Un freakin' believable. I cannot figure out why all of these apparently well-financed, risk-aware financial institutions are so quick to throw money at the tan man and his excuse for an enterprise.
In hindsight, how will it appear to have been a bad idea to invest in CFC when BoA went first?
"Trust" is the grease of any economic system. "Daddy", the BofA, just failed to protect "us". The new batch of dads are all ersatz, in our minds.
Due to this news, perception has changed. The economic waters are no longer safe for the many who wanted to believe everything would be okay. The rational & thoughtful have already retreated. The rational will leave immediately. The naive and needful will stay and hope.
Perception change. Game over.
What's next in Mozillo's "economy"?
BK and mass layoffs, not 20% in R/E & Finance, but 40% and 60% and when there, I yet wonder what will happen to the UST external debt? Does Company USA get bought out, and honor its debt, or hyperinflate, or just say "no"? What happens to the external debt?
I'm not sure, in dollars, but I'm pretty sure that it's the only part of that operation that has much worth, right now.
Countrywide Bank is paying top of the market for CDs in a desperate attempt to build a deposit base, even if it brings the net interest margin down. Where have we seen that before? FFDIC? Are you here this morning?
Countrywide with market cap $9.7bn has; a bank, a servicing agency, $2bn in REOs and a business model. The REOs are worth half their book values and the business model is broken. Where's the investment value?
Unless he's filed an amendment I don't know about, it looks like Mozilo's sell program has been shut down for the moment. From an Aug. 24 CNBC interview:
BARTIROMO: I've got to ask you about this. What's the lowest price you've sold at?
Mr. MOZILO: Whatever the--well, the lowest price was 28 because built into the--into my 10b5-1 is a can't sell below $28 a share.
They do? I just heard someone else say it was one billion.
And is that RE actually owned on Countrywide's books? Or is Countrywide the serivcer marketing the REO on behalf of an investor?
Sorry, but "REO" just means that someone who used to own a loan asset now owns a real estate asset. But that someone isn't necessarily the servicer who markets the REO.
I could go try to look this up, but since I'm not the one who keeps bringing up CFC's REO volume, can the rest of you who do so link to the data source, so we can understand whether this is an issue of CFC's balance sheet or CFC's servicing portfolio?
I notice the NYP says CFC services 1 out of 5 mortgages. That would mean its servicing portfolio would be about $2.08 trillion. Yet the last 10-Q showed that CFC's total servicing portfolio was $1.4 trillion. But what's half a trillion dollars?
it's pretty clear to me that this whole thing was an elaborate rouse to increase the value of CFC's current MSR. Hey bitches, good luck getting a refi now! HAHAHA!
It is interesting that we did not hear anything about the BoA convertible before company PR and now we have this rumor. This is from BoA convertible 8K.. look like BoA has approval right for any futher convertible preferred. And also BoA has firt right of refusal of buying CFC if it is putting themselves up for sales. Don't know how CFC can duplicate these 2 conditions for new convertible preferred... I think this is bogus rumor to help to help the short.. No current position for CFC, used to own put on the company..
"With respect to dividends and distributions upon the liquidation, winding-up and dissolution of the Company, the Convertible Preferred Securities rank in priority senior to the Companys common stock and to each other class of capital stock or series of preferred stock (where the terms of the stock do not expressly provide that it ranks senior to or on parity with the Convertible Preferred Securities) and on parity with any additional Convertible Preferred Securities and any other class of capital stock or series of preferred stock established after August 22, 2007 which issuance is subject to approval by two-thirds of the holders of Convertible Preferred Securities."
" The Company is required to offer Bank of America the right to match the terms of any third party proposal entertained by the Company regarding a sale of the Company"
What xofruitcake said. As I noted in the BofA buys in thread, CFC gave them a Poison Put.
If they're selling securities to JPMC or Citi, they definitionally cannot have the same put. AND BofA (though not the sharpest tacks in the bunch) appears to have decided that it doesn't want any more exposure to the company, even at the usurious terms of before or better.
Mozilo blames the economy? Does he have documented proof that the defaultees, in any great numbers, lost their jobs? Could it be that these people instead obtained mortgages from Mozilo that never, ever could have been repaid?
Maybe he should have waited for the jobs reports to soften for several months before he tried that smokescreen.
lama, you clearly don't have what it takes to work in the mortgage business. These people didn't lose their jobs. What happened is that the jobs that were supposed to materialize--the ones that paid the stated income, or that lovely "future income" the economists tell us about--failed to materialize. Hell, we already knew that the jobs we had wouldn't work. We're just feeling a tad bit ripped off, you know, because the jobs we were promised were taken away, just like the HPA we were promised was taken away. Someone should have to pay for pulling the rug out from under CFC, don't you think?
Tell that to the DOW. Up 120+ right now because, well, because.
shrug
Cheers,
prat
praetorian | 09.11.07 - 11:13 am |
Go talk to a intensive care ward at any major hosipital in America.
You can find plenty of patients on significant life support (little brain activity, no hope, heart beat only).
Equities are the Sideshow.
"Someone should have to pay"
Hmmmmm, if it's the economy's fault, and taxpayers are essentially the economy, I think the taxpayers should pay for all this!!
Good morning Tanta.
Been reading my 3 morning papers. The Dallas Morning Snooze
The Wall Street Jackoff
The New York Hard Times
Yep, these high CD rates have spelled doom in the past and what gets dicey for the CD holders is when the bank fails with little or no notice. However, if you have enough money in the bank it always seemed that you were tipped off to move it pronto. To me the big difference with Countrywide is its size which might save it under some new government bailout twisteroo we have never seen before and probably will hope we never see it again. That's my $00.02. Gotta go take my cheese grits out of the over hon.
first!
Well the issues facing CFC are sure worse than most people believed. Or maybe not.
Again, why would anyone throw good money after bad on this turkey?
Fascinating to see human nature.
Kubler Ross first appears "denial".
It appears to me first appears "confusion".
This is classic. Confusion & Denial.
You choose the noun to describe CW... dead? deader? or deadest?
Moin,
does anybody remember this comment from Mozillo just a few month ago....
http://www.toondoo.com//public/kahunabear/toons/cool-cartoon-46840.png
What a difference a few month or weeks made...
Un freakin' believable. I cannot figure out why all of these apparently well-financed, risk-aware financial institutions are so quick to throw money at the tan man and his excuse for an enterprise.
In hindsight, how will it appear to have been a bad idea to invest in CFC when BoA went first?
Investors? Buzzards jockeying for their spots in the chow line as the carcass spoils in the heat.
How much is the servicing operation worth?
In hindsight, how will it appear to have been a bad idea to invest in CFC when BoA went first?
"Trust" is the grease of any economic system. "Daddy", the BofA, just failed to protect "us". The new batch of dads are all ersatz, in our minds.
Due to this news, perception has changed. The economic waters are no longer safe for the many who wanted to believe everything would be okay. The rational & thoughtful have already retreated. The rational will leave immediately. The naive and needful will stay and hope.
Perception change. Game over.
What's next in Mozillo's "economy"?
BK and mass layoffs, not 20% in R/E & Finance, but 40% and 60% and when there, I yet wonder what will happen to the UST external debt? Does Company USA get bought out, and honor its debt, or hyperinflate, or just say "no"? What happens to the external debt?
Anybody wonder if the automatic selling of shares on Mozillo's behalf is continuing?
After all, it was "automatic" and has nothing to do with the market conditions and it is out of Mozillo's hands.
So, where is the equity dumping of the recent past?
Perception change. Game over.
Tell that to the DOW. Up 120+ right now because, well, because.
shrug
Cheers,
prat
How much is the servicing operation worth?
I'm not sure, in dollars, but I'm pretty sure that it's the only part of that operation that has much worth, right now.
Countrywide Bank is paying top of the market for CDs in a desperate attempt to build a deposit base, even if it brings the net interest margin down. Where have we seen that before? FFDIC? Are you here this morning?
Why do we spend so much time talking about a company that is already dead?
Countrywide with market cap $9.7bn has; a bank, a servicing agency, $2bn in REOs and a business model. The REOs are worth half their book values and the business model is broken. Where's the investment value?
Unless he's filed an amendment I don't know about, it looks like Mozilo's sell program has been shut down for the moment. From an Aug. 24 CNBC interview:
BARTIROMO: I've got to ask you about this. What's the lowest price you've sold at?
Mr. MOZILO: Whatever the--well, the lowest price was 28 because built into the--into my 10b5-1 is a can't sell below $28 a share.
CNBC Exclusive Interview: Maria Bartiromo Interviews Countrywide CEO Angelo Mozilo on "Closing Bell with Maria Bartiromo" Today at 4:00 PM ET (Part 2: Transcript Included) - CNBC
$2bn in REOs
They do? I just heard someone else say it was one billion.
And is that RE actually owned on Countrywide's books? Or is Countrywide the serivcer marketing the REO on behalf of an investor?
Sorry, but "REO" just means that someone who used to own a loan asset now owns a real estate asset. But that someone isn't necessarily the servicer who markets the REO.
I could go try to look this up, but since I'm not the one who keeps bringing up CFC's REO volume, can the rest of you who do so link to the data source, so we can understand whether this is an issue of CFC's balance sheet or CFC's servicing portfolio?
I notice the NYP says CFC services 1 out of 5 mortgages. That would mean its servicing portfolio would be about $2.08 trillion. Yet the last 10-Q showed that CFC's total servicing portfolio was $1.4 trillion. But what's half a trillion dollars?
How much is the servicing operation worth?
it's pretty clear to me that this whole thing was an elaborate rouse to increase the value of CFC's current MSR. Hey bitches, good luck getting a refi now! HAHAHA!
$2bn in REOs
They do? I just heard someone else say it was one billion.
The point of service versus owning is well taken. I don't have that answer. It is $1bn in CALIFORNIA.
See: Countrywide Foreclosures (REO) Blog
Wow,The Tan Man has become the Al Davis of the Mortgage Industry.
It is interesting that we did not hear anything about the BoA convertible before company PR and now we have this rumor. This is from BoA convertible 8K.. look like BoA has approval right for any futher convertible preferred. And also BoA has firt right of refusal of buying CFC if it is putting themselves up for sales. Don't know how CFC can duplicate these 2 conditions for new convertible preferred... I think this is bogus rumor to help to help the short.. No current position for CFC, used to own put on the company..
The resource cannot be found.
"With respect to dividends and distributions upon the liquidation, winding-up and dissolution of the Company, the Convertible Preferred Securities rank in priority senior to the Companys common stock and to each other class of capital stock or series of preferred stock (where the terms of the stock do not expressly provide that it ranks senior to or on parity with the Convertible Preferred Securities) and on parity with any additional Convertible Preferred Securities and any other class of capital stock or series of preferred stock established after August 22, 2007 which issuance is subject to approval by two-thirds of the holders of Convertible Preferred Securities."
" The Company is required to offer Bank of America the right to match the terms of any third party proposal entertained by the Company regarding a sale of the Company"
So what happens to my puts when CFC goes BK?
Freak,
That's step 3, Profit.
What xofruitcake said. As I noted in the BofA buys in thread, CFC gave them a Poison Put.
If they're selling securities to JPMC or Citi, they definitionally cannot have the same put. AND BofA (though not the sharpest tacks in the bunch) appears to have decided that it doesn't want any more exposure to the company, even at the usurious terms of before or better.
Mozilo blames the economy? Does he have documented proof that the defaultees, in any great numbers, lost their jobs? Could it be that these people instead obtained mortgages from Mozilo that never, ever could have been repaid?
Maybe he should have waited for the jobs reports to soften for several months before he tried that smokescreen.
lama, you clearly don't have what it takes to work in the mortgage business. These people didn't lose their jobs. What happened is that the jobs that were supposed to materialize--the ones that paid the stated income, or that lovely "future income" the economists tell us about--failed to materialize. Hell, we already knew that the jobs we had wouldn't work. We're just feeling a tad bit ripped off, you know, because the jobs we were promised were taken away, just like the HPA we were promised was taken away. Someone should have to pay for pulling the rug out from under CFC, don't you think?
Tell that to the DOW. Up 120+ right now because, well, because.
shrug
Cheers,
prat
praetorian | 09.11.07 - 11:13 am |
Go talk to a intensive care ward at any major hosipital in America.
You can find plenty of patients on significant life support (little brain activity, no hope, heart beat only).
Equities are the Sideshow.
"Someone should have to pay"
Hmmmmm, if it's the economy's fault, and taxpayers are essentially the economy, I think the taxpayers should pay for all this!!
Good morning Tanta.
Been reading my 3 morning papers. The Dallas Morning Snooze
The Wall Street Jackoff
The New York Hard Times
Yep, these high CD rates have spelled doom in the past and what gets dicey for the CD holders is when the bank fails with little or no notice. However, if you have enough money in the bank it always seemed that you were tipped off to move it pronto. To me the big difference with Countrywide is its size which might save it under some new government bailout twisteroo we have never seen before and probably will hope we never see it again. That's my $00.02. Gotta go take my cheese grits out of the over hon.
11,836 Homes Offered For Sale on Countrywide Financial's Website
Total Asking Price: $2,496,366,775
(As of September 5, 2007)
from Countrywide Foreclosures blog
Not sure if this was posted yet.
LA Business Journal
Countrywide Slips After Group Cuts State 50 percent
Los Angeles Business Journal Online - business news and information for Los Angeles California
Mish's latest take on Countrywide, "I am a bit Suspicious"
Mish's Global Economic Trend Analysis: Countrywide Seeks Another Cash Infusion
Law Firm: Countrywide Faces Purported ERISA Class-Action Suit
This just appeared on my Ameritrade news ticker. No story. Perhaps the First Magnus debacle has awakened some concerns about CFC.
Well that explains Mozillo's tan: he's toast.