.
In 1919, Missouri deal-maker Bert Walker became the president and CEO of the W.A. Harriman and co. bank, which became one of the largest companies in the world. In 1922, the Harriman company set up a branch in Berlin under the residency of George H. Walker. In 1924, the Harriman company spun off the Union Banking Corporation [Wikipedia entry on Union Banking Corporation], also run by Bert. The UBC was established to send American capital to Germany to finance the reorganization of its industry under the Nazis. Their leading German partner was the notorious Nazi industrialist Fritz Thyssen, who wrote a book admitting much of this called "I Paid Hitler." [quoted here] An article called Nazis In The Attic states boldly, "Walker was one of Hitler's most powerful financial supporters in the United States." and gives other details.
Samuel Prescott Bush, father to Prescott, was an Ohio manufacturer and close advisor to President Herbert Hoover. During WWI, Samuel was director of the facilities division of the US War Industries Board under Bernard Baruch. In 1920, Harriman and Bert Walker gain control of the German Hamburg-Amerika Line, said to be the world's largest private shipping line which had been confiscated by the US after the war [part of long blog posting here]. Still, while many of his business deals are with shady people who were more involved with the Nazis, Samuel himself wasn't a major player.
Prescott Bush was a major player. In addition to having ties with most of his father-in-laws friends (notably the Harrimans) and companies (notably the Union Banking Corporation), Bert hired Prescott to supervise the new Thyssen/Flish Consolidated Silesian Steel Corporation and the Upper Silesian Coal and Steel Company. John Loftus, a former Justice Department prosecutor whose latest series of lectures is on The Truth About Terrorism, has published a number of books about the Nazis and WWII. The page on Loftus' site linked above is from a Clamor magazine article by Toby Rogers entitled Heir to the Holocaust and also says, "Prescott Bush became managing director of UBC and handled the day-to-day operations of the new German economic plan. Bush's shares in UBC peaked with Hitler's new German order. But while production rose, cronyism did as well." and "According to classified documents from Dutch intelligence and US government archives, President George W. Bush's grandfather, Prescott Bush made considerable profits off Auschwitz slave labor." Rogers says this information came from "A Dutch intelligence agent in 1941," before we were at war with Germany. While the companies were seized by the Germans during the war, claims Cecil, Rogers points out that Prescott was eventually paid $1.5 million for his interest in UBC after Thyssen died and the companies assets were unfrozen.
Dealing with Nazi Germany, and even financing Hitler, may have been ethically and morally repugnant, even at the time, but they weren't illegal until Hitler declared war on the US. Six days after Pearl Harbor, FDR signed the Trading With the Enemies Act. By then, most (though not all) of the companies that had been doing business with Hitler's war machine had stopped. But not Prescott Bush and the Union Banking Corporation. Writes Rogers, "Prescott Bush continued with business as usual, aiding the Nazi invasion of Europe and supplying resources for weaponry that would eventually be turned on American soldiers in combat against Germany." }
Oil reversed earlier losses to trade back above $106 as a further fall in the dollar overshadowed an easing of tensions in the key Iraqi oil port of Basra.
Dollar weakness has encouraged investors to buy into crude, as funds look to hedge against a tumbling currency, inflation concerns and widespread financial weakness. The dollar has slipped to a low of $1.5895 against the euro this afternoon.
McCain won't win in a electoral college landslide due to the almost stone like red-blue divide... but he won't be challenged much UNLESS he does something stooopid.
The interesting thing to note is that, in the states with the most electoral votes and the ones with the closest red/blue numbers, H won. But I'm in total agreement with you dryfly. And as the current occupant demonstrated a win is a win, no matter how close. I just don't understand the Dems strategy at all with O. The more things look unstable, the more people will run to the guy that looks like (grand)Dad.
BTW, when a post has the word "Hitler" in it, the thread is categorically dead.
my fav was when China told Jackson to go f*ck himself when he tried to pawn off MBSs that even our own GSEs wanted no part of.
I just don't understand the Dems strategy at all with O
People are voting in the Dem primary for whom they prefer (for actual Dems, who they want as Pres, for Republicans, who they want to run against).
What's so hard to understand about this?
Seriously, you guys that think Obama really stands a chance were probably Dean supporters last election cycle.
Most of you thought Kerry was a shoe-in. I actually think Kerry had a better shot than Obama. I am ready to double my existing wager.
Instead of a weak and vacillating Government, a single, purposeful, energetic personality is ruling today.
Hjalmar Schacht
The German future lies in the hands of our Fuehrer.
Hjalmar Schacht
After the many rumours that we had heard about Hitler and the published criticisms we had read about him, we were pleasantly impressed. His appearance was neither pretentious nor affected.
Hjalmar Schacht
And I think the American people look to the leaders to lead. They look to the leaders to take on the big problems. And the president deserves a lot of credit for doing that.
John W. Snow
We continue to have a strong dollar policy; we continue to support the strong dollar policy. It's been our policy and will continue to be our policy.
John W. Snow
Well, I make a practice of not commenting on the role of the relative exchange value of our currency.
John W. Snow
personally i'm voting for David Duke...at least i know i know who and what the scum BUCKET really is...
ipodius,
Thanks for the tip-off on the Godwin violation - moving to the next thread!
The rich in general did far better under Clinton than they have under W. even though W. did everything he could to favor them. Under Clinton, though, the rest of the country also did far better, so on a relative basis, the rich did not do as well under Clinton. Why did the rich do well under Clinton? The S&P grew at a CAGR of 16% under Clinton, and 0% under Bush. The performance of the stock portfolio is more important to your wealth if you have lots of wealth than a few points on your marginal tax rate.
It kind of reminded me of 1984 but "The Picture of Dorian HUD" is much funnier
Tanta -
I was referring to Broker's 'bovine' comment, not your description of Jackson from the earlier thread.
I'm no fan of A-Jax. On the contrary - he has demonstrated himself to be petty, vain, and of marginal intellectual capacity on many occasions. But with so many substantive criticisms available, it seems beneath any of us to resort to nothing more than name-calling.
I was hoping to punk him so much better than that. But if he's just another bald, retired golfer now - there's no sport in that.
Sounds like some desperate Jews are so afraid of Obama that they won't stop the attacks anywhere.
Pathetic, really.
The most recent national polls show Obama beats McCain. McCain isn't unelectable, but between his support for the Iraq War and a economic plan that consists solely of cutting corporate taxes (literally!) he has a huge hill to climb whatever the election is fought over. When people start looking at what a McCain administration would do his numbers will drop substantially. Also, if Obama is the nominee don't underestimate the power of the unprecedented political machine he's constructed. He's going to have something like a million volunteers backed by half a billion dollars. There has never been anything like that in American politics. He won the 1992 Senate election for Carol Mosely Braun with a voter registration drive, and he had nothing like the resources he'll have this year.
Bangkok Post | Sports plus | FIA President Mosley under pressure over Nazi sex video
The News of the World reported that Mosley, 67, paid five prostitutes 2,500 pounds in cash and then engaged in an orgy that lasted almost five hours.
Spitzer and Paulson have not commented about this situation which involved Nazi role- playing which many believe to be linked to the Shanghai stock market and new labor laws in China.
The Electoral College is all uphill for the Dems. With O as the nominee McCain could actually take California. Game over. Not that it maters, being merely competitive in CA drains far too many resources for O to win elsewhere. While H can safely ignore CA as hers except for writing checks she gives up near all the swing states in exchange. The Dems should just be grateful that the popular former Governor of Florida is saddled with an unfortunate last name and thus beyond Rep VP consideration. Lieberman's endorsement tells you how middle america will turn regardless.
In California: Obama 49%, McCain 40%. Hillary is only 46-43. McCain will not beat Obama in California.
Fair Economist writes:
In California: Obama 49%, McCain 40%. Hillary is only 46-43. McCain will not beat Obama in California.
If you think that is a safe margin for Obama you don't have a lot of experience in California. Two words; "Tom Bradley."
This year will really come down to voter turn-out vs cross-over votes. Conservative turn-out will be low for McCain. H turnout will be low for O supporters and vice versa. The question then becomes how many of these dis-affected supporter will cross over or just hold their nose and vote party lines and say the h--k with it.
I don't think anyone can tell today how that mix will play out. There might be some idea in Sept/Oct but there won't be many rabid/passionate supporters on either side who can make the difference.
^enuf wif da politx plz
Lieberman's endorsement tells you how middle america will turn regardless.
LOL, I flushed better political analysis than this thread after breakfast this morning. I'll try to save some tomorrow.